![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 35 to 59 of 74. Go back in thread:
Posted by Sigismund on April 19, 2009, at 0:12:26
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by 4ed on April 18, 2009, at 23:42:02
Now you're talking.
Thank you.
Posted by SLS on April 19, 2009, at 7:04:05
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » linkadge, posted by Garnet71 on April 18, 2009, at 20:32:01
> I meant late onset (as opposed to progressive)
Unfortunately, Major Depressive Disorder and Bipolar Disorder ARE progressive diseases in that symptoms worsen over time. There are also what seem to be neurodegenerative processes that occur over the course of the illness, especially if left untreated. The brains of people who are affectively ill demonstrate differences in structure and tissue volume when compared to those of healthy people. It is a scary thing to consider, but the good news is that many of these brain areas recover upon effective treatment, and although there are residual cognitive differences that can be detected in psychometric examinations, very often the differences are not noticed by the patient.
- Scott
Posted by Larry Hoover on April 19, 2009, at 7:28:02
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by 4ed on April 18, 2009, at 23:42:02
> Let me go out on a limb and tell you all... I was better off taking some MDMA, Ketamine, or Psiylocybin, on occasion. a single dose comibined with accompanying positive set and setting, fixed me for a good while off a single dose.
I'm going to have to agree with your thesis, although I employed LSD. I used to think of it as a mental tonic. The effect lasted a good long while.
Before MDMA became popular as a club drug, it was getting a lot of good scientific press for its use in psychotherapy. Then the "war on drugs" mentality took over.
Lar
Posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on April 19, 2009, at 14:12:38
In reply to Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by newquestions on April 16, 2009, at 9:10:07
Oh God, I know what you're talking about. I have said over and over that I wish I never would have been on an SSRI. I recall the 15 minute consultation I received in 1991, after which the doctor whipped out a prescription pad and prescribed Prozac. What a relevation the med was, for about a year. And after, what hell it has been. I too am sensitive to a ton of meds.
I took a break from all meds in April 2007 and ended up in the hospital in March 2008. A year later I am still trying to recover, as, for once in my entire history, the time I was off meds brought on not just a return of major depression, but skyrocketed anxiety and OCD. I cannot describe the hell I was in. It's too painful and it would be too triggering.
I am so sorry. I don't know what else to say to people's stories of hell on meds--I just want you to know that I understand.
Posted by linkadge on April 19, 2009, at 15:53:13
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by SLS on April 19, 2009, at 7:04:05
>Unfortunately, Major Depressive Disorder and >Bipolar Disorder ARE progressive diseases in >that symptoms worsen over time.
That is simply not true as a general statement.
Posted by linkadge on April 19, 2009, at 16:00:32
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » newquestions, posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on April 19, 2009, at 14:12:38
New research is also showing that SSRI use among adolecents may actually increase depressive behavior in adulthood.
In mice they can acutally induce a model of adult depression by feeding young mice clomipramine or other SSRI drugs. They found that in mice, it leads to a rewiring of conections from the prefrontal cortex to the limbic system.
If the same is true in humans, it may mean we need to rethink the use of SSRI drugs in adolecent depression, especially for extended periods of time.
So when somebody comes on this board and says that they feel that their brain has been permanently altered by medications, why is that so hard for us to digest? From what I have seen, there are a lot of 20 somethings (like myself) who say they were put on SSRI drugs in adolecence and who are only having more problems now. I thinkg its totally possible that the exposure to drugs during that critical period of neural development has lead to some potentially permanat brain changes.
Oh no, my precious prozac would never do anything like that.
Linkadge
Posted by Amelia_in_StPaul on April 19, 2009, at 17:48:42
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by linkadge on April 19, 2009, at 16:00:32
I was put on in it my early 20s and I know that I am altered (in my late 30s).
