Shown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 17:23:41
I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
Any ideas will be appreciated.
Marty
I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
Posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 17:36:43
In reply to Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI, posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 17:23:41
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
>
> Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
>
> Any ideas will be appreciated.
>
> Marty
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...That's awesome Marty! Yea, wait for some posts from Scott, Ed, and Linkage, these guys are incredibly smart when it comes to Psychopharmacology. I'll come up with a real cool 'Parnate related name' for you. :) The other post was all in fun as you know...i better calm it down though however and be "Civil." I wrote that after a crappy 2 hrs. sleep.
Anyway, congrats and welcome to the wonderful World of Parnate!Crazy Horse/Tyler
Posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 19:33:04
In reply to Re: Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI » MARTY, posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 17:36:43
Ahahah Of course it was all a joke. I didn't need sleep deprivation to reply you.. my first day of Nardil withdrawal give me enough buzz :P
Yep.. that's for real now. I can't wait to start taking Parnate, but at the same time fear the 10 days thing. At worst I'll become a Parnatian in 9 sleeps LOL
All was cool with my Pdoc as you can now guess. As I told you shes like a all-you-can-eat buffet; "What do you do this week Martin ? I stop Nardil, start Parnate, stop this and this and I want to try that thing I saw on that research report: put me all that in a brown bag.. ok Martin, thanks to shop at crazyville."
So you think you can set up an expert board to discuss the "10 days or not" etc ? if the others care to answer me, that would be great!
~
~
U====Marty .. passing back the funny green pipe to Crazy Horse.
> >
> > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
> >
> > Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
> >
> > Any ideas will be appreciated.
> >
> > Marty
> >
> > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
>
> That's awesome Marty! Yea, wait for some posts from Scott, Ed, and Linkage, these guys are incredibly smart when it comes to Psychopharmacology. I'll come up with a real cool 'Parnate related name' for you. :) The other post was all in fun as you know...i better calm it down though however and be "Civil." I wrote that after a crappy 2 hrs. sleep.
> Anyway, congrats and welcome to the wonderful World of Parnate!
>
> Crazy Horse/Tyler
Posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 20:36:54
In reply to Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI, posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 17:23:41
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
>
> Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
>
> Any ideas will be appreciated.
>
> Marty
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...Hey Guys, Please answer Marty's question. Thank you.
-Crazy Horse
Posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 20:41:50
In reply to Re: Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI » Crazy Horse, posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 19:33:04
> Ahahah Of course it was all a joke. I didn't need sleep deprivation to reply you.. my first day of Nardil withdrawal give me enough buzz :P
>
> Yep.. that's for real now. I can't wait to start taking Parnate, but at the same time fear the 10 days thing. At worst I'll become a Parnatian in 9 sleeps LOL
>
> All was cool with my Pdoc as you can now guess. As I told you shes like a all-you-can-eat buffet; "What do you do this week Martin ? I stop Nardil, start Parnate, stop this and this and I want to try that thing I saw on that research report: put me all that in a brown bag.. ok Martin, thanks to shop at crazyville."
>
> So you think you can set up an expert board to discuss the "10 days or not" etc ? if the others care to answer me, that would be great!
>
> ~
> ~
> U====
>
> Marty .. passing back the funny green pipe to Crazy Horse.
>
> > >
> > > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
> > >
> > > Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
> > >
> > > Any ideas will be appreciated.
> > >
> > > Marty
> > >
> > > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
> >
> > That's awesome Marty! Yea, wait for some posts from Scott, Ed, and Linkage, these guys are incredibly smart when it comes to Psychopharmacology. I'll come up with a real cool 'Parnate related name' for you. :) The other post was all in fun as you know...i better calm it down though however and be "Civil." I wrote that after a crappy 2 hrs. sleep.
> > Anyway, congrats and welcome to the wonderful World of Parnate!
> >
> > Crazy Horse/Tyler
>
>As a new member of the Parnation society, I now give you the new name "Parn Star"...I think that fits you Marty...what do you think? Pretty creative ,eh??
