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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Mark H. on May 3, 2000, at 19:16:24
Soul-baring time again. I've always said I've never been truly manic, maybe a little hypomanic, maybe just dysthymic. Lately, well, you know how I hate mood stabilizers, but, well, how exactly do you know if you're manic? I actually looked at a piece of sculpture the other day with a price tag of $12,500 and didn't run screaming in the other direction. No, I cannot afford it! Even if it were 10% of that, I don't have it. Also thought a $5,500 pair of speakers looked reasonably priced. Talking a lot about sex. Confessing old sins to an email friend and scaring the bejeezus out of him. Distracted and unable to concentrate at work. Staying up all night. Taking off from work to photograph an Uzbeki dancer during the day (well, she does work for us as a translator some times, but it meant I had to work from 6 last night to 6 this morning to catch up on my administrative duties). Any of you BP One's out there with any advice?
More to the point, are there any so-called "mood stabilizers" that don't make you feel like a stupid wet brick of adobe drying in the sun somewhere? I've tried lithium sulfate, Depakote, and other things that only made me feel worse. I don't want to lose my edge, I'd just like not to scare anyone, including myself.
Much love,
Mark
Posted by Cam W. on May 3, 2000, at 19:53:17
In reply to Mania -- Do You Know When It's Happening?, posted by Mark H. on May 3, 2000, at 19:16:24
Mark - It has been my experience that the person with the mania is the last to know. I don't know if it is like alcoholism, where If you admit your problem it is the first step to recovery. See your doc, he can probably tell better than any of us. (You seem fine to me, but who am I to judge). I just spent $30 on a CD just because I couldn't find it for a year and then see it on a website. I really didn't want it that badly.Stay real (and with us) - Cam W.
Posted by Janice on May 3, 2000, at 21:15:06
In reply to Mania -- Do You Know When It's Happening?, posted by Mark H. on May 3, 2000, at 19:16:24
Hi Mark,
To me, this sounds like you are on your way. I am assuming you are not a multi-millionaire.
I had a little paragraph typed to you about sleep in my thread above, but i deleted it. I thought, 'no, he doesn't need a lecture on sleep by me'. But you do need this lecture.
My entire rapid cycling cycle is about sleep. Getting good regular sleep. Going to bed at the same time every night and getting up at the same time every day. Of course, this is a theory.
So since I have not had much luck with mood stabilizers (they make me feel STUPID too), I can only suggest, for now, you find something that can put you to sleep at night at a decent hour--before midnight, and then get up at the same time every morning. I'd give yourself 9-10 hours of sleep a night. Sleeping causes depression for many rapid cyclers, so a few good night's sleep may be all that is necessary to stop the mania.
I'd stay away from alcohol and caffeine.
and when all is said and done, a little hypomania can be a very good thing. just don't buy anything that can't be returned and have your wife watch you.
>
take care, Janice
Posted by Janice on May 3, 2000, at 21:17:10
In reply to Re: Mania -- Do You Know When It's Happening?, posted by Cam W. on May 3, 2000, at 19:53:17
but it's suppose to feel good.
Janice
can you return it?
Posted by Cam W. on May 3, 2000, at 22:44:52
In reply to Cam--that's impulse shopping…, posted by Janice on May 3, 2000, at 21:17:10
> but it's suppose to feel good.
>
> Janice
>
> can you return it?Janice, returning it is too much hassle, besides, the fun was looking for it in the first place and when I could get it, the thrill was gone. Oh well, I'll add it to the collection. I will listen to it occasionally, anyway. - Cam W.
Posted by Mark H. on May 3, 2000, at 23:46:24
In reply to Mania -- Do You Know When It's Happening?, posted by Mark H. on May 3, 2000, at 19:16:24
Cam and Janice,
Thank you for your help. I had a good group this evening, saying a few wildly inappropriate things, but now my motor is finally running down. It's weird, Janice, because I've been sleeping 12-plus hours a day since October. Just started coming out of it within the last three weeks or so. Now I'm more wired than I remember being for a long, long time. I feel calm and "normal" this evening -- never thought I would celebrate normality when I was younger. Therapist said, "Yup, sounds like mania to me." Time for bed. Will take your sleep advice. Sue was not thrilled I worked through the night last night.
Much love,
Mark
Posted by JohnB on May 4, 2000, at 3:18:50
In reply to Re: Better This Evening, posted by Mark H. on May 3, 2000, at 23:46:24
I was reading a study done in Brazil about some AD that was working TOO well. One of the things mentioned was that some of the married women were looking up their old boyfriends and partying all night. Mania, yup.
Posted by Jan on May 4, 2000, at 14:19:09
In reply to Re: Mania, posted by JohnB on May 4, 2000, at 3:18:50
The true test for someone to get "help" I think, is : Is your behavior interferring with your relationships and peace of mind ? Remembering that depression almost always follows mania and it tends to get deeper with more episodes.
Posted by SLS on May 7, 2000, at 11:48:07
In reply to Re: Mania -- Do You Know When It's Happening?, posted by Janice on May 3, 2000, at 21:15:06
Dear Mark,
Janice seems to have given you a reply that has struck a chord with you. She has good insight.
I'm sorry I didn't reply to your long post in a previous thread. I started feeling crappy, and then completely forgot about it.
NEVER stay up all night. Sleep deprivation can cause mania.
