![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 15 to 39 of 42. Go back in thread:
Posted by liliths on February 16, 2007, at 14:45:29
In reply to Back from Exile, posted by Quintal on February 13, 2007, at 15:56:22
Posted by Quintal on February 17, 2007, at 20:30:41
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! (nm) » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 16, 2007, at 14:45:29
Thanks liliths, I didn't see any new posts or threads about what came of your hearing. You must have had it by now? How are you and what happened?
Q
Posted by liliths on February 19, 2007, at 12:09:11
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 17, 2007, at 20:30:41
hi Q
thanks for asking - it's a big mess
I did post an update on the work board after the hearing:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/work/20061208/msgs/723561.htmlbut have since had things happen... such as actually getting a copy of their contract, which has caused me to have a fit!
It's a 'standard' addict/alcoholic's contract and since I'm neither, I can't see the point in complying with something so stringent. I must make daily calls to 'discover' if it's my day to get to a lab within 12 hours (though they won't tell you where the labs are until you sign so you haven't a clue how far you may have to travel) and pee in front of someone (of course, at your own expense), ALL my doctors must provide quarterly reports (again at my own expense), I must obtain approval for EVERY prescription medication before being allowed to take it and I'm not allowed ANY alcohol
does ANY of this even make sense to you?? And the contract that they get fat off the state from is for 5 f***ing years!!
there's supposedly an appeals process but damned if I can get anyone to help me figure it out and the clock's ticking... which means if I want to appeal, I obviously have to get a lawyer. That means looking at legal aid or something but it means making an effort I'm too tired to make. Every earlier attempt tp speak with an atty was a bust. Bewteen PRN being a big dog no one wants to touch to the fact that they all react when they hear the word "painkiller" and immediately assume I am an addict. It doesn't matter that in 5 years, I never needed to change my therapeutic dose... nor that I've since stopped it. Though I had oral surgery last week and I will say, that's one of the perks of not taking it daily - it is more effective for pain LOL
they've made the entire experience so awful... it's simply not worth fighting for anymore. I won't pretend I'm not miserable about it, but I also won't pretend to have any energy left to fight a grinding machine, which only seems to chew me up and spit me out.
I've been off the hydro for awhile. Starting taking tianeptine, which seems to help some - particularly in the mornings when I take my ADD meds.
but they don't make a pill to stabilize a depression created by external sources. Even the hydro doesn't make me feel better enough anymore. I barely leave the house and just feel frozen into a kind of blank emptiness
nothing gets through. I tell myself I don't care - it's time to move forward but at night instead of sleeping, my head rants about this and I wake up dreading every moment of every day
haven't posted much here because even writing has become hard and I do apologize, as I appear to be having a particularly vicious day
I'm angry with no outlet and no energy to even bother finding one
I'd better go - nothing good's coming out of this post - again, I do apologize for whining
namaste,
lilith> Thanks liliths, I didn't see any new posts or threads about what came of your hearing. You must have had it by now? How are you and what happened?
>
> Q
Posted by Phillipa on February 19, 2007, at 19:18:14
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 19, 2007, at 12:09:11
Simply horrible. I think by now I wouldn't even want to be part of the profession. So that's what happens to honest people? Not fair and you deserve better. I'm so sorry. Love Phillipa
Posted by Quintal on February 19, 2007, at 21:57:06
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 19, 2007, at 12:09:11
I'm sorry to hear that lilith. I don't watch the work board so that'll be why I didn't see your posts.
>does ANY of this even make sense to you?? And the contract that they get fat off the state from is for 5 f***ing years!!
I don't understand why you can't have any alcohol. It only makes sense as a way of Big Brother flexing his muscles and throwing his weight around. It makes me angry to hear what they're doing to you.
I don't really know what to say other than I feel for you and wish I could have done more to help you through the whole process. I hope you can find a way of getting back into work or doing something you enjoy. I remember you saying you worked in a few different fields a while ago. could you try to find work there again?
How about taking up (again I know) a new career path or training course?
Q
Posted by liliths on February 20, 2007, at 7:21:08
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Phillipa on February 19, 2007, at 19:18:14
hi Philippa
thank you so much for your support. You're right, I don't want to do it anymore... this nightmare just sucked the dream out of me
on the other hand, I've already paid the damn state for my license, gave up my house and 2 years of my life to accomplish this, got good grades, passed the damn Certification Boards and even already belong to the professional organizations. Ironic, I have insurance for something I'm not allowed to practice. It never occurred to me that this would happen.