Crazy :)
Posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 20:44:23
In reply to Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI, posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 17:23:41
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
>
> Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
>
> Any ideas will be appreciated.
>
> Marty
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...What do you think Linkage?
Posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 23:26:57
In reply to Re: Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI » MARTY, posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 20:41:50
Mouahaha pretty nice nick :) It with honor that I accept this parnation nick.. hope it will fit better my "parnate me" than my "nardil me" ...
Marty> > Ahahah Of course it was all a joke. I didn't need sleep deprivation to reply you.. my first day of Nardil withdrawal give me enough buzz :P
> >
> > Yep.. that's for real now. I can't wait to start taking Parnate, but at the same time fear the 10 days thing. At worst I'll become a Parnatian in 9 sleeps LOL
> >
> > All was cool with my Pdoc as you can now guess. As I told you shes like a all-you-can-eat buffet; "What do you do this week Martin ? I stop Nardil, start Parnate, stop this and this and I want to try that thing I saw on that research report: put me all that in a brown bag.. ok Martin, thanks to shop at crazyville."
> >
> > So you think you can set up an expert board to discuss the "10 days or not" etc ? if the others care to answer me, that would be great!
> >
> > ~
> > ~
> > U====
> >
> > Marty .. passing back the funny green pipe to Crazy Horse.
> >
> > > >
> > > > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
> > > >
> > > > Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
> > > >
> > > > Any ideas will be appreciated.
> > > >
> > > > Marty
> > > >
> > > > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
> > >
> > > That's awesome Marty! Yea, wait for some posts from Scott, Ed, and Linkage, these guys are incredibly smart when it comes to Psychopharmacology. I'll come up with a real cool 'Parnate related name' for you. :) The other post was all in fun as you know...i better calm it down though however and be "Civil." I wrote that after a crappy 2 hrs. sleep.
> > > Anyway, congrats and welcome to the wonderful World of Parnate!
> > >
> > > Crazy Horse/Tyler
> >
> >
>
> As a new member of the Parnation society, I now give you the new name "Parn Star"...I think that fits you Marty...what do you think? Pretty creative ,eh??
>
> Crazy :)
Posted by SLS on April 14, 2006, at 6:04:32
In reply to Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another MAOI, posted by MARTY on April 13, 2006, at 17:23:41
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
>
> Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
>
> Any ideas will be appreciated.
>
> Marty
>
> I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
You are probably going to receive varying opinions on this. Mine is conservative. I think it is important to wait at least 10 days between drugs. This is probably more important when going from Nardil to Parnate than vice versa. Some experienced doctors feel that even 10 days isn't enough and prefer to wait 14. The risk of having a stroke is very real. One of my doctors actually saw this happen with a collegue's patient.
- Scott
Posted by linkadge on April 14, 2006, at 8:33:52
In reply to Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question. » MARTY, posted by Crazy Horse on April 13, 2006, at 20:44:23
I don't have a lot of expertise in this area. I know others on this board have. I know that SLS probably knows about such possible interactons.
I should think that if you started low enough on the parnate, you could start it right away.
But, I think there have been interactions (not sure how that happens)
Linkadge
Posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 9:02:52
In reply to Re: Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question., posted by linkadge on April 14, 2006, at 8:33:52
Ok, thanks guys.What do you think of this theory:
The monoamines oxidase level is returning to is normal level after 3-5 days. For this theory lets be more conservative/safe and let's say 10 days.
My pdoc think that because Nardil and Parnate works in the same way, stoping a MAOI and starting another should not be a problem since it should not change a lot the MAO level.. letting some MAO in the body which is important since a person with a level of 0 MAO is in big trouble.
