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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 7 to 31 of 31. Go back in thread:
Posted by linkadge on April 26, 2007, at 15:02:05
In reply to JFK THEORY: Smaller doses have stronger effect » Sandra62, posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 26, 2007, at 11:46:31
Often seroquel does not help me sleep. Its like it shuts off half of my brain and keeps the other half awake. I don't want to knock it if others find it usefull, I just want to share my experience.
I also get some of the worst rebound from seroquel withdrawl. Intense otherworldy anxiety.
Benzos seem to be the best thing to get me to sleep.
I need a benzo on average twice a week.
Linkadge
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 26, 2007, at 18:41:38
In reply to Re: JFK THEORY: Smaller doses have stronger effect, posted by linkadge on April 26, 2007, at 15:02:05
If you do, Seroquel could cause the opposite effect, such as insomnia. I was just talking about taking Seroquel and nothing else, not even an aspirin.
Posted by crenshaw387 on April 26, 2007, at 19:32:19
In reply to Re: JFK THEORY: Take any other meds? » linkadge, posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 26, 2007, at 18:41:38
wow thanks everyone sounds like seroquel is some good stuff... im trying to stay away from benzos because i have a huge tolerance for them and constantly need more... and when i quit them last time it wasnt fun =] again thank you everyone =]
Posted by linkadge on April 26, 2007, at 20:48:09
In reply to Re: JFK THEORY: Take any other meds? » linkadge, posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 26, 2007, at 18:41:38
I've taken seroqel alone too, and had mixed sucess. I do not really do well on antihistamines. Regular antihistamines cause paradoxical excitation in me.
Seroquel made me drowsy and really sedated, but didn't acutally make me loose contiousness.
Linkadge
Posted by CA 2 NJ on April 27, 2007, at 17:14:04
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia » crenshaw387, posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 26, 2007, at 3:02:11
I too take Seroquel for sleep in addition to Lunesta (which I personally don't think I need).
Someone mentioned refractory (I think that's it) anxiety when the Seroquel wears off. Well I know Seroquel only lasts 8-12 hours so would that mean that some are more prone to anxiety once the Seroquel wears off? Because I have noticed my anxiety level went up when I started using Seroquel as a sleep aid.
If anyone has any knowledge of this, I would really appreciate it as this is something I have been wondering about. I want to completely get off Seroquel as I already use Lunesta for sleep and seem like I am in bed 12-14 hours a day now. Plus I feel like I'm overpaying for 2 High-Priced sleep aids.
Thanks all! I hope to hear from someone soon! Take care and have a great weekend!
Hugs,
CA 2 NJ> Thats just my opinion.
>
> I think if you are NOT taking any other meds, and you take as little as 25mg of Seroquel, you will most certainly fall asleep and probably have the best night of sleep of your life.
>
> The best thing about Seroquel is that you will know the first day or so if it works, not 8-12 weeks.
>
> zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz :) Michael
Posted by CA 2 NJ on April 27, 2007, at 17:17:45
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia, posted by CA 2 NJ on April 27, 2007, at 17:14:04
LOL Make that "Rebound" Anxiety. :)
> I too take Seroquel for sleep in addition to Lunesta (which I personally don't think I need).
>
> Someone mentioned refractory (I think that's it) anxiety when the Seroquel wears off. Well I know Seroquel only lasts 8-12 hours so would that mean that some are more prone to anxiety once the Seroquel wears off? Because I have noticed my anxiety level went up when I started using Seroquel as a sleep aid.
>
> If anyone has any knowledge of this, I would really appreciate it as this is something I have been wondering about. I want to completely get off Seroquel as I already use Lunesta for sleep and seem like I am in bed 12-14 hours a day now. Plus I feel like I'm overpaying for 2 High-Priced sleep aids.
>
> Thanks all! I hope to hear from someone soon! Take care and have a great weekend!
>
>
> Hugs,
> CA 2 NJ
>
>
>
> > Thats just my opinion.
