![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by bb154 on June 1, 2011, at 15:26:55
I'm new to this but i'll try to some up my issues in a few paragraph. I've had anxiety issues since i was 16 been on and off meds zoloft, celexa, prozac. i did well on all. I'm now 30. About 3 years ago i began to have racing thoughts. not manic. just always racing music, my own thoughts never grandious or increased energry. In the past year my anxiety turned into depression. with lots of crying racing sad thoughts, general anxiety. panic attacks. I've been on in the past 7 months Wellbutrin-did nothing. lamicta (200) and lithium 900 with zolfoft.Also xanax .25 as needed. the only thing that stopped the crying was the zoloft. Nothing else touched that. Lithium and lamictal did nothing for racing thoughts. My question is. What is this from?? i've never had a manic episode in my life. just anxiety and now depression. i'm on currently on zoloft 150 and pristiq 100. and tapering off zoloft to see if pristiq can stop the racing thoughts. Their next step is trying going with abilify. I'm terrified to try that. There is no clear answer to what my racing thoughts are from. I stress I've never had a manic episode these thoughts are constant but i can still get through the work day and some school. any help would be greatly appreciated. This is beyond frustrating. i feel like a medical guinea pig.
Posted by bleauberry on June 2, 2011, at 10:26:09
In reply to Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bb154 on June 1, 2011, at 15:26:55
frustrating. i feel like a medical guinea pig.
We are all medical guinea pigs, simply because the medical world cannot adequately explain where depression comes from, what has gone awry, or how drugs work when they do or don't when they don't.
Your symptoms could be from a variety of possibilities which include food choices (reacting badly to something but you don't realize it but it is something you eat all the time), genetic insults or flaws, heavy metal accumulation, other toxin accumulation, chronic low grade unsuspected undiagnosed infection (toxins of these kinds of infections are extremely potent causes of psychiatric symptoms).
The medical community does not make hardly any effort to address causes of depression, anxiety, or racing thoughts. They instead focus merely on lessening the symptoms. That strategy itself is a pure guessing game.
Since zoloft helped somewhat, that is at least one clue to work with. Personally I would suggest adding Nortriptyline to it. But you are already on a path for Pristiq. I doubt Pristiq is going to do what you want, but I've been wrong before and would like to be wrong this time. The class of antipsychotics, to which Abilify belongs, makes sense. In that category however I would strongly favor Zyprexa over any of the others. it is, in my opinion, the first line choice, while all the others are backup second line choices. Zyprexa usually works rapidly for symptoms like yours.
What I don't like about us being medical guinea pigs is that somewhere along the line it completely fences us off from a wide array of medicines the earth has already given us. We get into a closed in rather small box in which only psychiatric pharmaceutical inventions are found. There are many plant medicines that have the potential to help you as much or more than the meds. Right off the bat I would have no problem suggesting a combo of 2 or 3 of:
Lemon Balm
Skullcap
Passionflower
Magnesium
B vitamins with emphasis on Niacinamide and B12.In my Lyme battles I accidentally discovered that the plant Japanese Knotweed pretty much puts an end to all anxiety and racing thoughts. Most people have never heard of it. It has the highest concentration of the miracle supplement Resveratrol. I don't think it directly influences any of the neurotransmitters, but its potent antioxidant activity, brain protection activity, and toxin absorbing activity yields unexpected benefits for psych patients. Assuming many of them probably have other issues they are not aware of, it also impacts many of those issues. I'm not outright suggesting this plant, but rather making a point...plant medicines have much more potential than the average person is aware of. This is not evident in the USA hardly at all, but is on par with pharmaceuticals in places like Germany and China.
