![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 111 to 135 of 138. Go back in thread:
Posted by Dinah on March 17, 2008, at 17:33:39
In reply to Re: Dereliction of duty, posted by Toph on March 17, 2008, at 9:25:24
I didn't take it in any bad way. :)
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 17:35:00
In reply to Citation for post by Dr. Kramer-LLhzgdshd?, posted by Lou Pilder on March 16, 2008, at 16:01:58
> > > > > > > > > Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing. Consider PB just one more unmoderated blog that is so pervasive on the Internet. I think we should just be glad that this forum exists at all.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > If anyone would care to answer: Exactly what is it that you find it necessary for Dr. Bob to be here?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > What can't you do while he is not here?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > He has no duty to make you happy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > In the 8 years I've been posting here, I have never seen Dr. Hsiung give medical advice. What else do you need him for?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Simple question: How does Bob's absence affect YOU.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > So far, I've asked this question with other words. No one has attempted to answer it. If you cannot answer this fundamental question, I don't see that there is much to discuss. I think there is a mob mentality here, and I wish people would just talk about themselves rather than allude to some global consensus.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > What do we need Bob for? That's another attempt to get to a straight answer out of somebody. Saying that some percentage of people are mad and sad and lost without our leader, Dr. Bob, does not address the questions I've posed in previous posts.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I hear children whining. It must be me.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > - Scott
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > It is written here,[...Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing...what is it..for Bob to be here...he has no duty to make you happy...never seen ..giving medical advice...Simple..how does Mr. Hsiung's absence affect YOU...no one has attempted to answer...mob mentality...some global consensus...What do we need Bob for?...hear children whining...].
> > > > > > > > Let us consider several aspects of this situation here one at a time by the use of established reasoning. One way of reasoning is by comparative analogy.
> > > > > > > > In an analogy, we could try to compare this communnity with another like community. If we compared this community to , let's say, an emergency room, would there be a proper analogy? Let's try and see.
> > > > > > > > Let us say that in an ER the main doctor that supervises all the other doctors leaves without saying when he will return and leaves the ER open to be run by his assistants that do not have the expertise as the main doctor and that the assistants do not have authority to act in a final decision as to do a critical surgery or not, for only the leader of those doctors is allowed to decide and the leader did not replace himself before he left with an equivalent doctor.
> > > > > > > > Then a 17 year old girl is brought in and emergency treatment that the doctors need authorization to perform is delayed because the main doctor has left the hospital that authorizes the procedure or not and the doctors ready to perform need the main dosctor to have his expertise to do the procedure. The family brought their daughter in in an expectation that treatment could be given.
> > > > > > > > Now in this community here, one could ask as to if an {agency} has been created from the past practice that one could expect.
> > > > > > > > Memebrs have expected here support and education that is moderated by the leader and that his policy is that his assistants do not have to act and can defer to the leader and that the assistants (deputies) are themselves members that share some of the psychological/emotioanl states that the members came to this community for support for. By the nature that the leader is not responding to pleas from members that have psychological/emotional states that they came to the forum for support and education about, and that notifications have been posted as being outstanding, could we determine if there is the potential that some of those members could slide into deeper depression and hopelesness and other psychotic states from the main administrator not responding to pleas from the members?
> > > > > > > > Then there is the question of the site being at no cost. Well, what if the ER in question was a free clinic? Would that change anything? If so, what? more...
> > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > friends,
> > > > > > > It is written here something like,[...where has Dr. Hsiung posted as a clinician?...].
> > > > > > > In order to have a determination concerning that aspect here, it is the generally accepted meaning of one to be a clinician if one presents him/her self as being qualified as a doctor or a psychiatrist or psychologist. The email address and such for Dr. Hsiung and his picture can identify him as a doctor and a psychitrist. But there is much more to this.
> > > > > > > In Mr. Hsiung's TOS he has a section called something like, {what medicine to take?}. In that section, could not some think that Mr. Hsiung is establishing an agency for others to get clinical expertise concerning medicine? If not, why not?
> > > > > > > And would it depend on if the member or the doctor is giving the opinion concerning the medicine? After all, if you take the position that it is the members, then since Mr. Hsiung could controll the content of the forum, then is there not the potential for one to see a controlled aspect of medictions here? If not, why not? more...
> > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > Let us look a what members here have access to in reagrds to medicines. A member here can click on the following:
> > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > Friends,
> > > > > Let us look at the link that members can acccess here concerning advice about medicines and such and if this does or does not have the potential to lead some others to think that there is advice or not concerning clinical pharmacology.
> > > > > Lou
> > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/experts.html
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > friends,
> > > > Here is a link where it is th epotential IMO for some others to think that Dr. Hsiung is writing about medication.
> > > > Lou
> > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20010417/msgs/60424.html
> > >
> > > Friends,
> > > Here is a link to one of Dr. Hsiung's guest experts that members could read about the drug Serzone. Dr. Kramer writes:
> > > A. Serzone's liver problems are quite rare
> > > B. Serzone is a good drug
> > > Now that was written here in 2002
> > > In 2004, Serzone was taken off the market 9citation sz1) because
> > > C.liver failure (people die from liver failure and there were 21 deaths linked to Serzone in the US, one possible, a 15 year old girl).
> > > D.The FDA had forced the manufacturer in 2002 to add a serious liver warning, but problems continued
> > > E. The drug was taken off the market in Europe, New Zealand, Austrailia and Canada and was continued to be prescribed in the US.
> > > Now let us reason together here. Has not Dr. Hsiung allowed this post to remain without being updated in the thread that it appears? If so, could a member here be influenced to think that Serzone is a good drug as Dr. Hsiung's expert guest , Dr. Kramer, writes? Could it be determined as to if Dr. Kramer knew about the taking off from the market the drug in 2002 in Europe? Even though the drug has been taken off the market in 2004 in the US, could there be now some people in the US that have shelved the drug in 2004 think that they can reinstate it now if they have no knowlege of that the drug has been taken off the market?
> > > Lou
> > > citation sz1
> > > http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/15/eveningnews/main612150.shtml
> > >
> > Friends,
> > Serzone was known to cause liver failure well befor 2004 and was taken off the market in 2003 in Europe, Canada, Austrialia and New Zealand.
