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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by muffled on December 18, 2008, at 11:38:25
>Muffled, it isn't clear from your post whether this friend is also a Babbler, but if it is, would you please rephrase those statements into "I" statements? Statements about how you feel rather than about what another person does? Or what another person's intentions might be?
*It was a babbler.
I am a little confused. I seem to be missing something. Inside of me it is missing.
But anyways, that is by way of explaining when I don't 'get' stuff. I guess I am fortunate I don't feel emotions so intensely. I think they suck.
This babbler ignores me, then emails me, and I would be pleased to be a friend and I want to be useful, but then they gone again.
I am inconsistant. I know this. Maybe that is why.
Maybe its got to do w/DD this lack of understanding? My DD is mild, but I guess the definition of disorder, is that it causes problems.
I am ever sorry for this.
Oftimes I read my emails to my T over and over and over and over. I am trying to undertsand the words. To see if they were right. Cuz I write it and do a quick review and then send, otherwise all is lost in editing.
I wonder, if as a result of this seeming lack of connection I seem to have btwn words and how they are perceived makes me an unlikely candidtate for babble.
I agree with myself and I think I need to babble just a wee bit (if possible, its hard to do that and not feel disconnected...) and mostly stay away and connect IRL.
So I will try the rephrase as I have always struggled with this:"she ignored me and went away"
I went to chat to see how a babbler that was there was doing, and when I arrived and said hi, she went away, I felt sad.
" I guess I tried to in a neutral way connect, and was rebuffed very thorougly indeed."
I guess I tried in a neutral way to connect, but ended up feeling badly."
Is this right?
Despite myself I am feeling triggered. Its a curious thing indeed the human psyche.
I struggle with being bad, or perceiving I am so. I think this is not uncommon here. Makes me wanto punish the bad part.
Damn I hate my weaknessess.
Lemme know.
Thanks
M
Posted by muffled on December 18, 2008, at 22:29:41
In reply to re: please rephrase muffled and just general, posted by muffled on December 18, 2008, at 11:38:25
> This babbler ignores me, then emails me, and I would be pleased to be a friend and I want to be useful, but then they gone again.
*I think I did it again didn't I?
I am rereading and I see this. This is wrong isn't it?
I try again.I am confised by this babblers behaviour. I don't know what to do.
The above is my rephrase. Was it wrong the fisrt statement? Is the rephrase correct?
Sometimes there's bad things in my head. But they allus against myownself.
I sorry.
I am not bad am I?
You tell me if I am bad.
I am sorry.
Posted by Deputy 10derHeart on December 18, 2008, at 23:38:11
In reply to oh crap, posted by muffled on December 18, 2008, at 22:29:41
You did an *excellent* job, Muffled, and you are too hard on yourself - you can and do get this. We just don't always realize how or what we've written, or, we get so emotional we can't see it, or sometimes don't want to, or don't care in that moment of upset. We are human and erring and learning.
It's all about practice, isn't it? It sure was for me. Like anything really, then with TONS of repetition it becomes close to second nature.
Your original rephrase was perfect, IMO.
Yes, you're right:
"This babbler ignores me" wouldn't be civil as it's talking about someone else's behavior and motivation, which, if we really, really break it down and use logic, we can't 100% know - NO MATTER how hugely obvious it seems to us (those pesky emotions again!) - unless we are inside their head. We could be mistaken. Maybe their actions are due to something else entirely.
NOW, having said that, sure, sometimes - this time - or at another time on or off Babble - maybe it was true and accurate. The other person really *was* deliberately not making contact. Well, the thing is, to keep ourselves civil and not take a chance at accusing or putting them down, we still can't post, "This Babbler ignores me." Just like we wouldn't want to post, "This Babbler hates me..., " or "This Babbler is mocking me..." or "This Babbler gave me an ugly look...." or "This Babbler disrespected me..." (do those help?)
When you wrote: A. I went to chat, and then B. she went away.....that was different, because those are "sterile" facts. I did a thing, she did a thing. If readers want to connect them, to attribute meaning to them, that is something they have to deal with in their minds. They can always post and ask for more depth, ask, "Did you feel badly then? Did you feel left out?" or something like that. In fact, when I first read your response to Dinah's post, my suggestion was you could say: "I feel left out sometimes around this Babbler, " or "I felt sad and uncomfortable being unable to have a chat conversation, and then confused at later receiving email..." What do you think of those?
