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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 29 to 53 of 53. Go back in thread:
Posted by Dinah on November 1, 2003, at 5:11:37
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by karen_kay on November 1, 2003, at 0:07:15
I suspect it's far from unusual. I suspect my lack of need for it has as much to do with my very poor assessment of my interpersonal ability as anything else. It doesn't really occur to me that he would have any reason to like me.
Posted by Poet on November 1, 2003, at 11:16:24
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by karen_kay on November 1, 2003, at 0:07:15
I need to be liked, too.
She shares a suite of offices with a bunch of other therapists. When I walk through the waiting area on my way out I wonder which person is waiting for her and does she like him/her better?
I am pathetic.
Poet
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 15:19:16
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club » karen_kay, posted by Poet on November 1, 2003, at 11:16:24
This thread is so much fun! Let's see.. I usually arrive about four minutes before my session , and become a traffic maniac if I get held up. He is always exactly on time, starting and stopping, and once apologized for being two minutes late. In the beginning, I didn't care how I looked, and wore blue jeans, sneakers and messy hair. Now, I do care, and usually wear a jacket, necklace, pants and good shoes. I use the couch more now, and sometimes really thrash about, so I no longer wear skirts. Keeping them *down* is definitely one thing too many. He has very poor taste in clothes, sometimes wearing things like a green jacket, blue pants and a loud flowered tie. So far, I have been able to keep this topic out of my stream of consciousness during the sessions, although I probably won't be able to any longer now that I've brought it up here! The office is awful, too- bad colors and boring paintings. The chairs and the couch are black leather, although there is a little flowered pillow on the couch which has a sort of disposable paper towel on it. There is an irritating space heater clicking on and off during the winter, as one side of the office is glass and it gets cold. There is one nice thing- a balcony outside overlooking a park and containing three bird-feeders which are in constant use.
I looked him up on the net and there were hundreds of entries- graduation pictures, class notes from Princeton, articles and book reviews he had written. So far, I've resisted the urge to drive by his house, although the temptation is strong. As to the car- I'm looking!
I, personally, am very jealous of any other patient I catch sight of, and tend to feel that he likes them more. He shares a waiting room with three other analysts, and there are often several people in there- I can't tell who goes to who. However, he is very warm and empathic to me, so I can't help but feel that he likes me as well. And, too, a deepening bond is developing through the work we are doing together- that feels real, and means an awful lot.
I'm usually in a daze aferwards, and don't think about food for a few hours. He has a parking space for his patients in the garage of his building. I often bring our dog in the car; she'll sleep quietly while I'm upstairs seeing him; then I often take her to a nearby park where there is a one-mile walk along a stream. She gets to swim- she's a spaniel- and I get to try and clear my head and think a few clear thoughts. It never works!
Pfinstegg
Posted by karen_kay on November 1, 2003, at 17:09:33
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club » karen_kay, posted by Poet on November 1, 2003, at 11:16:24
Poet, If you are pathetic, I am even more! I saw another client one time and she was prettier than I am. I almost cried. That is what started the question of whether I am his favorite client or not. I figured if I am not his prettiest, maybe I can be his favorite. Now, that is pathetic. :)Karen
Posted by karen_kay on November 1, 2003, at 17:13:53
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 15:19:16
Ok, what about this? I send him thank you cards. I thanked him when I was manic and he spotted it. I thanked him when I was depressed and he spotted it and helped me through it. I sent him a congratulations card when he passed his big test to finally get his certification. And he keeps them in his office on display. Is this too much you think? Does this make me a good client or obsessed? Ugh.. But he knows I am a card-sending addict and I know he appreciates it.... what do you think? Karen
Posted by underthecs on November 1, 2003, at 20:15:35
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by fallsfall on October 30, 2003, at 7:24:07
> ??How often is it "OK" to call your therapist, >After hours? During business hours?
Well, mine says call me if I need to. I can email also. It is SO hard to call, though. I try to do it at times where I know he won't be at work, and I can leave a message on his voicemail. Or I have to be really, really drunk <g>
> ??Are you jealous of their other clients?Lord, yes! Even the kids that he sees. And I've told him this.
