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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 70 to 94 of 272. Go back in thread:
Posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 10:47:43
In reply to Re: trust, posted by Dr. Bob on July 6, 2009, at 0:53:46
Posted by Nadezda on July 6, 2009, at 14:37:37
In reply to Re: trust, posted by Dr. Bob on July 6, 2009, at 0:53:46
"Maybe a negative view of other online groups reflects a positive view of this one. It may be a sign of cohesion."That does cheer me up considerably. I hope that's more what it is. --
Thanks --
Nadezda
Posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 15:26:25
In reply to Re: trust, posted by Dr. Bob on July 6, 2009, at 0:53:46
Bob...it would be so much more helpful to us if you did not keep going slightly off-track when the topic of people leaving Babble because they have been hurt by it comes up, as it does over and over.
Everyone, except you apparently, is very clear that they are NOT confusing past hurts in their lives with hurts which have occurred here on this site. They are so definitive and self-aware about this that it is really rather insulting and patronizing of you to keep telling posters here that you feel you know better than they do what their hidden or unconscious motives for feeling hurt might be. You don't.
We would like you to understand that the large number of posters who have left have done so because this site, which they valued and trusted a lot, has hurt them. To be specific, your severe blocking policies have hurt them. In my six years posting here, it has been my experience that it is very rare for one poster to hurt another badly. Usually, things are worked out, or, quite often, posters who do not get anything positive out of posting to one another just avoid doing it. A large majority of the interactions here are tremendously caring, understanding and helpful. So, everyone is mostly solving the interpersonal problems which arise by themselves. Punitive actions are just not needed, although I think administrative help in making sure people do solve these situations can occasionally be very valuable.
Really, saying that a negative view of Twitter reflects a positive view of Babble is just not a relevant or intelligible statement. People are concerned about their increasing loss of privacy over what they may have said in the past online here. Even though we have given you permission to use what we say here for other purposes, I think most of us assumed that you meant that you might use data or other information in psychiatric publications, while guaranteeing our privacy, as other publishing psychiatrists are always careful to do. Twitter is a very different proposition, and as several internet-savvy posters have pointed out, may increase the possibility of posters being identified IRL, because of the increased cross-referencing which can be done. None of us really know yet whether this is a valid concern, but a number of us are concerned that it might be- thus all the opt-outs. Liking Babble better than Twitter is SO not the point- our privacy is.
Your blocking policies, and the way you enforce them, are what have hurt people here. If it weren't for how harshly you have treated people in your own community, this would be such a great place. You have put yourself in the position of being like the Gorgon in the Greek myths, who ate his own children. Why on earth do that when you have created something so good? I know that it hurts you to hear this, but it is the truth. If you go on avoiding the truth, and doing nothing to correct what you are doing, despite hearing exactly the same thing from dozens of people, over and over for years, how can there be a good or worthwhile future for Babble? It's very sad to say- there can't be.
Posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 15:32:21
In reply to Re: trust, posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 15:26:25
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 6, 2009, at 17:30:15
In reply to Re: trust, posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 15:26:25
> Bob...it would be so much more helpful to us if you did not keep going slightly off-track when the topic of people leaving Babble because they have been hurt by it comes up, as it does over and over.
>
> Everyone, except you apparently, is very clear that they are NOT confusing past hurts in their lives with hurts which have occurred here on this site. They are so definitive and self-aware about this that it is really rather insulting and patronizing of you to keep telling posters here that you feel you know better than they do what their hidden or unconscious motives for feeling hurt might be. You don't.
>
> We would like you to understand that the large number of posters who have left have done so because this site, which they valued and trusted a lot, has hurt them. To be specific, your severe blocking policies have hurt them. In my six years posting here, it has been my experience that it is very rare for one poster to hurt another badly. Usually, things are worked out, or, quite often, posters who do not get anything positive out of posting to one another just avoid doing it. A large majority of the interactions here are tremendously caring, understanding and helpful. So, everyone is mostly solving the interpersonal problems which arise by themselves. Punitive actions are just not needed, although I think administrative help in making sure people do solve these situations can occasionally be very valuable.
