![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 130. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Lamdage on May 26, 2011, at 12:33:54
Hey Guys,
im new here but ive been on this forum before and really liked the idea of this board helping people, and i really appreciated the support i got here. I changed my name due to some privacy issues. Please dont talk about my old name "in public" so i cant be googled here. Pm me if you wanna know.
I took Nardil once before and for me -like many others- it was the only thing that brought depression into complete remission. I know now since docs gave me all sorts of crap. lol
When i took it back then (new nardil) it has caused some issues with instable moods, even manicky at one point. It was very very activating, wich is not per se bad, BUT it was like the "dopamine" was building up to excessive levels, worsening with time. This may be a problem with the new pills disintegrating too fast and therefore too much phenelzine is converted to PEA.. thats what ive been reading. I am planning to add some of the substances of the old formulation, provided that its reasonably priced.
I will post some links until saturday.I cant understand that while there are many ranting (understandable) there are only few who try to overcome the issue with some manipulation of the nardil we have access to.
I will now try to use empty enteric coated capsules (i can provide a link where these can be bought!!) and yeah.. with these enteric coated capsules in theory there might be more mao inhibition and less PEA and therefore more reasonable dopamine levels.
Plus with this capsule thing i can do very fine dosage adjustments. Meaning half and quarter pills. For these reasons i am hopeful to be able to avoid the whole excess dopamine, excess activation and instability issues.Heres the link where these empty enteric coated capsules can be bought at an excellent price.
http://capsules-online.co.uk/store/category.php?id_category=9I will come up with some more details but for now i just wanted to throw this out there, maybe its of some use.
good to be here again :PLamdage
Posted by Phillipa on May 26, 2011, at 12:53:27
In reply to Another Nardil Thread (old-new issue), posted by Lamdage on May 26, 2011, at 12:33:54
Lamdage no idea who you are and your babblemail isn't on so no one can babblemail you. I have another thought on dose what about a compounding pharmacy as getting hormones there, and reading the brochure and website they also do kids meds, adhd med, thyroid meds to make the T3 time release so not dumped into the system, adrenal fatigue hormones, and male hormones even meds for pets and the best is specially formulated pain meds with exact doses of each ingrediant including tylenol in some formulations. Just a thought Phillipa
Posted by Lamdage on June 5, 2011, at 4:23:13
In reply to Re: Another Nardil Thread (old-new issue) » Lamdage, posted by Phillipa on May 26, 2011, at 12:53:27
Hey,
unfortunately i did not find out how to turn on babble mail. Well im the guy who wrote something like nardil epiphany godsent last year and was borderline psychotic a couple days for various reasons. But also the guy who went through alot of positive change and something like 2 years of psychotherapy in 3 month due to nardil.
Another question.. Right now im Taking 225mg bupropion and 150mg venlafaxine.
How am i titrating off those two and onto nardil?
I was thinking to take one pill right away. From my experience i have 0 trouble to go off venlafaxine rather quickly.
Just a thought:
So id take one pill right away and cut the venlafaxine down to 75.
Stay like that for 7 days, then down to 0 venlafaxine and 150mg bupropion.
After 10 days id take two nardil and stay on that until day 15.
After day 15 id take only about 100mg bupropion.
Leave it like that until day 18, after that take 75mg bupropion until day 22. Bump up two 37.5mg nardil and 0 bupropion.Ok its maybe a little too hardcore. But im not going to wait for like 6 weeks thats for sure. Id rather quit venlafaxine right now because i have nil antidepressant activity from it. Ill try to find an Maoi experienced Pdoc but god knows when i will find one...
Input appreciated..
friendly greetings Lamdage
Posted by Lamdage on June 5, 2011, at 6:49:52
In reply to Re: Another Nardil Thread (old-new issue) » Lamdage, posted by Phillipa on May 26, 2011, at 12:53:27
Oh i was once diagnosed bipolar.. wich was horsecrap (sorry i could go rant about pdocs for hours, made very bad experiences).
I was completely pulled off ads twice by pdocs, each time the subsequent depression got deeper. I was on nardil in the very beginning, i chose it and i was precisely spot on.I have severe atypical depression. None of these so called experts used the word atypical. I cant make a diagnosis because im not a doctor? Thats like saying i cant distinguish between apples and potatos because im not a biologist.
So severe 110%atypical depression.
