![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 23 of 23. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Michael Bell on April 15, 2003, at 21:10:53
Okay, I like this drug. Been taking it for Social Phobia for only four days as an add-on to Picamilon. Already I can tell that it has greased the social wheel and made me pretty comfortable in social situations.
BUT... why does it make me so tired?! I only take 25mg/day in the mornings. Does the drowsiness go away eventually? WOuld it help if I took the doses at night instead? Anyone with amisulpride experience or knowledge, please respond. Thanks!
Oh, and here's an update to my experience with Picamilon - it kicks *ss for social phobia. Been taking it for a while, hardly any anxiety. But it's not prosocial either, which is why I added amisulpride. Later!
-- Michael Bell
Posted by chad_3 on April 16, 2003, at 12:35:10
In reply to AMISULPRIDE!, posted by Michael Bell on April 15, 2003, at 21:10:53
Hola Dude -
Glad you like you amisulpride. Did you know that amisulpride is more toxic than risperdal, and that the substitute benzamides are notorious - as are the classic neuroleptics - in causing a great variety of tardive movement disorders.
Likely the sedation will get worse - and you won't want to continue the amisulpride beyond 3 weeks - but hopefully you won't develop a movement disorder before that. It does not always take long - especially in young males.
Later dude,
Chad
http://www.socialfear.com/
> Okay, I like this drug. Been taking it for Social Phobia for only four days as an add-on to Picamilon. Already I can tell that it has greased the social wheel and made me pretty comfortable in social situations.
>
> BUT... why does it make me so tired?! I only take 25mg/day in the mornings. Does the drowsiness go away eventually? WOuld it help if I took the doses at night instead? Anyone with amisulpride experience or knowledge, please respond. Thanks!
>
> Oh, and here's an update to my experience with Picamilon - it kicks *ss for social phobia. Been taking it for a while, hardly any anxiety. But it's not prosocial either, which is why I added amisulpride. Later!
>
> -- Michael Bell
Posted by btnd on April 16, 2003, at 18:10:41
In reply to 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? , posted by chad_3 on April 16, 2003, at 12:35:10
> Hola Dude -
>
> Glad you like you amisulpride. Did you know that amisulpride is more toxic than risperdal, and that the substitute benzamides are notorious - as are the classic neuroleptics - in causing a great variety of tardive movement disorders.
>
> Likely the sedation will get worse - and you won't want to continue the amisulpride beyond 3 weeks - but hopefully you won't develop a movement disorder before that. It does not always take long - especially in young males.
>
> Later dude,
>
> Chad
> http://www.socialfear.com/Chad, are you serious?? I've been researching Amisulpride for about a month and have found great info/studies on it working for dysthymia. Could you post some references on amisulpride toxicity?
Brad
Posted by Michael Bell on April 16, 2003, at 18:28:37
In reply to 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? , posted by chad_3 on April 16, 2003, at 12:35:10
Uhh - Well, I could take low-dose Amisulpride, which has been proven by numerous studies to be safe and have the same rate of EPS issues as placebo. Or I do what your website says and take Nardil or Klonopin, whose side effects only include... let's see, possible death or dependence. Gee, tough choice. No offense, but you seem very misinformed about amisulpride. I don't mind being proven wrong, as long as you post some links and studies that back you up as opposed to just making statements as though they are fact. Peace!> Hola Dude -
>
> Glad you like you amisulpride. Did you know that amisulpride is more toxic than risperdal, and that the substitute benzamides are notorious - as are the classic neuroleptics - in causing a great variety of tardive movement disorders.
>
> Likely the sedation will get worse - and you won't want to continue the amisulpride beyond 3 weeks - but hopefully you won't develop a movement disorder before that. It does not always take long - especially in young males.
>
> Later dude,
>
> Chad
> http://www.socialfear.com/
>
>
> > Okay, I like this drug. Been taking it for Social Phobia for only four days as an add-on to Picamilon. Already I can tell that it has greased the social wheel and made me pretty comfortable in social situations.
> >
> > BUT... why does it make me so tired?! I only take 25mg/day in the mornings. Does the drowsiness go away eventually? WOuld it help if I took the doses at night instead? Anyone with amisulpride experience or knowledge, please respond. Thanks!