But here's my theory: Nardil and Parnate doesn't inhibit the MAO-A and MAO-B in the same proportion. Here's an exemple of the problem that it could cause: If one day after stoping Nardil, which let's say BY EXEMPLE inhibit 75% MAO-A and 25% MAO-B, I start Parnate who would BY EXEMPLE inhibit 25% MAO-A and 75% MAO-B.. I would have in theory, depending on the dose of Nardil and Parnate and etc.. near not much MAO since N-MAO-A 75% + P-MAO-A 25% = MAO-A 100% and N-MAO-B 25% + P-MAO-B 75% = MAO-B 100% ...
Those numbers are fictional and have been picked just to simplify the explanation of my theory.
Anyone thinks it could make sens ?
Thanks for your time and hope you are all well.
Marty
Posted by Crazy Horse on April 14, 2006, at 9:19:50
In reply to Re: Veterans : 10 Days withdrawal before Another M, posted by SLS on April 14, 2006, at 6:04:32
> >
> > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
> >
> > Do you think the 10 days between 2 MAOI is important ? Why do you think we need 10 days before the 2 ? Any case report or research paper about that on the Internet ?
> >
> > Any ideas will be appreciated.
> >
> > Marty
> >
> > I have stopped Nardil this morning and my Pdoc has already given me Parnate telling me that she doesn't think we really need to wait the end of the 10 day break...
>
>
> You are probably going to receive varying opinions on this. Mine is conservative. I think it is important to wait at least 10 days between drugs. This is probably more important when going from Nardil to Parnate than vice versa. Some experienced doctors feel that even 10 days isn't enough and prefer to wait 14. The risk of having a stroke is very real. One of my doctors actually saw this happen with a collegue's patient.
>
>
> - Scott
>
>Marty 'Parn Star'
I think i would go with what Scott says here. Unfortunatly, waiting 10-14 days is a pain, but much better than the alternative. We'd kinda like to keep you around bud. I'd wait. Let me know your plan.
Crazy Horse
P.S. Huma cama lama magesto-Which is Sioux for; Take care my Parnate Brother! :)
Posted by SLS on April 14, 2006, at 10:25:34
In reply to Re: Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question. » linkadge, posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 9:02:52
It does take about 10 days for MAO activity to recover after discontinuing irreversible MAOIs. Nardil might take even longer than that. I worry that taking Parnate immediately after discontinuing Nardil will produce a hypertensive reaction. Some people experience a hypertensive reaction to Parnate monotherapy when they first start it, despite being unmedicated for an extended period of time previously.
There have been one or two people here who have tried overlapping Parnate and Nardil. They did not report any adverse reactions.
- Scott
Posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 12:11:56
In reply to Re: Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question. » linkadge, posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 9:02:52
Sorry this post wasn't only for Linkage like my title was saying...
What do you think of this theory:
The monoamines oxidase level is returning to is normal level after 3-5 days. For this theory lets be more conservative/safe and let's say 10 days.
My pdoc think that because Nardil and Parnate works in the same way, stoping a MAOI and starting another should not be a problem since it should not change a lot the MAO level.. letting some MAO in the body which is important since a person with a level of 0 MAO is in big trouble.
But here's my theory: Nardil and Parnate doesn't inhibit the MAO-A and MAO-B in the same proportion. Here's an exemple of the problem that it could cause: If one day after stoping Nardil, which let's say BY EXEMPLE inhibit 75% MAO-A and 25% MAO-B, I start Parnate who would BY EXEMPLE inhibit 25% MAO-A and 75% MAO-B.. I would have in theory, depending on the dose of Nardil and Parnate and etc.. near not much MAO since N-MAO-A 75% + P-MAO-A 25% = MAO-A 100% and N-MAO-B 25% + P-MAO-B 75% = MAO-B 100% ...
Those numbers are fictional and have been picked just to simplify the explanation of my theory.
Anyone thinks it could make sens ?
Thanks for your time and hope you are all well.
Marty
Posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 12:22:31
In reply to Oups bad title.. post for everyone, posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 12:11:56
With your output and after weighting the pros and the cons, I decided to wait for 7 days.This '7 days' is in the Parnate monography that says that it's enough to stop any MAOI and start Parnate. This seems to indicate that they didn't received any case report related to this '7 days' delay.