Posted by connor on April 20, 2009, at 1:24:22
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by linkadge on April 19, 2009, at 16:00:32
I think some people are brain washed, pure and simple. They don't understand how questionable a science antidepressants are. There's no proven chemical imbalance there are just correlations.When people are given ssri's, some people who are depressed go into remission, this doesen't mean that the problem was solved, it just means it happened to treat the symptoms, I could think of a million drugs to take that would make me feel damn good, ssri's just happen to be the agreed upon method
If this was at all scientific, we wouldn't have multiple classes of antidepressants. When you go on an antidepressant you are taking a shot in the dark period. I was put on these medication in my teens, and I lost so many feelings that make a person human. It's as simple as that. They numb your feelings, for some people this doesen't go away after quitting.
Posted by SLS on April 20, 2009, at 7:19:11
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by linkadge on April 19, 2009, at 15:53:13
> >Unfortunately, Major Depressive Disorder and >Bipolar Disorder ARE progressive diseases in >that symptoms worsen over time.
>
> That is simply not true as a general statement.It took me 5 seconds on Medline to come up with this. There are quite a few more. Why do you even bother anymore?
- Scott
1: Int J Clin Pract. 2007 Dec;61(12):2030-40. Epub 2007 Oct 17.Click here to read Click here to read Links
Neurobiology of depression: an integrated view of key findings.
Maletic V, Robinson M, Oakes T, Iyengar S, Ball SG, Russell J.School of Medicine, University of South Carolina, Greer, SC 29650, USA. vmaletic@bellsouth.net
AIMS: The objectives of the present review were to summarise the key findings from the clinical literature regarding the neurobiology of major depressive disorder (MDD) and their implications for maximising treatment outcomes. Several neuroanatomical structures in the prefrontal and limbic areas of the brain are involved in affective regulation. In patients with MDD, alterations in the dynamic patterns of activity among these structures have profound implications for the pathogenesis of this illness. DISCUSSION: The present work reviews the evidence for the progressive nature of MDD along with associated changes in neuroanatomical structure and function, especially for the hippocampus. The role of glucocorticoids, inflammatory cytokines and brain-derived growth factors are discussed as mediators of these pathological alterations. From this integrated model, the role of antidepressant therapy in restoring normative processes is examined along with additional treatment guidelines. CONCLUSION: Major depressive disorder is an illness with significant neurobiological consequences involving structural, functional and molecular alterations in several areas of the brain. Antidepressant pharmacotherapy is associated with restoration of the underlying physiology. Clinicians are advised to intervene with MDD using an early, comprehensive treatment approach that has remission as the goal.
PMID: 17944926 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
Posted by linkadge on April 20, 2009, at 8:11:11
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by SLS on April 20, 2009, at 7:19:11
Do you have any idea what I was saying? I am not saying that some people's mood disorder is not associated with possible hippocamal volume differences, I was only saying that as a general statement this is not true.
For instance, there are many studies such as this one which demonstrate absolutely no difference in hippocampal volume between depressed patients and normal controls.
http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0006322399002966
Maybe if you read the exact phrasing of my claim you wouldn't become so unnecssarily inflamed.
Linkadge
Posted by SLS on April 20, 2009, at 8:58:31
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » SLS, posted by linkadge on April 20, 2009, at 8:11:11
> Do you have any idea what I was saying? I am not saying that some people's mood disorder is not associated with possible hippocamal volume differences, I was only saying that as a general statement this is not true.
>
> For instance, there are many studies such as this one which demonstrate absolutely no difference in hippocampal volume between depressed patients and normal controls.
>
> http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S0006322399002966
>
> Maybe if you read the exact phrasing of my claim you wouldn't become so unnecssarily inflamed.
>
> Linkadge
I have been around research clinicians and have conducted my own research long enough to know exactly how pervasive is the opinion that it is indeed worthy of a general statement. I don't expect everyone to agree nor find it a palatable opinion that affective disorders are progressive and perhaps even degenerative if left untreated. However, it is difficult to refute that the severity of early-onset depression increases with age if insufficiently treated.I guess my statements are merely opinions of opinions. I do apologize that I reacted aggressively to one of your many attempts to discredit me. You have done much worse in the past, so I guess I should cut you some slack.