> >
> > Oh, and here's an update to my experience with Picamilon - it kicks *ss for social phobia. Been taking it for a while, hardly any anxiety. But it's not prosocial either, which is why I added amisulpride. Later!
> >
> > -- Michael Bell
>
>
Posted by btnd on April 16, 2003, at 18:52:05
In reply to Re: 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? » chad_3, posted by Michael Bell on April 16, 2003, at 18:28:37
Ok i've found it. It's the only study on amisulpride and *possible* problems.
Novel antipsychotics, extrapyramidal side effects and tardive dyskinesia.
Barnes TR, McPhillips MA.
Division of Neuroscience and Psychological Medicine, Imperial College School of Medicine, London, UK.
A common and serious drawback of the conventional antipsychotics is their association with a range of motor disturbances: acute extrapyramidal symptoms, including parkinsonism, acute akathisia and acute dystonia; and chronic motor problems such as tardive dyskinesia, chronic akathisia and tardive dystonia. In addition to physical disability directly related to abnormal movements, the acute movement disorders can cause considerable subjective discomfort and distress, and are frequently cited as a reason for poor compliance with medication, at least during acute treatment. They can also confound clinical assessment of mental-state phenomena because of symptom overlap with the psychotic illness being treated. The results of clinical trials of the newer antipsychotic drugs such as clozapine, risperidone, olanzapine, amisulpride, quetiapine and sertindole suggest a lower liability for acute extrapyramidal symptoms than conventional antipsychotic drugs such as haloperidol and chlorpromazine. The relative liability of each of the newer drugs to cause acute extrapyramidal side effects is not known, as they have been available for a relatively short time and there is a paucity of direct comparative studies. Evidence is accumulating that those patients exhibiting acute extrapyramidal side effects are at greater risk of developing tardive dyskinesia, which raises the hope that the newer antipsychotic drugs may also be associated with less tardive dyskinesia in the longer term. Encouraging data are already available for clozapine, which appears to have a low incidence of tardive dyskinesia, and therapeutic value in a proportion of established cases of tardive dyskinesia and tardive dystonia. Here we review the available data on atypical antipsychotics and adverse motor effects.
Posted by Michael Bell on April 16, 2003, at 19:26:29
In reply to 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? , posted by chad_3 on April 16, 2003, at 12:35:10
Chad, sorry if I came on too strong in the last post. The point I should have made was that all the research studies I have read say that low dose amisulpride is very safe. Dosage is very important when considering side effects. The average dose of amisulpride for schizophrenics is between 400 - 800 mg per day. Also, it's important to note that this drug has opposite effects at low and high doses. At low doses (0 - 200mg/ day), it selectively blocks PREsynaptic dopamine receptors, thus increasing dopamine transmission. This seems to be the reason why it has proven helpful for negative symptoms of schizophrenia and dysthymia. At higher doses (400 - 800mg/ day) it blocks POSTsynaptic dopamine receptors, and is helpful for curtainling the positive symptoms of schizophrenia. So I agree that taking doses in the high range may pose some of the same TD problems as the older TDs, but the dose I'm taking is only 1/16th of the lowest doses for schizophrenia. I've yet to come across a study that shows type of dosage to be unsafe.
And for anybody else out there... does the drowsiness go away after a while? Did the positive effects of this drug last? Thanks!
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 16, 2003, at 22:12:52
In reply to 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? , posted by chad_3 on April 16, 2003, at 12:35:10
> Glad you like you amisulpride...
Sorry, I didn't have it set right, but you're still supposed to be blocked.
Bob
PS: Follow-ups regarding posting policies should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration; otherwise, they may be deleted.
Posted by action_jackson on April 16, 2003, at 23:38:05
In reply to Re: 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? , posted by Michael Bell on April 16, 2003, at 19:26:29
Hi Michael -
I work in an ER and I see quite a bit of acute dystonic reactions from Reglan. This is a an FDA approved substitute benzamide used for nausea - the same class of med Chad says amisulpride is in...
