Posted by Zo on August 8, 2003, at 0:34:29
In reply to Re: Bob, please consider a PBC for Larry » Larry Hoover, posted by Ame Sans Vie on August 6, 2003, at 11:53:22
. . pretty well illustrates the difference between those who come from their emotions, in their manner of speech - and those who more closely examine their actual wording.Is it not possible, Larry and Ame, to observe that real offence has been taken, and to consider that the analytical only goes so far, when it comes to people's feelings? It is not the scrupulosity with which you justify your own words that troubles me - and I do not mean to single you out, I merely address you both because you are here - and represent a position, a way of thinking, that contributes to many of the misunderstandings I've seen here.
And even more, it represents Bob's thinking, and the reason for the resultant upheavel.
The moment of difference, I notice, for each of you, is that when you get the response that someone is hurt or angry or offended at what you've posted - Larry, particularly you - you immediately turn to your *own* words.
Instead of turning *towards* your fellow board member who is upset with you, to mend things with them - you turn to your own words, reread them, find nothing wrong - and put the other person, who has told you of their feelings, at an further remove.
Follow me, here. In the world of Aspergers, the rest of us are called NTs. For neurotypical. And it is granted, by all, that NTs feel the general social run of things. Whether one approves or not, we are the norm. Whether it is fair or not - and I didn't invent this stuff - society and psychology are rife with judgement upon those who do not readily, or easily, "connect" to others. OR - and this is an important or - readily "get" the tone of things, that others are getting.
To NTs, turning away from the feelings brought before you - is an offense. It is the equivalent of saying, I do not care about your feelings.
So that when you comb over your post, instead of really listening to the *person* and their complaints, it unfortunately broadcasts a message I'm not sure you intend.
Then, let us say the NT gets further upset at being cold-shouldered, and the analytical type is even more mystified, why the big deal, examines his post even more - and withdraws even more from the person who wanted and needed his presence.
Awareness. That's all. These are different modes of being and of communicating - and they're horribly misread, as in this thread. Two different languages. I've had experience in both camps, and feel for everybody, and would dearly love this to stop.
Ame, Lar, it gives offense to justify yourself when another is hurting. It just does. Pax, Zen, Larry is turning to *his* skill set. Beneath our different tool kits, we all want the same thing - the love and caring of one another. Even if the opposite style from yours - all of you - pisses you off, I don't care. It's all a MISUNDERSTANDING.
And Larry, unfortunate but I'm sure you know, true, the more analytic types are outvoted. Society has already ruled, to listen is to demonstrate caring and respect. That's what is important. Not that your post be impeccable and well-defended. There is much to be said about adjustments from all sides, but for now, the burden is with you. Hey, my Dad was a physicist, he was the same way, I loved my Dad. That is quite apart from the fact *he* had to learn how to go along with common social behaviors. If he wanted to be liked and accepted, which he achieved.
Bob is not "the bad guy" here. He *is* the guy who regularly alienates and has driven away some of the most brilliant minds I've ever known. An unfortunate part of Aspergers is the inability to consider, to really in your heart consider, the other person's position. It's a neurological disability - that can be changed.
Many thoughts. I hope some prove useful.
Zo
poster:Zo
thread:248064
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20030508/msgs/249191.html