![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 71. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Bob on October 5, 2009, at 22:45:53
I might be behind the curve here, but I recently came across some literature espousing Low Dose Naltrexone for, among other things, fibromyalgia symptoms. The prevailing recommendations suggest taking it some time between 10pm and 2am before going to bed. The theory is that it inhibits endogenous opiate receptors during the time of peak activity during sleep (I guess) thus raising the available levels of endorphins available. The usual doses for things like addiction problems is 50mg, but the LDN regimen calls for building up the dose by 1.5mg increments to a total of only 4.5mg.
Anyway, I'm wondering if anyone here has any experience with LDN. I got the prescription for 1.5mg 3 times per day and took the first pill two nights ago. The next day I woke up refreshed and felt unusually calm and relaxed, yet energetic and focused. All my fibro type aches, pains and muscle problems seemed to evaporate and I was well enough to be able to clean and arrange a significant portion of the house. It was a day like I hadn't had in a long time. Last night I took another single 1.5mg pill and slept like a baby. Today I woke up and was irritated and tired. As the day progressed I felt somewhat weak, had some episodes of sweatiness, and had periods of depression. As good as the first day was, it has all seemed to have evaporated.
Is LDN something that can build over time, or is this second day a bad sign, and an indicator that this is not a good thing to pursue? I am confounded by the good first day and how quicky it seemed to disappear.
Bob
Posted by Phillipa on October 6, 2009, at 0:52:27
In reply to LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Bob on October 5, 2009, at 22:45:53
Bob you know a while back LDN was a hot topic here. May have saved something from the thread. Phillipa I'll look in am.
Posted by Bob on October 6, 2009, at 0:56:06
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Bob, posted by Phillipa on October 6, 2009, at 0:52:27
> Bob you know a while back LDN was a hot topic here. May have saved something from the thread. Phillipa I'll look in am.
Yeah, that's why I said I'm probably behind the curve. It looks like LDN has come and gone and I wasn't really paying attention. I assume it's not really helping people or else we'd still be talking about it.
Posted by Phillipa on October 6, 2009, at 19:47:35
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Phillipa, posted by Bob on October 6, 2009, at 0:56:06
What I found wasn't good info sorry about that. I'd google this site for the discussions in the past. Phillipa sorry
Posted by bleauberry on October 6, 2009, at 20:12:13
In reply to LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Bob on October 5, 2009, at 22:45:53
I have some LDN experience, both from personal use as well as hanging out with other LDN users online.
It is important to respect that LDN accrues longterm benefits slowly. Any initial boost is probably due to some unknown opioid/dopamine/serotonin connection. I felt that too.
The stuff is really powerful. I found 1.5mg was my max dose. Any higher reversed the benefits. I think it is wrong to rush to the doses suggested by others. It is more appropriate to find your own best dose in slow experimentation. LDN is longterm, mistake to rush it.
LDN's primary proposed mechanism is immune modulation/acceleration. This helps fight a wide variety of mysterious complexes such as irritable bowel syndrome, fibro, chronic fatigue, Lyme, other unsuspected infectious bacteria, protozoa, fungi, or virus, MS, and more. Experience shows clearly with a large body of evidence, while analytical research does not (since it hasn't been done) that a significant percentage of all these disorders is caused by an immune dysfunction with a current or past infectious agent as the culprit.
As the immune system is boosted, pathological organisms will be suppressed and killed. That causes die-off. Common symtpoms of die-off include worsened depression, irritibility, oversensitive emotions, anxiety, lack of pleasure, tired, fatigue, insomnia, or oversleep, and worsened pains. All are from the toxic inflammation response.
As stressers are reduced, benefits become apparent steadily. This is usually in the 3 to 6 week range, with perhaps sporadic random moments of feeling good along the journey to feeling more sustained good.
This is a casual non-scientific observation, but it appears to me that approximately 20% of LDN users find it to be a miracle, the next 60% find it to be of significant benefit worth keeping, and the final 20% no benefit. Reports of worsening in any way, depression whatever, are very rare, maybe 5% or less?
So there ya go! Hope it helps.
Hope this helps!