I suggest to look up metaclopramide on google and see if you find any data on that - there is no question that Reglan can cause severe EPS. If you look up PDR data on Risperdal you will see that the newer atypical a/p's not uncommonly cause severe EPS reactions as well ... I personally believe we see more EPS in the ER from Reglan only because it is more often given to "normals" in acute or sub-acute use.
Jack
> Chad, sorry if I came on too strong in the last post. The point I should have made was that all the research studies I have read say that low dose amisulpride is very safe. Dosage is very important when considering side effects. The average dose of amisulpride for schizophrenics is between 400 - 800 mg per day. Also, it's important to note that this drug has opposite effects at low and high doses. At low doses (0 - 200mg/ day), it selectively blocks PREsynaptic dopamine receptors, thus increasing dopamine transmission. This seems to be the reason why it has proven helpful for negative symptoms of schizophrenia and dysthymia. At higher doses (400 - 800mg/ day) it blocks POSTsynaptic dopamine receptors, and is helpful for curtainling the positive symptoms of schizophrenia. So I agree that taking doses in the high range may pose some of the same TD problems as the older TDs, but the dose I'm taking is only 1/16th of the lowest doses for schizophrenia. I've yet to come across a study that shows type of dosage to be unsafe.
>
> And for anybody else out there... does the drowsiness go away after a while? Did the positive effects of this drug last? Thanks!
Posted by michael on April 17, 2003, at 3:24:38
In reply to Re: 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? , posted by Michael Bell on April 16, 2003, at 19:26:29
> Chad, sorry if I came on too strong in the last post. The point I should have made was that all the research studies I have read say that low dose amisulpride is very safe. Dosage is very important when considering side effects. The average dose of amisulpride for schizophrenics is between 400 - 800 mg per day. Also, it's important to note that this drug has opposite effects at low and high doses. At low doses (0 - 200mg/ day), it selectively blocks PREsynaptic dopamine receptors, thus increasing dopamine transmission. This seems to be the reason why it has proven helpful for negative symptoms of schizophrenia and dysthymia. At higher doses (400 - 800mg/ day) it blocks POSTsynaptic dopamine receptors, and is helpful for curtainling the positive symptoms of schizophrenia. So I agree that taking doses in the high range may pose some of the same TD problems as the older TDs, but the dose I'm taking is only 1/16th of the lowest doses for schizophrenia. I've yet to come across a study that shows type of dosage to be unsafe.
>
> And for anybody else out there... does the drowsiness go away after a while? Did the positive effects of this drug last? Thanks!I think what you said about dose is relevant. I know some people had success w/it here a year or two ago - I'd search the archives (andrewb wrote quite a bit aobut it - don't recall for certain, but I think it was spring of 2001 or 2002).
It made me very tired/drowsy too, and seemed to keep getting worse - I think I tried it for a few weeks. I had to stop. However, I found sulpiride to be a little helpful w/mood - nothing drastic, but noticeable. It may be that I was taking too much amisulpiride, (for me) even though I was taking a low dose. I don't recall off-hand how much for certain - I think only 25-50mg, or so? You might find old posts of mine w/more specifics in the archives. But fwiw - at the time, I know andrew (& others, I think) thought it was helpful.
But I think you'd find a bunch of comments in the archives. Hope that helps.
michael
Posted by Michael Bell on April 17, 2003, at 22:04:56
In reply to Re: 4 days on amisulpride - great for SP? » Michael Bell, posted by michael on April 17, 2003, at 3:24:38
Thanks for the reply. I'm just curious about when you took your dosage... morning, noon or night. I take mine in the morning, and every day I get the same experience - I feel fine for several hours, then at about 2 or 3pm I'm hit with extreme drowsiness. This lasts for about 1 hr, then I feel fine again. Then the drowsiness comes back at about 10pm. Weird, right? I'm thinking about taking the med at night instead. What was your experience?
Posted by action_jackson on April 18, 2003, at 1:03:29
In reply to AMISULPRIDE!, posted by Michael Bell on April 15, 2003, at 21:10:53
Is the antipsychotic continuing to be the answer to your SP? Keep us posted!