Totally floored me... and basically is killing me. You're right, I didn't deserve it and that's what makes it that much harder to accept. Realizing how little I really matter as an individual hasn't been easy at my age. This was my last shot at getting back on my feet. Now I can't even leave the house
I may not see myself practicing, but at the same time, I HATE just giving up and letting them win. Though the truth is, since I have been unable to get anyone to even tell me how to go about the appeals process, I haven't the energy to fight anymore. I'm just afraid if I let it pass without doing something, I'll hate myself even more for the failure
yes, this IS what happens to honest people! Imagine, if I hadn't checked the damn box admitting to be treated, I'd actually have gotten my license, no questions asked, months ago.
My doctors assured me I wouldn't be discriminated against, that being honest was the best way to deal with it, and I knew that if I didn't admit it and it caught up to me, I'd be guilty of committing fraud. I didn't think I had any reason NOT to be honest. I do prefer to be truthful. It is my first reaction
But I'm SO sorry now. I certainly learned my lesson... though it's too late
you really are a lovely light on this board :)
thanks again.. hope you have a glorious day
namaste,
lilith> Simply horrible. I think by now I wouldn't even want to be part of the profession. So that's what happens to honest people? Not fair and you deserve better. I'm so sorry. Love Phillipa
Posted by liliths on February 20, 2007, at 7:34:56
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 19, 2007, at 21:57:06
good morning Q
reading your post brought tears to my eyes because I know you really do wish there was something you could've done.
This board is the only place that really 'gets' what I've gone through. I've had to sever most of my friendships, barely leave the house. I know most people just think I am being 'difficult and selfish' as I just don't have the energy to take care of anyone, much less fake feeling 'fine' in order to go out
the whole contract IS simply about control... and $$. PRN gets off on controlling me (particularly as I fought back) and their contracts net them a lot of money.. from the state, from the labs they use, from me
yes, I've done many things... the problem is I no longer even know how to go out anymore, much less look for work. And in some of my fields, I'm simply too old. Younger, more eager and now better educated people are out there in droves. I put so much time into going back to school, I lost a lot of my creative edge.... and my confidence.
Being treated like this hasn't brought out the best in me.
I keep wishing for a terminal illness. It would makes things SO much easier. I don't even have the energy to kill myself. I'm too aware of the huge mess I'd be leaving behind for those I care about to clean up. I keep saying I have get everything in order first and that's a LOT of work... even on a good day, I barely make a dent. LOL it's funny AND pitiful
hope things are going well.
As always, I thank you simply for being you :)namaste,
lilith> I'm sorry to hear that lilith. I don't watch the work board so that'll be why I didn't see your posts.
>
> >does ANY of this even make sense to you?? And the contract that they get fat off the state from is for 5 f***ing years!!
>
> I don't understand why you can't have any alcohol. It only makes sense as a way of Big Brother flexing his muscles and throwing his weight around. It makes me angry to hear what they're doing to you.
>
> I don't really know what to say other than I feel for you and wish I could have done more to help you through the whole process. I hope you can find a way of getting back into work or doing something you enjoy. I remember you saying you worked in a few different fields a while ago. could you try to find work there again?
>
> How about taking up (again I know) a new career path or training course?
>
> Q
Posted by Quintal on February 20, 2007, at 22:34:49
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 20, 2007, at 7:34:56
Hi Lilith,
>I keep wishing for a terminal illness. It would makes things SO much easier. I don't even have the energy to kill myself. I'm too aware of the huge mess I'd be leaving behind for those I care about to clean up. I keep saying I have get everything in order first and that's a LOT of work... even on a good day, I barely make a dent. LOL it's funny AND pitiful
I know, I've often wished for cancer too. Nothing awful and sad like motor neurone, maybe something heroic like leukemia as in that film with Julia Roberts. I actually think it might, perversely, give me a stronger sense of purpose and the will to live. This may change of course if it ever actually happens (and I'm certain it will - just at the time I've found the perfect antidepressant/anxiolytic and my life is back on track).