Posted by Lamdage on June 6, 2011, at 19:10:00
In reply to Re: Another Nardil Thread (old-new issue), posted by Lamdage on June 5, 2011, at 4:23:13
Is this thread lost somewhere on the 4th page of this website or is the feeling that ive had (before) legitimate that i am not appreciated here anymore? If so id like to know what has caused this..
Posted by Lamdage on June 6, 2011, at 19:17:49
In reply to Another Nardil Thread (old-new issue), posted by Lamdage on May 26, 2011, at 12:33:54
..
Posted by Phillipa on June 6, 2011, at 21:59:49
In reply to feels unappreciated, posted by Lamdage on June 6, 2011, at 19:10:00
Did anyone answer but me? Posting is way down for quite a while. Phillipa
Posted by floatingbridge on June 7, 2011, at 1:49:41
In reply to feels unappreciated, posted by Lamdage on June 6, 2011, at 19:10:00
Hey, I've written posts and no one has responded. It's difficult for me not to take personally. I do, but I don't think it is really personal.
Phillipa is right. Posting is down this week. Don't give up.
I don't have any experience with the meds you're working with. I wish you the best. Don't give up posting--I'm sorry for the poor babble response. But it may catch the attention of the Nardil knowledgable tomorrow.
If not, maybe start another thread.
Welcome back,
fb
Posted by Lamdage on June 7, 2011, at 15:40:35
In reply to Re: feels unappreciated » Lamdage, posted by floatingbridge on June 7, 2011, at 1:49:41
Hmm maybe your right.. its just sometimes when i speak my mind i still fear getting a physical or mental blow or being ignored. Its sad posting is down because this was a great place to be. . i might be a bit babblespoiled, too.My thread back then drew a lot of attention since my response to Nardil was very profound and i had something what can be called a pretty major epiphany.
It was a very exciting time and hard as it might have been.. i look back to it longingly almost every day. Never before have i felt what it feels like... what my very being feels like. (had to go through alot of childhood trauma) Brief update: I quit relations to my family of origin for good. Experience has shown they wont ever change and are are viciously.. ehm ill put in one sentence: They want to destroy me in some dark way.
Well im waiting for the Nardil to come in like a little child waits for christmas. Im depressed on this venlafaxine-bupropion combo. Like i said due to bad mistakes of responsible doctors and periods of no ADs at all it has gotten even heavier than it was anyway. I need higher dosages now than i used to. Every episode of major depression has picked up where the last one has stopped and no one, not even the so called experts are calling what i have medium anymore. Its rock bottom depression.
Ok to the transition. It shouldnt be taken lightly although what the (non)experts say regarding Maoi.. well its way way overblown. Still its a very powerful med.
Like i said i can kick the venlafaxine out easily since it has like 20% of total AD activity in that mix. bupropion is way more effective for me. Question is.. how long does a significant SSRI action remain after cessation of the drug?
I dont wanna have serotonin syndrome or excess stimulation with bupropion. BUT and this is key: i do not want my underlying depression to get any worse so i want a transition as smooth as possible and i dont want to have a large timeframe where i go almost without AD(s).
Hoping for some knowledge inputLamdage
Posted by floatingbridge on June 7, 2011, at 17:11:21
In reply to Transition: Bupropion/venlafaxine to Nardil??, posted by Lamdage on June 7, 2011, at 15:40:35
Hey, so do you want to know the absolute shortest wash time from these two meds?
Wish I could remember. I think effexor minimum is two weeks. Emergency measures could be different, but I think you'd need a doc who was willing to treat aggressively.
But please don't rely on my information.
As for Bupropione I don't know.I asked similar questions getting off pristiq. You'd think I'd remember. Google the archives if no one else bites.
Good luck and welcome back,
fb
Posted by Lamdage on June 7, 2011, at 18:51:05
In reply to wash time to Nardil from Bupropion + venlafaxine? » Lamdage, posted by floatingbridge on June 7, 2011, at 17:11:21
> Hey, so do you want to know the absolute shortest wash time from these two meds?
>
> Wish I could remember. I think effexor minimum is two weeks. Emergency measures could be different, but I think you'd need a doc who was willing to treat aggressively.
>
> But please don't rely on my information.
>
>
> As for Bupropione I don't know.
>
> I asked similar questions getting off pristiq. You'd think I'd remember. Google the archives if no one else bites.