Jack
> Okay, I like this drug. Been taking it for Social Phobia for only four days as an add-on to Picamilon. Already I can tell that it has greased the social wheel and made me pretty comfortable in social situations.
>
> BUT... why does it make me so tired?! I only take 25mg/day in the mornings. Does the drowsiness go away eventually? WOuld it help if I took the doses at night instead? Anyone with amisulpride experience or knowledge, please respond. Thanks!
>
> Oh, and here's an update to my experience with Picamilon - it kicks *ss for social phobia. Been taking it for a while, hardly any anxiety. But it's not prosocial either, which is why I added amisulpride. Later!
>
> -- Michael Bell
Posted by Michael Bell on April 18, 2003, at 7:15:24
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! Keep us Posted!!! , posted by action_jackson on April 18, 2003, at 1:03:29
Really, Picamilon has been the answer to the anxiety portion of SP. In fact, the only thing that has ever worked better for me was alcohol. Picamilon has completely wiped out the physiological symptoms of SP. And when I say "completely", I mean just that. No more racing heartbeat, no anticipatory anxiety, no cold feeling in the chest, no shakiness, no fear, etc. What it didn't do is correct the thought process portion of SP, such as thinking "so and so is judgning me", but it does help somewhat in that regard by lessening negative thoughts. The reason I started taking amisulpride is because I seem to have anhedonia in addition to SP, which may or may not be caused by the Picamilon (as a GABA potentiator, it may lower serotonin and/or dopamine effcts in the brain). Sometimes the Picamilon does make me very social, but the effects are inconsistent at best.
Here's what amisulpride seems to have done for me so far - it makes me more LIKELY to consistently socialize in social settings, lessens anhedonia, helps with the "I'm being judged" issue and overall just maikes my brain feel "cleaner", if that makes sense.
My only complaint with amisulpride - drowsiness. Last night I started taking my dose at night instead of in the morning. I'll let you know how this affects the drowsiness issue, and how the amisulpride trial is going overall.
Posted by action_jackson on April 18, 2003, at 12:02:33
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! Keep us Posted!!! , posted by Michael Bell on April 18, 2003, at 7:15:24
Much appreciated. Good luck!
Jack
> Really, Picamilon has been the answer to the anxiety portion of SP. In fact, the only thing that has ever worked better for me was alcohol. Picamilon has completely wiped out the physiological symptoms of SP. And when I say "completely", I mean just that. No more racing heartbeat, no anticipatory anxiety, no cold feeling in the chest, no shakiness, no fear, etc. What it didn't do is correct the thought process portion of SP, such as thinking "so and so is judgning me", but it does help somewhat in that regard by lessening negative thoughts. The reason I started taking amisulpride is because I seem to have anhedonia in addition to SP, which may or may not be caused by the Picamilon (as a GABA potentiator, it may lower serotonin and/or dopamine effcts in the brain). Sometimes the Picamilon does make me very social, but the effects are inconsistent at best.
>
> Here's what amisulpride seems to have done for me so far - it makes me more LIKELY to consistently socialize in social settings, lessens anhedonia, helps with the "I'm being judged" issue and overall just maikes my brain feel "cleaner", if that makes sense.
>
> My only complaint with amisulpride - drowsiness. Last night I started taking my dose at night instead of in the morning. I'll let you know how this affects the drowsiness issue, and how the amisulpride trial is going overall.
Posted by not exactly on April 18, 2003, at 19:38:36
In reply to AMISULPRIDE!, posted by Michael Bell on April 15, 2003, at 21:10:53
Michael,
So glad to hear you've found something that works for you!
Amisulpride is a drug that's been on my must-try list ever since I first heard about it (over a year ago). Would have gotten to it by now if it was available for Rx here in the states. I assume you're obtaining it via mail order (Europe?). Its mechanism of action (in low doses) seems like "just what the doctor ordered" for improving DA transmission without increasing chronic DA levels (leading to down-regulation of receptors and thus inevitable "poop-out").
Never even heard of Picamilon before. So it's a GABA enhancer? How does it compare to Klonopin for SP/GAD benefits and potential side effects?