How is the tianeptine going? I liked it myself but I took it with reboxetine which unfortunately made me panicky and anxious.I'm in the process of weaning myself off codeine, and it's not too bad so far.
Q
Posted by liliths on February 21, 2007, at 12:09:45
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 20, 2007, at 22:34:49
Hi Quintal
that's exactly how I feel... you nailed it :)
I'm so dysfunctional lately, it's hard to tell if anything really gets through so I'm not sure about tianeptine.. it's a subtle drug. I do seem to feel it in the morning with my ADD meds, but the afternoon dose doesn't seem to do a thing. I'm considering going back on wellbutrin in the afternoon, hoping maybe they'd work well together. Otherwise, I may just take it in the morning. Since it's expensive, that'd help make it last longer too.
I've also considered looking into Piracetam just to augment my lazy brain LOL
would kratom help wean off the codeine? I hope it's going well. Are you being forced off or just taking a break?
namaste,
lilith
> Hi Lilith,
> I know, I've often wished for cancer too. Nothing awful and sad like motor neurone, maybe something heroic like leukemia as in that film with Julia Roberts. I actually think it might, perversely, give me a stronger sense of purpose and the will to live. This may change of course if it ever actually happens (and I'm certain it will - just at the time I've found the perfect antidepressant/anxiolytic and my life is back on track).
>
> How is the tianeptine going? I liked it myself but I took it with reboxetine which unfortunately made me panicky and anxious.I'm in the process of weaning myself off codeine, and it's not too bad so far.
>
> Q
Posted by Quintal on February 21, 2007, at 15:19:25
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 21, 2007, at 12:09:45
Oh liliths,
I don't know how I get myself into these things - it's funny you should mention piracetam. I ordered some earlier today along with tianeptine and other nootropics like picamilon (I know it isn't supposed work, but what the hell, there's still placebo to fall back on). I have to use PayPal because all my main cards have bounced and I'm stuck with a crappy 'Solo' debit card. Anyway, the guy who runs it sent me two emails back asking me why I'd used the wrong site, and why had I emailed him instead of using the order form on the website........ I was just following instructions (which happened to be 3 years out of date). Now he's sent me two irate emails asking why the Hell haven't I answered the phone? - he's been trying to ring me.
So where is the problem I hear you ask? Under normal circumstances this would be fine of course, but I need the tianeptine et al for social phobia, and to get it I now have to pick up the phone (which is set on silent mode so I can get some peace from all the irate debt collectors that are baying for my blood), and converse not only with a complete stranger, but with an aggrieved and aggressive, larger than life scary American dude of a stranger. All of this while risking answering the phone to one of the debt collectors by mistake. And then they'll know.
I'm having palpitations at the thought of it. Don't know what to do. If I let it go he might put me down as a time waster and never entertain my custom again, so I won't be able to get tianeptine as that is the only site I know of that accepts PayPal where I can use my Solo card. I'm not entirely sure why I'm bothering to try it again to be honest. Curiosity and lack of side effects I suppose. And to be sociable, so I can be on the same drugs as my bestest friends here...............if only Phillipa would ditch her Luvox and join in too we could all share the fun. Are you up for it Phillipa?
I'm going off codeine because I seem to have developed tolerance to it. I've decided to make a clean break. I tried some Kratom the other day but it didn't seem to bother itself enough to have any effect at all, and if it's going to be like that then I want nothing to do with it either.
Q
Posted by liliths on February 21, 2007, at 15:47:59
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 21, 2007, at 15:19:25
oh wow Q
what you wrote makes such perfect sense to me... it's so much the way I am these days as well. And how funny about the piracetam!
I wish the tianeptine was helping my anti-social behavior but it hasn't touched it. I'm still sitting in the house, day after day, dreading every damn second... scared the phone will ring, scared at what I've become... scared I'll just keep getting worse
you know - and you really DO know this - that you CAN deal with this guy if you have to.. and it sounds like you have to... do you have a number for him? would be easier to force yourself to call? (this from someone who hasn't been able to pick up the phone in weeks! - gotta laugh at myself for that one)
BUT YOU CAN DO IT! I know you can. Have you listened to your messages? Does he leave contact info?
I can't answer my phone on a good day without screening so I know who I'm picking up for. Can you do that? Turn the volume on and when it's a collector, turn it down so you don't have to listen
You can also email him and simply explain your mistake... that you were looking at an old cached site.