Posted by Bob on October 6, 2009, at 21:26:21
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Bob, posted by bleauberry on October 6, 2009, at 20:12:13
> I have some LDN experience, both from personal use as well as hanging out with other LDN users online.
>
> It is important to respect that LDN accrues longterm benefits slowly. Any initial boost is probably due to some unknown opioid/dopamine/serotonin connection. I felt that too.
>
> The stuff is really powerful. I found 1.5mg was my max dose. Any higher reversed the benefits. I think it is wrong to rush to the doses suggested by others. It is more appropriate to find your own best dose in slow experimentation. LDN is longterm, mistake to rush it.
>
> LDN's primary proposed mechanism is immune modulation/acceleration. This helps fight a wide variety of mysterious complexes such as irritable bowel syndrome, fibro, chronic fatigue, Lyme, other unsuspected infectious bacteria, protozoa, fungi, or virus, MS, and more. Experience shows clearly with a large body of evidence, while analytical research does not (since it hasn't been done) that a significant percentage of all these disorders is caused by an immune dysfunction with a current or past infectious agent as the culprit.
>
> As the immune system is boosted, pathological organisms will be suppressed and killed. That causes die-off. Common symtpoms of die-off include worsened depression, irritibility, oversensitive emotions, anxiety, lack of pleasure, tired, fatigue, insomnia, or oversleep, and worsened pains. All are from the toxic inflammation response.
>
> As stressers are reduced, benefits become apparent steadily. This is usually in the 3 to 6 week range, with perhaps sporadic random moments of feeling good along the journey to feeling more sustained good.
>
> This is a casual non-scientific observation, but it appears to me that approximately 20% of LDN users find it to be a miracle, the next 60% find it to be of significant benefit worth keeping, and the final 20% no benefit. Reports of worsening in any way, depression whatever, are very rare, maybe 5% or less?
>
> So there ya go! Hope it helps.
>
> Hope this helps!
That was a helpful post. It begs the question though as to whether you are currently taking it, and if not, why not?
Posted by morganator on October 6, 2009, at 22:10:48
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » bleauberry, posted by Bob on October 6, 2009, at 21:26:21
> That was a helpful post. It begs the question though as to whether you are currently taking it, and if not, why not?
I am .wondering the same thing.
Posted by bleauberry on October 7, 2009, at 9:57:20
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » bleauberry, posted by Bob on October 6, 2009, at 21:26:21
> >
> > So there ya go! Hope it helps.
> >
> > Hope this helps!
>
>
> That was a helpful post. It begs the question though as to whether you are currently taking it, and if not, why not?
>Excellent question. I am not on it. I was on it for about 3 weeks. During that time I had a roller coaster ride of feeling energetic, peppy and happy, to feeling like I wanted to cry, sometimes these waves were only minutes long, sometimes hours, sometimes entire days. It was obvious some rebalancing of something was occuring and that it was in a good direction and I had every intention of continuing.
Then I increased the dose to 3mg. Bad mistake. Severe depression. Was it a stronger Herx? Something else? I don't know. But it scared me.
The whole while some longstanding skin infections, boil-like, were getting much worse. I knew from hearing from other LDN users that the first month or so commonly includes worsening of existing symptoms, and that the worse they get in early treatment is predictive of the best outcomes in later treatment. It appears to be stage of immunopathology in readjustment. It was the 3mg dose that really scared me away.
Am I to return to it? That is a definite yes. Those minutes, hours, or days of happy energy were totally awesome, probably just a hint of things to come, and I want more of that! But I realize now it must be part of a comprehensive plan in my case, not a monotherapy. I need to include anti-spirochete agents, antifungal agents, antiprotazoal agents, anti-autoimmune agents, and anti-inflammatory agents, as well as continue to sample things that might help depression. This is actually a fairly short list of about 6 different herbs that cover that entire spectrum, all with extremely low toxicity, suitable for longterm use, inexpensive, a large body of evidence spanning generations of experience supporting their efficacy and safety.
I wish I would be in that 20% group that finds LDN by itself to be the miracle, but I think I am in the 60% group that finds it very beneficial but as a component of a comprehensive strategy.
I plan to restart it soon, likely Nov 1. I just got out of surgery and this not a good time to making any big changes for me.