The trouble comes when *we* automatically connect actions, and then post our conclusions, publicly. "She left; it's because of me = she ignored me."
As for "I am confused by this babblers behaviour. I don't know what to do." - I *think* this would be okay, because well, we all have "behavior" (you did not decide what it *meant* i.e., ignoring, nor did you describe any sort of "bad" behavior) Your writing that does keep it about you and not them, so, yes, *I* say it's fine.
Thank you for the efforts. I know I can speak for all the deputies when I say we really appreciate it. And BTW, though I am sad it doesn't go without saying, of course you are not "bad, " in fact, I don't think of uncivil posting as "wrong" even. Just out of place? Just outside the guidelines Dr. Bob requests? Not fitting for here? Not the best for harmony and peace and safety in this unique setting? I hope you can think of it more that way, too.
Posted by Partlycloudy on December 19, 2008, at 8:37:26
In reply to thank you...and more on civil phrasing (long) » muffled, posted by Deputy 10derHeart on December 18, 2008, at 23:38:11
You did a beautiful job explaining :-)
Posted by llurpsienoodle on December 19, 2008, at 11:17:52
In reply to Re: thank you...and more on civil phrasing (long) » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by Partlycloudy on December 19, 2008, at 8:37:26
I wish most things on this board were so productive.
Thanks 10der for the learning opportunity
Thank muffled for your sincere efforts. I hope you are feeling okay. No, you didn't do anything wrong. You're NOT a bad person. You are trying hard to do the right thing. You are thinking about the bigger picture here, and putting in a lot of care (and angst :( ) into your posts.
-Ll
Posted by 10derHeart on December 19, 2008, at 11:25:59
In reply to Re: thank you...and more on civil phrasing (long) » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by Partlycloudy on December 19, 2008, at 8:37:26
Posted by muffled on December 19, 2008, at 12:36:58
In reply to cool thread, posted by llurpsienoodle on December 19, 2008, at 11:17:52
I am working on a reply. I have it on wordpad.
Just 10der put so much effort into her reply I need to equal it!!!!
But I am very busy, last day of school for kids, BUSY.
Stupid T kinda triggered me Tues, and then H did too yesterday, so i all scrambled and not functioning at optimal capacity.
I be back.
I be fine.
Allus is.
Thanks.
M
Posted by 10derHeart on December 19, 2008, at 13:37:24
In reply to Thanks also., posted by muffled on December 19, 2008, at 12:36:58
>>Just 10der put so much effort into her reply I need to equal it!!!!
No, you don't. silly!! Don't worry about it. I enjoyed it. It helps me, too, you know, to think about this stuff :-)
Family comes first!
Posted by muffled on December 29, 2008, at 1:29:14
In reply to Re: Thanks also. » muffled, posted by 10derHeart on December 19, 2008, at 13:37:24
I found it on my desktop and I guess i forgot to send it. So here it is.
Thx 10der.
)))))))))))))))))))
> You did an *excellent* job, Muffled, and you are too hard on yourself - you can and do get this. We just don't always realize how or what we've written, or, we get so emotional we can't see it, or sometimes don't want to, or don't care in that moment of upset. We are human and erring and learning.*Thanks Deputy 10der. I had read it and thot it civil, but guess not. I still find this stuff confusing figgering it.
> It's all about practice, isn't it? It sure was for me. Like anything really, then with TONS of repetition it becomes close to second nature.*yeah, practice makes perfect, you sound like me talking to my IRL kids! LOL!
> Your original rephrase was perfect, IMO.*well thats good, maybe on some level I get it a bit, but not completely.
> "This babbler ignores me" wouldn't be civil as it's talking about someone else's behavior and motivation, which, if we really, really break it down and use logic, we can't 100% know - NO MATTER how hugely obvious it seems to us (those pesky emotions again!) - unless we are inside their head. We could be mistaken. Maybe their actions are due to something else entirely.*hmmm maybe.....not that I am saying this is 100 % known what happened, but that my unfortunately uncivil response, while not meaning to be cruel was just wanting to have others tell me I wasn't bad is all. This is a difficulty w/babble.
I guess what I *should* be thinking, is that the person was just protecting themselves, NOT trying to hurt me, it was just me personalizing it. I shouldn't do that. Just hit a button I guess.