You might want to also tell him you're going through a rough time, which is why you're ordering the tianeptine in the first place. You're depressed! He probably won't get it BUT on the other hand, your communication might be enough to placate him. And at least email IS easier contact than the phone :)
and yes, if a drug isn't working, there's no point taking it. A break will do you good... except for now, when you could use some help. But it will work again after the break.. you know that
it's funny, but you're so right. This board is where my friends live as well as the only place I can go where people understand. That alone is simply staggering
take a deep breath.... take another... 1 more for good measure
s-t-r-e-t-c-h
you're going to be ok :)
You're not alone in this and even though we're not in the room with you, you're right here in oh-so-many hearts
You've been there for so many people. You're resiliant. You're strong. You're compassionate. No silly salesman can take that away
namaste and a ((BIG HUG)) from a distance so it's not too scary :)
lilith> Oh liliths,
>
> I don't know how I get myself into these things - it's funny you should mention piracetam. I ordered some earlier today along with tianeptine and other nootropics like picamilon (I know it isn't supposed work, but what the hell, there's still placebo to fall back on). I have to use PayPal because all my main cards have bounced and I'm stuck with a crappy 'Solo' debit card. Anyway, the guy who runs it sent me two emails back asking me why I'd used the wrong site, and why had I emailed him instead of using the order form on the website........ I was just following instructions (which happened to be 3 years out of date). Now he's sent me two irate emails asking why the Hell haven't I answered the phone? - he's been trying to ring me.
>
> So where is the problem I hear you ask? Under normal circumstances this would be fine of course, but I need the tianeptine et al for social phobia, and to get it I now have to pick up the phone (which is set on silent mode so I can get some peace from all the irate debt collectors that are baying for my blood), and converse not only with a complete stranger, but with an aggrieved and aggressive, larger than life scary American dude of a stranger. All of this while risking answering the phone to one of the debt collectors by mistake. And then they'll know.
>
> I'm having palpitations at the thought of it. Don't know what to do. If I let it go he might put me down as a time waster and never entertain my custom again, so I won't be able to get tianeptine as that is the only site I know of that accepts PayPal where I can use my Solo card. I'm not entirely sure why I'm bothering to try it again to be honest. Curiosity and lack of side effects I suppose. And to be sociable, so I can be on the same drugs as my bestest friends here...............if only Phillipa would ditch her Luvox and join in too we could all share the fun. Are you up for it Phillipa?
>
> I'm going off codeine because I seem to have developed tolerance to it. I've decided to make a clean break. I tried some Kratom the other day but it didn't seem to bother itself enough to have any effect at all, and if it's going to be like that then I want nothing to do with it either.
>
> Q
Posted by liliths on February 21, 2007, at 19:43:42
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 21, 2007, at 15:19:25
hi Q
I apologize if my response was a bit over the top
namaste,
lilith> Oh liliths,
>
> I don't know how I get myself into these things - it's funny you should mention piracetam. I ordered some earlier today along with tianeptine and other nootropics like picamilon (I know it isn't supposed work, but what the hell, there's still placebo to fall back on). I have to use PayPal because all my main cards have bounced and I'm stuck with a crappy 'Solo' debit card. Anyway, the guy who runs it sent me two emails back asking me why I'd used the wrong site, and why had I emailed him instead of using the order form on the website........ I was just following instructions (which happened to be 3 years out of date). Now he's sent me two irate emails asking why the Hell haven't I answered the phone? - he's been trying to ring me.
>
> So where is the problem I hear you ask? Under normal circumstances this would be fine of course, but I need the tianeptine et al for social phobia, and to get it I now have to pick up the phone (which is set on silent mode so I can get some peace from all the irate debt collectors that are baying for my blood), and converse not only with a complete stranger, but with an aggrieved and aggressive, larger than life scary American dude of a stranger. All of this while risking answering the phone to one of the debt collectors by mistake. And then they'll know.
>
> I'm having palpitations at the thought of it. Don't know what to do. If I let it go he might put me down as a time waster and never entertain my custom again, so I won't be able to get tianeptine as that is the only site I know of that accepts PayPal where I can use my Solo card. I'm not entirely sure why I'm bothering to try it again to be honest. Curiosity and lack of side effects I suppose. And to be sociable, so I can be on the same drugs as my bestest friends here...............if only Phillipa would ditch her Luvox and join in too we could all share the fun. Are you up for it Phillipa?