When I do, it will be the 1.5mg dose for at least a month, maybe longer. When I increase it, I will be opening my compounded pharmacy capsules to make my own...increasing in .5mg steps. Going from 1.5mg to 3mg is a 100% increase. Too much for me. I'll go from 1.5mg to 2.0mg, or maybe even 1.5mg to 1.75mg.
Posted by Jimmyboy on October 7, 2009, at 22:07:01
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by bleauberry on October 7, 2009, at 9:57:20
I tried it several times for about a week or two at a time. Probably 3 -4 trials. I had similar response. The first few days woke up with energy and less depressed and more socially outgoing. Within a few days I would get completely exhausted in the mid afternoon and feel like I was going to nod off any minute. Eventually after a weeke or two I would feel very weird kind of like out of body/dissassociation type feelings and feel physically shaky and it seemed to really aggravate my anxiety so I got off it everytime. This could have been a herx like effect or maybe I was getting too much endorphins or dopamine.
But I agree with the above posters that it is a very powerful drug and has the potential to help some folks. It just was not a good drug for myself.
Posted by Bob on October 8, 2009, at 0:47:17
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Jimmyboy on October 7, 2009, at 22:07:01
> I tried it several times for about a week or two at a time. Probably 3 -4 trials. I had similar response. The first few days woke up with energy and less depressed and more socially outgoing. Within a few days I would get completely exhausted in the mid afternoon and feel like I was going to nod off any minute. Eventually after a weeke or two I would feel very weird kind of like out of body/dissassociation type feelings and feel physically shaky and it seemed to really aggravate my anxiety so I got off it everytime. This could have been a herx like effect or maybe I was getting too much endorphins or dopamine.
>
> But I agree with the above posters that it is a very powerful drug and has the potential to help some folks. It just was not a good drug for myself.My experience closely parallels yours, except my super-ultra-sensitivity to meds caused me to have to stop it within 3 days. After the beautiful morning and afternoon of the first day, it all started to go downhill rather quickly. I started getting bouts of depression, anxiety, and irritability.
Disappointing, but not the first drug I've had that type of experience with.
Bob
Posted by Jimmyboy on October 8, 2009, at 9:39:48
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Jimmyboy, posted by Bob on October 8, 2009, at 0:47:17
Agreed, it is disappointing b/c its an interesting and rather ingenius therapy that I hoped would work. By far most of the anecdotal reports I have read, the folks taking it had no bad effects at all just positives that came along gradually with the immune modulating effect But like you said .. if you have foud yourself at this board often you are probably the type that has paradoxical rxn's to meds and are non-responsive or ultra sensitive to everything.
Posted by casse on December 22, 2009, at 12:46:04
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Jimmyboy on October 8, 2009, at 9:39:48
I'm new to this board and have been searching through older threads on LDN. I've been using it off and on since June '09. I can't take the 1.5 mg that is reported to be the minimally effective dose. In fact I just started back on it at .25mg every other night. Some people are so extremely sensitive to meds that they must start very low. Dr. Lawrence ( UK ) uses doses lower than 1.5 mg. for some of his patients.
I'm still fiddling with trying to find the right way to dose, but I'm not alone. There is a new yahoo group dedicated to people who are using very low dose naltrexone. I don't get the mental anxiety from it if I take too high a dose, I just feel ill at ease physically and that can be exhausting. But I feel that way anyway it's just a little worse with LDN sometimes. Overall, I feel that LDN is helpful. I can get out of bed and think more clearly. The initial icky feelings on it make me think "homeopathic" might be accurate in describing it's action.
I've done a lot of reading about Naltrexone, and one outstanding complaint in people on it at 25+ mg. is anxiety. Loss of pleasure is also common. I suspect that even at low doses it might sequester in tissue, resulting in constant blockade of endorphin production instead of the intermittent blockade that is therapeutic. That's why I skip doses. I'm still trying to find what works best.
I compound my own from 50mg tabs in syrup from the pharmacy to get such a low dose. 100ml of syrup ( or distilled water ) makes for .5mg pr 1 ml.
Are you still using it?
