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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by freedom2001 on October 23, 2002, at 23:07:00
Hi,
I'm a sufferer of OCD and has been using the following to combat it:Natural therapy per afternoon
1 mega Vitamin B-50 complex with zinc (8 mg), magnesium (60 mg)
3 Calcium (200mg) and magnesium (100mg)/w zinc (1mg), apple vinegar sugar, manganese
1 mega Vitamin C (500mg-just started)
2 500mg EPA / 310 mg DHA fish oilsDrug therapy in morning
3 prozac (60mg)(down from 4 previously to cut medication as I've just added vitamin C)
1 deanxit (a low dose neuroleptic,anxiolytic drug)
half a tablet of xanax (down from 1 tablet)
1 trazodone (50mg at night to help sleep)
It's very difficult to augment as there're so many other options eg.
- risperal (weight gain is a concern)
- neurontin (gaba modulator and anticonvulsant)
- dilantin (possible med for OCD but drug companies not pushing it as its patent has expired after 14 years)
- taurine 500 mg (calming effect but said to be half as effective as dilantin)
- other SSRI such as citalopram
- small dose of anafranilWhat should I do as I sometimes or often still have significant OC symptoms.
Should I take vitamin C (suppose to reduce histamine levels) and wait for a while...
or take out xanax (for fear of dependence) and also deanxit (unproven augmentation drug for OCD) and add in one of the augmentors eg. neuroleptic and dilantin
or add in taurine 500mg
or change SSRI completely?
But I also heard that a woman with OCD on diazepam had a relapse when her diazepam was removed and get back to normal when diazepam was restored, so what about my xanax, also a benzo?
Pls advise!
Posted by McPac on October 23, 2002, at 23:40:41
In reply to ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy, posted by freedom2001 on October 23, 2002, at 23:07:00
Freedom,
Of every drug that you mentioned, ONLY Prozac is significantly capable and approved for helping the OCD. How long have you been taking it? If it is not effective, you may wish to try another med for your OCD---Zoloft, Luvox, Paxil, etc. Anafranil is also very effective for many people.
Make sure that whatever med you try that you take it long enough AND at a high enough dose to truly see if it works or not. Taking a high enough dose is very impotant.
Posted by freedom2001 on October 24, 2002, at 1:03:23
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy, posted by McPac on October 23, 2002, at 23:40:41
> Freedom,
> Of every drug that you mentioned, ONLY Prozac is significantly capable and approved for helping the OCD. How long have you been taking it?I have been taking it for almost 2 years (60mg) and 6 months (80mg).
If it is not effective, you may wish to try another med for your OCD---Zoloft, Luvox, Paxil, etc. Anafranil is also very effective for many people.
> Make sure that whatever med you try that you take it long enough AND at a high enough dose to truly see if it works or not. Taking a high enough dose is very impotant.I think I've tried prozac for a sufficiently long time and at the maximum dose.
So are you saying that I should switch SSRI, and also add in a small dose of anafranil?
FYI, I was on anafranil (200mg) many years back for a total of 60 days. Does not help at all.
Will adding a small dose of anafranil to SSRI change things?
I've also tried remeron+prozac (and efexxor+prozac) for 2 weeks each. Remeron messes around with NE while efexxor messes with NE and DA (at higher doses). These were ineffective.
What about natural therapy?
The VAST array of options is confusing me, or IS THIS another of my obession?!!
Posted by Ed O`Flaherty on October 24, 2002, at 2:59:54
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy » McPac, posted by freedom2001 on October 24, 2002, at 1:03:23
Your dose of omega-3 fish oil is too low here.Try 5-10g daily (total of EPA plus DHA) as well as continuing on the Prozac.I have seen that dose work in just a few days.
Posted by Fenny3 on October 24, 2002, at 16:11:25
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy » McPac, posted by freedom2001 on October 24, 2002, at 1:03:23
I found 75 mg of effexor on it's own to be completely effective for me, although I have a supposedly mild case of OCD (is there such a thing?) Anyway, I have a book "Tormenting thoughts and secret rituals" I think, and I found reading this book and then reiterating/talking about it with my SO, very effective therapy. As you no doubt know, OCD is particularly evil because part of the symptom presentment is a strong desire to hide obsessions/compulsions. So my SO dragged everything out in the open, and to this day will watch me for reoccurances. We probably have the conversation once a month. I have had very few though, so this is good therapy for me. Also, I've found flax oil to be helpful too.
Fenny
P.S. If you want to email me, its fennythree@hotmail.com
Posted by freedom2001 on October 24, 2002, at 22:16:10
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy, posted by Ed O`Flaherty on October 24, 2002, at 2:59:54
> Your dose of omega-3 fish oil is too low here.Try 5-10g daily (total of EPA plus DHA) as well as continuing on the Prozac.I have seen that dose work in just a few days.
