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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by JohnDoenut on July 6, 2004, at 1:12:15
In reply to Thank You..(Trigger), posted by SandyWeb on July 4, 2004, at 9:02:00
> Hi everyone,
>
> I know I promised not to post anymore, but this is not a suicidal message. *smile* I would like to thank everyone for standing by me during the past few months when I was going through one difficulty heaped upon another. You really did
>This is a wonderful outcome to a series of not so happy events. I hope you to contine making progress.
I read this and I dont think you wanted to kill yourself because you are still here. I sometimes think
about killing myself but I dont think of it further
than that. I know it is an extreme expression of
deep frustration and anger etc. But I also know
that if I reached that state of mind that means
it, I would do it and that would be that. Thats
what they say, when people really want to do it,
they do.So people dont do it and get help and start to feel better. But how long does that last for?
I feel like its all some horrible dream
that cant possibly be happening and I want
to wake up from it but I cant and so called reality
is just a toy for them to control us. They "they"
try and make the illusion bearable and oh
everything will be ok when its all lies
and you just dont know how long its gonna be
before things get really out of hand.On the other hand, the human body and psyche seems to have a remarkable resilience to endure
pain and suffering and misery. Aided by drugs
that just dull it for some time. Because we were
born into the "caste" of society that doesnt
have any power or influence and cant get it and
are just pawns in some vast scheme to extract
whatever they can from the downtrodden masses. How do you overcome your genetic heritage to break out and make your own reality that works better?!
Posted by SandyWeb on July 6, 2004, at 8:06:45
In reply to Re: Thank You..(Trigger), posted by JohnDoenut on July 6, 2004, at 1:12:15
> I read this and I dont think you wanted to kill yourself because you are still here.<Oh no, John, I was perfectly willing to die that night. That being said, it also appears that I took the phone into the bathroom with me and dialed 911...of which I don't remember. And I was desparate to be dead when I heard the police pounding on my door. So even though I apparently left an opening to be "rescued", I really was trying to leave this world. I guess my conscious and subconscious had two different plans.
I think when a person finally attempts a suicide it is a last desparate cry for help. When all else fails, use a lethal means that will either take you away from it all or will demonstrate the degree of distress you are suffering in order to facilitate the offering of help (usually through being committed!). It is a LAST cry for help because you are more than willing to accept the alternative outcome of dying. And it is a DESPARATE cry for help because who is going to actually make a serious attempt on their own life unless they are overwhelmed and hopeless?
I also believe that a person doesn't just decide to kill themselves one day. I think that they have been suffering for awhile, wanting to die but just not being able to achieve that. Yes, they are not quite ready to do it yet....even though they may be talking about it and making half-hearted attempts. But one day a final trigger will arrive....and it may be a simple matter or a complex one....everybody is different. Regardless, it is the "last straw" for somebody....and that is when the point of no return is reached. It may have taken years to reach that point, or it may have taken only months. But the person finally reaches a point where the half-hearted attempts are a thing of the past, and the pain drives them to seriously attempt a suicide. For me, my thing is to cut my wrist....I would not want to die any other way. People seem to have their own ways in which they want to have the control of killing themselves....and they are not likely to attempt any other way. But with cutting your wrist, there is always the chance of being "rescued" because death is not instantaneous. Why did I call the police? I don't know. I don't know if I spoke or even when I called. I guess my subconscious, my SOUL, was not ready to give up on Sandra yet.
I've rambled enough for now. I apologize if I didn't make much sense. My brain still isn't clicking strongly yet. It's still pretty mushy from that night.
Hugs,
Sandy
Posted by Jai Narayan on July 6, 2004, at 20:35:13
In reply to Re: Thank You..(Trigger) » JohnDoenut, posted by SandyWeb on July 6, 2004, at 8:06:45
Dear Sandy,
what a great response.
I come from a few generations of suicide attempts and one who died.
My uncle died from his wounds. He was a doctor. His DX was BP.
The attempts were all my sisters and me.
So I know first hand how painful the process is.
I thank God none of us girls accomplished it.
What a devastation it is to have a family member die like that. My grandparents NEVER got over it.
His untimely death haunts all of us as well. He was a wonderful and very loved man. We miss him terribly.