> >
> > I think if you are NOT taking any other meds, and you take as little as 25mg of Seroquel, you will most certainly fall asleep and probably have the best night of sleep of your life.
> >
> > The best thing about Seroquel is that you will know the first day or so if it works, not 8-12 weeks.
> >
> > zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz :) Michael
>
>
Posted by crenshaw387 on April 27, 2007, at 20:27:02
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia » CA 2 NJ, posted by CA 2 NJ on April 27, 2007, at 17:17:45
once i get to sleep even if im woken i can easily go back to sleep.... i just have the hardest time falling asleep at a consistent time... i get up every morning at 7 and want to go to sleep at like 10-11 actual time i fall asleep is usually between 1am and 6am... if at all... its like i feel tired but then get in bed and close my eyes and suddenly i feel like im full of energy and should be up doing something...
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 28, 2007, at 0:19:16
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia » CA 2 NJ, posted by CA 2 NJ on April 27, 2007, at 17:17:45
Taken alone with no other meds, there is just no way that Seroquel will increase anxiety in anybody.
However, everything changes when you mix it with other drugs. Heck, like I mentioned at the top, if you take Seroquel with some drugs (I have no idea which ones), it could even cause insomnia.
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 1, 2007, at 15:50:11
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia » crenshaw387, posted by UgottaHaveHope on April 26, 2007, at 3:02:11
Seroquel is far from being an ideal treatment for insomnia. Just for a start it's.......expensive, causes daytime drowsiness, weight gain etc.
Ed
Posted by CA 2 NJ on May 1, 2007, at 16:44:39
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia, posted by kaleidoscope on May 1, 2007, at 15:50:11
I agree! I mean everything Ed says seems to be true for me.
Is Trazadone a better alternative? I may ask my new Psychiatrist about it as Lunesta doesn't really work all that wonderfully. Is Ambien any better?
I would ask about Remeron but I hear that promotes big-time weight gain. I don't need any help in that department!
So is it possible to take Trazadone at night if I take 75mg of Effexor XR during the day?
> Seroquel is far from being an ideal treatment for insomnia. Just for a start it's.......expensive, causes daytime drowsiness, weight gain etc.
>
> Ed
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 2, 2007, at 4:37:01
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia, posted by kaleidoscope on May 1, 2007, at 15:50:11
That is your opinion and this is mine: Seroquel does not cause direct weight gain. It may cause you to be more tired during the day, which means you may lay around more, which means you may feel less likely to want to exercise, which may cause you to gain weight.
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 3, 2007, at 16:12:09
In reply to Re: Seroquel is the best med ever for insomnia » kaleidoscope, posted by CA 2 NJ on May 1, 2007, at 16:44:39
>Is Trazadone a better alternative?
A good hypnotic should improve sleep without causing daytime fatigue. Trazodone is particularly poor in this respect.
>Is Ambien any better?
It may be slightly more effective than Lunesta. Could be worth a try.
Ed
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 3, 2007, at 16:24:22
In reply to It is $$$ and causes grogginess, but not wght GAIN » kaleidoscope, posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 2, 2007, at 4:37:01
>That is your opinion and this is mine
Unfortunately, Seroquel does sometimes cause weight gain. It is a well known side effect, not a personal opinion of mine. There are almost certainly multiple mechanisms by which this occurs.
Ed
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 3, 2007, at 16:36:47
In reply to Seroquel can cause weight gain » UgottaHaveHope, posted by kaleidoscope on May 3, 2007, at 16:24:22
A little information from AstraZeneca, the manufacturer of Seroquel.....
The overall weight gain for SEROQUEL-treated patients diagnosed with schizophrenia (n=661) was 2.3 kg (a median gain of 1.5 kg) after at least 26 weeks of treatment.
Posted by Larry Hoover on May 3, 2007, at 17:23:18
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain, posted by kaleidoscope on May 3, 2007, at 16:36:47
> A little information from AstraZeneca, the manufacturer of Seroquel.....
