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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
I had a somewhat frustrating session with my T last night - sometimes I feel like she just doesn't 'get it.'
Okay, okay...I know she is human - she can't possibly 'get it' all the time, right? But I truly wonder how much I'm getting out of therapy...
It's not that I don't like my therapist - but it seems that she's not very intent on giving me ideas on how to deal with particular issues, but instead will point out errors in my thinking. I don't mean that what she is doing is wrong - last night she said that she knew it probably sounded picky, but that it might help a little if I stopped saying to myself, "I can't do this anymore" and started saying, "This is very difficult, but I am going to deal with it," or something like that.
I see her point. But what I guess I wanted was for her to give me some concrete suggestions about ways of dealing with my situation. Maybe. I don't know. I just felt like she didn't know what to tell me, or that she was agreeing that my circumstances are bad, but she didn't have any thoughts about how to improve them. She said she knew I was resourceful and that I would figure out a way of dealing with all of this (job, finances, etc.), and I know she's not a career counselor or a financial counselor, but maybe if she had even said, "You might consider speaking to a financial counselor," or something like that...
I don't know. I'm so frustrated and I just don't see how therapy is helping right now. I don't feel like I'm making any strides, small or great, in therapy. I don't feel like my pdoc gets it either, really - he kept pointing out how I AM enjoying certain things - babysitting, basketball season, my dogs - so everything isn't terrible...and I told him, yes, that's true, but even when I ended up in the hospital, I still enjoyed *some* things. I've never been so depressed that I didn't find any joy anywhere - it's just that those things are too few and far between.
I wish, truly, that I could just disappear. Just vanish. Cease to be. Not to 'die' necessarily - but I wish that I had never existed. I feel like I'm only barely existing right now anyway.
I don't have the energy or the motivation to deal with my stressors right now, and I just need a *little* help - someone to point me in the right direction - give me the name of someone who can give me more help - SOMETHING - but no one seems to have any answers. And I guess my question to my therapist is this - if she can't even point me in the right direction, how am I supposed to be able to guide myself?
I just want to sleep. Forever and ever.
P
Posted by Dinah on December 10, 2003, at 10:18:46
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
Sounds typically therapeutic. They really aren't supposed to give advice, but to do things like correct distorted cognitions. My therapist sometimes errs on the other side and gets frustrated when he can't think of advice that would be helpful when what I really need for him is to listen, not to "fix". I guess sometimes you can't take the man out of the therapist.
You might be honest with her and tell her that temporarily you need a bit more coaching and counselling than she may be comfortable with. Does she think she can help you. Because it is true that when life circumstances are folding in on you it's hard to concentrate on therapy concerns.
So is a financial counselor or career consultant a possibility? Is there any assistance available through your EAP program? I know you said you can't afford the legal fees to file bankruptcy. Is that what you need to do? If so, are there any legal aid facilities in your area? Do you have other support resources for more pragmatic advice?
Posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:52:35
In reply to Re: Purpose in continuing therapy??? » Penny, posted by Dinah on December 10, 2003, at 10:18:46
> Sounds typically therapeutic. They really aren't supposed to give advice, but to do things like correct distorted cognitions. My therapist sometimes errs on the other side and gets frustrated when he can't think of advice that would be helpful when what I really need for him is to listen, not to "fix". I guess sometimes you can't take the man out of the therapist.
- Yes, I'm thinking that maybe, too, it's one of the differences between a clinical social worker and a psychologist - my former T (an MSW) was more likely to actually go through things with me - have me write down my budget in our session, for example - or give me names of places or people I could speak with. Oh well...
> You might be honest with her and tell her that temporarily you need a bit more coaching and counselling than she may be comfortable with. Does she think she can help you. Because it is true that when life circumstances are folding in on you it's hard to concentrate on therapy concerns.- I feel like I'm caught in a vicious circle - my mood is declining, so I'm not sure the medication is working properly, which makes it that much harder to deal with my financial/work issues, which makes me more depressed, etc. I told her that something is going to have to change, and she asked what I thought was going to change, and I told her that that's what I have to figure out. She did ask if I had thought about looking for a new job here at the university - something that pays more. I don't know what I want - I want to have more energy and stamina and not feel so fearful all the time so I can deal with these things!!! And I guess if she could give me some suggestions on how to not be so fearful. Maybe there really is nothing (or not much) she can do on her part to help with this. I don't guess I know what exactly I want from her.
> So is a financial counselor or career consultant a possibility? Is there any assistance available through your EAP program? I know you said you can't afford the legal fees to file bankruptcy. Is that what you need to do? If so, are there any legal aid facilities in your area? Do you have other support resources for more pragmatic advice?I don't know much about the EAP program here - but if it's anything like the EAPs through my last two jobs, it would be a waste of my time. The counselors I've seen in the past haven't been able to guide me toward anything or anyone helpful.
Part of my problem is that I make TOO MUCH MONEY. Ha. I think that's amusing...but, salary-wise, I do. I make too much money to qualify for aid, yet I don't make enough money to cover my expenses. I just got a letter from one of the hospitals here that I owe money to saying that I exceed their income limits for assistance, and demanding payment immediately. Chuckle. I've already explained to them that I would be happy to make payments, but they will only accept payments of a minimum of $70 or so a month, which I can't afford. I tried explaining to them that I can't make $70 payments, but they won't accept less, and instead have turned my account over to a collection agency. I'm anticipating another similar letter from the hospital I was in this summer that I also can't afford to pay. Even though these folks asked for my budget breakdown, so they can see for themselves that there's no money left over at the end of the month, they just look at my salary and say I make too much money. I'm glad to know that I make too much money. If I didn't have a car payment or car insurance I could swing some of these payments. Still, not all.