> > But the drug could be still available in the U.S. as a generic and I do not know if it is or is not availble as this is written, but it could be.
> > You see, that drug is from a chemical class called the Phenylpiperazines that I have been wanting to post about here. If one was prescribed a generic form of Serzone, how likely in your opinions could it be that a person receiving the drug as a generic could know that it was a phenylpiperazine as like Serzone if it still being prescribed?
> > I ask in your opinions, could (you could email me for this if you like)
> > Lou
>
> friends,
> Here is the link to the post by DR. Kramer where he writes,[...Serzon's liver problems...are quite rare...] and,[...Serzone is a good drug...].
> Lou
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020327/msgs/101267.htmlfriends,
Scott wrote that he has never seen medical advice given by Mr. Hsiung here.
On the opening page of the {medicine} board, it writes that you can clik on the name of several medicines to get infomation about that drug. Mr. Hsiung has his photographic image on the top of the page. This could IMO give some people the idea that what is on the page is placed there by Mr. Hsiung for the benifit of the members.
When you clck on the drug Serzone (citation sz2) you get a list of many of the things that one could like to know about that drug. Is it advice? The generally accepted meaning of {advice} is that there is infomation given that could help one make a decision. Here in this section about drugs, there is infomation that could IMO help one to make a decision as to take the drug or not. But there is not the infomation there that the drug has been associated with numerous deaths due to liver failure and that the drug was taken off the market in Europe, the U.S. in Canada, Austrailia and New Zealand around 2003-4. So is the advice such that one could have an imformed body of knowlege to make an well-informed decision as to take the drug or not in your opinions? Also, is there not the aspect of that there may be the generic equivalent that could be given by a general practioner that also may not be aware of the drug being taken off the market? Then I ask, why is the section that is on the opening page of the board called Medicine not accurate in terms of this situation that deaths could occure from liver failure by taking the drug?
Lou
citation sz2
http://dr-bob.org/tips/nefazodone.html#side-effects
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 18:07:14
In reply to Lou's reply to Scott's post-dnthtdthrod, posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 17:35:00
> > > > > > > > > > Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing. Consider PB just one more unmoderated blog that is so pervasive on the Internet. I think we should just be glad that this forum exists at all.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > If anyone would care to answer: Exactly what is it that you find it necessary for Dr. Bob to be here?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > What can't you do while he is not here?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > He has no duty to make you happy.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > In the 8 years I've been posting here, I have never seen Dr. Hsiung give medical advice. What else do you need him for?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Simple question: How does Bob's absence affect YOU.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > So far, I've asked this question with other words. No one has attempted to answer it. If you cannot answer this fundamental question, I don't see that there is much to discuss. I think there is a mob mentality here, and I wish people would just talk about themselves rather than allude to some global consensus.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > What do we need Bob for? That's another attempt to get to a straight answer out of somebody. Saying that some percentage of people are mad and sad and lost without our leader, Dr. Bob, does not address the questions I've posed in previous posts.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I hear children whining. It must be me.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > - Scott
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > > It is written here,[...Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing...what is it..for Bob to be here...he has no duty to make you happy...never seen ..giving medical advice...Simple..how does Mr. Hsiung's absence affect YOU...no one has attempted to answer...mob mentality...some global consensus...What do we need Bob for?...hear children whining...].
> > > > > > > > > Let us consider several aspects of this situation here one at a time by the use of established reasoning. One way of reasoning is by comparative analogy.
> > > > > > > > > In an analogy, we could try to compare this communnity with another like community. If we compared this community to , let's say, an emergency room, would there be a proper analogy? Let's try and see.
> > > > > > > > > Let us say that in an ER the main doctor that supervises all the other doctors leaves without saying when he will return and leaves the ER open to be run by his assistants that do not have the expertise as the main doctor and that the assistants do not have authority to act in a final decision as to do a critical surgery or not, for only the leader of those doctors is allowed to decide and the leader did not replace himself before he left with an equivalent doctor.
> > > > > > > > > Then a 17 year old girl is brought in and emergency treatment that the doctors need authorization to perform is delayed because the main doctor has left the hospital that authorizes the procedure or not and the doctors ready to perform need the main dosctor to have his expertise to do the procedure. The family brought their daughter in in an expectation that treatment could be given.
> > > > > > > > > Now in this community here, one could ask as to if an {agency} has been created from the past practice that one could expect.
> > > > > > > > > Memebrs have expected here support and education that is moderated by the leader and that his policy is that his assistants do not have to act and can defer to the leader and that the assistants (deputies) are themselves members that share some of the psychological/emotioanl states that the members came to this community for support for. By the nature that the leader is not responding to pleas from members that have psychological/emotional states that they came to the forum for support and education about, and that notifications have been posted as being outstanding, could we determine if there is the potential that some of those members could slide into deeper depression and hopelesness and other psychotic states from the main administrator not responding to pleas from the members?
> > > > > > > > > Then there is the question of the site being at no cost. Well, what if the ER in question was a free clinic? Would that change anything? If so, what? more...
> > > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > friends,
> > > > > > > > It is written here something like,[...where has Dr. Hsiung posted as a clinician?...].
> > > > > > > > In order to have a determination concerning that aspect here, it is the generally accepted meaning of one to be a clinician if one presents him/her self as being qualified as a doctor or a psychiatrist or psychologist. The email address and such for Dr. Hsiung and his picture can identify him as a doctor and a psychitrist. But there is much more to this.
> > > > > > > > In Mr. Hsiung's TOS he has a section called something like, {what medicine to take?}. In that section, could not some think that Mr. Hsiung is establishing an agency for others to get clinical expertise concerning medicine? If not, why not?
> > > > > > > > And would it depend on if the member or the doctor is giving the opinion concerning the medicine? After all, if you take the position that it is the members, then since Mr. Hsiung could controll the content of the forum, then is there not the potential for one to see a controlled aspect of medictions here? If not, why not? more...
> > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > Let us look a what members here have access to in reagrds to medicines. A member here can click on the following:
> > > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/
> > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > Let us look at the link that members can acccess here concerning advice about medicines and such and if this does or does not have the potential to lead some others to think that there is advice or not concerning clinical pharmacology.
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/experts.html
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > friends,
> > > > > Here is a link where it is th epotential IMO for some others to think that Dr. Hsiung is writing about medication.