>
> I'm going off codeine because I seem to have developed tolerance to it. I've decided to make a clean break. I tried some Kratom the other day but it didn't seem to bother itself enough to have any effect at all, and if it's going to be like that then I want nothing to do with it either.
>
> Q
Posted by Quintal on February 21, 2007, at 21:56:06
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 21, 2007, at 19:43:42
No, it wasn't over the top, it was very thoughtful! I just got distracted with arguments going on, on other parts of the board and didn't want to write a two-line post in return or something.
It turned out alright in the end. I emailed him back to say my voice line is suspended (it is as a matter of fact and I'll have to ring them to ask them to re-activate it). He was very understanding and has shipped my order, minus the tianeptine, which will come in two weeks then I have to pay him again.I bought some adrafinil (didn't think much of it first time round but I was on a hefty dose of Klonopin then). I'm just curious to see if my brain responds differently now. Are you going to get some piracetam?
I found vinpocetine very good at getting more mileage out of my meds. Smaller doses seemed to have a greater effect - maybe more was getting to my brain?
Thanks again for the heartfelt post - it's good to know there are others in the same position. Am off to bed now - hardly slept in two days.
Q
Posted by liliths on February 22, 2007, at 14:17:49
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 21, 2007, at 21:56:06
hi Q
I'm so glad it worked out well. I knew it would. The guy obviously just freaked when you contacted him in an unexpected way. Maybe he needs to take his product :)
so now you have me looking at vinpocetine. I don't know that I'd need both and wonder which one might be more effective.
any thoughts about this? like you, I'm pretty broke.
hope you got some good delicious sleep.
I sent a letter of appeal today to the board. Now I guess I've have to find an atty - either legal aid or someone who will take the case pro bono. I don't even care about practicing anymore. But that doesn't mean I'm willing to just roll over. I paid for the damn license, but if I lose the appeal, I'll walk away. I wouldn't be able to do much anyway as I've been having terrible pain in my shoulders, arms, hands... have had some tests done and will hopefully find something out on monday. But it's just been getting worse and worse lately
ok... enough whining from me. All I ever seem to have are problems. I'm so sick of myself
when you have the chance, I would be interested in your thoughts about the different nootropics
namaste,
lilith> No, it wasn't over the top, it was very thoughtful! I just got distracted with arguments going on, on other parts of the board and didn't want to write a two-line post in return or something.
>
> It turned out alright in the end. I emailed him back to say my voice line is suspended (it is as a matter of fact and I'll have to ring them to ask them to re-activate it). He was very understanding and has shipped my order, minus the tianeptine, which will come in two weeks then I have to pay him again.I bought some adrafinil (didn't think much of it first time round but I was on a hefty dose of Klonopin then). I'm just curious to see if my brain responds differently now. Are you going to get some piracetam?
>
> I found vinpocetine very good at getting more mileage out of my meds. Smaller doses seemed to have a greater effect - maybe more was getting to my brain?
>
> Thanks again for the heartfelt post - it's good to know there are others in the same position. Am off to bed now - hardly slept in two days.
>
> Q
Posted by liliths on February 22, 2007, at 14:37:21
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 21, 2007, at 21:56:06
hi again... just wanted to tell you that I just ordered some vinpocetine. I found a site that was offering it w/o shipping and the price was really good
then when I went to order some piracetam (on another site - the other didn't carry it), when they wanted $15 minimum for shipping, I just exited.
so I'll try the one anyway.... unless I can find a good deal on the other :)
namaste,
lilith> No, it wasn't over the top, it was very thoughtful! I just got distracted with arguments going on, on other parts of the board and didn't want to write a two-line post in return or something.
>
> It turned out alright in the end. I emailed him back to say my voice line is suspended (it is as a matter of fact and I'll have to ring them to ask them to re-activate it). He was very understanding and has shipped my order, minus the tianeptine, which will come in two weeks then I have to pay him again.I bought some adrafinil (didn't think much of it first time round but I was on a hefty dose of Klonopin then). I'm just curious to see if my brain responds differently now. Are you going to get some piracetam?
