Posted by Adam on March 17, 2001, at 23:11:26
In reply to Re: What DOES one do?, posted by allisonm on March 17, 2001, at 21:20:47
I can't speak for Dr. Bob, but my impression of this analogy is that it was meant to be a very loose one, and no parallel other than helplessness should be drawn.
I have a number of relatives (my maternal grandfather, most saliently) who were/are addicted to alcohol. My granfather, as far as I can tell, is inebriated 100% of the time, and sometimes drinks himself into unconsciousness. When I was little, the characteristic odor that he exuded just was "his smell". As I got older, I realized the man was half pickled at this point, and the fact that he is still alive today is a source of considerable amazement.
Interestingly, I'm not sure anyone has seriously pushed him toward sobriety. I guess that when he goes without a drink for too long, he becomes monstrous. I feel a bit monstrous for harboring such sentiments, but, since being sober doesn't appear to work for him, I sometimes wish he would just die and get it over with. He'll never quit, can't seem to function without booze anyway, and only barely functions now as it is. I can scarcely bring myself to visit him anymore at Christmas, and must confess I've gone a couple Holidays without even making the effort. It's simply a horrible thing. I do believe he is helpless: His one comfort and stabilizing influence in life has utterly ruined him, and he has nothing left to do but to drink and expire. However, without the alcohol, I think he would be capable of murder. He is a monster, and a sad, sick, lonely, pathetic man all at once. He has simultaneously a heart of gold and the blind rage of a killer, and is beyond my comprehension or my ability to reach out to. He must be accepted as he is, or abandoned. There is no hope for change, not anymore.
I once met a schizophrenic man who was given to some rather elaborate and incomprehensible fantasies or delusions, as well as some pretty violent and foulmouthed outbursts at seemingly no provocation who, after some heavy ECT and perhaps even heavier doses of neuroleptics, appeared (though he spoke at about half the pace of the average conversationalist at that point, and didn't change the tone of his voice all that much) much more aware of reality, much more subdued, happier, and perhaps maybe even capable of functioning outside of a hospital, on his own. Simon. I liked him.
Different as apples and antelopes.
> > > BTW, it's controversial, how responsible for their drinking to consider people with alcoholism. One way to look at it is as a symptom of their illness. In which case it's their choice as much as hallucinating is for people with schizophrenia.
> >
> > That is very interesting! I never thought of my alcoholism as something akin to schizophrenia, and had not heard that theory. I will have 14 years sobriety in June, and I have to say the "bottle as Siren" is a strong call for me. It always seemed like a choice not to take that first drink. Hmmm, very interesting.< <
>
> No doubt we could talk on this subject for eons. I came to the conclusion a long time ago that my mother simply could not stop drinking no matter how hard she tried or wanted to stop... kind of akin to schizophrenic hallucinations now that you mention it, Bob. I do view alcoholism as an illness. In my mother's case, it was terminal.
poster:Adam
thread:5149
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20010209/msgs/5158.html