>
> Really, saying that a negative view of Twitter reflects a positive view of Babble is just not a relevant or intelligible statement. People are concerned about their increasing loss of privacy over what they may have said in the past online here. Even though we have given you permission to use what we say here for other purposes, I think most of us assumed that you meant that you might use data or other information in psychiatric publications, while guaranteeing our privacy, as other publishing psychiatrists are always careful to do. Twitter is a very different proposition, and as several internet-savvy posters have pointed out, may increase the possibility of posters being identified IRL, because of the increased cross-referencing which can be done. None of us really know yet whether this is a valid concern, but a number of us are concerned that it might be- thus all the opt-outs. Liking Babble better than Twitter is SO not the point- our privacy is.
>
> Your blocking policies, and the way you enforce them, are what have hurt people here. If it weren't for how harshly you have treated people in your own community, this would be such a great place. You have put yourself in the position of being like the Gorgon in the Greek myths, who ate his own children. Why on earth do that when you have created something so good? I know that it hurts you to hear this, but it is the truth. If you go on avoiding the truth, and doing nothing to correct what you are doing, despite hearing exactly the same thing from dozens of people, over and over for years, how can there be a good or worthwhile future for Babble? It's very sad to say- there can't be.twinleaf,
You wrote,[...You (Mr. Hsiung)...being like the G*rgon..xxx his own xxxxxxx...][...I know it xxxx...it is the truth...].
I am unsure as to what you are wanting to mean here. If you could post answers to the following, then I could respond accordingly.
A. How do you know that Mr. Hsiung is xxxx by what you wrote to him?
B. What criteria did you use to determine that it is the xxxxx?
C. In the Greek myth, what criteria did you use to make the analogy?
D. other aspects not stated
Lou
Posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 17:50:26
In reply to Re: trust..great post! (nm) » twinleaf, posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 15:32:21
Thanks, Fayeroe! I do appreciate the support. But it's probably way overdue for me to stop talking about this. There are such great things about Babble that I keep thinking, "if only...'
I'm so sorry about your garden. It sounded so beautiful, and you put so much work and care into it. Is it much hotter and drier than usual this summer? It must be.
Posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 17:54:08
In reply to Lou's request-WCFeeldz » twinleaf, posted by Lou Pilder on July 6, 2009, at 17:30:15
I'm sorry, Lou. So far, I'm batting 0% in being able to answer you.
Posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 18:33:39
In reply to Re: trust..great post! » fayeroe, posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 17:50:26
> Thanks, Fayeroe! I do appreciate the support. But it's probably way overdue for me to stop talking about this. There are such great things about Babble that I keep thinking, "if only...'
I probably shouldn't talk about what Bob says either. But when I see an apparent effort to manipulate what others have posted, I have to reply to it.
>
> I'm so sorry about your garden. It sounded so beautiful, and you put so much work and care into it. Is it much hotter and drier than usual this summer? It must be.We're having the worst drought that we've had in 50 years. I can only imagine what the farmers and ranchers are experiencing. We had a horrid year in 2008 and so many people went broke when their crops and livestock died.
Posted by henrietta on July 6, 2009, at 19:58:10
In reply to Re: trust..great post! » fayeroe, posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 17:50:26
I'm sorry I haven't publicly supported your incisive and important posts, twinleaf. I read them and am greatly cheered that somebody is saying what needs to be said, and is able to spend the time to say it articulately and compassionately and CIVILLY. I thank you for your continued efforts on the behalf of of all of us.
AND, by the way, to Fayroe. GOD, do I feel for you and your garden. I don't really think (I may be wrong, of course) that people who don't garden get it. Don't get the grief that a gardener feels after 4 years of drought, or after an over-population of deer has trampled, in 5 seconds, the cosmos you started from seed in February, or the vegetables and herbs destroyed by four-lined bugs, and all the beauty you dreamed all winter, and worked your f'in butt off for, and spent loving care planting, and depend on for both food and joy---
OK, this paragraph has lost its thread. But I understand, Fayroe, and am so saddened by the loss of your garden. I nearly cried today when I read your post.