> > > > > Lou
> > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20010417/msgs/60424.html
> > > >
> > > > Friends,
> > > > Here is a link to one of Dr. Hsiung's guest experts that members could read about the drug Serzone. Dr. Kramer writes:
> > > > A. Serzone's liver problems are quite rare
> > > > B. Serzone is a good drug
> > > > Now that was written here in 2002
> > > > In 2004, Serzone was taken off the market 9citation sz1) because
> > > > C.liver failure (people die from liver failure and there were 21 deaths linked to Serzone in the US, one possible, a 15 year old girl).
> > > > D.The FDA had forced the manufacturer in 2002 to add a serious liver warning, but problems continued
> > > > E. The drug was taken off the market in Europe, New Zealand, Austrailia and Canada and was continued to be prescribed in the US.
> > > > Now let us reason together here. Has not Dr. Hsiung allowed this post to remain without being updated in the thread that it appears? If so, could a member here be influenced to think that Serzone is a good drug as Dr. Hsiung's expert guest , Dr. Kramer, writes? Could it be determined as to if Dr. Kramer knew about the taking off from the market the drug in 2002 in Europe? Even though the drug has been taken off the market in 2004 in the US, could there be now some people in the US that have shelved the drug in 2004 think that they can reinstate it now if they have no knowlege of that the drug has been taken off the market?
> > > > Lou
> > > > citation sz1
> > > > http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/15/eveningnews/main612150.shtml
> > > >
> > > Friends,
> > > Serzone was known to cause liver failure well befor 2004 and was taken off the market in 2003 in Europe, Canada, Austrialia and New Zealand.
> > > But the drug could be still available in the U.S. as a generic and I do not know if it is or is not availble as this is written, but it could be.
> > > You see, that drug is from a chemical class called the Phenylpiperazines that I have been wanting to post about here. If one was prescribed a generic form of Serzone, how likely in your opinions could it be that a person receiving the drug as a generic could know that it was a phenylpiperazine as like Serzone if it still being prescribed?
> > > I ask in your opinions, could (you could email me for this if you like)
> > > Lou
> >
> > friends,
> > Here is the link to the post by DR. Kramer where he writes,[...Serzon's liver problems...are quite rare...] and,[...Serzone is a good drug...].
> > Lou
> > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020327/msgs/101267.html
>
> friends,
> Scott wrote that he has never seen medical advice given by Mr. Hsiung here.
> On the opening page of the {medicine} board, it writes that you can clik on the name of several medicines to get infomation about that drug. Mr. Hsiung has his photographic image on the top of the page. This could IMO give some people the idea that what is on the page is placed there by Mr. Hsiung for the benifit of the members.
> When you clck on the drug Serzone (citation sz2) you get a list of many of the things that one could like to know about that drug. Is it advice? The generally accepted meaning of {advice} is that there is infomation given that could help one make a decision. Here in this section about drugs, there is infomation that could IMO help one to make a decision as to take the drug or not. But there is not the infomation there that the drug has been associated with numerous deaths due to liver failure and that the drug was taken off the market in Europe, the U.S. in Canada, Austrailia and New Zealand around 2003-4. So is the advice such that one could have an imformed body of knowlege to make an well-informed decision as to take the drug or not in your opinions? Also, is there not the aspect of that there may be the generic equivalent that could be given by a general practioner that also may not be aware of the drug being taken off the market? Then I ask, why is the section that is on the opening page of the board called Medicine not accurate in terms of this situation that deaths could occure from liver failure by taking the drug?
> Lou
> citation sz2
> http://dr-bob.org/tips/nefazodone.html#side-effectsFriends,
Now on the board called medication, there are many medicines listed to click on to get infomation concerning the drug, which IMO could have the potential to be considered by some to be advice about the drug. Another of the drugs is Remeron. Clicking on the link gives infomation but is there the FDA's warning that drugs of that class and others could have the increased risk of suicide to those that take the drug? If not, why not, in your opinons.
The FDA issued a second warning in 2005 that people taking antidepressant drugs be monitored for signs of suicidal thoughts and deepening depression. The FDA ordered manufacturers to place a warning on the lables of all antidepressants detailing those heightened risks (citation FDA1). There has been more about this since 2005.
Now is there this warning from the FDA in Mr. Hsiung's offering infomation about these drugs? If not, why not in your opinions? Is the offering to members to click on the links to get infomation about these drugs considered to be medical advice in your opinions?
Lou
citation FDA1
http://health.dailynewscentral.com/content/view/1199/0
Posted by moonlightsonata2 on March 17, 2008, at 19:58:12
In reply to Lou's reply to Scott's post-sucdrskvdth, posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 18:07:14
What's up with the random letters (non-sensical words) you include in the subject lines of your post? What are they supposed to mean?? Do you just make them up? I don't understand.
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 20:18:21
In reply to question for Lou, posted by moonlightsonata2 on March 17, 2008, at 19:58:12
> What's up with the random letters (non-sensical words) you include in the subject lines of your post? What are they supposed to mean?? Do you just make them up? I don't understand.
Moonlightsonata2,
You wrote,[...random letters..in subject line..What are they supposed to mean?...}
The letters are a code that help me to remember what the subject of the post was so that when I return to it I can recognize it easily. Most of the letters make up the title to a song or a line from a song or some other musical recolection that in my memory will bring back what was in the backroads of my mind.
Let us look at this one that has {wknthedg} in the subject line.
That is my shorthand for [...walkin the dog..] which could bring a memory to me for the content of the post as to what I remebr in my memory from that song of that title many years ago.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 20:20:18
In reply to Lou's reply to moonlightsonata2-gentlnmymnd, posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 20:18:21
> > What's up with the random letters (non-sensical words) you include in the subject lines of your post? What are they supposed to mean?? Do you just make them up? I don't understand.
>
>
> Moonlightsonata2,
> You wrote,[...random letters..in subject line..What are they supposed to mean?...}
> The letters are a code that help me to remember what the subject of the post was so that when I return to it I can recognize it easily. Most of the letters make up the title to a song or a line from a song or some other musical recolection that in my memory will bring back what was in the backroads of my mind.
> Let us look at this one that has {wknthedg} in the subject line.