I wonder if the addition of a bit of Selegiline might make your new magic cocktail work even better. I expect it would amplify the DA signal which would further help with anhedonia and might let you reduce the dose of Amisulpride (while retaining its benefits). The Selegiline might also alleviate the drowsiness and have some potential neuro-protective benefit. I'm a chemist, not a doctor, so I'm just making some suggestions based on educated guesses.
BTW, I remember reading your posts about SP and anhedonia in another thread you started entitled "Dopamine agonists" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030301/msgs/205134.html]. The information you posted there was very helpful to me, and led me to discover a med combo that has worked remarkably well - see "SUCCESS!" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030310/msgs/208344.html] and "Re: SUCCESS with K and Buspar" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030310/msgs/208906.html]. Since you seemed to disappear from that thread before I posted my news about the successful application of your advice, I never got the chance to thank you for the crucial role you played in my discovery (and the continuing dramatic improvement in the quality of my life).
- Bob
Posted by action_jackson on April 19, 2003, at 0:16:35
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! » Michael Bell, posted by not exactly on April 18, 2003, at 19:38:36
Question: Doesn't amisulpride block dopamine receptors, but increase the release of dopamine *more than* the da blockade (at least in the limbic area) - although net dopamine decreases are noted in other areas ... but also ... couldn't one simulate this by combining a classic da blocker (ie; haldol) at a low dose, with say, adderall (increasing release of dopamine) at a high enough dose to override the da blockade?
Wouldn't the haldol + adderall also be a good way to induce movement disorders?
BTW, are you finding the nighttime dosing eliminates the otherwise increasing sedation from amisulpride Michael?
Not Exactly: Glad you have discovered Klonopin for SP. It is arguably the *most* effective med out there for SP! Michael states it is addictive however - do you find this to be the case?
Jack
> Michael,
>
> So glad to hear you've found something that works for you!
>
> Amisulpride is a drug that's been on my must-try list ever since I first heard about it (over a year ago). Would have gotten to it by now if it was available for Rx here in the states. I assume you're obtaining it via mail order (Europe?). Its mechanism of action (in low doses) seems like "just what the doctor ordered" for improving DA transmission without increasing chronic DA levels (leading to down-regulation of receptors and thus inevitable "poop-out").
>
> Never even heard of Picamilon before. So it's a GABA enhancer? How does it compare to Klonopin for SP/GAD benefits and potential side effects?
>
> I wonder if the addition of a bit of Selegiline might make your new magic cocktail work even better. I expect it would amplify the DA signal which would further help with anhedonia and might let you reduce the dose of Amisulpride (while retaining its benefits). The Selegiline might also alleviate the drowsiness and have some potential neuro-protective benefit. I'm a chemist, not a doctor, so I'm just making some suggestions based on educated guesses.
>
> BTW, I remember reading your posts about SP and anhedonia in another thread you started entitled "Dopamine agonists" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030301/msgs/205134.html]. The information you posted there was very helpful to me, and led me to discover a med combo that has worked remarkably well - see "SUCCESS!" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030310/msgs/208344.html] and "Re: SUCCESS with K and Buspar" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030310/msgs/208906.html]. Since you seemed to disappear from that thread before I posted my news about the successful application of your advice, I never got the chance to thank you for the crucial role you played in my discovery (and the continuing dramatic improvement in the quality of my life).
>
> - Bob
>
Posted by not exactly on April 19, 2003, at 5:18:42
In reply to Re: Amisulpride vs Klonopin, posted by action_jackson on April 19, 2003, at 0:16:35
> Not Exactly: Glad you have discovered Klonopin for SP. It is arguably the *most* effective med out there for SP! Michael states it is addictive however - do you find this to be the case?
I've taken Klonopin before (about 3 years ago) and don't remember having any particular problems when I stopped it. But I was taking a very low dose (0.5 mg/day or less) for a relatively short period (a couple of weeks) and tapered off rather than quitting cold turkey.
Now that I'm taking a slightly higher dose (up to 1 mg/day) and expect to continue it for months or even years, I may have more trouble if I ever want/need to stop it. I'm sure I'll have to taper it very slowly to avoid feeling overwhelmed by anxiety. But will that be a "withdrawal symptom", or just the return of my pre-treatment anxiety state?