But, honestly, the best thing for me would be to file bankruptcy. I have an attorney, who told me that I could either file or I could choose to do nothing. I don't have any real property - the only thing I 'own' of value is my car, and I'm still financing that, so I don't actually own it. And my debts are all unsecured, so there's nothing to repossess (except the car, but I keep the payments on that up). But I don't have the $700 or so it would cost me to file, and I don't feel comfortable doing it on my own.
And I guess the whole point is that I don't see the point in going to see my therapist twice a week when I don't feel like I'm accomplishing anything in there, because there's really not a whole lot she can offer me other than a sounding board. And I can get that here. I'm sure she WANTS to help, but I don't think she CAN help in this situation. And until I can get this part of my life situated, I don't see how I can focus on anything else.
I just don't know what to do, Dinah. Sigh sigh sigh.
P
Posted by fallsfall on December 10, 2003, at 11:59:11
In reply to Re: Purpose in continuing therapy??? » Dinah, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:52:35
Ugh. You sound overwhelmed and confused. That is not a good place to be.
Maybe you could see her once a week and see a career or financial consultant once a week. So you are still going (and paying?) for 2 appointments, but one is with her and one with someone else. I don't know what your out of pocket expense is for her, nor what the others would charge.
If she can't advise you on the things that you need, she should be able to help you identify how to get the answers you are looking for. Frame you problem as not being able to move forward in solving these other things. How can you get "unstuck" so that you have a plan of attack. Are there emotional things that are keeping you stuck (embarassment, fear of reality, fear of change, trust issues, etc.)? In other words, maybe you can reframe your problem into something that she Can/Will address.
Does she understand how frustrated you are?
Is there a career counseling center for the Students that would be willing to help you?
Pray for a $700 Christmas?
If I were you, I would need a plan for how to get out of the situation. Or at least a plan for how to get a plan to get out of the situation.
I'm cheering for you!
(((((Penny)))))
Posted by Karen_kay on December 10, 2003, at 12:58:52
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
I know that personally I feel that my therapist isn't helping me at all. That we aren't accomplishing anything. Has your therapist been able to help you in the past? Do you think that being depressed has something to do with your opinion of her helpfulness or lack thereof? Maybe you are at a dry spell and need to talk to her about it. Sometimes when I feel that way I tell my therapist that he's useless (Ack! I'm harsh!). He then reassures me of the progress we've made thus far and where we are headed. Maybe if she goes over your goals (you do have them, right?) and you can see where you started and the progress to date it might help to jump start therapy once again. And she may see the need for a different type of approach.
Karen
Posted by justyourlaugh on December 10, 2003, at 13:47:35
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
i cant believe your last line..
i just wrote that to a friend and then erased it because i didnt want him to think i wanted to die..just sleep...forever...i "get it"
i think it would be a great help if you printed your post here and gave it to her..
she will then see perhaps she needs to "pick" less and help direct more by offering viable options...
:)
j
Posted by DaisyM on December 10, 2003, at 14:10:21
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
Oh, Penny...
I know I've seen you write that you need to not look for a permanent solution to a temporary problem -- hold tight to that thought.
I think you need to continue your therapy for the emotional support but I agree with everyone else about making her more aware of how you are really feeling. It has been suggested before but taking in what you have written might be a concrete way to *demand* help.
Since finances seem to be a huge part of the problem, have you thought about refinancing the car? You might be able to get the $700 you need this way. I think I read that you are Public Relations? How about freelance work? You can do this from home sometimes. Can you cash in accrued vacation? Even a garage sale can sometimes net a couple hundred dollars.
I hate that "you make too much money" catch-22. But from your post, it seems that your depression is making you even more hopeless -- which makes every idea so easy to reject or it feels like too much energy would be required. So break it down. Baby steps. I like Fallsfalls idea: plan to make a plan.
You are in my thoughts. Sometimes it is just day by day, minute by minute. Hang in there.
Posted by zenn4 on December 10, 2003, at 14:53:23
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
Hang in there. There are times when therapy seems like it just isn't going anywhere, and it's maddening. I would try to speak with your T and explain your frustrations. I would also do the same with your pdoc. It doesn't help when you are not feeling great to have someone tell you that you are feeling better. That's more of a cognitive call. Maybe you need some tweaking in the meds department. Depression robs me of all pleasure and sometimes when I start to get in a bad funk (providing I'm not already there) I tell myself the improvements I have made, however small. Financial problems are a bummer (I have them too) but remember they can't bleed money from a stone. You only have what you have and there's not a whole lot that you can do about it. I think that's just acceptance or something like that. Also keep in mind if your really depressed, everything begins to take on epic proportions. I'd keep going to therapy and just put one foot in front of the other. You can do it.
Posted by Dinah on December 10, 2003, at 14:56:04
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
Penny, have you tried debtors anonymous. A lot of times they'll help you out with a plan?
Posted by judy1 on December 11, 2003, at 10:21:29
In reply to Purpose in continuing therapy???, posted by Penny on December 10, 2003, at 10:01:05
I think your best course of action now would be to go to a credit counseling agency (non-profit). They will stop the hospital from going to a collection agency and force them to accept whatever payment plan they make up for you- at one time I was paying a creditor $10/ month and they were greatful for that. Bankruptcy should be a last resort, and despite how you feel, (depression does color everything)it's usually reserved for people who owe considerably more than you and have homes they want to protect- plus it follows you for 10 years (far longer than this depression I hope). Another suggestion I liked was the MSW, I agree they are so much more practical, and that is exactly what you need now.
let us know how things work out- take care, judy
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