Posted by henrietta on July 6, 2009, at 20:09:39
In reply to Re: trust..great post!, posted by henrietta on July 6, 2009, at 19:58:10
I'm sorry I got a bit carried away with the garden grief. It's just that today the 2 posts that touched me were yours and Fayroe's "My lovely garden". I want to be sure you know that your posts , twinleaf, are vital, and that they do have great meaning to me, and probably to many others who don't post often. Thank you, most sincerely.
Posted by Kath on July 6, 2009, at 20:09:45
In reply to Re: Important question at end., posted by Dr. Bob on July 2, 2009, at 18:58:20
Thx for replies.
For that matter, I found PB by googling "Celexa"!!
Is twitter like a house with many rooms & one of the rooms is the PsychoBabble Twitter? Another, if I chose to have one, would be Kath Twitter?
K
Posted by Kath on July 6, 2009, at 20:14:05
In reply to Re: trust, posted by Dr. Bob on July 5, 2009, at 1:28:55
> Maybe some posters are wary because they were harmed when they trusted others in the past.
>
> Bob~ ~ For me, it's that I feel secure in having my words here in this 'forum' that I've chosen to be part of.
Because Twitter seems to be an up-&-coming thing that LOTS of people might join - like Facebook & MSN etc, I think that way more people might be likely to read my words there, than the number of people who would 'land' here at PB. That's where the discomfort lies for me. However, I'm not feeling as uncomfortable as I was. But I still am opting out, & still would have preferred if the default was to be opted out & people had to 'apply' to be part of the twitter thing.
K
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 6, 2009, at 23:01:51
In reply to Re: trust..great post! » twinleaf, posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 18:33:39
> > Thanks, Fayeroe! I do appreciate the support. But it's probably way overdue for me to stop talking about this. There are such great things about Babble that I keep thinking, "if only...'
>
> I probably shouldn't talk about what Bob says either. But when I see an apparent effort to manipulate what others have posted, I have to reply to it.
> >
> > I'm so sorry about your garden. It sounded so beautiful, and you put so much work and care into it. Is it much hotter and drier than usual this summer? It must be.
>
> We're having the worst drought that we've had in 50 years. I can only imagine what the farmers and ranchers are experiencing. We had a horrid year in 2008 and so many people went broke when their crops and livestock died.
>
> fayeroe,
You wrote,[...effort to m*nipulate what others have posted..]
I am unsure as to what you aree wanting to mean here. If you could answer the following, then I could have the opportunity to respond accordingly.
A. Who was doing the m*nipulation?
B. How do you determine that what was done constitutes m*nipulation?
C. What post(s) are involved?
Lou
Posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 23:11:52
In reply to Lou's request- » fayeroe, posted by Lou Pilder on July 6, 2009, at 23:01:51
Posted by rjlockhart04-08 on July 6, 2009, at 23:20:13
In reply to Re: trust, posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 15:26:25
I mean spin! you know that song "You spin me right round baby" That's stuck in my head.
Head has 360degree's of frustration, reality checkin' coming soon.
Posted by Kath on July 7, 2009, at 8:10:03
In reply to I don't want to be a twit, posted by Kim on July 6, 2009, at 2:07:21
> Please. No Twitter. Please.
~ ~ like your sense of humour. K
Posted by Timne on July 7, 2009, at 10:46:54
In reply to Re: trust, posted by Dr. Bob on July 6, 2009, at 0:53:46
>
> Maybe a negative view of other online groups reflects a positive view of this one. It may be a sign of cohesion.
>
> BobAnother way of seeing it could be that people already aware of their peril because they hear ice cracking beneath their feet might be unwilling to step further, or to move about at all, on such thin ice.