1 single dose of my fish oil contains EPA 500 mg and 310 mg DHA.
If I need 5 g, that would mean 10 fish oils a day.
How is that possible?My concern here is that my Avant brand fish oil contains cholesterol, when I took 4, I already felt dizzy. I suppose that is related to the blood pressure thing.
There's another brand that does not contain cholesterol. But it's way too expensive. Selling for S$80 per bottle!
So how do I up my EPA levels in an affordable way? Is flaxseed oil suitable or any other suggestions?
Advise needed!
Thanks!
Posted by freedom2001 on October 24, 2002, at 22:29:33
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy » freedom2001, posted by Fenny3 on October 24, 2002, at 16:11:25
> I found 75 mg of effexor on it's own to be completely effective for me, although I have a supposedly mild case of OCD (is there such a thing?)
Yes, I think there are mild and severe cases. Mine happen to be severe, unfortunately, exarcebated by my working and relationship stresses. It's not that I'm having problems in work and relationship. On the contrary, I'm fine in both respects. It's just that maybe I can't tolerate the rigours of every day life and also my perfectionistic personality is killing me with all these OC symptoms.
I've tried Effexor 75mg, used as augmentation in addition to 60mg Prozac. First few days seem to improve, after that, everything went back to normal OC symptoms. I guess that's the placebo effect. When I up to 150mg Effexor, I was like a walking zombie. Effexor probably inhibits NE at lower doses and also inhibits DA at higher doses.
I think I have way too much DA and NE. So Effexor is not suitable for me as it increases the availability of NE and DA in addition to serotonin.Anyway, I have a book "Tormenting thoughts and secret rituals" I think, and I found reading this book and then reiterating/talking about it with my SO, very effective therapy.
Can you briefly tell me about the contents of the book that may help me?What do you mean by the term "SO"? - Secret Officer? :)
As you no doubt know, OCD is particularly evil because part of the symptom presentment is a strong desire to hide obsessions/compulsions. So my SO dragged everything out in the open, and to this day will watch me for reoccurances. We probably have the conversation once a month. I have had very few though, so this is good therapy for me. Also, I've found flax oil to be helpful too.
Faxseed oil....Did you also try fish oil?
I'm on 1000 mg EPA and 620 DHA daily. But Dr. Flaherty told me it's too little. I need at least 5000 mg EPA.....Pls tell me more about the flaxseed oil. Are they the same as fish oils?Thanks!
>
> Fenny
>
> P.S. If you want to email me, its fennythree@hotmail.com
Posted by Fenny3 on October 25, 2002, at 20:24:00
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy » Fenny3, posted by freedom2001 on October 24, 2002, at 22:29:33
Maybe your symptoms present whether stressors are good or bad? I think that's the case with me.
How long were you at 150 mg? Can you adjust the DA and NE?
About the book, here's the table of contents:
Table of Contents
Prologue A Personal Perspective
1 Filth, Harm, Lust, and Blasphemy
2 Diagnosing OCD
3 Who Gets OCD?
4 OCD's Best Treatment: Behavior Therapy
5 Using Medications
6 The Lessons of Group: Ten Strategies for
Coping with OCD
7 OCD in the Family
8 Making Sense of Senseless Symptoms
9 OCD as a Brain Disorder
10 From Hypochondriasis to Sexual Addictions: Obsessive-Compulsive Spectrum
Disorders
11 Spiritual Directors and Greek Doctors: A Historical Perspective on OCD Treatment
Appendix A The Yale-Brown Obsessive-Compulsive Scale
Appendix B The DSM-IV Diagnostic Criteria for OCD
Appendix C Suggested Readings
Appendix D Where to Find HelpThe historical stuff was neat, and the behaviour therapy. However, I should say that my symptoms are more thoughts than rituals, with the exception of counting.
Oh yeah, SO is significant other, but I like secret officer better
I take about 1500 mg of flaxseed oil per day, the component (dha and epa) are there, same as fish oil, but some people say the fish oil is more effective, but secret officer will only take the flax.
Fen
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 26, 2002, at 10:37:10
In reply to Re: ADVICE NEEDED ON OCD therapy » freedom2001, posted by Fenny3 on October 24, 2002, at 16:11:25
> Anyway, I have a book "Tormenting thoughts and secret rituals" I think
I'd just like to plug the new double double quote feature. But I don't mean to be pushy. Did you deliberately not use it to link to Amazon? If so, I'd be interested in why, over at PBA:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20020918/msgs/7717.html
Thanks,
Bob
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