- Scott
Posted by linkadge on April 20, 2009, at 10:03:18
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » linkadge, posted by SLS on April 20, 2009, at 8:58:31
>I guess my statements are merely opinions of >opinions.
I do apologize that I reacted >aggressively to one of your many attempts to >discredit me. You have done much worse in the >past, so I guess I should cut you some slack.
Attemtps?
My arguement is simply that there is no proof that *all* cases of depression are:
a) chronic
b) degenerative
c) associated with significant structural brain
alterations.If you read the specificity my my statement you will realize it is impossible to refute.
The studies you will find, will point to general *trends* but they are certainly not conclusive about the specific pathology of all depressive disorders.
The study you referenced also makes another sweeping claim that antidepressants "restore" the structural abnormalities in depression. This is unsubstantiated and quite possibly false.
To date there are only a handful of *preliminary* information that show that *some* antidepressants can improve *certain aspects* of brain structure in depression. The only one that comes to the top of my head is a study with paxil on PTSD patients.
Some antidepressants influence certain aspects of hippocampal neurogenesis. This is far from proving that antidepressants do infact reverse the strucal abnormalities associated with certain depressions. I think this is the hope, although there is insufficient evidence at this date to support the notion that this is actually the case.
Linkadge
Posted by 49er on April 23, 2009, at 19:02:46
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » linkadge, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on April 17, 2009, at 1:34:35
Hi Jay,
I am not sure how you can make the statement about drugs causing brain damage not holding up since 2 to 10% of all adverse side effects are ever reported to the FDA.
Also, drug companies have no incentive to do studies on this. To quote Laurie Yorke, the RN who runs the Paxil Progress site that New Questions refers to, the people taking the drugs are the long term studies and no one is collecting the data. I am not sure I am quoting her exactly right but close enough.
Additionally, if doctors routine dismiss complaints by psych patients as part of their illness, how do you expect side effects to ever be reported accurately? I know someone who was involuntarily committed because this person got very frustrated that the psych. wouldn't listen to a complaint about a med side effect. And this is a person who was always compliant about taking some drugs that had horrific side effects.
I don't doubt you when you talk about university students doing well on drugs. They can work great initially. But then there is poopout which happens to most people on psych meds. The brain can only adapt for so long before it starts rebelling.
As far as just dying a few years young, I guess you haven't seen the statistics that patients on psych meds are dying 25 years too early.
And even if you question it, (I don't), Joseph Glenmullen, who is not antimeds, mentions some studies in Prozac Backlash that suggest people start getting neurological damage after long term SSRI use. I don't recall the exact details and I don't claim it is strong research.
But my point is it isn't just an issue of dying a few years young. Actually, my hearing loss from Remeron use and a worsening of LD issues is a perfect example of that.
Anyway, as one who was on 4 meds at one point, I will pass on your advice of a multicocktail. You call it the anti psych meds' sites irresponsible but how is advocating a multi-drug cocktail that has a chance of greatly increasing side effects any more responsible? I know your intentions were good by the way but to be honest, as one who suffered greatly from this multicocktail, I found that very appalling.
Finally, on a different note, I read in another post that you lost your wife and kids in an accident? Sorry, my short term memory is bad.
Anyway, my condolences on your loss. I can't imagine living with that horror.
49er
> > >does worry me that the horror stories are >putting a lot of people off meds who could be >significantly helped.
> >
> > That doesn't worry me one bit. I am still suffering seemingly permanent symptoms very similar to this due to long term SSRI use.
> >
> > I think that it is absolutely critical that people come on and share the full extent of their experiences like this so that potential SSRI users will be able to make informed decisisons about using SSRI's.
> >
> > If all you hear is the rosey storeys that are filtered through drug company websites then there is no way for people to get an acurate picture of the long term safety and efficacy (or lack thereof) of these medications.