Possible symptoms of hypomania and mixed-states:- Reduced need for sleep. Sleep 4 hours or less and do not feel sleepy the next day. You can feel "burned-out", however.
- Hypersexuality.
- Racing thoughts with the inability to stay on one topic.
- Irritability and impatience with people who do things too slowly.
- Overconfidence. Feeling that you can think or do things that the people around you couldn't possibly be capable of. Feeling that people would not believe how smart you are, even if you told them.
- Rage.
- Suspiciousness of others.
Do any of these apply?
Q: How does one recognize when he is manic?Cam's Parodox: When one is sure that he is not.
:-)
You are doing a good job of trying to screen for it.
- Scott
Posted by Todd on May 10, 2000, at 14:40:22
In reply to Re: Mania -- Do You Know When It's Happening?, posted by SLS on May 7, 2000, at 11:48:07
Hey there, Mark.
Like somebody said above, nothing wrong with a little hypomania. I flirt with it every now and again and it can be pretty refreshing. Everyone who has responded to you has it right - the uncontrolled speech, racing thoughts, topic jumping, wanton spending, lack of sleep, grandiosity, and intense sexuality is all part of the mania package. If you can contain yourself and conduct yourself "normally" then you're probably just experiencing a hypomania.
Keep an eye on it, though. Contrary to what many say about BP's being the last to know they're manic, if you are honest with yourself you can spot the signs before anything gets out of hand. I would say that the ones who don't notice it are so relieved to be finally feeling inspired and energized that they will not admit there is a problem. I think they feel that this is the way people are SUPPOSED to feel. (As an aside, I think that is part of the problem with BP's - we feel that everyone else is loving life while it passes US by. Playing the passive victim. I think realizing that EVERYONE hurts and bears their own crosses is adding another piece to the puzzle.)
Anyway, keep an eye out. Be a witness to yourself. If you feel mildly euphoric and a little bit infused, go with it. But treat yourself right. Lack of sleep and poor eating habits are both a symptom and cause of mania. When your system gets thrown off too much, one feeds the other. Lack of sleep causes manic tendencies which tend to reduce need for sleep which feeds the mania and so on. Ditto for eating properly. If there is no food for the body, it will feed off of itself and perpetuate the problem.
I have only had one close call where a hypomania threatened to morph into an actual mania. My thoughts were getting grandiose and my energy level was high. Couldn't sleep soundly because of all the thoughts, and when I did sleep, it was filled with dreamscapes. Doc prescribed me Risperdal for a night or two just to shut my brain down and allow restful sleep. Also took some Lorazepam for a few days to calm down. Upped my lithium by a few hundred mgs and it all worked like a charm. Whew! Nobody ever knew. Just keep a caring eye on yourself, and if your friends and family think something is a little off, it probably is. They have the objectivity to see your patterns, trust them. Lots of love.
Todd
Posted by Mark H. on May 10, 2000, at 15:58:03
In reply to re: Mark H. and hypomania, posted by Todd on May 10, 2000, at 14:40:22
Hi Todd,
Beautifully said -- another one of your responses I will keep on hand for those tough days. By the end of last week, I was experiencing a state of homicidal and suicidal rage. I have excellent self-control, so nobody got hurt, but it sure took a toll on my body and brain for a few days.
When that started to arise yesterday morning, I recognized the over-reacting and paranoid quality of it right away and immediately got an appointment with my psychiatrist for early afternoon.
I explained that my therapist of many years was currently encouraging me (and everyone else in his group practices) to express small irritations as soon as they arise, so that anger doesn't build up. I don't experience "small irritations." If it's small, I have the skills and ability to choose something other than anger in response -- I've been working on it for 30 years. But he kept pushing me to practice minor outbursts as a healthy release and, as he says, to drain the swamp.
Well, as you can imagine, I go from zero to 100 in about 10 minutes of being pushed and encouraged to give voice to my anger. I don't think it's the right "method" for me -- it's working well for my wife and others, and I think it's great for them, if it works for them.
My psychiatrist has also been a group client of my therapist, so he (my shrink) knows my therapist's techniques, and in his opinion, the exercise of expressing my anger was "kindling" rage, like throwing more wood on smouldering embers -- not the right technique for bipolars.
Likewise, Sue and I met with our lama on Saturday, and he reminded me that we have practices for draining and purifying afflictive emotions that don't involve indulging them. He also suggested that I negotiate a different agreement for dealing with "small irritations" with my therapist.
My psychiatrist gave me some Zyprexa to try, since I thought perhaps I should be taking an anti-psychotic on those days that I feel like my head is going to explode. I took 5mg last night and slept 16 hours -- whoops! But I feel good today, calm, my humor has returned, and everything is back in perspective. I'm not so much focused on myself.
I may or may not go to group tonight, but the next time I see my therapist, I will negotiate a different way of dealing with it. I still need to practice letting Sue express her anger and irritations without analyzing them for validity or doing anything about them -- that will be a stretch for me -- but I'm not going to join her in the exercise. On the other hand, I have given her permission to tell me to go sit on a cushion (that is, meditate/practice) anytime of the day or night that she thinks I need to look at what I'm doing. That feels OK to me.
I'm almost glad to have had that mania experience, as unpleasant as it was. I'm grateful for the support of my wife, pdoc, good meds and the wonderful people on this board.
Much love,
Mark H.
This is the end of the thread.
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