>
> The overall weight gain for SEROQUEL-treated patients diagnosed with schizophrenia (n=661) was 2.3 kg (a median gain of 1.5 kg) after at least 26 weeks of treatment.Hmmm. Since half the subjects gained 1.5 kg or more, but the mean gain was 2.3 kg, some smaller subset gained a very substantial weight indeed (positive homoskedacity).
Lar
Posted by Honore on May 3, 2007, at 19:36:01
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain » kaleidoscope, posted by Larry Hoover on May 3, 2007, at 17:23:18
Could someone translate 1.5 kg and 2.3 kg into pounds?
Also what dose seemed to be associated with weight gain? And what were the mechanisms, insofar as they were analyzed?
thanks,
Honore
Posted by Larry Hoover on May 4, 2007, at 6:45:00
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain--at what dose?, posted by Honore on May 3, 2007, at 19:36:01
> Could someone translate 1.5 kg and 2.3 kg into pounds?
3 and 5 lbs., approximately, respectively.
Just for information's sake, Google's search bar is also a metric/imperial conversion tool. Just plug in "1.5 kg in pounds" (without the apostrophes), and see what you get.
> Also what dose seemed to be associated with weight gain?
Ed's source is British, and the American monograph doesn't give precisely the same info. From the U.S. one, they collapsed all doses (75-800 mg), and said: "the proportions of patients meeting a weight gain criterion of 7% of body weight were compared in a pool of four 3- to 6-week placebo-controlled clinical trials, revealing a statistically significantly greater incidence of weight gain for SEROQUEL (23%)". So, if a subject weighed e.g. 120 lbs., the criterion for "positive for weight gain" would be at least 8.4 lbs. increase, in a 3 to 6 week time frame. Gaining merely eight pounds would be "negative" for this criterion. It's really important to look at the definition for each criterion. You can "shape" the data in many ways.
> And what were the mechanisms, insofar as they were analyzed?
>
> thanks,
>
> HonoreWell, that's not clear cut. In roughly the same proportions as those who experience these weight gains, we also find: a) significantly increased cholesterol and triglycerides; b) significant decreases in thyroid T4 output; and c) hyperglycemia. I wouldn't be surprised if they also might find changes in the satiety regulators leptin and ghrelin, which go hand in hand with these measured parameters.
I hope this helped answer your questions.
Lar
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 4, 2007, at 15:22:28
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain--at what dose? » Honore, posted by Larry Hoover on May 4, 2007, at 6:45:00
Hi Lar
My impression of Seroquel is that while some patients gain little weight, others put on huge amounts of weight. Although less offensive in this department than Zyprexa, Seroquel can certainly cause obesity!
>Ed's source is British, and the American monograph doesn't give precisely the same info.
I got it from seroquel.com
>Well, that's not clear cut. In roughly the same proportions as those who experience these weight gains, we also find: a) significantly increased cholesterol and triglycerides; b) significant decreases in thyroid T4 output; and c) hyperglycemia. I wouldn't be surprised if they also might find changes in the satiety regulators leptin and ghrelin, which go hand in hand with these measured parameters.
Atypical antipsychotics are certainly a very effective means to increase cardiovascular risk factors. Increased appetite is probably one the numerous ways by which Seroquel increases weight. The cardiovascular safety of Seroquel and other APs is particular poor in elderly patients w/ dementia.........hence the FDA's blackbox warning.
'Increased Mortality in Elderly Patients with Dementia-Related Psychosis
Elderly patients with dementia-related psychosis treated with atypical antipsychotic drugs are at an increased risk of death compared to placebo. Analyses of seventeen placebo-controlled trials (modal duration of 10 weeks) in these patients revealed a risk of death in the drug-treated patients of between 1.6 to 1.7 times that seen in placebo-treated patients. Over the course of a typical 10 week controlled trial, the rate of death in drug-treated patients was about 4.5%, compared to a rate of about 2.6% in the placebo group. Although the causes of death were varied, most of the deaths appeared to be either cardiovascular (eg, heart failure, sudden death) or infectious (eg, pneumonia) in nature. SEROQUEL (quetiapine) is not approved for the treatment of patients with Dementia-Related Psychosis.'
