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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 5 of 5. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Vincent_QC on December 8, 2008, at 12:42:45
Let me clear this time...my main problem is general anxiety and social phobia.
My new psychiatrist put me on Parnate 3 weeks ago. I only do 4 days on it at 10-20mg...because it was too much stimulant for me, I Was not able to handle the situation. I see him the week after and he put me back in Nardil but only 15mg/day week 1 and 30mg/day week 2...I see him again tomorrow...
Since i'm addict to all the benzodiazepines drugs, and my new psychiatrist wanted me to take more benzo to encounter the exciting side-effect of Parnate, I ask him to put me back on Nardil insistead to increase my Valiums intake and continue with the Parnate...
To finish my long story...I'm on week 2 of Nardil...30 mg and I just stop yesterday, after I had a CAR ACCIDENT!!!
I meet my family doctor last week, it was the one who precribe to me the Nardil back in 2007...he look in my folder and see that after 3 months I was saying back then that I was feeling worse than before I start the Nardil...So I ask myself, why another try on Nardil??? I already do 3 months at 90mg without any improve...so I think I made a mistake...
The CAR ACCIDENT happen because I ask my family doctor to prescribe something for the insomnia and a low dose of Ativan, because my Valiums pills was not strong enought to encounter the dopamine and NE effects I feel with the Nardil (Strange cause back in 2007 I didn't notice this side-effects or this negative energy feeling...). At fisrt I didn't wanted to increase my Valiums intake or having a more potent benzo, since last summer I ended up at the hospital for an abuse of Xanax...and it take a long 3 months to recover from the withdraw on the Xanax...but well I was feeling extremely overstress, especially since the Parnate try... So he give to me a prescription of Seroquel XR, the extend release, 50mg/6hours before bed time and 8mg/day of ativan, if I feel the need to take it...
I start the Seroquel-XR 5 days ago...and yes I sleep more well and I stop having this prematures wake up at 2 or 3 AM...I was able to sleep normal night of 7 hours...But I also notice that I was VERY CONFUSED all day long after...like a real ZOMBIE, I try to take only 25 mg for 2 nights, and I feel the same bad feeling all day long. It's like I lost the contact with the reality...I never felt like this before except when I do panic attacks...you know, the fear to loose the control and to feel out of your body...It's how I feel the day after I take a small dose of Seroquel...I hate it!!! And I have a lot of nauseas...
So the CAR ACCIDENT I had last evening was caused by a really high drop of my cognitives abilities. I was trying to put a CD and adjust the volume level at the same time and I stop looking at the road...When I look at the road again, 10 seconds later, I see that I will miss the exit I had to take...I slow down on the speed and in the "curve" of the exit I lost the control of the car, I was not able to put the break and I was soo much excited that I lost all the control over my body...I was not able to react... Thanks god, I was alone, no car in front of me or behind...and I had no injury...but the car had several dommages (I know that's just a material thing but that was not MY car...).
So today i'm really confuse...because it was the NEW car of my mom...She don't have a lot of money and me either, she wanted to help me, I can take her car when she don't need it, she's nice to do this...and I always told her that I will take of her new car when I borrow it...you understand... So after the car accident, I take my cellphone and call her...She was not happy (but she said that it was not my fault and stop feeling guilty because of the car, it's just a plastic and iron thing)...my dad was not happy because I have no insurrance for the car and he will have to pay for the repair of the car...
So today I feel very guilty, I already feel like this often...but last night and today it's really hard to handle...I'm confuse cause I don't know what to think of the situation...What is the problem ???
Is it me? Is it the Nardil ? Is it the Seroquel-XR? Is it the Ativan? Is it a blend of all of this put together???
What can I do? I have social phobia since i'm 19yo, now i'm 32 yo... I never find anything to help me with my anxiety and my social phobia...Trust me, I do a lot of efforts and I try a lot of things, CTB, pills, therapies...name it...I try everything...
Since I stop the Nardil last Saturday night...and I see my new psychiatrist tomorrow morning (9 december), what I can ask to him and what I say to him???
Did I try again the Parnate and taking more Valiums or Ativan pills to entercount the stimulant profile of this drug? Did I ask to try the Zeldox (Geodon in the USA)...it's seem to have a good reputation for the anxiety problem and social phobia...
I'm very confuse... I have to admit that I take an high dose of Ativan mixed with Valiums last night because I was not able to sleep... so today i'm really slow... and I feel guilty, for the car and for my intake of benzos pills...
Can someone help me and put me in the good way please?... Parnate, Geodon, Lamictal???
The medecine I never try are : Lamictal, Lithium, TCA's except the infamous impramine and elavil (that's not good for social phobia anyway), Geodon (Zeldox in Canada), cymbalta (less potent than effexor-xr and not very helpfull for social phobia)...I never tolerate Effexor, so that one seem to be the same...more NE effet, less SE... And the last one I never try is Luvox, the only one SSRI I never take...ho and the Manerix cause it's not worth the try...
So you can see, the choice is limited...I try everything else...All the antidepressants, anticonvulsives (Lyrica, gabapentin, neurontin), antipsychotic (Zyprexa, Risperdal, Seroquel...), some mood stabiliser...all the benzo drugs avaible in Canada...Nardil, Parnate...
Any help will be appreciate!!!
Thanks !