>
> Good luck and welcome back,
>
> fbHey, yes thats what i want to know.. i know that nardil starts to do some of its magic at about 30 to 45mg. So i wanna have both effexor and wellbutrin washed out at the point when i hit 30mg.
Also is it responsible to do this "seamless transition" strategy i suggested above or should i rigidly wait the washout period(s) before i take the first nardil pill? Or at what point does it start to get irresponsible. This is the core of my question.
Washout is a great word for google.. thanks;)
Grateful Ld
Posted by Phillipa on June 7, 2011, at 20:25:24
In reply to Re: wash time to Nardil from Bupropion + venlafaxine?, posted by Lamdage on June 7, 2011, at 18:51:05
Two weeks washout from other threads have read on nardil. When were you a member and was this your posting name at the time would be interesting to see how you did back then Phillipa
Posted by jedi on June 8, 2011, at 0:14:40
In reply to Transition: Bupropion/venlafaxine to Nardil??, posted by Lamdage on June 7, 2011, at 15:40:35
Lamdage,
I would give the venlafaxine a full two week washout. It has a large effect on serotonin and mixing it with phenelzine without a long washout would be a serious mistake. Bupropion, on the other hand, is a different story. It has very little effect on serotonin. Though contraindicated, I have taken 90mg of phenelzine augmented with 300mg of bupropion with no trouble. I did start low and titrate slowly. Bupropion tends to make me aggressive, which is very unlike my normal personality. I'm not going to recommend that you take the two medications together. But I would think a long washout of bupropion would be unnecessary. Everybody is different, I would suggest researching it further. This is only my experience.
Jedi
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20060927/msgs/691100.html
>
> Ok to the transition. It shouldnt be taken lightly although what the (non)experts say regarding Maoi.. well its way way overblown. Still its a very powerful med.
>
> Like i said i can kick the venlafaxine out easily since it has like 20% of total AD activity in that mix. bupropion is way more effective for me. Question is.. how long does a significant SSRI action remain after cessation of the drug?
>
> I dont wanna have serotonin syndrome or excess stimulation with bupropion. BUT and this is key: i do not want my underlying depression to get any worse so i want a transition as smooth as possible and i dont want to have a large timeframe where i go almost without AD(s).
>
>
> Hoping for some knowledge input
>
> Lamdage
>
>
>
>
Posted by Lamdage on June 8, 2011, at 7:22:35
In reply to Re: wash time to Nardil from Bupropion + venlafaxine? » Lamdage, posted by Phillipa on June 7, 2011, at 20:25:24
Thanks for your input.. i think i will quit taking the venlafaxine pretty much right away. Maybe 2 days on 75mg and than thats it. I think its doing close to nothing.
Aah what the heck i can post the link here.. Just keep the old name out of this fred and we should be fine.
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20100504/msgs/946827.html
Can someone explain how to use babble mail in a nuthsell?
Thanks
Ld
Posted by Lamdage on June 8, 2011, at 7:23:49
In reply to Re: wash time to Nardil from Bupropion + venlafaxine?, posted by Lamdage on June 8, 2011, at 7:22:35
Pls dont revive it though
Posted by jedi on June 8, 2011, at 10:24:42
In reply to Re: wash time to Nardil from Bupropion + venlafaxine?, posted by Lamdage on June 8, 2011, at 7:22:35
> Can someone explain how to use babble mail in a nuthsell?
http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/settings.pl
Posted by Phillipa on June 8, 2011, at 22:28:20
In reply to Re: wash time to Nardil from Bupropion + venlafaxine?, posted by Lamdage on June 8, 2011, at 7:23:49
No problem thanks Phillipa
Posted by Lamdage on June 9, 2011, at 14:36:13
In reply to To turn on babblemail » Lamdage, posted by jedi on June 8, 2011, at 10:24:42
> > Can someone explain how to use babble mail in a nuthsell?
> http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/settings.plThank You! So i will take my last venlafaxine dose tomorrow. Will be interesting to see if i even realize its missing.
Do you something to help me keep depression at bay when i reduce bupropion? I have read bupropion has about 7-10 day washout.
Could use sth. when bupropion is down to like 100-150 and im waiting for nardil to take effect.I got piracetam coming in next week and also modafinil. I think Stablon would be awesome because its only a couple hours and then its out. But i currently cant put my hands on it.