However, I'm not really concerned about becoming a benzo addict. Since the Klonopin appears to be effectively solving a significant chronic problem, I wouldn't really mind if I had to take it for the rest of my life. Does a diabetic worry that he's "addicted" to insulin? Klonopin is cheap and benign insurance. It's such a relief to finally live in a world that doesn't feel constantly threatening.
- Bob
Posted by SLS on April 19, 2003, at 8:28:19
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! » Michael Bell, posted by not exactly on April 18, 2003, at 19:38:36
> Amisulpride is a drug that's been on my must-try list ever since I first heard about it (over a year ago). Would have gotten to it by now if it was available for Rx here in the states.
Abilify (aripiprazole), like amisulpride, preferentially antagonizes DA presynaptic autoreceptors. It is supposed to have almost no risk of movement EPS because it does not block receptors in the striatum. People taking it for depression, myself included, report that Abilify makes one feel more social as well as helping with anhedonia and motivation. I am currently taking 10mg, which seems to be low enough to prevent akathisia.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on April 19, 2003, at 8:36:36
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE!, posted by SLS on April 19, 2003, at 8:28:19
I was inaccurate in my previous post regarding the activity Abilify displays in the striatum. It does indeed block D2 receptors in the striatum. However, it seems that it does not induce an upregulation of postsynaptic receptors. It is perhaps for this reason that Abilify has not displayed significant movement EPS.
Sorry.
- Scott
Posted by Michael Bell on April 20, 2003, at 10:12:06
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! » Michael Bell, posted by not exactly on April 18, 2003, at 19:38:36
Bob - it's great to hear that you found inspiration from a thread on this board. I truly believe in a forum like this which offers unregulated information exchange between people who have the same experiences. Keep us up on your experiences!
Regarding amisulpride, I can't post the site where I got it, but just do an internet search. It's about $200 for 90 pills, 100mg each. Since I break each pill into four, this equates to a year's supply for $200. Not horribly expensive, if you look at it like that.
Picamilon is actually GABA bonded to niacin (vitamin B3), which lets Picamilon pass through the blood-brain barrier rather easily. Taking pure GABA is often ineffective, b/c GABA on its own has a very difficult time passing through the barrier.
I tried Selegiline (5mg/day) for several months on my self-treatment road, but it really didn't help. By itself, it definitely did not help with SP, and made the paranoid ideation slightly worse. Tyrosine supplementation made me extremely paranoid after a while, though admittedly I was taking much more than recommended.
Anyway, good luck with everything!
> Michael,
>
> So glad to hear you've found something that works for you!
>
> Amisulpride is a drug that's been on my must-try list ever since I first heard about it (over a year ago). Would have gotten to it by now if it was available for Rx here in the states. I assume you're obtaining it via mail order (Europe?). Its mechanism of action (in low doses) seems like "just what the doctor ordered" for improving DA transmission without increasing chronic DA levels (leading to down-regulation of receptors and thus inevitable "poop-out").
>
> Never even heard of Picamilon before. So it's a GABA enhancer? How does it compare to Klonopin for SP/GAD benefits and potential side effects?
>
> I wonder if the addition of a bit of Selegiline might make your new magic cocktail work even better. I expect it would amplify the DA signal which would further help with anhedonia and might let you reduce the dose of Amisulpride (while retaining its benefits). The Selegiline might also alleviate the drowsiness and have some potential neuro-protective benefit. I'm a chemist, not a doctor, so I'm just making some suggestions based on educated guesses.
>
> BTW, I remember reading your posts about SP and anhedonia in another thread you started entitled "Dopamine agonists" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030301/msgs/205134.html]. The information you posted there was very helpful to me, and led me to discover a med combo that has worked remarkably well - see "SUCCESS!" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030310/msgs/208344.html] and "Re: SUCCESS with K and Buspar" [http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030310/msgs/208906.html]. Since you seemed to disappear from that thread before I posted my news about the successful application of your advice, I never got the chance to thank you for the crucial role you played in my discovery (and the continuing dramatic improvement in the quality of my life).
