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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Jake E on December 5, 2003, at 16:51:11
I've read several posts about Adderall tolerance. I'm dismayed that a definite solution to this problem hasn't been found.
Has anyone had success with the Klonopin + Adderall approach?
Posted by BackOfClass on December 5, 2003, at 18:55:54
In reply to Adderall tolerance, posted by Jake E on December 5, 2003, at 16:51:11
I take both Klonopin and Adderall but the biggist problem, some may relate who have anxiety and ADHD, is finding the right balance between the two. When I take Adderall I become anxious, which creates the need for the Klonopin, which makes me numb and dumb, thus creating the need for Adderall. It is always a challenge getting the dosage just right. I am interested in knowing if anyone can relate? I should also mention that I take Zyprexa and Zoloft, both of which I feel no effects from.
Posted by Viridis on December 7, 2003, at 2:51:33
In reply to Adderall tolerance, posted by Jake E on December 5, 2003, at 16:51:11
For me, Klonopin and Adderall work very well together. Despite trials of many other drugs, these are my "core" meds, and I haven't developed tolerance to either one, after about 2 1/2 years of Klonopin and over 2 years of Adderall, both at pretty low doses.
I should add that I have a frustrating combination of ADD, anxiety, and recurring depression, and have had poor to terrible responses to quite a range of "conventional" antidepressants.
I take 1 mg Klonopin/day and 10 mg Adderall, (Adderall in two doses of 5 mg apiece, a few hours apart). I skip the Adderall for a day or two here and there to help avoid tolerance, and have no problems with this. If I don't take Klonopin, I experience major anxiety.
Klonopin took care of most of my anxiety and insomnia and got rid of the worst of my depression (much of which was the agitated, "can't sleep, can't eat" type). Adderall helps me think more clearly and boosts the antidepressant effects of the Klonopin. I also find it somewhat relaxing.
Things aren't perfect and I keep trying other meds with varying degrees of success, but these are the two I'll stick with (for now at least) no matter what. And, unlike most of the others I've tried, after a brief adjustment period I've had no side effects and no need for dosage increases with either.
That's just me, but some others here have related a similar synergy between Klonopin and Adderall, so this seems to be a good combo for certain people.
Posted by Jake E on December 7, 2003, at 16:35:53
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance » Jake E, posted by Viridis on December 7, 2003, at 2:51:33
> For me, Klonopin and Adderall work very well together. Despite trials of many other drugs, these are my "core" meds, and I haven't developed tolerance to either one, after about 2 1/2 years of Klonopin and over 2 years of Adderall, both at pretty low doses.
>
> I should add that I have a frustrating combination of ADD, anxiety, and recurring depression, and have had poor to terrible responses to quite a range of "conventional" antidepressants.
>
> I take 1 mg Klonopin/day and 10 mg Adderall, (Adderall in two doses of 5 mg apiece, a few hours apart). I skip the Adderall for a day or two here and there to help avoid tolerance, and have no problems with this. If I don't take Klonopin, I experience major anxiety.
>
> Klonopin took care of most of my anxiety and insomnia and got rid of the worst of my depression (much of which was the agitated, "can't sleep, can't eat" type). Adderall helps me think more clearly and boosts the antidepressant effects of the Klonopin. I also find it somewhat relaxing.
>
> Things aren't perfect and I keep trying other meds with varying degrees of success, but these are the two I'll stick with (for now at least) no matter what. And, unlike most of the others I've tried, after a brief adjustment period I've had no side effects and no need for dosage increases with either.
>
> That's just me, but some others here have related a similar synergy between Klonopin and Adderall, so this seems to be a good combo for certain people.I'm glad to hear you've had success with this drug combination. You're lucky to have not developed a tolerance to either drug.
The specific problem I'm referring to, however, is when a person finds that the Adderall is tremendously effective at first, but in subsequent days or weeks the beneficial effects dissipate.