Posted by floatingbridge on June 9, 2011, at 14:50:26
In reply to Sth for temporary depression relief??, posted by Lamdage on June 9, 2011, at 14:36:13
Lamdage,
I think stablon contraindicationed with maoi's.
Short term benzo use?
fb
P.S. I wrote you a long babblemail and lost it. Will write again sometime soon.
Be well. Stay within the speed limits ;-)
Posted by Lamdage on June 10, 2011, at 8:03:22
In reply to Re: Sth for temporary depression relief?? » Lamdage, posted by floatingbridge on June 9, 2011, at 14:50:26
> Lamdage,
>
> I think stablon contraindicationed with maoi's.
>
> Short term benzo use?
>
> fb
>
> P.S. I wrote you a long babblemail and lost it. Will write again sometime soon.
>
> Be well. Stay within the speed limits ;-)Haha yeah i feel ya. Ill be careful.
Sorry about the lost writing.. same thing happens to me all the time.
So benzos can provide relief from depression?? I got the eat alot sleep alot depression
Ld
Posted by Lamdage on June 10, 2011, at 8:09:02
In reply to Re: Sth for temporary depression relief??, posted by Lamdage on June 10, 2011, at 8:03:22
But finally.. the porsche, not the volkswagen. :D:D
Posted by floatingbridge on June 10, 2011, at 12:30:22
In reply to Re: Sth for temporary depression relief??, posted by Lamdage on June 10, 2011, at 8:09:02
Hi Lamdage,
I don't know about benzos bringing you relief. Your signature says anxiety, so it was a quick thought. I don't want to start you on an addiction.
Maybe neurontin (gabapentine) BUT I 'm not sure about maoi contraindications. If you are going on Nardil, you want to be careful any add-on or temporary relief won't slow your transition down.
Please tell me you are working with a doctor, yes?
fb
Posted by Lamdage on June 11, 2011, at 13:00:30
In reply to Re: Sth for temporary depression relief?? » Lamdage, posted by floatingbridge on June 10, 2011, at 12:30:22
> Hi Lamdage,
>
> I don't know about benzos bringing you relief. Your signature says anxiety, so it was a quick thought. I don't want to start you on an addiction.
>
> Maybe neurontin (gabapentine) BUT I 'm not sure about maoi contraindications. If you are going on Nardil, you want to be careful any add-on or temporary relief won't slow your transition down.
>
> Please tell me you are working with a doctor, yes?
>
> fbThere is no doctor for me floatingbridge as i live in a country where Nardil was discontinued due to "severe side effects". Nevertheless Parnate, wich tends to have MORE tyramine risk is available. Its nothin but german ignorance.
Unfortunately Parnate pressures me extremely so its not an option. Yes i am looking for a doctor.. but i dont think its my best bet, because it could very well be id have to see 20 pdocs and have them all mistreat and talk trash to me until i find one that supports me. Ive already been severely mistreated for month (yes by the very people who are supposed to help me) and if i continue to let people mistreat me and beg on my knees, no drug is going to help me anymore.
Please dont tread on me for this fact because i didnt choose it.
Posted by Lamdage on June 11, 2011, at 13:03:05
In reply to Re: Sth for temporary depression relief??, posted by Lamdage on June 11, 2011, at 13:00:30
Besides, i know my nardil better than 19 out of 20 sh*tty german doctors
Posted by floatingbridge on June 11, 2011, at 14:05:30
In reply to Re: Sth for temporary depression relief??, posted by Lamdage on June 11, 2011, at 13:03:05
Lamadge,
I would never tread on you or put you down for anything. I want you to know that. Even if we found ourselves in disagreement, I would work to understand with respect.
Many here have had the experience of sometimes knowing way more about our
own treatment than the doctor we are seeing. It's difficult not to become disheartened or even frightened in my own situation because of the balance of power in the doctors' favor. They hold the script pads.And yet, there are good doctors out there. Ones who will listen to their patients even if the doctors themselves do not have all the answers. Doctors are only human. And each of us and our
illnesses are so idiosyncratic and, at times, difficult as well as difficult to understand. And we all can feel hurt or insulted so easily. You've been through a lot.Parnate, I understand is too stimulating. Can you find a doctor over the German
border to treat and prescribe? It could be worth the drive to get Nardil. If you are able to get out and about. Or can you Skype and have a friends pick up your prescription?Many, many good wishes,
fb
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.