Posted by bsj on November 25, 2003, at 2:30:13
In reply to Re: Boy~Do I miss Vicodin!, posted by rxnurse on November 24, 2003, at 22:55:22
"As far as the efficacy of 'politically acceptable' antidepressants goes, they do not
produce a "high" nor false sense of well-being. They reduce the re-uptake of circulating
serotonin, and to a lesser degree norepinephrine. SSRI's and the like restore the amount
of neurochemicals in depressed people to the levels of people who do not demonstrate
depressive symptoms. This effect does not take an hour but weeks of daily use. Opiates
have no affinity for these chemicals, but for opioid or mu receptors in the central
nervous system. There is not nor will ever be a comparison clinically between opiates and
antidepressants."That's the party line; do you write ads for drug-makers, by any chance?
But you completely ignore the likelihood that some with depression suffer from manfulction of
the endogenous opioid systems. It would be _astounding_ if these systems alone were immunue
to dysfunction. SSRIs and the like wouldn't do squat for these people; and right now
the only treatments available are opiates. They're crude drugs, to be sure, but
there's no alternative. The serotonin and dopamine theories of depression are hot in
acadamia right now; so there won't be many people researching alternative drugs. It
would be nice to see someone working on an antidepressant derived from morphine or some
other opiate; but I'm not holding my breath. I really don't like the fact that I have
to choke down hydrocodone pills twice a day or I spend all my time staring at the ceiling
and thinking about killing myself.But as for mainstream antidepressants: I guess you missed that study in the BRITISH JOURNAL OF PSYCHIATRY where it was shown that, on the whole, ADs and placebos perform on a comparable level; something like 80% of the response to ADs are attributable to the placebo effect. OUCH. Mainstream ADs are third-rate psychotropics; they're like psychic powers: they work largely when you BELIEVE. (What was all that stuff about
reducing the re-uptake of circulating serotonin?)"Opiates are a central nervous system depressant."
In textbooks from the 1950s they are; but today, it's apparent that they're far more than
that. Opiates have a lot of actions that are poorly understood or not understood at all.
To fit them into the neat "central nervous system depressant" box shows your ignorance."Opiate withdrawl can kill people"
Not otherwise healthy people.
"...not withdrawl from Prozac."
I don't know; it wouldn't surprise me if there were deaths associated with withdrawal
from Paxil or Effexor. Withdrawal from the former was the worst two weeks of
my life.
poster:bsj
thread:270292
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/subs/20031014/msgs/283506.html