> >
> > Linkadge
>
> I think you would consider my story 'rosey' then, as many of those so-called *evil* drugs have helped me, and many others I know. The kind of proper 'cocktail' a good doctor would prescribe has nothing to do with individual drug "fancy stories" put out by drug companies. I honestly think the real reason why many people don't get well is because they don't have a doctor with a depth to use "every arsenal" in combinations that go beyond simplified drug advertising.
>
> I had obtained Abilify, and living in Canada I had to import it. I had amazing success with that med, but unfortunately it's harder to get as it isn't sold here. So, I had to stop a pretty darn good drug.
>
> About 'long term safety'. I think if people where using drugs for 150-200 years, then there may be concern. All of this 'stuff' about people believing they are braindamaged or what, doesn't seem to fold out. I find it very, very irresponsible by those websites that demonize psychiatric medications. I work with a LOT of university students who are also on numerous psychiatric medications. They are completing undergrad and graduate degrees, things that where stopped because of their illness without treatment. I am working on my second undergrad degree right now. There is a beautiful calm that I don't think I even appreciated before treatment, that keeps me focused, able to study hard and write up great research, that I get good marks in. Most of all, I feel content and, yes, happy. Not *all the time*, but quite often/most of time. We don't live much of a long life, anyways, so heck, even if these meds took a year or two off my life, and I could die contented and happy, I wouldn't mind.
>
> I personally have not heard of many people getting *very* well on just one drug. This goes for most mental illness. I knew this actually before I started meds because I had worked on a grant at the Canadian Mental Health Association back in the late 1980's. Polypharmacy, and a fair amount of testing, trial and error, were part of many who got well treatments. Of course, you have to have an openminded doc. I was once going through a REALLY bad, bad time when I first got my new doc. So, he slowly ramped up on a bit of a high dose benzo plus a high dose stimulant. He added two mood stabalizers. That *greatly* got me out of, and through, my tough time. My doc and I still keep that benzo/stim cocktail on our sides, and know it is there if needed again.
>
> Just using one drug seems to be, actually, a not-so-good choice to fight mental illness. (And yes, for all you people on one drug, I don't mean to put you down or anything like that.)
>
> Just IMHO...
> Jay
Posted by linkadge on April 23, 2009, at 20:20:45
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » Jay_Bravest_Face, posted by 49er on April 23, 2009, at 19:02:46
Thats an excellent point - we are the long term study. If nobody believes us, then what are we going to learn?
Linkadge
Posted by sowhysosad on April 23, 2009, at 20:54:44
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » Jay_Bravest_Face, posted by 49er on April 23, 2009, at 19:02:46
> I am not sure how you can make the statement about drugs causing brain damage not holding up since 2 to 10% of all adverse side effects are ever reported to the FDA.
Probably a stupid question, but how do they quantify side effects that AREN'T reported to the FDA?
> I don't doubt you when you talk about university students doing well on drugs. They can work great initially. But then there is poopout which happens to most people on psych meds. The brain can only adapt for so long before it starts rebelling.
Are there any hard-and-fast statistics relating to "poop-out"? I've taken SSRI's for years at a time and have never experienced anything approaching it.
> As far as just dying a few years young, I guess you haven't seen the statistics that patients on psych meds are dying 25 years too early.
But aren't their a million and one different life-threatening conditions that are associated with depression and anxiety? Heart disease, diabetes, stroke etc.
> And even if you question it, (I don't), Joseph Glenmullen, who is not antimeds, mentions some studies in Prozac Backlash that suggest people start getting neurological damage after long term SSRI use. I don't recall the exact details and I don't claim it is strong research.
There's an interesting, balanced discussion about Glenmullen from some years ago here:
Posted by newquestions on April 24, 2009, at 9:40:20
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by sowhysosad on April 23, 2009, at 20:54:44
What is your drug history?
