Posted by Ron Hill on December 1, 2009, at 10:34:03
In reply to Re: Umm. Let's Not Ignore the Science, posted by SLS on December 1, 2009, at 6:29:01
Scott,
It is not my intent to imply that you must respond favorably to exercise. Different pts respond to differing tx's.
Further, it is certainly not my intent to question your ability to discern what works and what does not work for you as an individual. To the contrary; you are one of the best I know at being in tune with the effectiveness of various treatments and the degree that the tx's affect your well-being.
Instead, my only point is that, generally speaking, exercise can make positive measurable changes within the brain.
Scott, for the first time in the ten years that we have known each other, I clearly hurt your feelings. And, what hurts you hurts me.
{Ron is: boo-hoo, boo-hoo ... tears, tears}. But, you still love me like a brother, right?
-- Ron
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> Hi Ron.
>
> > I agree that the patient may be unable to exercise due to severe depression-induced anergy, amotivation, and anhedonia. However, let's not dismiss the fact that exercise improves brain functioning.
>
> This feels like someone is trying to force a sugar pill down my throat. Give me something that works for ME.
>
> What is so hard about acknowledging the fact that exercise will not benefit a sizable percentage of people who suffer from depression? Let's not extol the virtues of exercise on physical fitness. That is irrelevant to this discussion.
>
> Regarding BDNF, if it were simply a matter of increasing its production, the only drug that would ever be needed to treat MDD and BD is lithium. Unfortunately, things are more complicated than that. Whatever benefits you think exercise has on brain function are either missing the target or not robust enough. Personally, I think it misses the target in a large number of people.
>
> It is harmful when one person insists that another person is not experiencing what they "should" be, despite that person having met the criteria set by the first person.
>
> In 1982, some of the most progressive research psychiatrists in the world insisted that my ultra-rapid cycling was due to a variability in my processing of unidentified pscychological pathologies. I was incredulous that my treatment team was so blind, especially with Ronald R. Fieve's office door being located just down the hall. I had already tried psychotherapy for 6 years using 4 therapists. Then, imipramine showed me what consciousness is without depression. Fortunately, I didn't internalize my doctors' assertions that I was in need of more psychotherapy and that drug therapy was not indicated. If they only had opened their eyes and minds, they would have seen the striking regularity of my ultra-rapid cycling, and realized that they were looking at a biogenic affective illness. Fieve would have diagnosed me properly right away, but then I would have had to suffer through trials of rubidium. I knew.
>
> For people whose depressions are areactive to exercise, we know. We just know.
>
>
> - Scott
poster:Ron Hill
thread:926857
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20091127/msgs/927681.html