Posted by B2chica on June 2, 2011, at 12:20:41
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bleauberry on June 2, 2011, at 10:26:09
i bet if you went to 5 different pdocs you'd get 5 varying answers of dx.
i've had similar reactions as you, they've been dx bipolarII, bipolar-mixed, aggitated depression, psychotic depression, OCD, and Extreme anxiety.basically if your racing thoughts are positive it would probably fall under either anxiety or bipolar (my best guess here is anxiety, which i have found kick starts my depression like a speed ball).
i would work on getting anxiety under control and then sleep as well.
i agree with bb about the zyprexa. it has always been a QUICK responder to my out of control anxiety, and also any severe depression going on. I would guess that as your anxiety quiets down as will your racing thoughts.b2c.
Posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 12:40:55
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by B2chica on June 2, 2011, at 12:20:41
wow thanks for all the information. I have also been looking into supplements that my body may be lacking or as you mentioned toxic accumulation. It's just odd that i have not had these racing thoughts most my life. Just in the past 3 years. and now this depression that seems to stem from the racing thoughts manifesting into something my brain just cant handle. I'm doing my best but it's hard to try to work and get back into my schooling which i once did very well in when i have all these lingering questions. It's like my brain in constantly in search for an answer that's just not there. You had mentioned japanese knotweed??? is this something i can buy??? Also with the other things you listed other things..are these safe to take with the meds i'm taking now??? i guessing yes....otherwise you would not have suggested it ha. It's to the point where my dr has suggested ECT...which in my mind i'm a fairly high function person for what i'm having to deal with. I def. agree there is so much medicine in plants that they may even know about but don't want to use....b/c the pharmacutical industry does not want this info getting out there. Anyways thanks you soooo much for the response. i will def look into trying the things you suggested. again thanks :) i will also look into the zyprexa. The racing thoughts are there when i'm not anxious though. just kinda there all the time.
Posted by floatingbridge on June 2, 2011, at 12:54:26
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 12:40:55
I'm sorry this has been going on so long. Sometimes the ssri's/snri's can make 'things' worse. But you did respond to zoloft. Somehow that one keeps coming up as helpful.
I won't venture more suggestions than others have above except for serezone (sp?) but haven't experienced it myself.
Keep us updated if you will. I'd like to hear how you are faring.
Welcome.
fb
Posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 13:06:38
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS » bb154, posted by floatingbridge on June 2, 2011, at 12:54:26
yes. zoloft took me from crying every single day to having some tears once and awhile. The only reason we tried pristiq was to see if that could help the racing thoughts. So far that's a no go. And i feel like if this was some form of mania the lamictal or lithium would have done a little. But it did NOTHING with my depression, anxiety or racing thoughts. at least the zoloft has helped with that. That being said. where do i go from here.i am feeling better, but i'm not even close to what i used to feel like. happy, carefree, some anxiety. nothing i could not handle previous to this. I'm almost apposed to trying antipsychotics. The side effects and risks just seem insane to someone with high anxiety already. I already had a very bad experience with lithium i don't want to go through that again.
Posted by floatingbridge on June 2, 2011, at 13:29:31
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 13:06:38
Well, since you wrote, I confess to an unpopular treatment. Right now I use benzodiazapams (sp!) for anxiety and sleep.
I don't know which is worse, personally, an AP or a benzo. It's a personal choice, and I don't really know. I have limited experience with AP's that failed, so my doc has tabled them, though I still ask
him (when desperate) about risperdal as needed or saphris. I'd be afraid to try only because of my idiosyncratic reactions. I'd have to wait for a weekend when my husband was home and enough benzo to knock me cold if I
reacted poorly.Truthfully, I envy the positive response AP's have for some. I would suggest not ruling them out if you haven't tried them.
They would be easy enough to trial if you're only on zoloft. (My opinion.)
Pristiq didn't help me with the symptoms you described. When 50mg didn't work, 100mg was tried and I cried non-stop, hand-wringing, etc, so I was taken back down. I'm off now and feel better. On emsam.
Are you reconsidering zoloft?
Hang in there.
Posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 14:49:35
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS » bb154, posted by floatingbridge on June 2, 2011, at 13:29:31
i'm on zoloft 150 as of now. and just bumped up my pristiq to 100 to see if that helps. He is lowering my zoloft on fri to 100 then i have an appt next fri to follow up. I luckily have not had terrible side effects from any of the SSRI's. lamictal made me dizzy and seemed more activating then calming. and lithium just really made me feel weird. hard to explain. but the benzos i take .25 alprazolam for anxiety and racing thoughts 3 times daily as needed. They don't make me tired. And i maybe take them once a day. I don't like being on a benzo but since it has done nothing bad so far i'm relieved to have them i guess. Until they find another solution to my over active mind and anxiety. I haven't ruled AP's out. they just scare me i guess. I feel like my diagnosis of mood disorder NOS is kinda bs....meaning no one is really sure what is wrong with me.
Posted by B2chica on June 2, 2011, at 15:22:00
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 14:49:35
just fyi pristiq took terrribly long for me to kick in. the first time i was on it it took 8 weeks this time around (after baby) it was closer to 11 weeks before i felt little better. still needed to augment with something.
i still say to work on your anxiety with whatever means possible. what your on may or may not help that. try something stronger to work on anxiety. once that calms down you can truly see if racing thoughts still exist or if they are manifestation of anxiety (which can increase depression).
try benzo's or AP if you want to go that route.
Posted by floatingbridge on June 2, 2011, at 15:38:30
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS » bb154, posted by B2chica on June 2, 2011, at 15:22:00
Ditto b2chica on the pristiq start up. Seemed like forever!
I also agree w/ this poster about anxiety. Increase benzo as stop gap treatment. I was able to cut way back on klonopin when my anxiety cooled down. And if you get an AP on board that works, an opportunity to cut back on benzos. However you do it, you'll have some medical tools. Who likes to take drugs? It's great to have them though.
Nos. I think that fits lots of folks. In some ways, your nor boxed in by a rush to dx you. You can treat symptoms.
I can fit any number of dx's. Try not to let that get you too down.
Posted by bb154 on June 2, 2011, at 16:25:56
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS » bb154, posted by B2chica on June 2, 2011, at 15:22:00
Are you saying to increase my benzo or try a dif benzo for the anxiety?? i guess...with my symptoms of racing thoughts it honestly doesn't feel like i'm anxious when i have these thoughts...i'm so used to it that it's hard to describe. When i was younger and had anxiety/panic attacks i had physical symptoms with it. This is more just a feeling that my brain won't calm down. just kinda filled with my own conversations and some music. It doesn't prevent me from sleeping most nights. It's just annoying and feels overwhelming considering i have not had this my whole life. Running mind gets me no where at the end of the day. just more questions as to what is causing these thoughts to flow through my head and not quite or stop. Not sure if that makes any sense...? It just feels like i will never be back to my normal self prior to the head racing and depression/anxiety. ps you guys are truely awesome for taking the time to chat with me. It's very much appreciated!
Posted by Zyprexa on June 3, 2011, at 12:37:11
In reply to Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bb154 on June 1, 2011, at 15:26:55
I also would suggest zyprexa! Abilify did not help.
Posted by bb154 on June 3, 2011, at 14:02:57
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by Zyprexa on June 3, 2011, at 12:37:11
is zyprexa a big weight gainer? i'm just wondering why my pdoc suggested abilify as the next step. What are some of the side effects you had on either of these. I just don't want to be put on something if it's not necessary. Like the lithium and the lamictal which honestly did nothing if not make me worse. physically and mentally.
Posted by Zyprexa on June 7, 2011, at 7:10:56
In reply to Re: Diagnosed Mood disorder NOS, posted by bb154 on June 3, 2011, at 14:02:57
Yes, zyprexa is a big weight gainer. But works very effectivly. It also has somnolence(sedation). An alternative is perphenazine which has the same side-effects, minus the weight gain.
Abilify, actualy made me more anxious and panicky. Plus I could not get restfull sleep.
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.