Posted by tea on December 27, 2009, at 19:52:17
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by casse on December 22, 2009, at 12:46:04
My poting nick used to be tealady, but I can't recall my email and my password stopped working over a year ago...so I couldnt see how to post other thn to sign up again as tea
> I'm new to this board and have been searching through older threads on LDN. I've been using it off and on since June '09. I can't take the 1.5 mg that is reported to be the minimally effective dose. In fact I just started back on it at .25mg every other night.
> I'm still fiddling with trying to find the right way to dose, but I'm not alone.
me 2 , similar with still fiddling and needing a way smaller dose, and intermittent-maybe until I get mor eused to it
Even at the 3mg dose I get greatly increased depression when I take it as it effects /until it wears off , anxiety too- I think but I havent taken as much lately. also can't sleep at night unitl it wears off, but then sleep very very deeply in morning- its midday now and I'm still reqlly wiped. But after it wears off and I've been on it for a few days it really does give me an increase in energy and I can wear thru the bush and not get tired- havent been able to do that in many years.I was looking here as I was wondering how others cope with going on it.
It does really help with decrease in pain felt.. also I think it may work as they say, but I've only been fiddling-twice now, all I can say it defunutely causes a decrease in pain feltI tried some ldn from India, and I couldn't titrate it in water as it didnt all dissolve and settled to bottom , I presume just the fillers but who knows. To be more sure of an even dose I just broken the tablet up- not precise as yet, but always less than 2mg or so (keep subdividing tablet).. then I took just a few grains on a finger sometimes! Not every day also.
Thinking of buying more accurate scales, but I can only get on ebay up to 1mg , which means, I presume it could be out by 0.5mg in measurement.(they don't specify).PS Lar, I reckon you should look into this stuff, should help you re pain and considering some of your problems seem to have some sorta autoimmune/hormonal posiibility to them.. but if you do, take it really really tiny (less than 1mg) due to the depression reacytion as it works for those few hrs at nighttime..and just stay in bed after you take it... even if you do feel really depressed, and everything is worrying etc, it wears off
Posted by Phillipa on December 27, 2009, at 20:27:50
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » casse, posted by tea on December 27, 2009, at 19:52:17
I saved the link you posted quite a while back on it and it's at the top of my mailbox. Welcome back. Phillipa
Posted by Dr. Bob on December 28, 2009, at 0:46:46
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » casse, posted by tea on December 27, 2009, at 19:52:17
> My poting nick used to be tealady, but I can't recall my email and my password stopped working over a year ago...so I couldnt see how to post other thn to sign up again as tea
Welcome back! I should be able to help you get tealady working again, just email me.
Bob
Posted by tea on December 28, 2009, at 3:22:58
In reply to LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Bob on October 5, 2009, at 22:45:53
> I might be behind the curve here, but I recently came across some literature espousing Low Dose Naltrexone for, among other things, fibromyalgia symptoms. The prevailing recommendations suggest taking it some time between 10pm and 2am before going to bed. The theory is that it inhibits endogenous opiate receptors during the time of peak activity during sleep (I guess) thus raising the available levels of endorphins available. The usual doses for things like addiction problems is 50mg, but the LDN regimen calls for building up the dose by 1.5mg increments to a total of only 4.5mg.
>
> Anyway, I'm wondering if anyone here has any experience with LDN. I got the prescription for 1.5mg 3 times per day and took the first pill two nights ago. The next day I woke up refreshed and felt unusually calm and relaxed, yet energetic and focused. All my fibro type aches, pains and muscle problems seemed to evaporate and I was well enough to be able to clean and arrange a significant portion of the house. It was a day like I hadn't had in a long time.I think the idea with ldn is to take only once a day (ie intermittently so your recptors are not continually dosed - ie they just have the 'hita' lasts no longer than 4 hrs (My understanding) and the response to the blockade of the recptors is what is supposed to help. So 3 times a day would build up and stop working.
Some poeple whose metabolism is a little slow(like hypothryoid) semt o function better ecven taking once every 2 or 3 days.. to allow sufficinet time for recptors not to be blocked. I haven't worked it out as yet myself!