> That is my shorthand for [...walkin the dog..] which could bring a memory to me for the content of the post as to what I remebr in my memory from that song of that title many years ago.
> Lou
>
> Here is the link for [...wknthedg...]
Lou
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20080204/msgs/816956.html
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 20:30:18
In reply to question for Lou, posted by moonlightsonata2 on March 17, 2008, at 19:58:12
> What's up with the random letters (non-sensical words) you include in the subject lines of your post? What are they supposed to mean?? Do you just make them up? I don't understand.
MLS2,
You wrote,[...do you...?]
I really want to thank you for posting here for no one ever aksed me, there were posters all around but I never heard them ask me...never heard them at all.
Lou
Posted by Phillipa on March 17, 2008, at 21:38:45
In reply to Lou's reply to moonlightsonata2-tlltherwzu, posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 20:30:18
Lou so glad she or he asked as I've always wondered and didn't want to intrude on your privacy and ask. Thanks. Understand you soooooo much better now. Phillipa
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 21:54:29
In reply to Re: Lou's reply to moonlightsonata2-tlltherwzu » Lou Pilder, posted by Phillipa on March 17, 2008, at 21:38:45
> Lou so glad she or he asked as I've always wondered and didn't want to intrude on your privacy and ask. Thanks. Understand you soooooo much better now. Phillipa
Phillipa,
You wrote,[...always wondered...]
You see, the code in the subject line taken altogether over the years paints a picture that can not be seen yet unless one knows the code. I do not think that anyone could figure it out yet for the code is to and from my memory. All of the songs tell of a story, a story that we all know that no one knows who wrote it first. It is a book, a book that goes back before time, a book for all of the ages, a book for the ages to come.
Lou
Posted by Phillipa on March 17, 2008, at 21:58:07
In reply to Lou's reply to Phillipa-hurothebkvlv » Phillipa, posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 21:54:29
Lou I like it a lot of us have our own ways of remembering things. Love Jan night.
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 18, 2008, at 11:42:11
In reply to Lou's reply to Scott's post-sucdrskvdth, posted by Lou Pilder on March 17, 2008, at 18:07:14
> > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing. Consider PB just one more unmoderated blog that is so pervasive on the Internet. I think we should just be glad that this forum exists at all.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > If anyone would care to answer: Exactly what is it that you find it necessary for Dr. Bob to be here?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > What can't you do while he is not here?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > He has no duty to make you happy.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > In the 8 years I've been posting here, I have never seen Dr. Hsiung give medical advice. What else do you need him for?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Simple question: How does Bob's absence affect YOU.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > So far, I've asked this question with other words. No one has attempted to answer it. If you cannot answer this fundamental question, I don't see that there is much to discuss. I think there is a mob mentality here, and I wish people would just talk about themselves rather than allude to some global consensus.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > What do we need Bob for? That's another attempt to get to a straight answer out of somebody. Saying that some percentage of people are mad and sad and lost without our leader, Dr. Bob, does not address the questions I've posed in previous posts.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I hear children whining. It must be me.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > - Scott
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > > > It is written here,[...Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing...what is it..for Bob to be here...he has no duty to make you happy...never seen ..giving medical advice...Simple..how does Mr. Hsiung's absence affect YOU...no one has attempted to answer...mob mentality...some global consensus...What do we need Bob for?...hear children whining...].
> > > > > > > > > > Let us consider several aspects of this situation here one at a time by the use of established reasoning. One way of reasoning is by comparative analogy.
> > > > > > > > > > In an analogy, we could try to compare this communnity with another like community. If we compared this community to , let's say, an emergency room, would there be a proper analogy? Let's try and see.
> > > > > > > > > > Let us say that in an ER the main doctor that supervises all the other doctors leaves without saying when he will return and leaves the ER open to be run by his assistants that do not have the expertise as the main doctor and that the assistants do not have authority to act in a final decision as to do a critical surgery or not, for only the leader of those doctors is allowed to decide and the leader did not replace himself before he left with an equivalent doctor.
> > > > > > > > > > Then a 17 year old girl is brought in and emergency treatment that the doctors need authorization to perform is delayed because the main doctor has left the hospital that authorizes the procedure or not and the doctors ready to perform need the main dosctor to have his expertise to do the procedure. The family brought their daughter in in an expectation that treatment could be given.
> > > > > > > > > > Now in this community here, one could ask as to if an {agency} has been created from the past practice that one could expect.
> > > > > > > > > > Memebrs have expected here support and education that is moderated by the leader and that his policy is that his assistants do not have to act and can defer to the leader and that the assistants (deputies) are themselves members that share some of the psychological/emotioanl states that the members came to this community for support for. By the nature that the leader is not responding to pleas from members that have psychological/emotional states that they came to the forum for support and education about, and that notifications have been posted as being outstanding, could we determine if there is the potential that some of those members could slide into deeper depression and hopelesness and other psychotic states from the main administrator not responding to pleas from the members?
> > > > > > > > > > Then there is the question of the site being at no cost. Well, what if the ER in question was a free clinic? Would that change anything? If so, what? more...
> > > > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > friends,
> > > > > > > > > It is written here something like,[...where has Dr. Hsiung posted as a clinician?...].
> > > > > > > > > In order to have a determination concerning that aspect here, it is the generally accepted meaning of one to be a clinician if one presents him/her self as being qualified as a doctor or a psychiatrist or psychologist. The email address and such for Dr. Hsiung and his picture can identify him as a doctor and a psychitrist. But there is much more to this.
> > > > > > > > > In Mr. Hsiung's TOS he has a section called something like, {what medicine to take?}. In that section, could not some think that Mr. Hsiung is establishing an agency for others to get clinical expertise concerning medicine? If not, why not?
> > > > > > > > > And would it depend on if the member or the doctor is giving the opinion concerning the medicine? After all, if you take the position that it is the members, then since Mr. Hsiung could controll the content of the forum, then is there not the potential for one to see a controlled aspect of medictions here? If not, why not? more...
> > > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > Let us look a what members here have access to in reagrds to medicines. A member here can click on the following:
> > > > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/
> > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > Let us look at the link that members can acccess here concerning advice about medicines and such and if this does or does not have the potential to lead some others to think that there is advice or not concerning clinical pharmacology.
> > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/experts.html
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > friends,
> > > > > > Here is a link where it is th epotential IMO for some others to think that Dr. Hsiung is writing about medication.
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20010417/msgs/60424.html
> > > > >
> > > > > Friends,
> > > > > Here is a link to one of Dr. Hsiung's guest experts that members could read about the drug Serzone. Dr. Kramer writes:
> > > > > A. Serzone's liver problems are quite rare
> > > > > B. Serzone is a good drug
> > > > > Now that was written here in 2002
> > > > > In 2004, Serzone was taken off the market 9citation sz1) because
> > > > > C.liver failure (people die from liver failure and there were 21 deaths linked to Serzone in the US, one possible, a 15 year old girl).
> > > > > D.The FDA had forced the manufacturer in 2002 to add a serious liver warning, but problems continued
> > > > > E. The drug was taken off the market in Europe, New Zealand, Austrailia and Canada and was continued to be prescribed in the US.
> > > > > Now let us reason together here. Has not Dr. Hsiung allowed this post to remain without being updated in the thread that it appears? If so, could a member here be influenced to think that Serzone is a good drug as Dr. Hsiung's expert guest , Dr. Kramer, writes? Could it be determined as to if Dr. Kramer knew about the taking off from the market the drug in 2002 in Europe? Even though the drug has been taken off the market in 2004 in the US, could there be now some people in the US that have shelved the drug in 2004 think that they can reinstate it now if they have no knowlege of that the drug has been taken off the market?
> > > > > Lou
> > > > > citation sz1
> > > > > http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/15/eveningnews/main612150.shtml
> > > > >
> > > > Friends,
> > > > Serzone was known to cause liver failure well befor 2004 and was taken off the market in 2003 in Europe, Canada, Austrialia and New Zealand.
> > > > But the drug could be still available in the U.S. as a generic and I do not know if it is or is not availble as this is written, but it could be.
> > > > You see, that drug is from a chemical class called the Phenylpiperazines that I have been wanting to post about here. If one was prescribed a generic form of Serzone, how likely in your opinions could it be that a person receiving the drug as a generic could know that it was a phenylpiperazine as like Serzone if it still being prescribed?
> > > > I ask in your opinions, could (you could email me for this if you like)
> > > > Lou
> > >
> > > friends,
> > > Here is the link to the post by DR. Kramer where he writes,[...Serzon's liver problems...are quite rare...] and,[...Serzone is a good drug...].
> > > Lou
> > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020327/msgs/101267.html
> >
> > friends,
> > Scott wrote that he has never seen medical advice given by Mr. Hsiung here.
> > On the opening page of the {medicine} board, it writes that you can clik on the name of several medicines to get infomation about that drug. Mr. Hsiung has his photographic image on the top of the page. This could IMO give some people the idea that what is on the page is placed there by Mr. Hsiung for the benifit of the members.
> > When you clck on the drug Serzone (citation sz2) you get a list of many of the things that one could like to know about that drug. Is it advice? The generally accepted meaning of {advice} is that there is infomation given that could help one make a decision. Here in this section about drugs, there is infomation that could IMO help one to make a decision as to take the drug or not. But there is not the infomation there that the drug has been associated with numerous deaths due to liver failure and that the drug was taken off the market in Europe, the U.S. in Canada, Austrailia and New Zealand around 2003-4. So is the advice such that one could have an imformed body of knowlege to make an well-informed decision as to take the drug or not in your opinions? Also, is there not the aspect of that there may be the generic equivalent that could be given by a general practioner that also may not be aware of the drug being taken off the market? Then I ask, why is the section that is on the opening page of the board called Medicine not accurate in terms of this situation that deaths could occure from liver failure by taking the drug?
> > Lou
> > citation sz2
> > http://dr-bob.org/tips/nefazodone.html#side-effects
>
> Friends,
> Now on the board called medication, there are many medicines listed to click on to get infomation concerning the drug, which IMO could have the potential to be considered by some to be advice about the drug. Another of the drugs is Remeron. Clicking on the link gives infomation but is there the FDA's warning that drugs of that class and others could have the increased risk of suicide to those that take the drug? If not, why not, in your opinons.
> The FDA issued a second warning in 2005 that people taking antidepressant drugs be monitored for signs of suicidal thoughts and deepening depression. The FDA ordered manufacturers to place a warning on the lables of all antidepressants detailing those heightened risks (citation FDA1). There has been more about this since 2005.
> Now is there this warning from the FDA in Mr. Hsiung's offering infomation about these drugs? If not, why not in your opinions? Is the offering to members to click on the links to get infomation about these drugs considered to be medical advice in your opinions?
> Lou
> citation FDA1
> http://health.dailynewscentral.com/content/view/1199/0Friends,
It is written here,[...I've never seen Dr. Hsiung give medical advice...].
Does not that bring up as to what is meant by {medical advice}?
When one comes to this forum, there is a wide selection of material offered by Dr. Hsiung that includes his photographic image on the top of the pages where this material about psychotropic drugs could be seen by the member.
One board is called {medication}. This could lead some here IMO to believe that psychotropic drugs are {medication}. But what is the definition of medication?
Let us look at this. The term {antidepresant} could lead some people to believe that there is a drug that helps to rectify some biological abnormalities that give rise to symptoms of depression as they could be led to believe IMO that the drug is a {medicine} for such. This is generally called the {disease centered} idea of the action of psychotropic drugs such as antibiotics as medicines for infections, insulin for diabetes and such that some branches of psychiatry enbrace. But is it fact? This model suggests that antidepressants help restore normal functioning by acting on the neuropathology of depressive symptoms by releving biochemical abnormalities. But is there evidence that the drugs themselves cause abnormal states?....more...