> ??Have you searched on the internet for them >Driven past their house? Do you know what kind >of car they drive? Do you know the car's >license number?Um, yeah to all of the above. I've even tried to hack into his email account. Got caught. He claims he wasn't mad. And hasn't really treated me any differently, nor has he suspended my email priviledges. He's pretty awesome.
>What are their therapy experiences?
I just know that he was in therapy. And I know kinda what his issues were. I am nosey!
Posted by underthecs on November 1, 2003, at 20:19:40
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by karen_kay on November 1, 2003, at 17:13:53
> Ok, what about this? I send him thank you cards. I thanked him when I was manic and he spotted it. I thanked him when I was depressed and he spotted it and helped me through it. I sent him a congratulations card when he passed his big test to finally get his certification. And he keeps them in his office on display. Is this too much you think? Does this make me a good client or obsessed? Ugh.. But he knows I am a card-sending addict and I know he appreciates it.... what do you think? Karen
**** I think it's sweet!
Posted by Emme on November 1, 2003, at 20:31:01
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by karen_kay on November 1, 2003, at 17:13:53
I think cards are very nice. And everyone likes to be appreciated. And it doesn't sound like you do it every other week or something extreme.
Now how about feeding them?? I'm the bringer of vegetables and chocolate. When my garden overproduced, I couldn't give much to my friends because they were in the same boat with their gardens. So my therapist got some of the extras, including things like 3 lb zucchinis. Afterwards she'd tell me how she cooked them.
As a total and complete chocolate snob, I occasionally bring good chocolate either to the therapist or pdoc. I sometimes wonder why I do it, or wonder if they wonder why I do it. I know they like me okay, so I don't think I'm trying to win approval. Part of it is thanks because they are extremely conscientious. Part of it is "chocolate evangelism". I just can't resist giving it to people.
It's not uncommon to see veggies or a cake floating around my pdoc's office and I realized that I wasn't alone - that her patients feed the office regularly!
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 22:31:46
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 15:19:16
My therapist did a very creative thing this fall. I have DID, among other things, and don't have much memory for ages 5-10, although I do have quite a few clear ones for 1-5. I brought in a journal with the few memories I have of those years, and a photo of myself when I was six. I thought he would have a brief look and return it, but he asked me if I would like him to keep it. I said yes; he asked me to try to tell him why, and I found myself saying that the part of me who is the little girl in pigtails in the photo could not think of a thing to say, and that I wanted him to keep her safe until she could, maybe, remember and begin to speak. He said it would be fine for her not to speak until she was ready. It felt very comforting for him to have the journal; two months went by with lots of other things happening, but not a word more about the little girl- and then, just yesterday, I felt I was speaking with her voice and starting to remember a few things from those years. The memories were very painful ones, but I was just sobbing with relief that they were no longer entirely buried inside me. I guess I'm telling this because I wanted you to know that although he wears pretty awful clothes at times, and does not have a very attractive office, as a therapist he is just wonderful -patient, understanding, creative, resourceful and effective. He ended that immensely powerful, moving session by saying, " we will be able to interact with one another a lot more now."
Well, having previously confessed to all the faults of being a Transference-Ridden member of THE IMPERFECT PATIENT CLUB, I guess I was eager to change the topic over to THE PERFECT THERAPIST CLUB! Hoping for other entries..please don't let me be the only one to be telling stuff like this.
Pfinstegg
Posted by karen_kay on November 2, 2003, at 9:26:19
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by underthecs on November 1, 2003, at 20:15:35
Wow! You know what his issues were? I know mine is thinking about seeking some counseling. And you tried to hack into his email account. I am so scared mine would just say,"Karen, leave my office and never come back!" or else I would try to do all of those things. I am glad that you have such as strong relationship. It helps. Karen
Posted by karen_kay on November 2, 2003, at 9:27:02
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by underthecs on November 1, 2003, at 20:19:40
****Thanks :)
Posted by karen_kay on November 2, 2003, at 9:31:59
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by Emme on November 1, 2003, at 20:31:01
I know my therapist ALWAYS has food is his office, so I would bring him food but I'm afraid he would say I can't accept gifts. I chew gum like a kid and I always offer him gum. I think it is very sweet that you offer gifts of chocolate, esp. nice chocolate!!! that is much better than hersheys!!! You should swing by the office I come to and I could steal some from my shrink ;) karen and the veggies sound great too! I think that it sounds like the type of thing I would do but I'm afraid he would say no and I would feel like an ass.