Posted by metric on April 24, 2009, at 17:44:13
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by SLS on April 20, 2009, at 7:19:11
> > >Unfortunately, Major Depressive Disorder and >Bipolar Disorder ARE progressive diseases in >that symptoms worsen over time.
> >
> > That is simply not true as a general statement.
>
> It took me 5 seconds on Medline to come up with this. There are quite a few more. Why do you even bother anymore?
>
I'm sorry, but it's not clear how this abstract is supposed to refute Linkadge's statement.
> - Scott
>
>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17944926?ordinalpos=9&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_DefaultReportPanel.Pubmed_RVDocSum
>
>
> 1: Int J Clin Pract. 2007 Dec;61(12):2030-40. Epub 2007 Oct 17.Click here to read Click here to read Links
> Neurobiology of depression: an integrated view of key findings.
> Maletic V, Robinson M, Oakes T, Iyengar S, Ball SG, Russell J.
>
> School of Medicine, University of South Carolina, Greer, SC 29650, USA. vmaletic@bellsouth.net
>
> AIMS: The objectives of the present review were to summarise the key findings from the clinical literature regarding the neurobiology of major depressive disorder (MDD) and their implications for maximising treatment outcomes. Several neuroanatomical structures in the prefrontal and limbic areas of the brain are involved in affective regulation. In patients with MDD, alterations in the dynamic patterns of activity among these structures have profound implications for the pathogenesis of this illness. DISCUSSION: The present work reviews the evidence for the progressive nature of MDD along with associated changes in neuroanatomical structure and function, especially for the hippocampus. The role of glucocorticoids, inflammatory cytokines and brain-derived growth factors are discussed as mediators of these pathological alterations. From this integrated model, the role of antidepressant therapy in restoring normative processes is examined along with additional treatment guidelines. CONCLUSION: Major depressive disorder is an illness with significant neurobiological consequences involving structural, functional and molecular alterations in several areas of the brain. Antidepressant pharmacotherapy is associated with restoration of the underlying physiology. Clinicians are advised to intervene with MDD using an early, comprehensive treatment approach that has remission as the goal.
>
> PMID: 17944926 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
>
>
Posted by SLS on April 24, 2009, at 19:37:49
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by metric on April 24, 2009, at 17:44:13
> I'm sorry, but it's not clear how this abstract is supposed to refute Linkadge's statement.
Which one?
What do you find not clear?
As for scrutinizing words, my original post was specific name Major Depressive Disorder (MDD) as the illness I was speaking of, and not to the generic word "depression".
Do you refute the progressive nature of MDD?
- Scott
Posted by 49er on April 25, 2009, at 14:29:38
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by sowhysosad on April 23, 2009, at 20:54:44
49er - <<I am not sure how you can make the statement about drugs causing brain damage not holding up since 2 to 10% of all adverse side effects are ever reported to the FDA.>>
>
so why so said <<Probably a stupid question, but how do they quantify side effects that AREN'T reported to the FDA?>>Actually, it is an excellent question with no good answer. I found this thread on pharmalot, http://tinyurl.com/22elxo which discusses the issue. I think the drug rep, Horus Cat, has the best answer about adverse side effects as it is like pornography, as you know it when you see it.
<<Are there any hard-and-fast statistics relating to "poop-out"? I've taken SSRI's for years at a time and have never experienced anything approaching it.>>
As an FYI, I was sure when I was on psych meds that I had never experienced poopout. It was only when I started tapering off of them that I realized that actually, I was starting to experience it. Many people I have encountered have reported similar experiences.
In browsing sites, the experts say 20%. But there isn't a direct link to a study so I won't post the site.
Since these are the same folks who minimize other stuff, I tend to believe it is much higher. But I don't have any proof either.
>
49er <<As far as just dying a few years young, I guess you haven't seen the statistics that patients on psych meds are dying 25 years too early.>>
>
so why so sad<< But aren't their a million and one different life-threatening conditions that are associated with depression and anxiety? Heart disease, diabetes, stroke etc.>>In the latest study on women and heart disease, there was a direct link to the antidepressants they were taking. Of course, that was minimized.
