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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by jay on December 5, 2002, at 18:58:52
I am still on Effexor XR, 150mg's, but noticed the following side effects on my first time on Remron (7.5 mg's)
-MAJOR increased vivid dreaming..which I HATE...as I find it 'disassociative', and woke up not knowing where I was, which was scarry as HELL..and I think this is HORRID for someone with PTSD. (It should be noted...many depressives have TOO MUCH rem/dream sleep....and most a.d.'s supress or normalize rem sleep)
-increased appetite right away...
-hang-over upon awakeningI am going to try it for a bit more, otherwise I may just go back to a benzo and small dose of Serzone. Serzone has the 5-ht1 antagonism.
What I am happy about is I am not stuck in the 'lull' I was with just taking Effexor. It seemed I was becoming too apathetic on just Effexor...and the little bit of a different antidepressant approach/augmentation jarred me out of that apathy.
Just my thoughts..but for many who have a fairly positive response to Effexor, I don't think completely switching to Remron *is* a good choice. Of course, YMMV, etc...
Jay
Posted by Ritch on December 5, 2002, at 20:54:48
In reply to Started Remron...yuck..yuck...YUCK!, posted by jay on December 5, 2002, at 18:58:52
> I am still on Effexor XR, 150mg's, but noticed the following side effects on my first time on Remron (7.5 mg's)
>
> -MAJOR increased vivid dreaming..which I HATE...as I find it 'disassociative', and woke up not knowing where I was, which was scarry as HELL..and I think this is HORRID for someone with PTSD. (It should be noted...many depressives have TOO MUCH rem/dream sleep....and most a.d.'s supress or normalize rem sleep)
> -increased appetite right away...
> -hang-over upon awakening
>
> I am going to try it for a bit more, otherwise I may just go back to a benzo and small dose of Serzone. Serzone has the 5-ht1 antagonism.
>
> What I am happy about is I am not stuck in the 'lull' I was with just taking Effexor. It seemed I was becoming too apathetic on just Effexor...and the little bit of a different antidepressant approach/augmentation jarred me out of that apathy.
>
> Just my thoughts..but for many who have a fairly positive response to Effexor, I don't think completely switching to Remron *is* a good choice. Of course, YMMV, etc...
>
> Jay
My sentiments exactly! I had all sorts of bizarre (not quite asleep, but awake) lucid dreaming episodes, and then of course, when it came time to wake up in the morning I would stumble all around and forget things and sit on the couch for hours totally unmotivated to do anything. One of the worst meds I have ever taken. I also had trouble grasping glasses/cups for some reason. Some of this I think was related to the orthostatic hypotension that I experienced with it. If a med makes me the slightest bit *hypo*tensive it bombs big time. What seems to work the best is something that tends to cause a *hyper*tensive situation that I need to watch closely. Not sure why.
Posted by LyndaK on December 5, 2002, at 22:27:43
In reply to Re: Started Remron...yuck..yuck...YUCK! » jay, posted by Ritch on December 5, 2002, at 20:54:48
Yep. I almost quit because of the start-up side-effects. REALLY glad I didn't. The drugged out thing resolved as did the hypotension. It's been the BEST med. for me.
Posted by shar30906 on December 5, 2002, at 23:19:21
In reply to Re: Started Remron...yuck..yuck...YUCK! » Ritch, posted by LyndaK on December 5, 2002, at 22:27:43
Hi, I've been taking remeron for a few months now and wanted to let you know that the side effects you experience will Pass. Remeron has worked very well for me in addition to depakote, It took forever to find the correct combo of meds to help me, and finally I'm starting to come out of a very long and deep depression. For me the initial side effects were welcome as I have a very hard time sleeping, it would litteraly knock my feet out from under me. My boy friend would have to pick me up off the floor and carry me to the bathroom if i had to get up after taking it as firtst, It would almost make me black out, extreme dizzyness, but that is all gone now, including him,lol.
wishing you health and happiness this holiday season,
shar30906
Posted by biovsenvio? on December 6, 2002, at 18:54:54
In reply to Re: Remron... start up effects will be gone soon, posted by shar30906 on December 5, 2002, at 23:19:21
did you have weight gain with remeron? if so at what dose... i heard that above 45mgs the histamine 1 receptor is washed out by sero/norepe...thus eliminating hunger..who knows though....just curious about weight gain....?
Posted by LyndaK on December 8, 2002, at 23:14:52
In reply to Re: Remron... and weight gain, posted by biovsenvio? on December 6, 2002, at 18:54:54
I gained 20 lbs on it. The insatiable hunger does go away -- I don't know if it goes away with time or with increased dose -- but it went away. The 20 lbs. never came off though -- didn't get worse, didn't get better. It's almost like I have a new "set point" with my weight. I don't think it's just an appetite thing -- I think my metabolism is actually lower on this drug.