Posted by karen_kay on November 2, 2003, at 19:17:30
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by Medusa on October 30, 2003, at 2:35:07
>
> New question: what does the therapist's attire mean?
>Well, we have discussed my attire many times, as I change my clothes many times a day. He always look fabulous. He mentioned that he enjoys looking nice. It means just that. I think that he is a little boy playing the big boy role myself, as I soemtimes get the sense that he is a little akward (not in the office, just in life in general) Then again, how would I know, other then what he tells me. Oh, adn when he comes to get me in the main waiting area, he has this "little boy" head looking down, hands in pocket, voice very low and I'm fairly loud and sometimes he has to repeat himself. But, that is just the impression I get.
> > How often is it "OK" to call your therapist,
> I only have an office number..Is there another one to reach him?? Huh?? Umm.. I may have called him 5 times to reschedule around classes.
> >
> > Does your therapist ever make mistakes? What was the worst one? Did you tell them?
> >
>Once he tried to make me do free association. We sat there in silence for about 35 minutes. I was so mad I couldn't even think of anything to say. He put me in the hospital once too. Big mistake! Hell yeah I tell him when he makes a mistake. Instead of signing a suicide contract, he just locked me up. But, he is relatively new at this and I got out the next day. But, it cost me a grand. I kept threatening to send him the bill for it. I still remind him about it occassionally too! Just jokinkly now, I'll be like, "Hey, remember that time you put me in the hospital?" He just laughs now.> > New question: when you've told the therapist about her/his mistakes, how have they responded? What's the Perfect Therapist response?
> I think at first my concern was that I didn't receive any type of counceling in the hospital. All they did was lock me up over night. It was horrible. I just wanted him to listen to me and he jumped the gun. He didn't even really listen to me, he just called my boyfriend and locked me up in the hospital. It was basically like cutting me off midsentence. Now, the perfect therapist response is laughter, laugh with the patient!
>
> > Are you jealous of their other clients?
> He has others? I'm not the only one? Yeah, I have actually told him once that I prefer to think I am his only client. He laughed and I didn't. I saw one of his other clients once and she was prettier than I am. I thought I was going to cry. But, I'm sure he likes me better anyway.
> >
> > Have you searched on the internet for them (my personal favorite)? Driven past their house? Do you know what kind of car they drive? Do you know the car's license number?
> >
> I have (hate admitting it) searched on the internet. I don't know where he lives, or I would drive past his house. I don't know his car. I have talked to him about what would happen if he found me waiting by his car. He said he would just tell me to go home.
> > What DO they want from us???????=
> He honestly wants me to be happy. I think 3 months ago, I would have said money, but now I am sure he wants me to be happy. And I think he just wants me period. More accurately, maybe I want him. Why can't it be the other way around?> New question: for other therapy HOs, what patterns have you noticed/reactions have you gotten from many, most or all of your therapists?
>
> He laughs a whole lot! Maybe I'm witty! Maybe I'm charming. Maybe he's just laughing at me. Not exactly sure yet. Also, he leans forward with his head on his fists but when I say something perplexing or interesting, he leans back.Ok, I have a question... or two
>Who analyzes their therapist, other than me obviously?
I think that I tend to talk about sex on occassion, though not that often. I think that mine missed out on some different experimental opportunities before he got married (such as threesomes). He tends to bring up an issue of a threesome that I had a long time ago that really has nothing to do with anything and he kinda gets a look on his face and I can't help but wonder if he missed out on his opportunity before he got married. Another example, I have a friend who is rather unamusing and I mentioned I could corupt her and he naturally assumed I meant by sex, which I didn't. It was funny, because he sat back and got a smirk on his face. I got defensive because I knew he thought I was talking about sex, which I wasn't. Seems like he thinks I am always talking about sex.
Plus, we are close to the same age, I am 24 he may be around 30 ish, but I wounder if he feels like a little boy trying to act like a man because most of the other therapists in the building are considerably older.
Anyone else try to out-shrink their shrink or just me????>Anyone else completely in love with their therapist?