Someone I know who was always very healthy prior to being placed on antipsychotics has developed diabetes, high cholesterol and high blood pressure.
And of course, there was the big lawsuits against the companies of the APS for causing health risks. Sorry, due to insomnia, I am being lazy and not looking it up. But do a google search and you'll see what I am talking about.
I know someone who died from a stroke but this person definitely was not depressed.
Logically, one or two conditions can't be responsible for a million things. Even AIDS and cancer don't do that by themselves.
I think pharma would like for people to believe what you wrote but until I see accessible full text studies by researchers who don't have pharma conflicts, I will have a hard time agreeing.
<<There's an interesting, balanced discussion about Glenmullen from some years ago here:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20000411/msgs/29656.html>>;Thanks, I will take a look at that.
49er
Posted by sowhysosad on April 25, 2009, at 14:55:13
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story... » sowhysosad, posted by 49er on April 25, 2009, at 14:29:38
> In the latest study on women and heart disease, there was a direct link to the antidepressants they were taking. Of course, that was minimized.
>
> Someone I know who was always very healthy prior to being placed on antipsychotics has developed diabetes, high cholesterol and high blood pressure.
>Yeah, AP's are another kettle of fish entirely, and I gather there's strong evidence of a link to diabetes and raised cholesterol.
As for AD's though, I don't doubt "Big Pharma" has tried to play down links to other life threatening conditions as you say. But I'd imagine it's on of those areas where it's pretty hard to prove cause and effect, like the "cannabis causes schiophrenia" debate.
Posted by meltingpot on April 27, 2009, at 14:34:10
In reply to Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by newquestions on April 16, 2009, at 9:10:07
Hi,
I just want to give my story as in a way the opposite happened to me although our stories start off very similiar.
I was 17 when I first started experiencing symptoms of depression and anxiety but from 17 up to 24 I thought I had some mysterious physical condition and was not treated.
Then when I hit 24 I started to get worst and after numerous visits to the doctors, the final time in tears, the doctor prescribed a tricyclic prothiaden.
The drug was miraculous I had such a wonderful response within a short time and felt as though I'd been given a new lease of life. I continued to take prothiaden until about the age of 27 when it seemed to start wearing off. I came off prothiaden and all drugs for a while and although I felt a bit depressed I was in no way as bad as I had been prior to starting prothiaden.
Then when I was put on Seroxat (paxil) again this worked brilliantly. I stayed on Seroxat until around the age of 31/32, at this point I had been reading a lot of scaremongering about SSRI drugs in general and as I was feeling ok, had forgotten what depression was like I decided to give it a go off medication. After a few hairy weeks coming off the seroxat I was back to normal and I spent about 4 years depression/anxiety free.
Then when I hit 35 the depression/anxiety came back with a vengence, this time I was suicidal and it took two years for me to find a drug and dose that worked. Two years later that drug stopped working.
I have to say that I don't know where I went wrong. I do know that I don't regret for a moment ever taking antidepressants as without them my life would not have been worth living. I've had life experiences that I would never have had if I had not taken antidepressants. I think even if I had of had therapy instead of medication then the therapy would not have worked and I would still have been convinced I had a physical illness.
All I can say now, is that I tried doing the right thing and coming off medication completely and still ended up suicidally depressed 3 years later so there doesn't seem to be any set rules when it comes to this horrible, horrible condition.
Denise
Posted by sowhysosad on April 27, 2009, at 15:37:31
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by meltingpot on April 27, 2009, at 14:34:10
> Then when I hit 24 I started to get worst and after numerous visits to the doctors, the final time in tears, the doctor prescribed a tricyclic prothiaden.
>
> The drug was miraculous I had such a wonderful response within a short time and felt as though I'd been given a new lease of life. I continued to take prothiaden until about the age of 27 when it seemed to start wearing off. I came off prothiaden and all drugs for a while and although I felt a bit depressed I was in no way as bad as I had been prior to starting prothiaden.