>
> I found vinpocetine very good at getting more mileage out of my meds. Smaller doses seemed to have a greater effect - maybe more was getting to my brain?
>
> Thanks again for the heartfelt post - it's good to know there are others in the same position. Am off to bed now - hardly slept in two days.
>
> Q
Posted by Quintal on February 22, 2007, at 20:54:38
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 22, 2007, at 14:17:49
Hi Lil,
I think vinpocetine acts more as a vasodilator, but you can take both together. Don't know a great deal about either to be honest. Time for Prof. Quintal to do his homework. Thanks for the link BTW.
I think you're right about appealing against their decision given all you put into getting your license. Are you sure the pains aren't due to the fact you're now off opiates? I'm having the same problem.
I was looking at the work thread, and I wondered who is Hannah?
Q
Posted by Phillipa on February 22, 2007, at 21:04:32
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 22, 2007, at 20:54:38
Quintal did someone post on work about Hanna? I better look. Love Phillipa
Posted by liliths on February 23, 2007, at 6:29:01
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by Phillipa on February 22, 2007, at 21:04:32
hi Phillipa
no, I had merely mentioned my cat, hannah.
hope you are doing well :)namaste,
lilith> Quintal did someone post on work about Hanna? I better look. Love Phillipa
Posted by liliths on February 23, 2007, at 7:49:36
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Quintal on February 22, 2007, at 20:54:38
hi Q
that's interesting... I take a nitric oxide booster as a vasodilator before working out. I'll have to keep looking for a better site then for the piracetam as it does look promising and sounds like one can take either or both - I'd do 'almost' anything to jump start this tired old brain :) Yes, I think I need to do more research myself. I'm glad the link was useful :))
someone posted about using SAMe with tianeptine. I found some old SAMe I've had for years - may not even be effective anymore but one never knows. Anyway, they said it definitely seemed to help boost the tianeptine. I may try one instead of a wellbutrin in my afternoon meds today
funny about the peripheral neuropathy. I was actually having trouble with my hands while I was still in school. I learned really quickly that I would need to be very careful not to blow them out and that I was already prone to problems. My knucles swelled so badly once that I saw my primary to ask about arthritis. I've had cervical problems for years that flare every now and again. The first time was when I was training as a bodybuilder, about 9 years ago... I lost feeling in my left arm and the hand was totally useless for weeks. The next episode affected my right arm. The point being that I 'think' whatever's going on is coming from my neck... though this right shoulder and arm pain is fairly new and totally awful. Now it seems I'm hitting the target of peripheral neuropathy - numbness, tingling, burning pains, aches. When I ride my mototrcycle, even in relatively mild weather, my fingers have a tendency to turn totally white, bloodless and numb. I've always been extremely sensitive to the cold. But now driving is a nightmare as turning my steering wheel causes my arms and shoulders to just kill me and with this left hand knuckle flare, even riding the bike makes me sore.
Of course, by now, I'm hoping for a diagnosis of some terminal illness LOL but I do think something besides my neck is causing this. A few years back I was visiting a gallery that shows my work and there was a guy doing thermography. Just for fun, he took a picture of me and one hand showed NO heat whatsoever. It actually scared the guy, who told me to go see my doctor. of course, I ignored it at the time
I'm already so near full blown agoraphobia, this is not helping!
so, many of these experiences took place while I was using hydro as an AD. I can only imagine how much worse the pain might have been without it. So I don't think not being on the hydro anymore has that much to do with it. I've had these problems off and on for so long - while on hydro and when not, that if anything, the hydro possible only helped me handle my exsting pain better
But I've definitely got something wrong. When I was having my nerve conduction tests, my fingers were literally blue. I catch chills that just won't go away... but as I said, I've always been really sensitive to the cold.