Posted by Madge on December 9, 2002, at 20:13:52
In reply to Started Remron...yuck..yuck...YUCK!, posted by jay on December 5, 2002, at 18:58:52
I have been on remeron for about 3 1/2 weeks. In that time my depression has abated and I feel great mood wise. I am concerned about my wieght gain of approx 8 lbs, with lots of bloating. My metabolism seems to have slowed way down. Does this go away? Also, I have had two episodes of sore throats. One took a week to go away, then came back a week later and I'm 4 days into it. I went for WBC test today and see my DR. tomorrow. IF WBC count is ok, what have others done to boost immune system so sore throats don't come back, or is this a side effect that goes away after awhile. I'm on 45mg once a day.
Posted by LyndaK on December 11, 2002, at 1:36:44
In reply to Re: Remeron and sore throats and weight gain, posted by Madge on December 9, 2002, at 20:13:52
I've never had sore throats as a side-effect of this drug. I too feel like my metabolism is slower on this drug. I've been on it at least 6 months now; I take 60mgs per day. I gained a total of 20 lbs and there it stays -- I don't gain any more / I don't lose any. But this medication has helped me tremendously -- worth every pound!!
Hope it works well for you too. ;-)
Lynda
Posted by Madge on December 11, 2002, at 8:17:04
In reply to Re: Remeron and sore throats and weight gain » Madge, posted by LyndaK on December 11, 2002, at 1:36:44
Thanks Linda for your message. I had WBC count done and it's perfectly normal so I'm staying on the Remeron. I'm meeting with my Psychopharmacologist on Monday who says there is a new drug(s) to counteract the weight gain. I'll let you know what he says and what I am going to try.
Posted by LyndaK on December 13, 2002, at 0:46:56
In reply to Re: Remeron and sore throats and weight gain, posted by Madge on December 11, 2002, at 8:17:04
> Thanks Linda for your message. I had WBC count done and it's perfectly normal so I'm staying on the Remeron. I'm meeting with my Psychopharmacologist on Monday who says there is a new drug(s) to counteract the weight gain. I'll let you know what he says and what I am going to try.
Thanks Madge. I'd be very interested in knowing what that "new drug" is.Take Care. I'll look for your post.
Lynda
Posted by Madge on December 20, 2002, at 10:26:24
In reply to Re: Remeron and sore throats and weight gain » Madge, posted by LyndaK on December 13, 2002, at 0:46:56
Lynda,
I met with my Psychopharmachologist on Monday. He recommended what I had found doing research on the web, which was Topamax for weight loss. There is a good article posted by Jaynee on Dec 10,2002 on Psycho babble, from McMaster U in Canada. No one knows why Topamax helps reduce the weight gain from the SSRI's or Remeron, but it does for many. The key is to titrate up VERY slowly ie 25mg at night until tolerated, then 25mg taken in am and pm, and so forth, until at l one reaches at least 100mg for the weight loss to occur. Most of the dosage is taken at night. If One titrates up too quickly there are wierd side effects like limb numbness, cognitive problems etc. I have been on 25 mg since Tues eve. First two nights I was really woozy and went to bed at 7pm. Last night I was fine adn stayed up till my usual bedtime. Topamax also is used as a mood stabilizer (although was originally designed as an anti-convulsant for epilepsy).
Topamax also has the added benefit in that it curbs ones appetite. I'm back exercising after being sick for a few weeks, so hopefully the weight will start to come off.
Other solutions if Topamax isn't one you want to try are amphetimines,but those aren't great for me since I have alot of anxiety associated with my depression anyway and take Klonapin for that. The Topamax could end up being a substitute for the Klonapin for me.
Best of luck to you and Happy Holidays.
Madge
Posted by LyndaK on December 23, 2002, at 23:05:24
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain, posted by Madge on December 20, 2002, at 10:26:24
Thanks for the Info. Madge! Sorry I'm a little late in responding -- I was out of town the past week. I'll look into the additional references you gave me. You mentioned "cognitive" problems as a possible side-effect of the Topamax -- that makes me really leery. I'm interested in hearing about your experience with it as you titrate up.
Best of luck to you and Happy Holidays!
Lynda
Posted by Madge on January 23, 2003, at 16:47:28
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain » Madge, posted by LyndaK on December 23, 2002, at 23:05:24
Hi Lynda,
I wanted to let you know how things are going taking topamax to counteract the weight gain of Remeron. I am now up to 125mg of Topamax. I have been titrating up very slowly and have been doing really well so far. The major side effects have been sedation and that hit at 100mg. It took me a few days to get used to that dosage and then I developed a bladder infection which seem to be more common with Remeron and Topamax. Not fun... I was not happy about that since I had one earlier that month as well. Staying hydrated is critical. I was on 100mg for two weeks, was exercising, and living comfortably and now will be on 125mg for another two weeks until I see my Dr. I'm just starting to see that my metabolism might be speeding up a bit and losing a little weight. I have not had the cognitive problems that others have experienced because I have titrated up so slowly. That seems to be the key ingredient to avoiding that side effect.
Anyway, I am hopeful that soon I will find a dosage that I can settle in on where my body will lose the weight and I can just live my life more comfortably and predictably. It's been a tough row to hoe finding the right combination of meds that don't have side effects that are debilitating.
