Posted by bleauberry on August 14, 2011, at 13:19:47
In reply to Feel crazy on antipsychotics!, posted by sheilac on August 14, 2011, at 12:23:51
Wow, I sure hear ya. That's my biggest problem with any new med or herb or supplement I try....getting trapped and it's hard to get out or know what to do. What an aweful place. I sure feel for you.
Well, since it has been good for your depression, at least that gives some hope that your brain is still capable of doing the job. The tricky part is figuring out how to tweek it similar to what geodon is doing, or to pinpoint the particular mechanism of geodon that is doing it.
I would guess the crazy bizarreness you are feeling is from the norepinephrine stimulation part of the med. It just sounds like being over-revved on adrenaline from within. Yeah? No? Maybe? I have often pondered that is maybe what is behind the akathisia associated with antipsychotics. I mean sure they block dopamine receptors and that is calming, they block serotonin receptors and that is calming, but they open up the flood gates for noradrenalin, which is manic-like, anxiety-like, nervous-like, or akathisia-like. Put it all together and that is one bizarre mix of emotions. What I experienced was that the dopamine and serotonin blocking would wear off, leaving all the excess NE completely unopposed.
I totally understand. In the latter stage of my years on zyprexa that happened to me. It was so calming and what a nice relief....I dosed it at 4pm, it kicked in by 6pm, nice smooth evening, great sleep, but oh my about 4am all hell broke loose....as if someone had shot adrenaline in my arm....and no amount of daytime zyprexa would make that go away. I literally had to burn off the excess noradrenalin through physical work or movement. It was a horrible, absolutely horrible, feeling. So I know it isn't helpful, but I just want you to know....been there done that it sucks!
I was thinking what would I do if I were in your shoes? Hmm. That is a tough one. For sure, no doubt, I would NOT be able to stay with it. I mean, even with the great antidepressant effect it has on you, the other crap is so bad as to not be able to function despite not being depressed. So what good is that? None. To me anyway. I mean, it is fairly predictable that even if geodon is a good antidepressant for you right now, it probably won't keep being that way in 2 years, 5 years, 7 years, whatever. So the last thing I want to do is get trapped even deeper in a hole because now I am not only on this bizarre med but also a couple others to deal with its side effects, and those themselves have their own side effects to compound my problems and they all mean I will have some bad withdrawals someday down the road. Just avoiding paying the price I will have to eventually pay, no escape.
But, that's just me. Someone else may feel differently. We all have to guide our own journeys.
The suggestion of abilify, well, I guess that kind of makes some sense. No way to tell without trying though. The hard thing about it is the dosing...akathisia/nervousness is common with it...more stimulating at lower doses...more calming at higher doses....but afraid to get trapped even deeper if it goes bad. Geez, I wish there was an easier way. Dang. I don't see, however, how abilify will dampen the excess norepinephrine stimulation, maybe make it worse.
The botanical route could be helpful, cheap, and easy. Much harder to get stuck in a 'trap'. For immediate help I would look at Lemon Balm tincture (not pills). Others that go good with it are PassionFlower and Valerian Root. There is a tea pretty good at this called Calm, made by Tazo. I think I got mine at Whole Foods Market.
Those will not stop the excess release of NE, but will dampen what has been released. To stop it, I would be thinking in terms of adaptogens, especially the more calming ones, such as Ashwaghanda.
I have seen some good things happen very frequently with Rhodiola, but never have I seen it combined with an AP so that is completely new territory to me. Maybe worth a look though. It's great for depression, more often than not, and at higher doses calming, primarily toning down excess NE.
And it might sound weird, but a NE reuptake inhibitor could help by bringing the feedback loops into play to act as governors preventing excess release. The only one I have personally experienced that can do that is milnacipran, but it comes with it about a week or so of worsened symptoms until the feedback loops kick in.
Until you can decide what to do, I would not hesitate to immediately seek some assistance from the plant medicines I mentioned. imo They all helped me through some really torturous times when I was on zyprexa. And actually, today, the botanical medicines I have pinpointed through trial and error that help me the most are outperforming any of the dozens of psych meds I ever took.
There is plenty of hope.
poster:bleauberry
thread:993742
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20110809/msgs/993763.html