and I've been off the hydro long enough to know that this is not withdrawal. In fact, had oral surgery last week, for which I took vicodin. One thing I will say for not taking opiods for depression is that they're more effective pain killers when taken less often. :)
And I've resisted the temptation to take them as an AD again, particularly since I'm fighting for my license. Thank you for understanding why I feel the need to contest their decision. I may not be up for much of a fight - I put so much into the last one and lost anyway - that old bugaboo "narcotic" sure puts the fear into everyone. This experience has so exacerbated my depression that I'm near total non-funtional status. Once PRN stepped in, no pill in the world could help what they've done to me. Nothing was working - going off the hydro didn't matter as I was already so depressed from outside events, nothing else got through
I'm sure you read my post on the opiate thread. Now I know what argument you were embroiled in the other night LOL
I often deliberately don't post because I hate how polarized people get about these things. It reminds me of religion, another conversation I prefer not to touch. When someone says THEY know the answer and that everyone else is wrong, I simply beat a hasty retreat. My experience has told me they're usually not interested in even listening to another point of view... whether it's about beliefs or meds (hell, what's the difference? sorry if that sounds blasphemous - I don't know if you're religious so I apologize if the statement was offensive)
I've always understood that there were many ways to view something. Like turning a prism to catch the light, I've always loved conversations that turned and were fueled by diversity. I used to sometimes get called 'wishy-washy' because I'm capable of seeing the point of so many different ways of looking at a subject.
are you having pain as part of your withdrawal or do you think it's just pain that was being masked by the codeine? When I tapered off the hydro, I did so slowly enough that I never felt a thing, really. But hey, I've tapered off 'notorious' effexor a couple of times too and also had no problems. I just take it slow, my body seems to have plenty of time to adjust. Now maybe that's just me. Maybe in addition to being an opiod responder, I have a good withdrawal system LOL anyway, the point I'm rambling around is that you might consider going down more slowly, if you're experiencing withdrawal pain
Hannah is my sweet cat. I had 2 - hannah & daphne - they were siblings and the 3 of us pretty much lived as 3 sisters :)
Daphne died on June 1... they had just turned 16 on May 3. There's a dedication to her on my site.
anyway, her death came pretty close to killing hannah too. It actually would probably have been easier on me to lose them both together as I am so dependent of hannah and hannah on me, I can't imagine how I'll possibly get through the grief when she goes. I still mourn daphne and cried every single day for months. I lost her just as I was just starting to study for my boards... I had to push my test date by 2 weeks to compensate for the time I was just overhwelmed by grief and fighting to keep hannah alive
My vet's amazed at how well she's doing for an old lady LOL Well, that's one of the side benefits of my being home every day, all day. She literally lives off my love and attention. They're Oriental Shorthairs - pure black - like patent leather when they were young, though now the fur is shot with grey :) Very intelligent, very demanding, very vocal... the breed is just amazing!
Hannah is my little miracle sister. She keeps me a prisoner in some ways. I can't travel, or even stay out for more than 1 night (even that's pushing it and I don't even live alone anymore) which would probably have really helped in the early days of my Board fiasco. It's also given me a good excuse to never leave the house. But as much as an anchor, she is also my lifeline. Many, many years ago, having hit a real bottom, I sat in my apartment and realized I was finally ready to die. Then I looked over at my 2 girls who were in the bed with me and realized if I killed myself, I'd have to kill them too and since they weren't asking to die, I could never do that... which meant I couldn't kill myself either. The irony of it caused me to just laugh and I later wrote a poem about it. Suddenly I understood why women killed their children when committing suicide and even why some men killed their whole families before killing themselves. Now understanding and condoning are 2 different things. I couldn't kill my girls. I had no choice but to live, but the realization and understanding was a profound experienceok, I've rambled enough at poor you for the moment :0
have a glorious day, my sweet friend Q
namaste,
lilith> Hi Lil,
>
> I think vinpocetine acts more as a vasodilator, but you can take both together. Don't know a great deal about either to be honest. Time for Prof. Quintal to do his homework. Thanks for the link BTW.
>
> I think you're right about appealing against their decision given all you put into getting your license. Are you sure the pains aren't due to the fact you're now off opiates? I'm having the same problem.
>
> I was looking at the work thread, and I wondered who is Hannah?
>
> Q
Posted by Quintal on February 23, 2007, at 16:14:21
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 23, 2007, at 7:49:36
Hi Lil,
I don't know a great deal about the nootropics myself to be honest. I found this that might be relevant to the poor blood flow in your hands though:
Piracetam is useful as a long term treatment for clotting, coagulation, and vasospastic disorders such as Raynaud's phenomenon [12]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piracetam>someone posted about using SAMe with tianeptine. I found some old SAMe I've had for years - may not even be effective anymore but one never knows. Anyway, they said it definitely seemed to help boost the tianeptine. I may try one instead of a wellbutrin in my afternoon meds today
How did it go? Maybe it's best to take it addition to the Wellbutrin given you don't want to go into withdrawal or anything?