Posted by Green Willow on December 28, 2009, at 22:22:26
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by tea on December 28, 2009, at 3:22:58
I have been taking ldn since early May '09 with great results. It has stopped my RA and spondy and at 3 mg. my health is back to 100% for which I am very happy. However, I do have this deep depressive disorder thingy going on, and I had no idea ldn might be aggrevating that. The other thing that I experience is that I sleep so soundly and well in the morning that it is about impossible to pull myself out of bed before 11 a.m. Sometimes I have strange dreams, usually they are actually bad dreams, but nothing to the extent that would make me want to go off this stuff as the benefit to my auto-immune is unbelievably good. Green Willow
Posted by tea on December 29, 2009, at 5:06:00
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Green Willow on December 28, 2009, at 22:22:26
> I have been taking ldn since early May '09 with great results. It has stopped my RA and spondy and at 3 mg. my health is back to 100% for which I am very happy. However, I do have this deep depressive disorder thingy going on, and I had no idea ldn might be aggrevating that. The other thing that I experience is that I sleep so soundly and well in the morning that it is about impossible to pull myself out of bed before 11 a.m. Sometimes I have strange dreams, usually they are actually bad dreams, but nothing to the extent that would make me want to go off this stuff as the benefit to my auto-immune is unbelievably good. Green Willow
I've been reading/listening to ldn most of the day. It seems a lot of pople are successful at lower than 3mg dose ..like 1.5mg or even 1mg over a longer period of time. I know you started lower and worked up to 3mg, but was that because it wan't effective until 3mg? Do you think it would work as well at say 2.75mg say? or even 2.5mg. One doc was saying we should all aim for the minimal effective does and I agree... not that I've worked it our myself!
Also some are taking once very other day or even once every 3 days better than daily as, I guess, they need that time off for the bounce back (maybe they have a slower metabolism or even slower liver function). Maybe being a bit hypothryoid means I have a slower metabolism.
I've been searching around tonight and found that very low dose forum mentioned on here. Here's the link if you are interested
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/Very_Low_Dose_Naltrexone/message/525 This post is showing that some who have said it stopped working have taken les often or lowered dose and it started working well again.
They are also saying depression is a starting side effect.
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/Very_Low_Dose_Naltrexone/Back to more reading. Thanks for giving me the confidence to continue.
Posted by Green Willow on December 29, 2009, at 20:51:47
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Green Willow, posted by tea on December 29, 2009, at 5:06:00
Thanks for cluing me in to the very-ldn group. I may be at the point where scaling back would be useful. I did a little partying last week and didn't take ldn the nights I had alcohol. I went about 4 nights in a row without taking any ldn and my RA did not bother at all, so I believe it must be building up or have some residual effects. During those 4 days, I did notice short bursts of the pounding heart but nothing that lasted long. By the way, I have been dxd with atrial fib.
Posted by Phillipa on December 29, 2009, at 21:41:32
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » tea, posted by Green Willow on December 29, 2009, at 20:51:47
That's not good are you taking something for it med wise? Love Phillipa
Posted by Green Willow on December 30, 2009, at 21:21:36
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Green Willow, posted by Phillipa on December 29, 2009, at 21:41:32
No, tried a few meds they prescribed and didn't like the effects. At this point it is rare that I have arrhythmias so I don't worry about it, and when I do have them I can usually trace it back to something such as medication that brought on the arrhythmia. About 7 years ago my heart was going wild all the time, but seldom anymore. GW
Posted by casse on December 31, 2009, at 14:08:14
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » Green Willow, posted by tea on December 29, 2009, at 5:06:00
I started back on VLDN last week. I took .25 mg every other day for 4 days, then skipped an extra day before taking only .125 mg (appx.) last night.
The extra day I skipped I felt better than I have in months. But it was sunny for the first time in weeks too....
I seem to feel worse the morning after I use LDN and a bit better the second day as a rule. I decided to try it at the even lower dose every other day and see if that helps. I didn't feel too bad this morning, so maybe the extremely low dose is more appropriate for me.
I have some vivid dreaming and difficulty sleeping if I stay up too long after taking it, but I can't say that it has really disrupted my sleep much. But I also take 50-100 mg of Trazodone every night. My problem is really more with feeling more anxiety symptoms than depression. And the anxiety aggrivates depression for me.
I definitely feel that the LDN is causing an increase in endorphin production, but I'm at a loss as to why this doesn't feel good to me. I never liked the way hydrocodone made me feel either. I didn't feel the wonderful euphoria I read about, it was a hard, icky feeling.