Ed
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 0:48:29
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain--at what dose? » Larry Hoover, posted by kaleidoscope on May 4, 2007, at 15:22:28
AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said gave that disclaimer about WEIGHT and a billion other possible side effects because of LIABILITY, end of story.
Yes I know people who have gained weight on Seroquel, but I know people who stayed the same wght on Seroquel (I admit I dont know anyone who LOST wght on Seroquel, which I am sure you will be happy to hear). However, I know ppl who gained weight without taking ANY MEDS, too.
I believe your convictions, I just hate how some people (and I'm not saying you) blame everything in life on meds, which they post about, which makes others scared to try that med, which may help them. It's a ridiculous cycle played out every day on Dr. Bob.
Prayers, love and anything else, Michael
Posted by Cynthia_Greene on May 5, 2007, at 15:41:44
In reply to AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said it ... » kaleidoscope, posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 0:48:29
> Yes I know people who have gained weight on Seroquel, but I know people who stayed the same wght on Seroquel (I admit I dont know anyone who LOST wght on Seroquel, which I am sure you will be happy to hear). However, I know ppl who gained weight without taking ANY MEDS, too.
>My friend who was on Seroquel for a few weeks lost some weight. He blamed the medication for taking away his appetite and making him want to sleep all the time instead of eating regularly.
He might be a weird case, though. And he wasn't on it for too long before he stopped taking it.
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 23:51:53
In reply to Re: AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said it ..., posted by Cynthia_Greene on May 5, 2007, at 15:41:44
Cynthia: I wish I had that problem. I didnt lose or gain weight either way. Thats very interesting. Your friend is lucky.
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 6, 2007, at 13:37:39
In reply to AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said it ... » kaleidoscope, posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 0:48:29
>AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said gave that disclaimer about WEIGHT and a billion other possible side effects because of LIABILITY, end of story.
No, you are not correct. AstraZeneca provided information about weight gain on Seroquel because their very own clinical trials revealed that weight gain was a common side effect.
>I just hate how some people (and I'm not saying you) blame everything in life on meds, which they post about, which makes others scared to try that med, which may help them.
I find this comment strange. I was discussing weight gain. I do not understand how my disscussion of weight gain would lead you to make a comment about 'blaming everything in life on meds'.
Ed_uk
Posted by notfred on May 6, 2007, at 20:22:11
In reply to AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said it ... » kaleidoscope, posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 0:48:29
AstraZeneca, manufacturer of Seroquel, said gave that disclaimer about WEIGHT and a billion other possible side effects because of LIABILITY, end of story.
No, their own studies showed weight gain and other side effects so they included this information
in the monograph.
Posted by Quintal on May 8, 2007, at 13:55:45
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain--at what dose? » Larry Hoover, posted by kaleidoscope on May 4, 2007, at 15:22:28
>My impression of Seroquel is that while some patients gain little weight, others put on huge amounts of weight. Although less offensive in this department than Zyprexa, Seroquel can certainly cause obesity!
I saw one of my mother's old friends at the bus stop last week and she had her schizophrenic daughter with her (on Seroquel the last time we spoke a year ago, and judging by the glassy eyes and vacant expression she's till on it). But it was her size that shocked me - she used to be a slender, willowy little thing a bit like a young Audrey Hepburn, but now she's a great hulking buffalo of woman. From the back I'd have mistaken her for a guy, she's so thickset. It's not just her body and face, but her whole head and skull that looks almost swollen and distorted with fat. It was an awful sight to behold.
Q
Posted by kaleidoscope on May 8, 2007, at 14:14:38
In reply to Re: Seroquel can cause weight gain--at what dose? » kaleidoscope, posted by Quintal on May 8, 2007, at 13:55:45
Hi Q
Some people gain horrendous amounts of weight on psych meds. Olanzapine, mirtazapine and clozapine are among the most offensive. It's difficult to take clozapine without becoming obese!
Ed
This is the end of the thread.
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