>
> Then when I was put on Seroxat (paxil) again this worked brilliantly. I stayed on Seroxat until around the age of 31/32, at this point I had been reading a lot of scaremongering about SSRI drugs in general and as I was feeling ok, had forgotten what depression was like I decided to give it a go off medication. After a few hairy weeks coming off the seroxat I was back to normal and I spent about 4 years depression/anxiety free.
>
> Then when I hit 35 the depression/anxiety came back with a vengence, this time I was suicidal and it took two years for me to find a drug and dose that worked. Two years later that drug stopped working.That's really interesting as your pattern of incidences of depression almost mirror mine: ages 24, 30 and 35 (albeit with one in the middle at around 27).
> All I can say now, is that I tried doing the right thing and coming off medication completely and still ended up suicidally depressed 3 years later so there doesn't seem to be any set rules when it comes to this horrible, horrible condition.
Why do you think being off meds is "doing the right thing"? That kinda proves my theory that the anti-med hysteria is causing some people to suffer unnecessarily.
Posted by meltingpot on April 28, 2009, at 11:11:03
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by sowhysosad on April 27, 2009, at 15:37:31
Hi,
What I'm saying is that there doesn't seem to be any right or wrong in all of this, no "If you do such and such then you will be ok".
No Questions initial point was that he wished he'd never taken SSRIs because he feels that the long term use has damaged him. However, I was pointing out that I actually came off them for exactly that reason (concern about damage), thinking if I came off them when I was still well I'd be ok but I actually ended up worse off in the long run.
Who knows if I had never come off a relatively low dose of Seroxat in the first place maybe I would not have slid into a suicidal depression. Would I have protected myself if I had of stayed on them.
I was just arguing in defense of taking antidepressants really because No questions argument seems to indicate that they are bad for you when isn't depression itself bad for you.
Denise
Denise
Posted by sowhysosad on April 28, 2009, at 14:18:12
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by meltingpot on April 28, 2009, at 11:11:03
Gotcha Denise.
The anti-med propaganda is encouraging people to quit their meds too early and causing rebound depression, or even discouraging them from trying meds in the first place and condemning them to a lifetime of suffering. You're living proof of that.
Sure, I agree there needs to be balanced information out there to counteract the volume of drug-company-funded stuff. But, as I said elsewhere in this thread, the negative experiences of a tiny minority of unfortunates (or even out-and-out web scaremongering from some quarters) can be more powerful than reams of rational scientific information.
"Seroxat"? Are you in the UK? Or Canada maybe?
Seroxat (Paxil) is a good example actually. If you believe everything you read on the web you'd think withdrawing from it would inevitably leave you a gibbering wreck with long-term neurological problems. And yet I found it a useful AD and incredibly easy to discontinue, with no issues whatsoever.
> Hi,
>
> What I'm saying is that there doesn't seem to be any right or wrong in all of this, no "If you do such and such then you will be ok".
>
> No Questions initial point was that he wished he'd never taken SSRIs because he feels that the long term use has damaged him. However, I was pointing out that I actually came off them for exactly that reason (concern about damage), thinking if I came off them when I was still well I'd be ok but I actually ended up worse off in the long run.
>
> Who knows if I had never come off a relatively low dose of Seroxat in the first place maybe I would not have slid into a suicidal depression. Would I have protected myself if I had of stayed on them.
>
> I was just arguing in defense of taking antidepressants really because No questions argument seems to indicate that they are bad for you when isn't depression itself bad for you.
>
>
> Denise
>
>
> Denise
Posted by Phillipa on April 28, 2009, at 21:10:57
In reply to Re: Effects of long term SSRI use... My Story..., posted by sowhysosad on April 28, 2009, at 14:18:12
Same here l0mg took tiny bites for about two weeks. thats it. Phillipa
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