When I'm taking LDN it's hard for me to sleep in, I wake up and feel better if I get up and move. If I don't get up I just feel more and more agitated.
It's so interesting how differently people react to it.
Posted by Elroy on December 31, 2009, at 16:31:59
In reply to LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Bob on October 5, 2009, at 22:45:53
> I might be behind the curve here, but I recently came across some literature espousing Low Dose Naltrexone for, among other things, fibromyalgia symptoms. The prevailing recommendations suggest taking it some time between 10pm and 2am before going to bed. The theory is that it inhibits endogenous opiate receptors during the time of peak activity during sleep (I guess) thus raising the available levels of endorphins available. The usual doses for things like addiction problems is 50mg, but the LDN regimen calls for building up the dose by 1.5mg increments to a total of only 4.5mg.
>
> Anyway, I'm wondering if anyone here has any experience with LDN. I got the prescription for 1.5mg 3 times per day and took the first pill two nights ago. The next day I woke up refreshed and felt unusually calm and relaxed, yet energetic and focused. All my fibro type aches, pains and muscle problems seemed to evaporate and I was well enough to be able to clean and arrange a significant portion of the house. It was a day like I hadn't had in a long time. Last night I took another single 1.5mg pill and slept like a baby. Today I woke up and was irritated and tired. As the day progressed I felt somewhat weak, had some episodes of sweatiness, and had periods of depression. As good as the first day was, it has all seemed to have evaporated.
>
> Is LDN something that can build over time, or is this second day a bad sign, and an indicator that this is not a good thing to pursue? I am confounded by the good first day and how quicky it seemed to disappear.
>
> Bob
>
LDN is not really designed as a primary anti-depression or anti-anxiety agents... though many of its users HAVE reported very positive results in both of those categories as they apply to their individual cases.For some great informational sites and info see the following:
http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/index.htm
http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/index.htm#What_is_low_dose_naltrexone
http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/ldn_and_ms.htm
http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/ldn_and_ai.htmhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_dose_naltrexone
http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/gazorpa/LDNFAQ.html
http://www.emaxhealth.com/1035/39/29168/more-magic-bullet-low-dose-naltrexone.html
http://www.ldnresearchtrustfiles.co.uk/docs/2009.pdf
(A 47-page Booklet of 47 Case Studies of the use of LDN... the booklet, once downloaded, can be printed out))https://ldndatabase.dabbledb.com/page/cancer-researchcopy/ddXxiaHj#
http://www.webspawner.com/users/introtoldn/index.html
These (below) are YouTube video clips on YouTube that are about LDN Therapy that you might find interesting......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAZ1fQKdOC8&feature=related (very good)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRI5f69N2eo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55562cy9fgQ&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT6J0M5GTQ4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVpjsDK0LPA
And ----Tea...
You are taking doses WAY too wrong - WAT too imprecise.
If you take too little, LDN will NOT work...
If you take too much, you reverse the effects that you are seeking....
The way that you are taking it is way too much "rough guessing".
This IS the correct formula to follow EXACTLY) to make a 1 mg dose of LDN (so then you can try 2 mg or 3 mg or 4mg) - 1.5mg is the lowest that ANY of the expert doctors have found to work...
Anyone having "positive effects" on less than that is experiencing the "Placebo Effect":
http://www.webspawner.com/users/howtoobtainldn/index.html
QUOTE:
AllDayChemist (India) http://www.alldaychemist.com/single_product_detail.php?productid=1704&isProductID=156/1(The River Pharmacy buys their Naltrexone tablets from India and then resells them. At the present time, Naltrexone is manufactured by a number of different companies... *)
Once you have a supply of 50 mg Naltrexone tablets, you can convert them as needed to LDN. To do so, fill a graduated cylinder with 50 ml of distilled water (unlike tap or spring water, distilled water contains no impurities that could potentially react with and thus reduce Naltrexone's effectiveness). Pour the water from the graduate into a 4 oz amber glass jar with a tight-fitting lid. Then add a 50 mg Naltrexone tablet. The tablet will mostly dissolve in about five to ten minutes. Since not all of the tablet is soluble in water, instead of yielding a clear solution, the result will be a cloudy suspension. It must be shaken each time before use to evenly disperse all the undissolved particles. One ml of the (shaken) suspension will contain one mg of Naltrexone. Use a graduated baby medicine dropper to measure out the dose you need.