Never under estimate your importance. That kind of death sends out a ripple none of us can get over.
So Sandy, I celebrate your survival and healing direction.
Thanks for posting your thanks, I appreciate it.
Posted by JohnDoenut on July 6, 2004, at 23:57:06
In reply to Re: Thank You..(Trigger) » JohnDoenut, posted by SandyWeb on July 6, 2004, at 8:06:45
>call the police? I don't know. I don't know if I spoke or even when I called. I guess my subconscious, my SOUL, was not ready to give up on Sandra yet.
>Wow thats amazing and beautiful.
Oh it made sense. I understood what you said.
thanks.Crazy.
I have this thing that we are living in The Matrix.
Then I say to myself well thats an excuse to just
not accept reality. So then I say I know there is
no Matrix and I have to deal with reality but then
I say well thats just the sort of thing a Matrix would
pull, and then I think that the Matrix would know
that I know and that thus in fact there is no....You get the idea.
My brain never clicks that strongly anymore.
Must be all the drugs. Prescription that is.
:)Hope youre doin ok.
J
Posted by Jai Narayan on July 7, 2004, at 8:47:13
In reply to Re: Thank You..(Trigger) » SandyWeb, posted by JohnDoenut on July 6, 2004, at 23:57:06
I think the first Matrix movie was one of the best and most spiritual movies I have seen in a long time.
I too see there is a mystery to life.We apprear to be one thing and then can become another even more authentic version of our selves.
I live to grow and change...
Posted by SandyWeb on July 7, 2004, at 11:58:21
In reply to Re: Thank You..(Trigger), posted by Jai Narayan on July 6, 2004, at 20:35:13
I am so sorry to hear about your Uncle. Undoubtedly he was suffering a great deal of distress to take his own life. This world of ours can certainly be a cruel game to play sometimes.
I can only speak from my own experience of attempting, and I've never been in the position of being a survivor of somebody's suicide, but I know that I had thoughts of my family beforehand. If your Uncle was anything like me, he probably had already rationalized within his mind that his family would do fine with his absence. I didn't necessarily have the thoughts of, "They're better off without me." Rather, my thoughts were along the lines of, "They will be fine when I'm gone." I had a lot of confidence in the strength of my family. Your Uncle probably did not have the motive of punishing his family through years of heartache. He may have believed in the resiliency of his loving family, much as I still believe in mine.
Hugs,
Sandy
Posted by SandyWeb on July 7, 2004, at 12:11:17
In reply to Re: Thank You..(Trigger) » SandyWeb, posted by JohnDoenut on July 6, 2004, at 23:57:06
I've never seen the movie, "The Matrix". I'm not quite sure if I understand the dynamics of your message in relation to a matrix, but maybe you are talking about how our world and selves can change from one experience to another?? I could be way off base here.
In terms of my serious attempt, I have to say that I have "exorcised" one demon for the time being...but it has been replaced by another. I am not longer suicidal. I am at a place now where I have hope, and I will try to incorporate new coping techniques into my lifestyle. I feel good today, and I hope to continue along this path.
However, I have another demon to fight now. Even though I am not suicidal, I still want to cut my wrist again. Why? Because my thwarted attempt amounts to another failure within my mind. The plan I had for myself....the control I had over my own decision....did not pan out. I did not achieve what I set out to do, and that smacks of a lifetime of ambitions that I tend to fail at.
I understand that my thinking is warped...I recognize that...but it doesn't change the fact that I have these thoughts. More to the point, I will act on these thoughts unless I find a way to achieve some notable successess that will outweigh the suicide failure. Very warped thinking, yes. But I'm not sure how to escape from it. I had a tremendous amount of control over this event because it was MY OWN BODY....and even with that, I failed. But did I really fail, since my soul reached out for help through the telephone line? It's a tough one to answer.
I'm sorry if I completely am off base here. I'm not sure what is meant by a "matrix". I guess I should watch the movies, huh? *smile*
Here's hoping our brains stop being so mushy!!! Lol!