Thats all for now. Hope you are doing well.Madge
Posted by LyndaK on January 25, 2003, at 3:03:31
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain, posted by Madge on January 23, 2003, at 16:47:28
Hi Madge. Thanks for the update! I remain very leery of adding another medication since I've been doing so well emotionally on just the Remeron alone. But I am VERY interested in how you are doing with that combo. and any difference it makes with the weightgain. I'm sure there are many others who are equally interested. I'm glad it's going well for you, although bladder infections are certainly no fun (I've had more than a few - not recently though). I'm not sure I understand how the bladder infections are related to the medication though.
Thanks again for sharing!
Lynda
Posted by Madge on January 31, 2003, at 10:07:34
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain » Madge, posted by LyndaK on January 25, 2003, at 3:03:31
Well, I don't know if the Topamax is right for me either. I am giving it a go, but two days ago I got a third UTI in one month. Topamax side effects include dehydration which can cause kidney stones at the worst and frequent UTI's. Remeron side effects include UTI"s as well I think because of the anithystimine effects, but I'm not sure. So it's a double whammy. If I don't hydrate myself to death, then I seem to end up with a UTI. I'm going to see my doc today about taking an antibiotic prophylactically for awhile. I am just on the cusp of 150mg of Topamax which seems to be the magic number of weight loss. At some point it gets to be an issue of quality of life, and I can't live my life sick because of UTI's.
I'm now feeling like the woman who swallowed the fly who now needs to swallow the spider to catch the fly..... I'm now up to the cow...
It's hard enough to accept that I need to be on AD's the rest of my life, but to also accept that I may also need to be 15lbs or more heavier is very hard, and I am very sad about it. Especially when I am used to being thin and in shape.
Posted by LyndaK on February 1, 2003, at 2:48:24
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain, posted by Madge on January 31, 2003, at 10:07:34
> Well, I don't know if the Topamax is right for me either. I am giving it a go, but two days ago I got a third UTI in one month. Topamax side effects include dehydration which can cause kidney stones at the worst and frequent UTI's. Remeron side effects include UTI"s as well I think because of the anithystimine effects, but I'm not sure. So it's a double whammy. If I don't hydrate myself to death, then I seem to end up with a UTI. I'm going to see my doc today about taking an antibiotic prophylactically for awhile. I am just on the cusp of 150mg of Topamax which seems to be the magic number of weight loss. At some point it gets to be an issue of quality of life, and I can't live my life sick because of UTI's.
> I'm now feeling like the woman who swallowed the fly who now needs to swallow the spider to catch the fly..... I'm now up to the cow...
> It's hard enough to accept that I need to be on AD's the rest of my life, but to also accept that I may also need to be 15lbs or more heavier is very hard, and I am very sad about it. Especially when I am used to being thin and in shape.Madge,
I can tell you that I haven't had any increase in UTI's with the Remeron, and I'm on 60mg. per day. It doesn't feel like the Remeron is causing me to be dehydrated at all.I agree that the extra weight is a blow to the ego. But, from my perspective, it's still worth it to not be horribly depressed anymore.
When I was in my 20's (I'm 40 now) I used to get very frequent and pretty severe UTI's (not medication related). I finally went to a urologist who did put me on prophylactic antibiotics (one-a-day) for at least a year (maybe 2). Anyways it DID work.
Good luck and thankyou for the update.
Lynda
Posted by Madge on February 12, 2003, at 21:03:02
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain » Madge, posted by LyndaK on January 25, 2003, at 3:03:31
HI LYnda,
Well, I wanted to let you know that i decided to go off the Topamax. I definately gave it the old college try, but after 100mg. I was getting UTI's every other week, inspite of using medication prophylactically. I also didn't lose any weight either. Last night I cut back 50 mg of the Topamax and this morning I felt so much better. I think the Topamax was really starting to make my brain feel slow and heavy.
Sooooooo, now onto plan B. I am starting on Phentermine (the non implicated part of phen fen) to speed up my metabolism 15mg in the morning for the first week, then 30mg in the am thereafter until I lose the weight. (12 lbs total)
From what I have read on Psycho babble and other literature, and talking to my pdoc, one can't lose the weight gain from Remeron without some help from some kind of other drug. My pdoc perscribes Remeron frequently and has found he needs to counteract the weight gain 9 x out of 10. I certainly understand you not wanting to add another med to the Remeron, but the extra weight for me is a problem on my knees, which is the biggest problem, secondly I don't like how I look, and thirdly my clothes don't fit.
So, wish me luck!!! The biggest side effect on Phentermine can be anxiety, and since I have that with my depression my pdoc was hesitatnt to try this first. But I tried it today and felt fine. Some people just feel a false sense of well being instead of anxiety. I can live with that.
I'll keep you posted. Here's to sheddding pounds and having a sense of well being.
Madge...
Posted by LyndaK on February 13, 2003, at 20:26:29
In reply to Re: Remeron and weight gain, posted by Madge on February 12, 2003, at 21:03:02
Hi Madge,
Thanks again for the update. I'm sorry the Topamax didn't work out. Getting a UTI every other week must have been HORRIBLE! Makes me shudder to think of it! Hope you have better luck with the new drug.
Take care.
Lynda
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