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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Amigan on January 12, 2008, at 12:27:40
Hi. I challenge you to explain this:
I obtained some selegiline in form of pills and i tried 2.5mg today for the first time. After a while my eyes felt kinda swollen and i was starting to feel drowsy. After 2 hours i was in bed sleeping! I was pretty much alerted before i took the (half) pill and i had slept well last night. I am almost certain that the drowsiness was caused by it.
When i woke up, i took another 2.5mg and i still feel the same.Now, why EVERYONE experiences insomnia, anxiety and agitation with selegiline, while i experience exactly the opposite?
I haven't tried a real stimulant in my life, thus tolerance isn't the issue. I'm a bit disappointed by it, as i was expecting to act like a mild stimulant judging from the testimonies i've read.
Posted by Phillipa on January 12, 2008, at 12:59:24
In reply to Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by Amigan on January 12, 2008, at 12:27:40
Maybe not enough time or a paradoxical reaction? I really don't know other than we are all different. Good luck. Phillipa
Posted by trx resistant on January 12, 2008, at 20:06:49
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.. » Amigan, posted by Phillipa on January 12, 2008, at 12:59:24
I would bet it was purely coincidence. No way could you get through the gut and obtain a blood level with one small pill. go to manufacturer's web or look at Bristol. It takes minimum of 5 days to reach lowest concentration of 20 mg through patch which is most direct route. 15 weeks to reach full blood level of 20mg.
Hey, where are the pharmacologists out there?
Posted by Phillipa on January 12, 2008, at 20:09:30
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by trx resistant on January 12, 2008, at 20:06:49
Good question. Phillipa sure not me!!!!!!!
Posted by amigan on January 12, 2008, at 21:05:40
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by trx resistant on January 12, 2008, at 20:06:49
No, i don't think that it was a coincidence but i can't exclude it 100%. I will continue to take selegiline in the next days to determine it.
I think i will try it sublingual. I read that this way you achive much better absorption, but on the other hand, it might be even more sedating for me as it doesn't get metabolised to l-amphetamine, like it does when you swallow it.
Posted by bleauberry on January 13, 2008, at 13:54:11
In reply to Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by Amigan on January 12, 2008, at 12:27:40
Depending on a person's wiring in the dopamine system, and whether certain receptors are too sensitive or not sensitive enough, dopamine enhancers can have opposite effects. Some people are calmed by ritalin, while others get sped up, as one example.
I think you would need a higher dose and a longer time period to solidly conclude how deprenyl affects you.
There is always the possibility of an allergic reaction. Usually when we think of allergy we think of rashes, hives, stuff like that. An allergic reaction can be a lot of other stuff besides skin. Fatigue and sleepiness is one form of an allergic reaction.
Posted by amigan on January 13, 2008, at 15:35:38
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by bleauberry on January 13, 2008, at 13:54:11
> Depending on a person's wiring in the dopamine system, and whether certain receptors are too sensitive or not sensitive enough, dopamine enhancers can have opposite effects. Some people are calmed by ritalin, while others get sped up, as one example.
You are right. This is what i read on another thread here, while i was searching. It could be that i have too many or too sensitive dopamine AUTO-receptors. Also, i have tried l-dopa in the past and all it did, was to make me vomit.
I wonder if there is any way to overcome this by Blocking the auto-receptors?? Any suggestions are welcome.> I think you would need a higher dose and a longer time period to solidly conclude how deprenyl affects you.
Yes, i'm not giving up yet. Btw, i tried 2.5mg sublingually today and felt sedated again.
No cognition enhancment. In fact, i'm sure it has a negative impact in this field. It makes me feel dull.
No increase in motivation either. It lowers my motivation, instead.
If i compare my experience with the rest of the experiences that i have read, i would say that i'm taking a sort-of anti-selegiline pill!
> There is always the possibility of an allergic reaction. Usually when we think of allergy we think of rashes, hives, stuff like that. An allergic reaction can be a lot of other stuff besides skin. Fatigue and sleepiness is one form of an allergic reaction.Correct me if i'm wrong, but i think that an allergic reaction usually causes agitation, due to histamine release. I'm sensitive to (anti)histamines.
Posted by mav27 on January 13, 2008, at 16:28:38
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.. » bleauberry, posted by amigan on January 13, 2008, at 15:35:38
> You are right. This is what i read on another thread here, while i was searching. It could be that i have too many or too sensitive dopamine AUTO-receptors. Also, i have tried l-dopa in the past and all it did, was to make me vomit.
> I wonder if there is any way to overcome this by Blocking the auto-receptors?? Any suggestions are welcome.Amisulpride will block d2 autoreceptors at low dose (under 100mg). Bocking autoreceptors increases dopamine transmission.
I'm on it at the moment, so far for me it's had a sort of calming yet activating effect, and has helped with my social anxiety quite well but it doesn't feel very strong, on the plus side no side effects at all other than a couple hours less sleep than usual.
Posted by amigan on January 13, 2008, at 17:53:41
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.. » amigan, posted by mav27 on January 13, 2008, at 16:28:38
> > You are right. This is what i read on another thread here, while i was searching. It could be that i have too many or too sensitive dopamine AUTO-receptors. Also, i have tried l-dopa in the past and all it did, was to make me vomit.
> > I wonder if there is any way to overcome this by Blocking the auto-receptors?? Any suggestions are welcome.