Hugs,
Sandy
Posted by partlycloudy on July 7, 2004, at 12:40:17
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » JohnDoenut, posted by SandyWeb on July 7, 2004, at 12:11:17
>I had a tremendous amount of control over this event because it was MY OWN BODY....and even with that, I failed. But did I really fail, since my soul reached out for help through the telephone line? It's a tough one to answer.
>
Sandy, I don't think we can isolate body from brain from soul - it was Sandy getting her precious life the help it needed - and still needs. So I would not see it at all as a failure that you did not succeed in cutting; rather, it was a very basic and instinctive part of you which realised the danger you were in, and called out for help. To me it illustrates that you - the whole you - does not want to carry this out. You do need a new definition of success versus failure; this is something I struggle with also in every facet of my life.> I'm sorry if I completely am off base here. I'm not sure what is meant by a "matrix". I guess I should watch the movies, huh? *smile*
>
It's worth it JUST to see Keanu Reeves!!!!! I had to watch it twice to figure out the story, though.Peace,
partycloudy
Posted by JohnDoenut on July 7, 2004, at 13:05:59
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » JohnDoenut, posted by SandyWeb on July 7, 2004, at 12:11:17
> I've never seen the movie, "The Matrix". I'm not quite sure if I understand the dynamics of your message in relation to a matrix, but maybe
>Ok for those who dont want the secret premise of the movie ruined then dont read this paragraph.
The premise of the movie is that what we percieve
to be reality is in fact a sensory controlled
computer program. Humans are grown by machines and
planted in cases that physically plug them into this matrix. There are only a few people that have "woken"
up to discover this and work to free other humans
that are enslaved in the matrix.Therefore a "Matrix" reference to reality is
that we are living in some sort of illusion
that we cant get out of.>new coping techniques into my lifestyle. I feel good today, and I hope to continue along this path.
>Thats great. It is possible to feel good and continue on this way. When we feel bad it helps
to remember that at some point we can feel good again.
>mind. The plan I had for myself....the control I had over my own decision....did not pan out. I did not achieve what I set out to do, and that smacks of a lifetime of ambitions that I tend to fail at.
>I think a lot of people feel this way and I am
going through something like that now.
I dont know if the following makes sense but
it is something I have thought about.
Buddhist thought says that the reason people are
in pain and misery is because of their desires.
Desires for things material but also spiritual.
They believe that by removing the desire you
are free of the pain. Then at that point you
can do something that comes from a place of
your own greater truth. And there is more
to it but I dont want to ramble on.
> I understand that my thinking is warped...IActually its not. Its a process that is working itself out.
You just need to live long enough to do that! :)>from it. I had a tremendous amount of control over this event because it was MY OWN BODY....and even with that, I failed. But did I really fail, since my soul reached out for help through the telephone line? It's a tough one to answer.
>This is brilliant insight into your mind! !
And how a lot of people feel and why they attempt
this. You could say that you suceeeded in more ways
than one because you excersized control in
two ways, first the attempt, then the call.
You controlled it all and then gave it up
temporarily so that you could recover and
get better. Sometimes we have to reach a bottom
before we can rise up again.
> Hugs,
>
> Sandy
>Hugs to you too!
JohnD
Posted by trucker on July 7, 2004, at 13:49:31
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » SandyWeb, posted by JohnDoenut on July 7, 2004, at 13:05:59
to all
i found that if we speak positive to ourselves -
we grow happy and healthy!!!if someone is continuly saying (for instants) your fat, your ugly, your worthless, your what ever that negative statement is, well if they say it often enough it demeaners us and eventually we get lower and lower... to where we feel like the statements that surround us!!!
so my reverse for that is...
****get a tape player*****
and speak into it positive things... over and over.. such as you are so useful, energtic, helpful, any thing positive you can think of...the exact opposite of the way you feel.. or what others have said about you...
put it in phrases such as "YOU ARE" AND THEN PLAY THIS TO YOUR SELF AS YOU SLEEP, ON ONE OF THOSE TAPE PLAYERS THAT FLIPS ITSSELF ALL NIGHT LONG...nothing to be afraid of because it is you speaking to your self. this reprograms your subconcious into positive thinking and then it will change your concious mind to a positive healthy manor.... try this.. it really worksi was told all my life that mommy was taking birth control when i was conceived.. (not wanted) then i was abused all my life..i was also told i was fat, ugly, worthless,a waist of time, etc... you get the picture!!! welll i did this and i reprogramed me to thinking that i am ok and mommy had a screw loose!!! and i now feel worthy, happy, healthy, and i have been kicked while i was down so to speak too.. so then you revert to the reprogramming again... all things are possible... this way and esp.. if you have JESUS!