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 7, 2009, at 18:03:47
In reply to Re: trust..great post! » twinleaf, posted by fayeroe on July 6, 2009, at 18:33:39
> Everyone ... is very clear that they are NOT confusing past hurts in their lives with hurts which have occurred here on this site. They are so definitive and self-aware about this that it is really rather insulting and patronizing of you to keep telling posters here that you feel you know better than they do what their hidden or unconscious motives for feeling hurt might be.
Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that anyone was confused or knew less than me. But even people who are really self-aware can be unaware of their unconscious motives.
> We would like you to understand that the large number of posters who have left have done so because this site, which they valued and trusted a lot, has hurt them. To be specific, your severe blocking policies have hurt them. In my six years posting here, it has been my experience that it is very rare for one poster to hurt another badly. Usually, things are worked out, or, quite often, posters who do not get anything positive out of posting to one another just avoid doing it. A large majority of the interactions here are tremendously caring, understanding and helpful. So, everyone is mostly solving the interpersonal problems which arise by themselves. Punitive actions are just not needed, although I think administrative help in making sure people do solve these situations can occasionally be very valuable.
I'm glad you've found it generally caring, understanding, and helpful here and have only rarely, if ever, been hurt badly by another poster.
I guess others may have left because of my policies or because they didn't get enough positive out of being here.
What sort of administrative help do you all think might be valuable?
> You have put yourself in the position of being like the Gorgon in the Greek myths, who ate his own children.
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
But please don't take this personally, either, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person, and I'm sorry if this hurts you.
More information about posting policies and tips on alternative ways to express oneself are in the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#enforceFollow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
> > it's probably way overdue for me to stop talking about this.
>
> I probably shouldn't talk about what Bob says either.
>
> fayeroeI'm heartened that you're reflecting on how you use your power to post -- and that fayeroe is encouraging you to stop doing something that caused an infraction. Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 7, 2009, at 18:13:34
In reply to Re: Important question at end. Dinah + Dr. Bob, posted by Kath on July 6, 2009, at 20:09:45
> Is twitter like a house with many rooms & one of the rooms is the PsychoBabble Twitter? Another, if I chose to have one, would be Kath Twitter?
You could think of it that way. Many people talking in many rooms. Or, like a radio with many channels?
Bob
Posted by fayeroe on July 7, 2009, at 18:14:08
In reply to Re: power and encouragement » twinleaf, posted by Dr. Bob on July 7, 2009, at 18:03:47
> > Everyone ... is very clear that they are NOT confusing past hurts in their lives with hurts which have occurred here on this site. They are so definitive and self-aware about this that it is really rather insulting and patronizing of you to keep telling posters here that you feel you know better than they do what their hidden or unconscious motives for feeling hurt might be.
>
> Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that anyone was confused or knew less than me. But even people who are really self-aware can be unaware of their unconscious motives.
>
> > We would like you to understand that the large number of posters who have left have done so because this site, which they valued and trusted a lot, has hurt them. To be specific, your severe blocking policies have hurt them. In my six years posting here, it has been my experience that it is very rare for one poster to hurt another badly. Usually, things are worked out, or, quite often, posters who do not get anything positive out of posting to one another just avoid doing it. A large majority of the interactions here are tremendously caring, understanding and helpful. So, everyone is mostly solving the interpersonal problems which arise by themselves. Punitive actions are just not needed, although I think administrative help in making sure people do solve these situations can occasionally be very valuable.
>
> I'm glad you've found it generally caring, understanding, and helpful here and have only rarely, if ever, been hurt badly by another poster.
>
> I guess others may have left because of my policies or because they didn't get enough positive out of being here.
>
> What sort of administrative help do you all think might be valuable?
>
> > You have put yourself in the position of being like the Gorgon in the Greek myths, who ate his own children.
>
> Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
>
> But please don't take this personally, either, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person, and I'm sorry if this hurts you.
>
> More information about posting policies and tips on alternative ways to express oneself are in the FAQ:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#enforce
>
> Follow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
>
> > > it's probably way overdue for me to stop talking about this.