So in 6 days from now I should become Parnated.
While waiting for that grand day, next Thursday, I will give you news about my withdrawal, if you care to read my posts; As I think my withdrawal will be tough and that I got nobody (non-network friends, familly, girlfriend) that could understand what I'll be going through.. it will be good and therapeutic to talk to you guys..
I'm really proud to have discovers you that forum and you guys...
thank a lot,
MartyPS Crazy Horse: Mana jioush Crazeous Horso, meaning in sioux: Thank you for encouraging me, Crazy one.
Marty
Posted by SLS on April 14, 2006, at 12:30:02
In reply to Oups bad title.. post for everyone, posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 12:11:56
Hi Marty.
The problem is this: These drugs do more than just attach themselves to the MAO enzyme. Unfortunately, there is no real incentive to elucidate exactly what these things are, but it is obvious that Parnate acts very much like a stimulant. It can produce an amphetamine-like effect at 10mg almost immediately. This is too low a dosage and too soon to inhibit a significant amount of MAO. So we have a drug that might act to release or inhibit the reuptake of norepinephrine. Whatever it does, it tends to cause spontaneous hypertensive reactions in some people. If introduced at a time when there is already significant MAO inhibition, there might be a synergism that results in a serious adverse event.
I like your theory, though.
- Scott
> Sorry this post wasn't only for Linkage like my title was saying...
>
> What do you think of this theory:
>
> The monoamines oxidase level is returning to is normal level after 3-5 days. For this theory lets be more conservative/safe and let's say 10 days.
>
> My pdoc think that because Nardil and Parnate works in the same way, stoping a MAOI and starting another should not be a problem since it should not change a lot the MAO level.. letting some MAO in the body which is important since a person with a level of 0 MAO is in big trouble.
>
> But here's my theory: Nardil and Parnate doesn't inhibit the MAO-A and MAO-B in the same proportion. Here's an exemple of the problem that it could cause: If one day after stoping Nardil, which let's say BY EXEMPLE inhibit 75% MAO-A and 25% MAO-B, I start Parnate who would BY EXEMPLE inhibit 25% MAO-A and 75% MAO-B.. I would have in theory, depending on the dose of Nardil and Parnate and etc.. near not much MAO since N-MAO-A 75% + P-MAO-A 25% = MAO-A 100% and N-MAO-B 25% + P-MAO-B 75% = MAO-B 100% ...
>
> Those numbers are fictional and have been picked just to simplify the explanation of my theory.
>
> Anyone thinks it could make sens ?
>
> Thanks for your time and hope you are all well.
> Marty
>
>
Posted by linkadge on April 14, 2006, at 14:34:27
In reply to Re: Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question., posted by SLS on April 14, 2006, at 10:25:34
With that being said, I probably change my recomendation to waiting out the washout. You may be able to get away with less, but I guess I can't recomend that.
Linkadge
Posted by Crazy Horse on April 14, 2006, at 15:55:06
In reply to My decision, posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 12:22:31
>
> With your output and after weighting the pros and the cons, I decided to wait for 7 days.
>
> This '7 days' is in the Parnate monography that says that it's enough to stop any MAOI and start Parnate. This seems to indicate that they didn't received any case report related to this '7 days' delay.
>
> So in 6 days from now I should become Parnated.
>
> While waiting for that grand day, next Thursday, I will give you news about my withdrawal, if you care to read my posts; As I think my withdrawal will be tough and that I got nobody (non-network friends, familly, girlfriend) that could understand what I'll be going through.. it will be good and therapeutic to talk to you guys..
>
> I'm really proud to have discovers you that forum and you guys...
>
> thank a lot,
> Marty
>
> PS Crazy Horse: Mana jioush Crazeous Horso, meaning in sioux: Thank you for encouraging me, Crazy one.
>
> Marty
Hey Parn Star,7 days huh? Just start with a very low dose of Parnate at first to make sure there won't be a problem. You're a lot like me, I'm a bit of a risk taker, personally i think 7 days will be enough, however i certainly don't have the psychopharmacology knowledge of SLS, and Link.