In the past couple of days I have done a little research on drugs that could possibly prevent amphetamine tolerance. In one post, someone mentioned that Klonopin do it. So I'm wondering if anyone has developed amphetamine (Adderall) tolerance, and then eliminated it by adding Klonopin.
Posted by Viridis on December 8, 2003, at 5:31:59
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance, posted by Jake E on December 7, 2003, at 16:35:53
I'm no expert, but could you take Adderall on alternate days, or for limited periods punctuated by a few days off? That might help you avoid tolerance.
Alternatively, Provigil or Strattera may be worth a try -- I've taken both, and they've been somewhat helpful (although not as good as Adderall). With Strattera, I'd strongly recommend a gradual dosage increase, as the side effects can be substantial at first, but not bad if you titrate up gradually.
Posted by Jake E on December 8, 2003, at 20:15:00
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance » Jake E, posted by Viridis on December 8, 2003, at 5:31:59
> I'm no expert, but could you take Adderall on alternate days, or for limited periods punctuated by a few days off? That might help you avoid tolerance.
>
> Alternatively, Provigil or Strattera may be worth a try -- I've taken both, and they've been somewhat helpful (although not as good as Adderall). With Strattera, I'd strongly recommend a gradual dosage increase, as the side effects can be substantial at first, but not bad if you titrate up gradually.Thanks for the input,
So far, I've been taking weekends off from Adderall. But this only seems to slow the rate at which the tolerance develops; I still have to occassionally increase the dosage.
I recently tried Strattera for about 3 months. It worked maybe 1/5 as well as Adderall. It was better than nothing I suppose.
I've never tried Provigil. I might look into this one...
For the time being, I'm going to take the advice of Andrew B: add a NMDA receptor antagonist to my drug regimine. Currently, I only have DXM available to me, found in cough syrup (Vicks). I'm using 60mg (4 tablespoons) a day, which is the maximum dosage indicated on the label.
When Memantine is made available in the US next month, I'll switch to it and see if all the claims are true -- that it can kill amphetamine-tolerance. When I find out, I'll let everyone know.
Posted by mindreseacher on August 21, 2004, at 23:03:33
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance » Jake E, posted by Viridis on December 7, 2003, at 2:51:33
Just a few comments about adderall, tolerance, and klonopin. Iv been on Klonopin for about 1 yr now, 2-3mg daily, Lexapro 10mg , Adderall 30mg 2x daily, and Subxone.
TO be brief about suboxone, its buprenorphine which helps with opiate addiction. Even though im an addicts to opiates, i dont abuse benzons, speed, alcohol, just seems that i just cant kick the opiates. But with this med combo, my cravings are about 80 percent lower that if i was just taking 1 med like zoloft or lexapro.
I dont feel high from subxone, even though its strong stuff, a partial mu agonist and kappa antangonist, so you dont feel much euphoria, but it kills any opiate withdrawls, and persons who are opiate nieve, will get a buzz.
Anyway, lexapro at 10mg, even at 20, cause absolutely no side effects which is great. But i lowered it to 10 because i take some 5htp at night. I figure this. Lexapro blocks the reuptake of seratonin. So 5htp creates seratonin , allowing more seratonin to be reuptaken by lexapro. I may be wrong, but...
Now Adderall. Tolerance is a big issue. Im at 30mg 2 x daily. I find 2 things that are causing a problem. THis dose wears off in 4-5 hrs, basically i dose every 5 hrs. I have to take an extra dose. I may run short but i do have (20) 30mg ritalins La. Which also may come in handy for 2 reasons.
Due to the fact im getting very tolerant to adderall, but i can tell its still helping, but i would like to give it a rest, so i figure, instead of stopping and going through withdrawls and sleeping 3 days, ill just take 2 ritalin la capsules daily, for 10 days. THis hopefully will help adderall get some potency back, iv read alot and i know there is a difference in ritalin and amphetamines due to amphetamines release dopamine and N/A and Ritalin like cocaine, block the reuptake. I still am researching more.