> >
> > I probably shouldn't talk about what Bob says either.
> >
> > fayeroe
>
> I'm heartened that you're reflecting on how you use your power to post -- and that fayeroe is encouraging you to stop doing something that caused an infraction. Thanks,
>
> BobBob, I was not talking to Twinleaf. I was saying that I probaly shouldn't talk about what you say. And to add to it, it doesn't do any good. Pat
Posted by fayeroe on July 7, 2009, at 18:14:17
In reply to Re: power and encouragement » twinleaf, posted by Dr. Bob on July 7, 2009, at 18:03:47
> > Everyone ... is very clear that they are NOT confusing past hurts in their lives with hurts which have occurred here on this site. They are so definitive and self-aware about this that it is really rather insulting and patronizing of you to keep telling posters here that you feel you know better than they do what their hidden or unconscious motives for feeling hurt might be.
>
> Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that anyone was confused or knew less than me. But even people who are really self-aware can be unaware of their unconscious motives.
>
> > We would like you to understand that the large number of posters who have left have done so because this site, which they valued and trusted a lot, has hurt them. To be specific, your severe blocking policies have hurt them. In my six years posting here, it has been my experience that it is very rare for one poster to hurt another badly. Usually, things are worked out, or, quite often, posters who do not get anything positive out of posting to one another just avoid doing it. A large majority of the interactions here are tremendously caring, understanding and helpful. So, everyone is mostly solving the interpersonal problems which arise by themselves. Punitive actions are just not needed, although I think administrative help in making sure people do solve these situations can occasionally be very valuable.
>
> I'm glad you've found it generally caring, understanding, and helpful here and have only rarely, if ever, been hurt badly by another poster.
>
> I guess others may have left because of my policies or because they didn't get enough positive out of being here.
>
> What sort of administrative help do you all think might be valuable?
>
> > You have put yourself in the position of being like the Gorgon in the Greek myths, who ate his own children.
>
> Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
>
> But please don't take this personally, either, this doesn't mean I don't like you or think you're a bad person, and I'm sorry if this hurts you.
>
> More information about posting policies and tips on alternative ways to express oneself are in the FAQ:
>
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
> http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#enforce
>
> Follow-ups regarding these issues, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
>
> > > it's probably way overdue for me to stop talking about this.
> >
> > I probably shouldn't talk about what Bob says either.
> >
> > fayeroe
>
> I'm heartened that you're reflecting on how you use your power to post -- and that fayeroe is encouraging you to stop doing something that caused an infraction. Thanks,
>
> BobBob, I was not talking to Twinleaf. I was saying that I probaly shouldn't talk about what you say. And to add to it, it doesn't do any good. Pat
Posted by Zeba on July 7, 2009, at 22:05:29
In reply to Re: power and encouragement » twinleaf, posted by Dr. Bob on July 7, 2009, at 18:03:47
And what might Dr. Bob's unconscious motives be???
Posted by rjlockhart04-08 on July 8, 2009, at 1:58:38
In reply to Re: trust » Dr. Bob, posted by Timne on July 7, 2009, at 10:46:54
Just like the Titanic thought it was unsinkable, crack! just going through some ice, and bumb....all terror broke lose! went down in 2 hours!
Anyways, need go down there see what's happenin'
It's suppost to be decaying....I don't know what's going to be left of it by 2020. Yet....show's "Titan" was a wierd logo it got. Something's are not coicencidece.
Posted by Timne on July 8, 2009, at 10:42:16
In reply to Re: Is twitter like a house, posted by Dr. Bob on July 7, 2009, at 18:13:34
Posted by rskontos on July 8, 2009, at 16:02:38
In reply to Re: trust, posted by twinleaf on July 6, 2009, at 15:26:25
Twinleaf,
So well put. And I say hear hear.
Dr. Bob so doesn't get it; it is about privacy. Alas, he almost always sees things so opposite of us. At least we admit we need(by being here) a mental health site, sometimes I wonder if..............
You do speak so well and Civilly. Well said.
rsk
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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