Posted by Simus on July 7, 2004, at 14:00:02
In reply to Re: (Trigger), posted by trucker on July 7, 2004, at 13:49:31
Powerful concept, Trucker!!! Might I add that you don't even have to believe these positive things about yourself at the time you say them. But say them anyway. Do it even if it "feels" stupid at the time.
Simus
Posted by tabitha on July 7, 2004, at 16:39:18
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » Jai Narayan, posted by SandyWeb on July 7, 2004, at 11:58:21
Hi Sandy, just wanted to pop into this thread and say how happy I am to hear you survived the descent and found some hope. The human spirit is awfully resilient, isn't it?
Posted by trucker on July 7, 2004, at 18:40:30
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » trucker, posted by Simus on July 7, 2004, at 14:00:02
YES I AGREE.... IT HAS PULLED ME THRU SO MUCH CRAP! sorry about language, but it is the only way i can really describe it... i have been thru the dung!!! and this is tried and true...trucker
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
> Powerful concept, Trucker!!! Might I add that you don't even have to believe these positive things about yourself at the time you say them. But say them anyway. Do it even if it "feels" stupid at the time.
>
> Simus
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:22:50
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » SandyWeb, posted by partlycloudy on July 7, 2004, at 12:40:17
Hi PartlyCloudy (or should I say: PartyCloud? *wink*)
I have to let everyone know that you were very supportive to me behind-the-scenes. Jlynne and LynneDa were consistent with their support here on Babble, and LynneDa continued emailing me after I left. But PartlyCloudy was right there with her in those emails!! What a great gal you are!!!
Thanks, girls!!!
And thank you to everyone else who posted messages on Babble to me. What a wonderful community we have here!!!!
Thank you all for welcoming me back!
Huggies,
Sandy
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:37:05
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » SandyWeb, posted by JohnDoenut on July 7, 2004, at 13:05:59
Hi John,
You appear to be very well rounded. You have an intelligent way of communicating, and you have a warm personality. I am so pleased that you are posting here.
I'm not much into SciFi so I'm not sure if I'd ever watch the Matrix movies. You'd probably find me inspecting the backs of my eyelids before too long! *smile* Although the premise sounds interesting, you wouldn't catch me paying $10 to go see it in the theatres. Of course, I could always get it for free at the library!
You mentioned that when a person removes their desire that it will ultimately remove their pain. I'm not sure how one would remove a desire. Actually, I think you have to have realistic desires. Otherwise, you will disappoint yourself when you pursue things that will be out of your reach. Realistic desires are wonderful in that they will give you goals to strive for. I believe that we need to have desires....realistic desires....in order to keep the fires of HOPE burning. And HOPE can be transformed into ACTION that will eventually allow us to achieve our desired GOALS. But I could be wrong. *big grin*
Let us know how you are doing, John. I'm not sure what your situation is, but I can tell that you have much inner strength on your side. Don't fall into the trap of analyzing yourself too much. One tends to become too self-absorbed that way, and every little bump in our personality becomes a monster! You're so smart that I'm fairly confident that you do a fair amount of analyzing. How about posting to us instead? We'll do the analyzing for you!! Ha ha!!!
Hugs,
Sandy
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:40:39
In reply to Re: (Trigger), posted by trucker on July 7, 2004, at 13:49:31
Yes, I believe that one should give themselves positive messages about the type of person they are. No harm can come from that. I am sorry that you had such a sad upbringing, but it's wonderful that you found a way to overcome it!! And yes....all things are possible with Jesus!!!
Hugs,
Sandy
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:41:59
In reply to Re: (Trigger) » trucker, posted by Simus on July 7, 2004, at 14:00:02
Hi Simus! *hand waving in the air*
I hope you have a lovely day today!!!