I take the klonopin basically at a dose of .5-1mg depending on my anxiety level, and to eliminate any anxiety from adderall. THis combo works very very well.
The only alternative i see are ordering smart nootropics drugs and giving them a shot or taking a maoi like paranate, due to my social phobia/add/depression.
But i do have a question. Would stopping adderall one day and switching over to ritalin for 10 days be ok? Or would maybe lowering my adderall dose and taking both?
thank you
MR
Posted by Jake E on March 8, 2005, at 15:44:11
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance, posted by mindreseacher on August 21, 2004, at 23:03:33
> Just a few comments about adderall, tolerance, and klonopin. Iv been on Klonopin for about 1 yr now, 2-3mg daily, Lexapro 10mg , Adderall 30mg 2x daily, and Subxone.
>
> TO be brief about suboxone, its buprenorphine which helps with opiate addiction. Even though im an addicts to opiates, i dont abuse benzons, speed, alcohol, just seems that i just cant kick the opiates. But with this med combo, my cravings are about 80 percent lower that if i was just taking 1 med like zoloft or lexapro.
>
> I dont feel high from subxone, even though its strong stuff, a partial mu agonist and kappa antangonist, so you dont feel much euphoria, but it kills any opiate withdrawls, and persons who are opiate nieve, will get a buzz.
>
> Anyway, lexapro at 10mg, even at 20, cause absolutely no side effects which is great. But i lowered it to 10 because i take some 5htp at night. I figure this. Lexapro blocks the reuptake of seratonin. So 5htp creates seratonin , allowing more seratonin to be reuptaken by lexapro. I may be wrong, but...
>
> Now Adderall. Tolerance is a big issue. Im at 30mg 2 x daily. I find 2 things that are causing a problem. THis dose wears off in 4-5 hrs, basically i dose every 5 hrs. I have to take an extra dose. I may run short but i do have (20) 30mg ritalins La. Which also may come in handy for 2 reasons.
>
> Due to the fact im getting very tolerant to adderall, but i can tell its still helping, but i would like to give it a rest, so i figure, instead of stopping and going through withdrawls and sleeping 3 days, ill just take 2 ritalin la capsules daily, for 10 days. THis hopefully will help adderall get some potency back, iv read alot and i know there is a difference in ritalin and amphetamines due to amphetamines release dopamine and N/A and Ritalin like cocaine, block the reuptake. I still am researching more.
>
> I take the klonopin basically at a dose of .5-1mg depending on my anxiety level, and to eliminate any anxiety from adderall. THis combo works very very well.
>
> The only alternative i see are ordering smart nootropics drugs and giving them a shot or taking a maoi like paranate, due to my social phobia/add/depression.
>
> But i do have a question. Would stopping adderall one day and switching over to ritalin for 10 days be ok? Or would maybe lowering my adderall dose and taking both?
>
> thank you
> MRI've recently been experimenting with the memantine (Namenda)/adderall combo and have had some pretty amazing results.
I've been using 40mg memantine in the morning, first thing, followed by 40mg adderall. Every morning the adderall is just as effective as the previous morning. I get about 4-5 hours of effectiveness every day.
The memantine seems to reduce some of the side-effects of adderall, specifically the mood swings that typically occur when tolerance sets in. The anxiety isn't as bad either.
The rumors are true. Memantine does help with adderall tolerance.
Posted by stresser on March 10, 2005, at 14:35:02
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance, posted by Jake E on March 8, 2005, at 15:44:11
Do you have ADD?-L
Posted by Jake E on March 14, 2005, at 22:54:19
In reply to Re: Adderall tolerance » Jake E, posted by stresser on March 10, 2005, at 14:35:02
> Do you have ADD?-L
I have hardcore ADD.
This is the end of the thread.
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