> NOW, having said that, sure, sometimes - this time - or at another time on or off Babble - maybe it was true and accurate. The other person really *was* deliberately not making contact. Well, the thing is, to keep ourselves civil and not take a chance at accusing or putting them down, we still can't post, "This Babbler ignores me." Just like we wouldn't want to post, "This Babbler hates me..., " or "This Babbler is mocking me..." or "This Babbler gave me an ugly look...." or "This Babbler disrespected me..." (do those help?)*Well anyways, I guess at the time, and even now, I don't truly understand how uncivil it was to say...or IS it civil for me just to state "I felt ignored and I felt hurt" ??? simple as that? I feel a bit silly going over this as I am no longer bothered by this but I just am STILL trying to understand this.
And now that I think about it, if you received a notification and were acting from that, then thats fine too, and that is more acceptable to me, cuz then the other person would feel better and thats a good thing. I just wonder if anything would have occured w/o a notification? Anyhow, if it was notification driven then it makes more sense to me, and that is fine. I do not wish to now if it was due to a notification, let me assume it was cuz I like that idea somehow.> When you wrote: A. I went to chat, and then B. she went away.....that was different, because those are "sterile" facts. I did a thing, she did a thing. If readers want to connect them, to attribute meaning to them, that is something they have to deal with in their minds. They can always post and ask for more depth, ask, "Did you feel badly then? Did you feel left out?" or something like that. In fact, when I first read your response to Dinah's post, my suggestion was you could say: "I feel left out sometimes around this Babbler, " or "I felt sad and uncomfortable being unable to have a chat conversation, and then confused at later receiving email..." What do you think of those?
*The first one was inaccuarate as I didn't feel 'left out' attal, right or wrong it *felt* very deliberate. But of course, what I did NOT know was intent, as I stated above. I had no way of knowing. I should have done better. But irregardless, right or wrong, I felt what I felt. So I reached out for validation. I thot that by not saying it was a babbler, then that would be OK.. I am just majorly thankful that stuff seems to somehow slither off me. Like water off a ducks back as my sis used to say.
I guess at the time it must have really hurt. But it doesn't now. I just now feel sad that I can no longer connect, I want to help, but I can't. I guess it makes me feel helpless is what it does. Agape love. I told my T bout what that means. There needs to be more of it in this crazy sad world.
> The trouble comes when *we* automatically connect actions, and then post our conclusions, publicly. "She left; it's because of me = she ignored me."*OK....manoman, I REALLY really really appreciate you taking all the time to write this 10der, and I only intended a quick reply on order to ask questions...but I am getting muddled. Sorry.
I guess maybe something else I am missing, and this may be important, is my understanding the bald faced written word. When I read it to myself, I hear *my* own tones and nuances added as I read then, and therefore perhaps skew the context. Also, I find it difficult to narrow the words into just words in themselves, I am distracted by the circumstances around the words....do you suppose this is just me? or is this a broader problem? I have no way of knowing.
> As for "I am confused by this babblers behaviour. I don't know what to do." - I *think* this would be okay, because well, we all have "behavior" (you did not decide what it *meant* i.e., ignoring, nor did you describe any sort of "bad" behavior) Your writing that does keep it about you and not them, so, yes, *I* say it's fine.*Also, I guess this statement, is just not in any way attacking I guess, cuz its just confusion only and can't be misinterpreted as anger or something?
I am growing spinny.
> Thank you for the efforts. I know I can speak for all the deputies when I say we really appreciate it. And BTW, though I am sad it doesn't go without saying, of course you are not "bad, " in fact, I don't think of uncivil posting as "wrong" even. Just out of place? Just outside the guidelines Dr. Bob requests? Not fitting for here? Not the best for harmony and peace and safety in this unique setting? I hope you can think of it more that way, too.
>
*Thank you for your efforts as well.
I hope I haven't given you a headache...
I like the phrase "Not the best for harmony and peace and safety in this unique setting? ".
You'll have to excuse the 'bad' thing. It seems to take repitions ad infinitum for parts of me to understand a concept.
Lastly, I would like to say, I am using this example as I can better understand IRL stuff.
In the off chance HF you are reading, I am not in any way feeling bad towards you. I wish you only the best, and I firmly beleive you will get thru all this stuff and be able to live a full and wonderful life and help many people. I hope you return to babble.
Muffled
This is the end of the thread.
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