>Had someone come to a session?>My boyfriend came to one and it was horrible. I felt like I was being attacked from both sides. I felt like I couldn't accurately prepare for the session and my old man wouldn't let me coach him on what to say.
> Do you argue with your therapist a lot?
> I used to all the time. Until I started leading the sessions. A few weeks ago he started letting me lead the sessions and now we don't argue anymore. And I don't answer with I don't know anymore. And when he starts to get boring I cut him off because we don't have time for his ramblings, and I tell him that. It is fun to tell him that too!
Karen
Posted by DaisyM on November 2, 2003, at 19:52:58
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club, posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 22:31:46
Ok, the perfect therapist would occasionally stop analyzing for a minute, not make everything an intraspective opportunity and say exactly they think.
I had that experience with mine recently. I was having a confidence crisis and we were on the phone. He is usually warm and supportive (I've only gotten mad at him once), but this conversation took a turn in the middle, I could almost feel him take a breathe and basically say "oh, to h--- with it" -- and he told me a number of positive things I needed to hear and then totally took myside against someone else, made suggestions on how to handle things and did not ask me how it was making me feel or WHY I was over the top upset. He was just there for me. Not careful, not prodding, just there.
Of course, now we are going to have to talk about this. :)
I also think the perfect therapist should wear interesting socks and nice shoes, because I spend so much time looking down. And should have a window in their office. And should play soft music to fill up the silence. And should have chairs in the waiting room, not couches.
Posted by Dinah on November 2, 2003, at 20:39:02
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club, posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 22:31:46
No, you sure aren't the only one. And I didn't think you were criticizing him about the clothes thing, any more than I meant to be really critical about the nose thing. It just helps to have something to lighten the mood that therapy leaves you with, and how better than by having a bit of fun with them.
I'm not sure my therapist is up to perfect yet, but he really has gotten pretty good. We were discussing whether I was a difficult client the other day. And whether he minded that I gave him strong hints on how he can say things to me without causing a flaming amygdala. And he was really laid back and said that no, he thought that it was important to communicate in a way that the other person can hear what you are saying, and he doesn't mind my helping him to do that. He also talked about how challenging me might upset me no matter how he words it, and what we might do in those circumstances. It felt so nice to be able to talk about those things.
I think the thing that makes my therapist most perfect (for me) is that he's teaching me that two people can get angry without it being the end of the world. That you can keep the connection even if you get angry.
But I think he's at his most perfect when he's at his most genuine. The times I've really made giant leaps in therapy are when he lets himself be at least a bit real. I can always tell because his drawl becomes more pronounced.
Posted by deirdrehbrt on November 2, 2003, at 21:03:08
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club, posted by Pfinstegg on November 1, 2003, at 22:31:46
I think you have every right to be quite happy. This sounds like a major breakthrough for you. I would bet that what you learn about those middle years will be very painful, but then, at least, you will know what has been your life.
Tell your six year old that I am very proud of her for speaking. I'm sure that she is as sweet as you are.
Hugs for your pain (((Pfinstegg))), and hope for your future.
I'm so glad you have a great therapist - it makes such a difference. You deserve a great therapist.
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 2, 2003, at 21:07:03
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club » Pfinstegg, posted by DaisyM on November 2, 2003, at 19:52:58
I agree- the socks and shoes are very important. When you are lying down on the couch, you still get to see them, up pretty close, and I don't like seeing loud argyll socks one foot away!
Pfinstegg
Posted by Emme on November 2, 2003, at 21:14:47
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club » Pfinstegg, posted by Dinah on November 2, 2003, at 20:39:02
>> I think the thing that makes my therapist most perfect (for me) is that he's teaching me that two people can get angry without it being the end of the world. That you can keep the connection even if you get angry.
yes yes yes yes. Me too.
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 2, 2003, at 21:24:59
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club » Pfinstegg, posted by Dinah on November 2, 2003, at 20:39:02
The things you are doing with him sound so good, Dinah. I've found, like you, that as I become more trusting and daring, I am more the one to lead the way into difficult areas, or tell him when I think he's off-base. Talking through anger is wonderful, too (I'm not as far along on that as you are). I don't know whether this is really true. or not, but from what I have been reading, re-experiencing all these feelings with a therapist, and having them be accepted so fully, may really change our brains- the right frontal and hippocampal areas, especially- making them more like they would have been if we had received good parenting. I know you read a lot- have you read anything by Allen Schore? He's an analyst who believes that therapy can make these positive neurological changes. It's very encouraging to read a bit of his writings.