>Of course, by now, I'm hoping for a diagnosis of some terminal illness LOL but I do think something besides my neck is causing this.
I suppose you can have both Raynaud's and cervical spondylosis? My dad has that and he has numbness in his fingers and burning pains.
>while on hydro and when not, that if anything, the hydro possible only helped me handle my exsting pain better
Wouldn't it be ironic if you were now prescribed the opiates for noiceptive pain? Do you think the PRN would accept that? Maybe go for it if you think they would.
I'm not sure about the origins of my own aches and pains. I'm a little young to have arthritis at 24, but it can happen I suppose. More likely it's simply due to my own pain threshold being lowered from being on the opiates? It's more a soreness in my muscles and achy feeling in my joints. I suppose some of the other meds you're taking might help dull the pain a little - like how most antidepressants are painkillers to a limited degree?
I'm sorry to hear about Daphne. I thought Hannah might have been a dog because you said she whined. My 11 year old whippet, Barry, died two years ago and Smudge withdrew into himself and seemed to develop an anxiety disorder. This was when I started work and he was left alone all day. He started to get diarrhea from panic attacks when he knew I was going out. He's a bit better now we have another dog, but still not the man he used to be bless him. It served as a model for the development of mental illness for me - a real-life study of how an anxiety disorder can be precipitated in the canine. I think the same thing happens in a similar way in humans. There are some links to pictures of Pop and Smudge over on the social thread.
>I sat in my apartment and realized I was finally ready to die. Then I looked over at my 2 girls who were in the bed with me and realized if I killed myself, I'd have to kill them too and since they weren't asking to die, I could never do that... which meant I couldn't kill myself either. The irony of it caused me to just laugh and I later wrote a poem about it. Suddenly I understood why women killed their children when committing suicide and even why some men killed their whole families before killing themselves. Now understanding and condoning are 2 different things. I couldn't kill my girls. I had no choice but to live, but the realization and understanding was a profound experience
Yes, we seem to have a similar thinking style. I take events like this and extrapolate them into scenarios in wider life. I think you're very probably right about that too. We do often look upon our pets as children and behave accordingly. It worries me about people who abuse animals, would they do that to their children too if only they couldn't talk and were completely at their mercy? It's bone chilling.
Q
Posted by Phillipa on February 23, 2007, at 21:27:03
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by liliths on February 23, 2007, at 7:49:36
Raynauds's syndrome is an autoiimune disease as is my hasimotos thyroiditis. Goggle autoimmune diseases they are so many. And maybe a treatment for one is opiods . Rheumatologists generally treat them or a lot of them. Lupus is one too. Love Phillipa
Posted by Quintal on February 23, 2007, at 21:39:19
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » liliths, posted by Phillipa on February 23, 2007, at 21:27:03
It says nothing about autoimmune disease here. I thought Raynaud's was porr blood flow to the hands?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raynaud%27s_syndrome
Q
Posted by Phillipa on February 23, 2007, at 22:11:33
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Phillipa, posted by Quintal on February 23, 2007, at 21:39:19
Q click epididimology on the link you posted the beginning are all autoimmune diseases. Then you will have to google autoimmune diseases on your own. I'm getting tired Love Jan
Posted by Quintal on February 23, 2007, at 22:33:07
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Quintal, posted by Phillipa on February 23, 2007, at 22:11:33
The most I can find is that when those symptoms appear in a person who has an autoimmune disease it is called Raynaud's Syndrome/Phenomenon - it occurs as a secondary condition in people who have an autoimmune disease, but it doesn't seem to be an autoimmune disease in itself. It seems the same phenomenon is called Primary Raynaud's Disease when it appears in people who do not have an autoimmune disease, so having those symptoms does not automatically mean that you have an autoimmune disease, but it's probably wise to have that possibility ruled out with tests.
Q
Posted by Phillipa on February 23, 2007, at 23:05:02
In reply to Re: Back from Exile: Welcome back Q! » Phillipa, posted by Quintal on February 23, 2007, at 22:33:07
Q an ANA is a first step. Love Phillipa
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