Vincent
Posted by Phillipa on December 8, 2008, at 13:08:52
In reply to Nardil Stop + Seroquel-xr , Need help!!!, posted by Vincent_QC on December 8, 2008, at 12:42:45
Personally first let me say I empathize with you about the accident. So lucky to have such understanding parents and thank-fully no one injured. Back to meds. I do know it's not conventional now but back in 70's was the only thing that eliminated panic for me was valium 5mg and mephrobamate which no longer used but I didn't abuse and just stopped the mep when felt better continued with valium. Been on low doses of benzos over 37 years. Only ad can tolerate is luvox sedating and potentiates effects of benzos right now increasing from 50 got to l00 and backed down last night to 75mg as only took 75mg first for two nights before increasing to l00mg. Has a short halflife. And don't feel need to increase benzos so maybe try that? I'd personally stay away from stimulants as my pdoc says anxiety is my problem and high anxiety leads to depression in me. Lamictal low dose is also good possibility or trileptal. So you're saying anxiety panic is your problem and don't feel depressed? Love Phillipa hope this helped a bit
Posted by bleauberry on December 8, 2008, at 15:36:02
In reply to Nardil Stop + Seroquel-xr , Need help!!!, posted by Vincent_QC on December 8, 2008, at 12:42:45
It sounds like you are not from USA? Can you get Amisulpride or Sulpiride? I would give those a good look at a dosage of 100mg to 400mg. They stimulate dopamine at low doses, block it at high doses, and a mix of both at medium doses. Being comfortable in a crowd is a common thing they do.
I wouldn't try to think too much about the dopamine thing. I can tell you are scared of that. Those drugs work different than the other dopamine things you have tried. And they are specific for dopamine. Things are too complicated to predict from sitting in a chair thinking about it.
There are other odd drugs to try that can work. Don't spend much time thinking about how they work, just know that they can work. Low dose Naltrexone (1.5mg to 4.5mg at 9pm to 11pm each night, not the 50mg usually used for treating addicts); Serzone; I might mention Mirtazapine but I have doubts about it in your case; Pramipexole; Abilify.
Depakote, Lithium, Lamictal...all good possibilities, but they have a fairly good chance of dulling your cognition. I remember a person here earlier this year who was on a very high dose of Klonopin with no relief. Started taking Lithium and had remarkable improvement so that the Klonopin was hardly needed anymore. This was after failing all kinds of other common drugs.
It might help also to just accept that we are all different. Some people are happy bouncy life-of-the-party; some are quiet in the corner; some prefer to be around people; some prefer to be alone. Rather than trying to want to be somebody else, somebody you were not born to be, accept the way you are and live your life in a way that fits that...for example, a job that is not surrounded by people, not going to crowded places, and such. I am not at all suggesting to just give up and live with it. I am saying keep looking for the right meds but at the same time lower your goals to something that is a compromise between where you are now and where you wish you could be. That way, when a med does finally work good, you will surpass your goals and be even happier than you planned on.
I say, when logical meds don't work, then look at illogical ones that don't make much sense. All too often I have seen people find miraculous cures with meds that usually have nothing to do with their supposed diagnosis. Don't worry about whether they are supposed to work for your symptoms or not. Things are too complicated to figure that out. All the drugs mentioned above are worth looking at and have indeed worked for your symptoms in other people. Here they are again:
Amisulpride, Sulpiride, Lithium, Lamictal, Depakote, Serzone, Klonopin, Low Dose Naltrexone, Abilify, Pramipexole.You might also find that a mixture of low doses of several might be best. A tiny bit of a ssri, a tiny bit of a benzo, a tiny bit of a abilify or amisulpride, a tiny bit of one or two of the 3 mood stabilizers. The synergistic action of them can be more powerful than high doses of any one or two of them. But in a mix like that, stay below the normal doses. Let small amounts doing lots of different things work in harmony. Too many drugs with too much dose is just a real drugged feeling and you don't know what is doing what.
For the natural side of things, try taking magnesium supplements. Either magnesium citrate, magnesium taurate, or magnesium glycinate. Get some glycine and sample those. Get some taurine and sample those. Get some Niacinamide and sample those. All good for anxiety related stuff. Some people have even found these so good they didn't need meds any more, or they needed smaller doses of meds than they used to take.
You are very strong. Try not be frustrated or confused. You have survived what most people could not. That makes you special. God would not have brought you this far if not for some good purpose. One thing you can do is help other people. You know a lot about meds, suffering, trials, recovery, traps, and healing. Lots of other people don't. Friends, neighbors, strangers, whoever. You might find opportunities to use your wisdom to help someone else through a tough time.
Start with the natural things listed above. Add them to your diet. Then start some new meds.
Posted by desolationrower on December 8, 2008, at 23:55:22
In reply to Nardil Stop + Seroquel-xr , Need help!!!, posted by Vincent_QC on December 8, 2008, at 12:42:45
Its good youre ok. It sounds like you may be a bit too worried or frustrated to really give a clear think of what medicines to try, and being willing to take them long enough to see if they really work. Getting a better relationship with a pdoc you trust could be very good.
-d/r
Posted by Phillipa on December 9, 2008, at 21:08:18
In reply to Re: Nardil Stop + Seroquel-xr , Need help!!!, posted by desolationrower on December 8, 2008, at 23:55:22
d/r excellent advise!!!! Love Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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