Thank you so much for replying. I was hoping to not just have a bit of fun, but to try to share the experiences I am having, and hoping that others would share theirs. I did have some uneasy hours, thinking I might have gone over the *line*, wherever that might be, so I really feel reassured by your response- thanks Dinah!Pfinstegg
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 2, 2003, at 21:32:44
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club » Pfinstegg, posted by deirdrehbrt on November 2, 2003, at 21:03:08
Thank you, Dee. I am so happy to receive your warm and encouraging response- it means so much to me. I know you are going through some of the same experiences that I am, so that you know what they are actually like- and that you also have an excellent therapist. I wish you the very best, also, and was very glad to hear, on Social, that things went well during your visit to your daughter's therapist. Thanks so much- what you said is so supportive and encouraging- it really helped!
Pfinstegg
Posted by Dinah on November 2, 2003, at 23:15:46
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club- Dinah » Dinah, posted by Pfinstegg on November 2, 2003, at 21:24:59
I don't think I've read him, although I have read a bit about reparenting. I think it's the idea behind what my therapist is doing with me.
There was so much more I wanted to say in response to your post, and really couldn't find the words. My brain is feeling dumb again, and to top it off I'm really distracted. I'll apply myself to thinking about the Perfect Therapist's Club when I'm thinking a bit clearer. :)
(But you do know, don't you, that your therapist is the only one I could ever imagine seeing other than mine. And that is suuuuch a huge compliment from me, since I can usually never imagine not seeing mine.)
Posted by Pfinstegg on November 3, 2003, at 12:57:29
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapist Club » Pfinstegg, posted by Dinah on November 2, 2003, at 23:15:46
It is a HUGE compliment, Dinah, because I know that who your therapist really is as a person is vital to you. I have an appointment with him in an hour, and am going to tell him! He knows who Dinah is, abstractly, as I have brought PB humor and interesting exchanges in in the past- he just loves learning what patients say to one another on-line, and thinks that therapists could really learn things by checking in
We work very hard together, but he's just fun, really. When I told him I had looked him up on-line, he said, "what took you so long? Find anything I should be ashamed of?" You just can't help but love him, wild colors and all.
Pfinstegg
Posted by Elle2021 on November 14, 2003, at 1:41:24
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club » Medusa, posted by Dinah on October 30, 2003, at 7:45:05
> Ok, I have another therapist/client question. If your therapist does things that are to your understanding outside the acceptable public range, such as pick his nose or chew at something stuck under his fingernail.
hehehe! My therapist has a habit of putting his hand inside his dress shirt. Like inbetween the buttons. It struck me as odd at first, but I think a security thing. It makes him feel safe and comfortable...or at least thats what I have concluded. I admit thats nothing compared to having a therapist pick his nose, which is socially frowned upon, but maybe he just feels comfortable enough with you? God bless you!
Elle
Posted by Dinah on November 14, 2003, at 10:04:22
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club » Dinah, posted by Elle2021 on November 14, 2003, at 1:41:24
I guess thinking he feels comfortable with me is a better way of framing it than thinking he feels contemptuous of me. Unfortunately, the behavior started back when I think he didn't like me very much. It had gone away some, and I thought that meant he no longer felt he needed to ward me off with revolting habits. But now it's increasing again.
The other day he was biting bits of his cuticles or nails off (I think he eventually got up and got a clippers) and piling the bits and pieces very neatly on the end table next to him.
I was at something of a loss, so I pretended I didn't notice.
Posted by Jai on November 14, 2003, at 17:13:12
In reply to Re: Perfect Therapy Patient Club, posted by Medusa on October 30, 2003, at 2:35:07
> How early? An hour early might mean anxiety about getting there on time. Camping overnight might mean something else. Especially if you camp under the therapist's car.
I laughed out loud with this wonderful response to being "on time". Thank you Medusa for the humor. I totally appreciated the response. I so seldom laugh. Laughter lightens the load. :)
This is the end of the thread.
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