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 18, 2008, at 17:41:12
In reply to Lou's reply to Scott's post-phlthwuhl, posted by Lou Pilder on March 18, 2008, at 11:42:11
> > > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing. Consider PB just one more unmoderated blog that is so pervasive on the Internet. I think we should just be glad that this forum exists at all.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > If anyone would care to answer: Exactly what is it that you find it necessary for Dr. Bob to be here?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > What can't you do while he is not here?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > He has no duty to make you happy.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > In the 8 years I've been posting here, I have never seen Dr. Hsiung give medical advice. What else do you need him for?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Simple question: How does Bob's absence affect YOU.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > So far, I've asked this question with other words. No one has attempted to answer it. If you cannot answer this fundamental question, I don't see that there is much to discuss. I think there is a mob mentality here, and I wish people would just talk about themselves rather than allude to some global consensus.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > What do we need Bob for? That's another attempt to get to a straight answer out of somebody. Saying that some percentage of people are mad and sad and lost without our leader, Dr. Bob, does not address the questions I've posed in previous posts.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > I hear children whining. It must be me.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > - Scott
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > > > > It is written here,[...Dr. Robert Hsiung owes us nothing...what is it..for Bob to be here...he has no duty to make you happy...never seen ..giving medical advice...Simple..how does Mr. Hsiung's absence affect YOU...no one has attempted to answer...mob mentality...some global consensus...What do we need Bob for?...hear children whining...].
> > > > > > > > > > > Let us consider several aspects of this situation here one at a time by the use of established reasoning. One way of reasoning is by comparative analogy.
> > > > > > > > > > > In an analogy, we could try to compare this communnity with another like community. If we compared this community to , let's say, an emergency room, would there be a proper analogy? Let's try and see.
> > > > > > > > > > > Let us say that in an ER the main doctor that supervises all the other doctors leaves without saying when he will return and leaves the ER open to be run by his assistants that do not have the expertise as the main doctor and that the assistants do not have authority to act in a final decision as to do a critical surgery or not, for only the leader of those doctors is allowed to decide and the leader did not replace himself before he left with an equivalent doctor.
> > > > > > > > > > > Then a 17 year old girl is brought in and emergency treatment that the doctors need authorization to perform is delayed because the main doctor has left the hospital that authorizes the procedure or not and the doctors ready to perform need the main dosctor to have his expertise to do the procedure. The family brought their daughter in in an expectation that treatment could be given.
> > > > > > > > > > > Now in this community here, one could ask as to if an {agency} has been created from the past practice that one could expect.
> > > > > > > > > > > Memebrs have expected here support and education that is moderated by the leader and that his policy is that his assistants do not have to act and can defer to the leader and that the assistants (deputies) are themselves members that share some of the psychological/emotioanl states that the members came to this community for support for. By the nature that the leader is not responding to pleas from members that have psychological/emotional states that they came to the forum for support and education about, and that notifications have been posted as being outstanding, could we determine if there is the potential that some of those members could slide into deeper depression and hopelesness and other psychotic states from the main administrator not responding to pleas from the members?
> > > > > > > > > > > Then there is the question of the site being at no cost. Well, what if the ER in question was a free clinic? Would that change anything? If so, what? more...
> > > > > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > friends,
> > > > > > > > > > It is written here something like,[...where has Dr. Hsiung posted as a clinician?...].
> > > > > > > > > > In order to have a determination concerning that aspect here, it is the generally accepted meaning of one to be a clinician if one presents him/her self as being qualified as a doctor or a psychiatrist or psychologist. The email address and such for Dr. Hsiung and his picture can identify him as a doctor and a psychitrist. But there is much more to this.
> > > > > > > > > > In Mr. Hsiung's TOS he has a section called something like, {what medicine to take?}. In that section, could not some think that Mr. Hsiung is establishing an agency for others to get clinical expertise concerning medicine? If not, why not?
> > > > > > > > > > And would it depend on if the member or the doctor is giving the opinion concerning the medicine? After all, if you take the position that it is the members, then since Mr. Hsiung could controll the content of the forum, then is there not the potential for one to see a controlled aspect of medictions here? If not, why not? more...
> > > > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > > Let us look a what members here have access to in reagrds to medicines. A member here can click on the following:
> > > > > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/
> > > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > > > Let us look at the link that members can acccess here concerning advice about medicines and such and if this does or does not have the potential to lead some others to think that there is advice or not concerning clinical pharmacology.
> > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/experts.html
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > friends,
> > > > > > > Here is a link where it is th epotential IMO for some others to think that Dr. Hsiung is writing about medication.
> > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20010417/msgs/60424.html
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Friends,
> > > > > > Here is a link to one of Dr. Hsiung's guest experts that members could read about the drug Serzone. Dr. Kramer writes:
> > > > > > A. Serzone's liver problems are quite rare
> > > > > > B. Serzone is a good drug
> > > > > > Now that was written here in 2002
> > > > > > In 2004, Serzone was taken off the market 9citation sz1) because
> > > > > > C.liver failure (people die from liver failure and there were 21 deaths linked to Serzone in the US, one possible, a 15 year old girl).
> > > > > > D.The FDA had forced the manufacturer in 2002 to add a serious liver warning, but problems continued
> > > > > > E. The drug was taken off the market in Europe, New Zealand, Austrailia and Canada and was continued to be prescribed in the US.
> > > > > > Now let us reason together here. Has not Dr. Hsiung allowed this post to remain without being updated in the thread that it appears? If so, could a member here be influenced to think that Serzone is a good drug as Dr. Hsiung's expert guest , Dr. Kramer, writes? Could it be determined as to if Dr. Kramer knew about the taking off from the market the drug in 2002 in Europe? Even though the drug has been taken off the market in 2004 in the US, could there be now some people in the US that have shelved the drug in 2004 think that they can reinstate it now if they have no knowlege of that the drug has been taken off the market?
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > citation sz1
> > > > > > http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/15/eveningnews/main612150.shtml
> > > > > >
> > > > > Friends,
> > > > > Serzone was known to cause liver failure well befor 2004 and was taken off the market in 2003 in Europe, Canada, Austrialia and New Zealand.
> > > > > But the drug could be still available in the U.S. as a generic and I do not know if it is or is not availble as this is written, but it could be.
> > > > > You see, that drug is from a chemical class called the Phenylpiperazines that I have been wanting to post about here. If one was prescribed a generic form of Serzone, how likely in your opinions could it be that a person receiving the drug as a generic could know that it was a phenylpiperazine as like Serzone if it still being prescribed?
> > > > > I ask in your opinions, could (you could email me for this if you like)
> > > > > Lou
> > > >
> > > > friends,
> > > > Here is the link to the post by DR. Kramer where he writes,[...Serzon's liver problems...are quite rare...] and,[...Serzone is a good drug...].