As far as support while you are tapering off Nardil, you got it from me. Sleep a lot if you can. And use your Klonopin to help you get through this. Also, drink a lot of water to help wash it(Nardil) out of your system. You'll be fine my friend...easy for me to say, huh? :)-Crazy Horse
P.S. Huna cama kotches ona sabita. Sioux for-Be strong Parn Star, the power of Parnate awaits you. :^)
Posted by Phillipa on April 14, 2006, at 16:06:02
In reply to Re: Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question. » SLS, posted by linkadge on April 14, 2006, at 14:34:27
If you can't tolerate wellbutrin can you tolerate an MAOI? Love Phillipa ps please excuse my typing as i broke my arm last night and amin a cast trying to type with one hand. What a pain 11111111
Posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 23:33:31
In reply to Re: My decision » MARTY, posted by Crazy Horse on April 14, 2006, at 15:55:06
Yep, 5 days to go :) and yes I will start it smoothly thursday. My Pdoc has prescribed me 10mg x3, but I will start with 10mg x1 for 3 days.
Thank for your support buddy. It's the first time ever someone who knows 'crazyville' and how a withdrawal feels offers his moral support..
Taking Klonopin is a good suggestion and is part of my plan. As for sleeping and drinking water I haven't thought about it.. it very simple but I never think of the simple things I can do to make me feel better.. All I usually do when I withdraw from a med is taking pills and observe how I feel.. got a fixation on my anxiety and depression. I never think about doing little things for me .. nap, taking a bath, taking a walk, eat well, plan simple things to do to makes days less painfull .. etc ..
Your sleep and water made me realize this. I should learn to take more care of me, not less like I usually do when I'm in pain. Maybe taking care of me could bring me back partially the sens of control over what I live that I loose usually when I do great anxiety.
Wow.. this Nardil withdrawal is transforming me in someone profound, almost philosophic ;)=
"Parnate Planet im Anblick, ein Pferd nahe Landungaufstellungsort sehend."
Meaning...
"Parnate planet in sight, seeing a horse near landing site."Marty
> Hey Parn Star,
>
> 7 days huh? Just start with a very low dose of Parnate at first to make sure there won't be a problem. You're a lot like me, I'm a bit of a risk taker, personally i think 7 days will be enough, however i certainly don't have the psychopharmacology knowledge of SLS, and Link.
> As far as support while you are tapering off Nardil, you got it from me. Sleep a lot if you can. And use your Klonopin to help you get through this. Also, drink a lot of water to help wash it(Nardil) out of your system. You'll be fine my friend...easy for me to say, huh? :)
>
> -Crazy Horse
>
> P.S. Huna cama kotches ona sabita. Sioux for-Be strong Parn Star, the power of Parnate awaits you. :^)
Posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 23:56:31
In reply to Re: Attn Linkage..Nardil to Parnate Question. » SLS, posted by linkadge on April 14, 2006, at 14:34:27
Thanks you again for your advices. I you should have read in my posts I decided to wait 7 days of withdrawal before taking my first dose which will be 10mg a day for 3 days.SLS, very interesting about the Parnate effects that isn't probably due to MAO inhibition. I guess it's much like the GABA work of Nardil. It would have been great to have more research done on those secondary effect, isolate their mecanism so we could recreate them without the MAO inhibition; the isolated Nardil GABA effect would make a nice competitor to benzos.
Linkage, thanks .. expressing your change of mind about an earlier advice shows how you take advising people seriously.
Both you, SLS and Crazy horse are worthy of my confidence.
Thanks a lot --
Marty
Posted by linkadge on April 15, 2006, at 15:20:42
In reply to Linkage and SLS, posted by MARTY on April 14, 2006, at 23:56:31
Parnate, I believe actually has some effects at monoamine uptake sites. Doesn't it acutally have a weak effect at serotonin uptake sites ?
Linkadge
This is the end of the thread.
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