Once a drug passes from a solid to a liquid state, its shelf life can decrease dramatically. Therefore, do not make more than 50 ml of liquid Naltrexone at a time, store it in the refrigerator, and do not keep it for more than a month. The fresher the preparation, the better. Be sure to shake the liquid LDN well before using, and keep it from direct exposure to sunlight.
The medicine dropper should be available in the infant/baby section of your local pharmacy. If you ask politely and are lucky, the pharmacist may (as a gesture of good will) give you an empty 4 oz amber glass jar. Distilled water is sold by most pharmacies, as well as by supermarkets, hardware stores, and convenience stores.
(END QUOTE)One precaution to the above. After initially dissolving the tablet in the specified amount of distilled water and shake it thoroughly to insure the Naltrexone is fully dissolved and disperesed in the solution, do NOT shake it anymore (as in prior to using it). The sediment - particles in the solution when you shake it - are binder substance compounds and several manufacturers use a dietary form of iron powder as one of their binding agent components and that can adversely affect Lupus patients and others with similarly related disorders.
From the Yahoo Group on LDN Therapy:
QUOTE:
Subject: [lowdosenaltrexone] Naltrexone and solutionsFor those of you that prepare naltrexone from 50 mg tablets dissolved in water- I have a strong recommendation for you: do not shake the solution before use. Shake when you prepare it, but once the tablet is dissolved, there is no need to suspend the insoluble portions of the tablet.
This is fairly important for those with Crohn's, but possibly other diseases as well. If the tablet contains iron oxide (the ones we buy do), the iron is very hard on the system. Naltrexone is very soluble; it will already be in the solution- it does NOT settle out. But removing the iron oxide may help those with Crohn's.
I am an analytical chemist, and have discovered this by trial-and-error. Iron supplementation is strongly discouraged for those on the SCD- and there is a very good reason for that. The reason the body is iron-deficient is because it believes it is combating an infection. If the iron as supplements is withheld, one can consume iron-rich foods like red meat, eggs, liver, etc. If the iron is added- particularly as the iron oxide in naltrexone tablets- the result is pain and bleeding, even in very small amounts.
Again- I'm a chemist by training. If you make your own solution, PLEASE do not consume the insoluble sediment. There is absolutely no need to shake the solution right before you consume it- only when you're preparing it for the first time- as the naltrexone is already dissolved.
I hope this helps someone somewhere. Good luck, and best wishes.
END QUOTE(*) The pills you are taking - even though manufactured in India, ALL of them are destined to also be sold under American brand names - and consist of pure Naltrexone Hcl USP, plus whatever used binders - it is the binders that do no dissolve fully in the distilled water, and it must be DISTILLED water... for the formula to work correctly (only as certain mineral content of some tap waters may have compounds which release cause the Naltrexone to dissolve too slowly... it should dump into your system in a rush ... and in that matter, the DIY formula is actually better than the pharmacy compounded tablets.
Posted by tea on January 1, 2010, at 3:30:29
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions » tea, posted by casse on December 31, 2009, at 14:08:14
It sure is interesting to hear how you are going on ldn Casse, and you are different, although lots are reporting that anxiety. Love it if you could keep chiming in occasionally with how you are going.
Best, tea
Posted by casse on January 1, 2010, at 11:57:27
In reply to Re: LDN Low Dose Naltrexone Questions, posted by Elroy on December 31, 2009, at 16:31:59
> This IS the correct formula to follow EXACTLY) to make a 1 mg dose of LDN (so then you can try 2 mg or 3 mg or 4mg) - 1.5mg is the lowest that ANY of the expert doctors have found work...
Actually Dr. Bob Lawrence, a Welsh phyisican with MS uses doses lower than 1 mg for some of his patients. Here's an interview with him regarding the use of LDN in his practice. There are some wonderful interviews with doctors and activists for LDN.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/mary-boyle-bradley/2009/09/29/the-mary-bradley-show
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.