> > > > Lou
> > > > http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20020327/msgs/101267.html
> > >
> > > friends,
> > > Scott wrote that he has never seen medical advice given by Mr. Hsiung here.
> > > On the opening page of the {medicine} board, it writes that you can clik on the name of several medicines to get infomation about that drug. Mr. Hsiung has his photographic image on the top of the page. This could IMO give some people the idea that what is on the page is placed there by Mr. Hsiung for the benifit of the members.
> > > When you clck on the drug Serzone (citation sz2) you get a list of many of the things that one could like to know about that drug. Is it advice? The generally accepted meaning of {advice} is that there is infomation given that could help one make a decision. Here in this section about drugs, there is infomation that could IMO help one to make a decision as to take the drug or not. But there is not the infomation there that the drug has been associated with numerous deaths due to liver failure and that the drug was taken off the market in Europe, the U.S. in Canada, Austrailia and New Zealand around 2003-4. So is the advice such that one could have an imformed body of knowlege to make an well-informed decision as to take the drug or not in your opinions? Also, is there not the aspect of that there may be the generic equivalent that could be given by a general practioner that also may not be aware of the drug being taken off the market? Then I ask, why is the section that is on the opening page of the board called Medicine not accurate in terms of this situation that deaths could occure from liver failure by taking the drug?
> > > Lou
> > > citation sz2
> > > http://dr-bob.org/tips/nefazodone.html#side-effects
> >
> > Friends,
> > Now on the board called medication, there are many medicines listed to click on to get infomation concerning the drug, which IMO could have the potential to be considered by some to be advice about the drug. Another of the drugs is Remeron. Clicking on the link gives infomation but is there the FDA's warning that drugs of that class and others could have the increased risk of suicide to those that take the drug? If not, why not, in your opinons.
> > The FDA issued a second warning in 2005 that people taking antidepressant drugs be monitored for signs of suicidal thoughts and deepening depression. The FDA ordered manufacturers to place a warning on the lables of all antidepressants detailing those heightened risks (citation FDA1). There has been more about this since 2005.
> > Now is there this warning from the FDA in Mr. Hsiung's offering infomation about these drugs? If not, why not in your opinions? Is the offering to members to click on the links to get infomation about these drugs considered to be medical advice in your opinions?
> > Lou
> > citation FDA1
> > http://health.dailynewscentral.com/content/view/1199/0
>
> Friends,
> It is written here,[...I've never seen Dr. Hsiung give medical advice...].
> Does not that bring up as to what is meant by {medical advice}?
> When one comes to this forum, there is a wide selection of material offered by Dr. Hsiung that includes his photographic image on the top of the pages where this material about psychotropic drugs could be seen by the member.
> One board is called {medication}. This could lead some here IMO to believe that psychotropic drugs are {medication}. But what is the definition of medication?
> Let us look at this. The term {antidepresant} could lead some people to believe that there is a drug that helps to rectify some biological abnormalities that give rise to symptoms of depression as they could be led to believe IMO that the drug is a {medicine} for such. This is generally called the {disease centered} idea of the action of psychotropic drugs such as antibiotics as medicines for infections, insulin for diabetes and such that some branches of psychiatry enbrace. But is it fact? This model suggests that antidepressants help restore normal functioning by acting on the neuropathology of depressive symptoms by releving biochemical abnormalities. But is there evidence that the drugs themselves cause abnormal states?....more...
> LouFriends,
If psychotropic drugs are medicines, as Dr. Hsiung has a board called medication, then the generally accepted meaning of a medication, which is a substance that is used to treat disease, could be looked at here along with that the generally accepted meaning of to practice medicine means that a doctor does things to alleviate or cure a disease by some type of treatment that could be with medicines.
When one drinks alcohol, they may have some of their symptoms relieved, but does that mean that the alcohol corrected a chemical imbalance that was the cause of their symptoms or that the person has a disease? If one drank alcohol for years would they have their symptoms healed? Is in your opinion alcohol a {medicine}?
Now let us look at psychotropic drugs. They may releive some symptoms of distress by causing indifference or blunting of the mind in the short term, or cause euphoria as in opiates in the short term, or sedation and such, but does that mean that those drugs are medicines? If one took the drug for years, what could happen to them, would they be healed of some disease?
My friends, the effects of psychotropic drugs after a short use are well-documented with the possibility that the drugs will cause a disease such as parkinsons-like disease, and neuroleptic malignant syndrome that could lead to death and liver disease and blood disease and other diseases well-documemted in the liturature concerning these drugs along with the possibility of death by overdose and/or suicide. And what could be the quality of the life in relation to peace and joy of a person after years of taking psychotropic drugs?
What are these drugs? Do you know what they are and where they originated from and the reason that they were formulated? If you could know that and would like to, could you email me, for the new rules here make it so that I am unsure if I can post links to this infomation here so that you can make your own determination as to if psychotropic drugs are medicines or not?
Lou
Posted by twinleaf on March 18, 2008, at 20:08:22
In reply to Please be civil/ follow site guidelines » twinleaf, posted by Deputy 10derHeart on March 13, 2008, at 17:49:13
I realize that my post definitely warranted a PBC. However, my post was in response to several earlier posts from gg to me and Adelaide Curtis. If my post deserved a PBC, which it did, why didn't you also give one to gg? In this thread, she sent three offensive posts to Adelaide, and one to me.
As a deputy, we all trust you to handle matters impartially. I am beginning to get the impression that the deputy functions are in danger of being used in a partisan manner. If we speak up to say that we feel the site needs a few words of support from Bob, or if we say that we think it would be better for the security and well-being of posters if deputies do not discuss personal decisions regarding their executive functions on the board while they are in the process of making them, our views are treated with .....well, in order to avoid another PBC, I'll let you choose the adjective.
It is especially important that the deputies act impartially now; in Bob's absence, we are counting on you to carry out the leadership functions of supporting everyone equally, and behaving in a way which will help the board remain calm and as stress-free as possible.
Psychobabble has been so valuable because it has provided a real "holding function" for its members. They have felt supported enough to be able to post very personal messages-well thought out and very candid. In doing this we have all become more vulnerable than we would be otherwise. We have been able to learn a lot from one another because of the excellence of the posting here. It's this quality-a sacred trust which posters have invested in Babble- that we are most in danger of losing. You have only to read rsk's recent post on Psychology to realize the toll this situation is having on a poster who has shared a great deal with us and in the process, has also given us a great deal. It goes without saying that she is not the only one.