God bless,
Sandy
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:44:51
In reply to Re: Sandy, posted by tabitha on July 7, 2004, at 16:39:18
Hi Tabitha,
Thank you for your kind words. It is inspiring to know how endurable the spirit is when we feel as though our life is over. Who'd a thunk?? *big grin*
Sandy
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:49:29
In reply to Re: (Trigger), posted by trucker on July 7, 2004, at 18:40:30
Hi all,
Today I have two meetings.
I have to see my counsellor at the Day Treatment Program (which doesn't start for me until mid-August) to go over my goals for the Program.
Then I have another Follow-up meeting from my stay on the Crisis Unit. I'm not quite sure what the meeting is about nor how long it will last. I'll let you know what happens.
I hope you all are able to enjoy this beautiful day today.
Hugs all around,
Sandy
Posted by Simus on July 8, 2004, at 9:26:37
In reply to Today's Meetings, posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 7:49:29
> I have to see my counsellor at the Day Treatment Program (which doesn't start for me until mid-August)
I wish you didn't have to wait SO LONG! August???
Simus
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 13:50:05
In reply to Re: Today's Meetings » SandyWeb, posted by Simus on July 8, 2004, at 9:26:37
I've been to my meetings today.
The first one was with my counsellor from the Day Treatment Program. We went over my goals, and she tried to get into my head. But we only had half an hour, and I really didn't want to start anything with her when I'd have to run. I have another appointment on August 5th, and I have to bring a timeline of significant events in my life. That should be interesting.
My next meeting was with my "team"...p-doc, psych. nurse, social worker, and a new psych. resident. My p-doc actually said that I had CRACKED!!! Lol! Is that correct psychological vocabulary?? *big smile* He said that I had so much stress heaped on me from over the years, and then the precipitating factor to my suicide attempt was all the events of the past few months, and that I CRACKED! He said that I had a tremendous threshold for stress, and that I was able to hold up for years, but there comes a point where a person can't deal with it alone anymore.
I have another appointment with my "team" in 2 weeks, but they will move the appointment up if I can't make it that long. He's concerned about suicide.
I also had a voicemail message when I got home today stating that I have an appointment with another p-doc next week, July 14. I'm not sure what that is all about. The message said that my p-doc had referred me. Maybe this other p-doc will be my regular doctor since my "team" is really only for follow-up.
I guess that's it for now. Enjoy your day!
Sandy
Posted by ghost on July 8, 2004, at 13:53:44
In reply to Re: Today's Meetings, posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 13:50:05
wow. that sounds like things went well-- and bringing a list of significant events in your life sounds like quite an assignment to me.
anyhow, i just wanted you to know i've been reading along and i'm so glad you're getting the help you need. i hope you're feeling better.
have a great day yourself,
ghost
Posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 14:04:20
In reply to Re: Today's Meetings, posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 13:50:05
The officers who were here the night of my attempt have been trying to get together with me since then. I asked them what time they got dispatched because I only remember to 12:15am. It turns out that they were dispatched at 12:43am and arrived at my apartment at 12:48am. So I've lost about half an hour of memory. And I still don't know how they got in because I never opened the door for them. They were banging and yelling for an eternity!!!
Posted by mystic on July 8, 2004, at 19:16:11
In reply to Re: Today's Meetings, posted by SandyWeb on July 8, 2004, at 13:50:05
Hey Sandy...Very very very proud of you...and you should be of yourself..You are climbing your way out..and that is good..you are doing some very positive things and you are going to get better i just know it..Thank you for keeping us posted I for one am very interested in knowing how you are doing...Take care..Luvya Your friend...Mystic
Posted by SandyWeb on July 9, 2004, at 7:14:30
In reply to Re: Today's Meetings, posted by ghost on July 8, 2004, at 13:53:44
Hi Ghost,
Thanks for responding to my postings. I didn't know that so many people were actually following me! Yes, it's been quite the journey....and I'm thankful for your comments.
We haven't had much of a summer here this year so far, but I'm enjoying the cooler weather while most around me are complaining. *smile* Hey, after being hit dead-on with a hurricane last Fall and a weather-bomb in the Winter, ANY weather is good weather now!!! Lol!!!
Take good care of yourself!
Sandy
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