>
> Amisulpride will block d2 autoreceptors at low dose (under 100mg). Bocking autoreceptors increases dopamine transmission.
>
> I'm on it at the moment, so far for me it's had a sort of calming yet activating effect, and has helped with my social anxiety quite well but it doesn't feel very strong, on the plus side no side effects at all other than a couple hours less sleep than usual.Good idea. I have read that sulpiride and amisulpride have this property at low doses. I have only tried sulpiride in the past because it's cheaper. Have you ever tried it in order to be able to compare these 2 meds?
My experience with sulpiride is, more or less, like yours with amisulpride: A calming (not sure about activating) effect, which was VERY weak. Hardly distinctable from placebo.. And that was the main reason that made me to stop taking it.
I have had some mild side effects, but only in the beginning.
Is Amisulpride any better? If it is, i might give it try.
Posted by mav27 on January 13, 2008, at 23:02:15
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by amigan on January 13, 2008, at 17:53:41
I've never tried sulpride so i can't compared the two.
By activating i guess i mean it sort of gives me a bit of an urge to do things i normally wouldn't do but that most people would just do without thinking about it. I mean simple things like grooming, making phone calls, talking to family members ect. as i'm usually very withdrawn.
Posted by Darwin on January 14, 2008, at 15:14:44
In reply to Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by Amigan on January 12, 2008, at 12:27:40
I have the same reaction to Selegiline ... it makes me sleepy.
I take 5 mg once or twice a week. When I first started Selegiline, it was mildly stimulating. Later, the sleepiness developed.
I've experimented with taking 10 mg and noticed that the sleepiness vanished. But I would not be surprised if the sleepiness returned after tolerance to the increased dosage developed.
There is little doubt in my mind that this odd reaction that you and I have to Selegiline is real and not due to some coincidence or other factor.
Posted by amigan on January 14, 2008, at 18:29:31
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.. » Amigan, posted by Darwin on January 14, 2008, at 15:14:44
> I have the same reaction to Selegiline ... it makes me sleepy.
>
> I take 5 mg once or twice a week. When I first started Selegiline, it was mildly stimulating. Later, the sleepiness developed.For me, it was sedating from the first dose.
> I've experimented with taking 10 mg and noticed that the sleepiness vanished. But I would not be surprised if the sleepiness returned after tolerance to the increased dosage developed.I will try to take 10-15 mg and see what will happen.
> There is little doubt in my mind that this odd reaction that you and I have to Selegiline is real and not due to some coincidence or other factor.
I have no doubts at all.
Btw, i drink a lot of coffee daily. I don't know if this is a factor or not. I just mention it.
Posted by Phoenix1 on January 14, 2008, at 18:59:51
In reply to Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by Amigan on January 12, 2008, at 12:27:40
> Hi. I challenge you to explain this:
>
> I obtained some selegiline in form of pills and i tried 2.5mg today for the first time. After a while my eyes felt kinda swollen and i was starting to feel drowsy. After 2 hours i was in bed sleeping! I was pretty much alerted before i took the (half) pill and i had slept well last night. I am almost certain that the drowsiness was caused by it.
> When i woke up, i took another 2.5mg and i still feel the same.
>
> Now, why EVERYONE experiences insomnia, anxiety and agitation with selegiline, while i experience exactly the opposite?
> I haven't tried a real stimulant in my life, thus tolerance isn't the issue. I'm a bit disappointed by it, as i was expecting to act like a mild stimulant judging from the testimonies i've read.Now I remember taking 5 and then 10mg oral l-deprenyl, for quite a while (months), not even realizing I should be taking any dietary/medication cautions.
My experience was absolutely nothing. It was like I was taking a sugar pill. I was taking this without a prescription (I know, bad bad me), but it was brand name Eldepryl from a reputable source. No anxiety, stimulation, improvement of depression. Weird. And then I have a massive response to Nardil. Shows you the MAOIs are all quite different.
Phoenix1
Posted by Amigan on January 15, 2008, at 17:13:45
In reply to Re: Selegiline (l-deprenyl) made me SLEEPY!.., posted by amigan on January 14, 2008, at 18:29:31
I took 12.5mg yesterday.
I didn't felt drowsiness this time! I'm not sure if i notice any stimulation at all, but i don't feel the need to drink coffee as i usually do.I have a question: I read that at high doses, it acts like Parnate. How much Selegiline should i take to achive a Parnate effect? How safe is it?
Posted by Lunette on September 6, 2012, at 16:41:14
In reply to Re: Trying a higher dose.., posted by Amigan on January 15, 2008, at 17:13:45
I have been taking Selegiline for several months now. I am particularly sensitive to meds so I started on a micro dose of just 1.25 and have increasing the dosage in micro increments and am now on 15mg. It still makes me sleepy so I only take it in the evening and at night. But I was wondering if I go up to a therapeutic dosage of say 20mg will it become more activating? I wonder if anyone else has found this. I will be going up to 17.5 next month and then finally 20mg.
I am actually grateful that it helps me sleep at night as there was hardly anything that worked for my insomnia other than gabapentin. I can not tolerate most sleep meds and in fact they often have paradoxical effect for me.
anyway.. I am hoping that I will be less sleepy during the day but also be able to sleep at night... finding the right balance and cocktail is really challenging for someone like me
anyone else have any suggestions?
This is the end of the thread.
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