>
> - Bob
Posted by Tepiaca on April 20, 2003, at 14:47:09
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! - correction, posted by SLS on April 19, 2003, at 8:36:36
amisulpride caused on me akathisia
and did nothing for my SP
Klonopin its better for me
I take 6 mg daily
Just sharing my experiences
Tep
Posted by michael on April 22, 2003, at 3:15:19
In reply to Re: drowsiness related to when pill taken? » michael, posted by Michael Bell on April 17, 2003, at 22:04:56
> Thanks for the reply. I'm just curious about when you took your dosage... morning, noon or night. I take mine in the morning, and every day I get the same experience - I feel fine for several hours, then at about 2 or 3pm I'm hit with extreme drowsiness. This lasts for about 1 hr, then I feel fine again. Then the drowsiness comes back at about 10pm. Weird, right? I'm thinking about taking the med at night instead. What was your experience?
I also took it in the morning. For me the fatigue & drowsiness kept building cumulatively, and I finally got to the point that I was just too wiped out - even though I went to bed earlier and earlier. Eventually, I decided to stop taking it. Like I said, it may be that the dose I was taking was too high for me...?Maybe taking it at night or in the evening is a good idea. I'd be interested to hear whether that helps, or not - if you decide to try that. Hope it works.
Posted by not exactly on April 22, 2003, at 15:52:00
In reply to Re: AMISULPRIDE! » not exactly, posted by Michael Bell on April 20, 2003, at 10:12:06
> I tried Selegiline (5mg/day) for several months on my self-treatment road, but it really didn't help. By itself, it definitely did not help with SP, and made the paranoid ideation slightly worse. Tyrosine supplementation made me extremely paranoid after a while, though admittedly I was taking much more than recommended.
Selegiline is an odd drug. At doses where it acts as a general MAOI (15 mg/day or higher), it can be a very effective antidepressant for some people. Of course, if you're inhibiting enough MAO-A for it to help, then you also run the risk of the dreaded "cheese effect" (unless you bypass the digestive system via transdermal or sublingual administration).
It lower doses (10 mg/day or less), when it only inhibits MAO-B, then it acts primarily as an "amplifier" - it can make you feel better when you're already feeling good (for whatever reason), but it can also intensify depression and other negative symptoms. Merely causing dopamine to stick around longer (without enhancing its transmission) does not necessarily improve mood, and can cause psychotic-like side effects.
For this reason, low-dose Selegiline works best when combined with something else that it can synergize with. Phenylalanine (a precursor to dopamine and phenethylamine) works well with Selegiline, as does large and/or frequent doses of chocolate (source of phenethyamine, which in the absence of an MAO-B inhibitor would get metabolized before it has much of an effect). Tyrosine can be effective too, but it's more like to produce side effects - NE increase, headaches, raised BP. Ritalin or amphetamines in TINY doses can also synergize positively (but large or even normal doses can be dangerous in this combination).
In general, anything that enhances DA transmission is likely to synergize positively with Selegiline. That's why I thought it might work well with Amisulpride.
Recently, I've been adding a small amount of Selegiline (2.5 mg/day orally) to my BuSpar/Klonopin cocktail with good results. It helps with the anhedonia, and definitely makes the BuSpar seem even more like an antidepressant.
At last, I'm happy not because I'm ignoring my problems, but because I'm solving them. I'm more creative and productive in my volunteer work, I'm thinking realistically about a new career, I'm playing a more active role in my parent's health care, and I'm getting my cluttered house organized and comfortable. Meanwhile, my psychotherapy sessions have degenerated into simply reporting my positive accomplishments (both tangible and conceptual) without gaining much direction/insight from the therapy itself. I'm seriously considering discontinuing the therapy sessions and just sticking with the meds for now.
- Bob
Posted by spooley on November 4, 2003, at 12:18:33
In reply to AMISULPRIDE!, posted by Michael Bell on April 15, 2003, at 21:10:53
been taking for 5 months, not drowsy now at all but severe pain in head is this a known side effect.
This is the end of the thread.
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