Posted by rayww on August 14, 2008, at 20:10:45
In reply to Lou's request for clarification-wnurnturnt » rayww, posted by Lou Pilder on August 12, 2008, at 21:54:07
> > > This misunderstanding of the words of Jesus (as well as the timing, the relevance, and the intended audience/timeframe), have been the source of much pain for many people who are outside the religion of Christianity, to include, to a huge extend, the Jews.
> > >
> > > I cannot fathom why this was left, unsanctioned, to continue to cause harm to others.
> > >
> > > Yes, I understand the context of the post, that Dee is here describing how that very misunderstanding has caused her to be harmed by the same institution (Christianity).
> > >
> > > But, how can some be sanctioned for speaking of what constitutes anti-Semitism, while this post has been allowed even as it speaks of what constitutes erroneous Christian understanding?
> > >
> > > Shalom, Dena
> >
> > <<<
> > I'm not certain exactly what you are saying Dena. Salvation belongs to Jesus because he created it. Other religions do not believe in Salvation. Let them believe in whatever they will, whether it is reincarnation, paganism, or whatever else. We in America believe in freedom of religion, and that has done well for America. Look at us.
> >
> > Is Salvation mentioned in the OT? In what context? Jesus invented/created the idea of salvation. It was Jesus who invented/created resurrection too. If we were to give credit where credit was due, everyone would fit somewhere. No one would be left out of anything, because if Jesus is real, if He invented salvation, if what He says is true, then we will all see Him one day, and have the privilege of working out our salvation from there with Him. If He is not real, then we have nothing to worry about because when we're dead we're dead.
> >
> > In the mean time, it would be good if we tried not to totally mess up our life here.
> >
> > God has told us a few hints on this too. Like, Love the Lord, don't kill anyone, use sex appropriately, don't steal, envy, lie, cheat, or bear false witness. Eat properly, take care of your body, spirit, and mind.
> >
> > Many people live a celibate life and seem to get along all right. what about the woman or man who through no fault of their own doesn't meet and fall in love with a person they want to marry? What about the person who takes an oath of celibacy?
> >
> > Every one of us lives with our own personal challenges, none of which needs to keep us from salvation, if that's what we believe. It is good to believe in something, whether its Jesus and salvation, or some other form of belief. Belief is what gives us hope, and hope is connected to faith. Faith is connected to God. Do we need to connect the dots to find it for ourselves?
>
> rayww,
> You wrote,[...Other religions do not believe in salvation...If (Jesus) is not real...when we're dead we're dead...]
> I am unsure as to what you are wanting to mean by what you wrote here. If you could clarify the following, then I could have the opportunity to respond accirdingly.
> A. In,[...other religions do not believe in salvation...], by what authority do you use to state that?
> B. In,[...if (Jesus) is not real...when we're dead we're dead...] could there be an explanation different from that, that could be unbeknownst to you?
> C. other aspects not stated
> Lou
>Lou, if you would like to enter a discussion with me on the meaning of Salvation, perhaps this would be a good place to start: http://byubmp3.byu.edu/edweek06/mcconkie.mp3
Your questions are honest, let me see if I can explain it so that you are able to understand.
What is the meaning of Salvation?
Ans: to be saved from our sins.
Que: why do we need to be saved from our sins?
Que: what will happen to us if we die with our sin?
Que: what is the definition of sin?
Que: What does it mean to be saved?
These questions have many different answers found in many different religions, but as described at the end of the reference above, there can be only one salvation, and it will be the same for everyone, and it would have been taught to Adam the same as it was to Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Jesus, and today. It is God's plan of Salvation, and just because our definitions may be a little screwed up, does not alter the fact that there is one salvation - God's.Jesus kind of shocked everyone when three days after he died he came back to life again, not as he was before, but resurrected, meaning he came back in a physical/tangible body inseparably connected to his spirit, in a form that could travel through space, walk through walls, enter wherever he chose. We don't know what substance he became, because it is not of this world. Jesus was the first one to be saved, and he opened the door for the whole world to go through. The graves were opened and many other people were resurrected at the time Jesus was. There is evidence and witnesses to that pivotal event on earth. It was such that time was measured according to it. BC, and AD.
If Jesus had failed, and had not been able to finish whatever it was he was sent here to do, when you die, you would be dead forever, you would die in your sins, remain in spiritual darkness along with everyone else. There could be no salvation because it would not be possible to be saved from your sin. You would have no hope of ever seeing God again, or being in his presence.
Why?
What is the door? How do we go through it?
"I am the way, the truth and the life". "He that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live".Some people believe in Jesus, and accept the idea of Salvation. Others do not. Just because they do not believe it, doesn't mean it can't happen. Everyone, with no one left behind, will some day have the opportunity to face the door that Jesus opened. In order to go through the door there might be changes we'll have to make. These changes are far easier to make on earth where we have spirit and body to work with because here we can increase our light and knowledge and we can grow more spiritually active, and become the person we want to be, so that at the point when we die, we'll be ready to meet our maker.
poster:rayww
thread:611474
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faith/20080809/msgs/846272.html