Posted by alexandra_k on December 20, 2004, at 12:45:08
In reply to Re: about being watched, posted by smokeymadison on December 20, 2004, at 1:58:46
> i have thought about it and i think that the paranoia stems from a feeling of unease. i feel uneasy and tend to want to attribute the feeling to something. i then attribute it to being scrutinized by some unseen source. the feeling comes first in this case, then the thought.
Yay! Phenomenological support for the empiricist model (sorry). Yeah, thats my intuition too...
> i am interested in the relationship between feelings, thoughts, and actions (behaviors). i know that there are a lot of cognitive behavioral theories out there that would propose that thoughts cause or give rise to feelings. but i can't believe tha this is ALWAYS the case. there have been so many times when i just feel something and have no thought related to it that i know of.Yes, yes, yes. I am interested in the relationship and causation between thoughts, feelings, and behaviours too. Even got permission to attend a graduate paper 'theory and issues in cognitive behaviour therapy'. I have lots of issues with the notion that thoughts cause feelings cause behaviours. Sometimes the feelings come first, as you say, and the thoughts are adopted as justifications or rationalisations - especially when the therapist requires you to rationalise or justify or you are being 'resistant'. Thats why I don't like cognitive restructuring. When you are required to JUSTIFY an intense / extreme state of emotional arousal you invariably envoke a cognitive error in your justification. If you are then told that you can change your feeling by changing your thinking then I think that they have the matter backwards. I learned nothing in the class except that cognitive behavioural therapy is so eclectic that it doesn't even deserve to be called a theory. I am not at all convinced that there is a coherent theory that could support or make sense of the little homework tasks and activities. But then I have a bone of contention there I suppose (too invalidating and superficial IMHO).
Linehan allows for feelings to come first. In fact, on her model the feelings typically do come first and she acknowledges that it is the intense emotions that produce the cognitive errors. But she still thinks that the way into the dysfunctional thought / feeling / behaviour cycle is usefully thoughts. Though I guess she tries to come in everywhere really...
poster:alexandra_k
thread:431767
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/write/20041210/msgs/432054.html