Posted by adelaide curtis on March 19, 2008, at 9:33:48
In reply to Re: Please be civil..... » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by twinleaf on March 18, 2008, at 20:08:22
i think it was okay for gg to post in a "tippy toes" uncivil manner because is a friend of dinah., and 10der, and bob.
snicker
Posted by twinleaf on March 19, 2008, at 9:51:46
In reply to yah... » twinleaf, posted by adelaide curtis on March 19, 2008, at 9:33:48
Well, it's probably better not to do it at all, but if someone is going to be partisan, and is trying to put other posters on the defensive, he/she should not be supported by a deputy. Using the word "deputy" in front of your name should mean that you are acting impartially, for the good of the entire site. In the absence of Dr. Bob. we really do count on the deputies to be fair and even-handed. If they use their powers to support certain posters whom they feel close to at the expense of other posters who they don't know as well, it's just an abuse of power.
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 10:53:04
In reply to Re: Please be civil..... » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by twinleaf on March 18, 2008, at 20:08:22
> In this thread, she sent three offensive posts to Adelaide, and one to me.
You've been asked before to follow site guidelines, which include not posting anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
To clarify, this would include not repeating that another poster sent offensive posts.
If you have a problem with another poster's posts, please use the notify administrators function. And if you believe that Administration has not read another's posts in the same way you have, and wish to highlight which portion you believe to be uncivil, please do so in the notification.
We interpret the civility guidelines in view of our understanding of them, and in view of past practice. Different people can read the same post and come to different conclusions. This does not mean they're showing favoritism. I happen to know that 10der is very careful to review her actions, just as I and Racer do.
Dr. Bob allows greater latitude towards incivility with regard to deputies than he does with regard to fellow posters. So please do not characterize other posters posts in negative ways while objecting to the behavior of deputies.
Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 10:56:09
In reply to yah... » twinleaf, posted by adelaide curtis on March 19, 2008, at 9:33:48
> i think it was okay for gg to post in a "tippy toes" uncivil manner because is a friend of dinah., and 10der, and bob.
> snicker
>If you believe a post is uncivil, please use the notification feature to explain why. Posting it on board has been deemed uncivil because it may lead others to feel accused or put down.
Dr. Bob is always free to override deputy decisions. His email is on the bottom of each page. Please feel free to email him if you believe this decision was made in error.
Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
Posted by twinleaf on March 19, 2008, at 11:58:27
In reply to Please follow site guidelines » twinleaf, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 10:53:04
It is very disappointing to be associated with a site which allows certain posters to be hurtful and offensive, but which punishes other posters for pointing that behavior out. In the last two weeks, I have posted about several things. They have been:
1. repeated requests for Bob to make a brief presence here during this crisis
2. requests for deputies standing in for Bob to treat everyone equally and impartially
There have almost no replies or comments from anyone about these issues. As this crisis has gone on and become more serious, I have not noticed anyone- poster or deputy- considering these issues with the aim of restoring Babble to what it was prior to the present crisis. There has been a cascade of problems: a pronounced decrease in the volume of posting, loss of long-time posters, posters not wanting to contribute because of feeling increasingly unsafe, and a marked increase in the number of very angry, hostile posts.
These are very serious, alarming developments. Shouldn't the deputies, who are now responsible for this site in the absence of Bob, be using their energies and intelligence to address these problems, rather than to waste them discriminating against a poster like me who happens to hold different views and has been willing to speak out?
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 12:37:11
In reply to disappointed and disillusioned....., posted by twinleaf on March 19, 2008, at 11:58:27
> As this crisis has gone on and become more serious, I have not noticed anyone- poster or deputy- considering these issues with the aim of restoring Babble to what it was prior to the present crisis.
I think it would be great to hear your ideas. I've think I've contributed everything my own intelligence can think of.
Posted by ClearSkies on March 19, 2008, at 12:44:43
In reply to Please follow site guidelines » twinleaf, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 10:53:04
>
> Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. BobWhy aren't you posting as Deputy Dinah?
Posted by ClearSkies on March 19, 2008, at 12:45:24
In reply to Please follow site guidelines » adelaide curtis, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 10:56:09
>
> Dinah, acting as deputy to Dr. Bob
>
>
Why aren't you posting as Deputy Dinah here either?
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 12:52:57
In reply to Re: Please follow site guidelines » Dinah, posted by ClearSkies on March 19, 2008, at 12:45:24
I forgot to change my posting name.
My apologies.
Posted by twinleaf on March 19, 2008, at 13:14:45
In reply to Re: disappointed and disillusioned..... » twinleaf, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 12:37:11
I think it's tremendously helpful to get off the merry-go-round of warnings and PCB's when we have such big underlying issues, and you just did that for me. Thank you. I don't mean that there isn't a place for them, but they will be much more easily accepted if we begin to get a handle on everyones' uneasiness and anger over our situation here.
Why don't we start a thread asking everyone for their opinions and suggestions? If anyone posts a destructive message, it would require deputy action, but we might go a little easy on other slightly borderline messages, because there is a lot of anger here now which people probably need to find some outlet for. Doing what you just did for me- hearing me, and moving away from the small surface problem to the underlying larger one- was very helpful to me. I felt heard, and helped to channel my own frustration in a more positive way. How about if all the deputies lead the way in doing this- hearing posters and welcoming their suggestions and solutions- from everyone here who wants to participate?
(I'll be away from my computer from now until about 11 PM)
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2008, at 13:18:19
In reply to A ray of hope.... » Dinah, posted by twinleaf on March 19, 2008, at 13:14:45
I think it's a great idea to start a thread asking for ideas. Would you like to start one?
Posted by KAL44 on March 19, 2008, at 23:21:44
In reply to Re: Please be civil..... » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by twinleaf on March 18, 2008, at 20:08:22
I am glad you did not get blocked. I was blocked under a different name sometime back when I suggested there was partisanship. I have not been reading much, and I hope this is not true now. I don't want to think some people can say their mind and others have to be extremely cautious and careful. I hope the deputies will say this is not true.
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