Posted by Larry Hoover on September 26, 2004, at 8:04:20
In reply to Re: What about Havarti?, posted by Ilene on September 25, 2004, at 21:01:32
> > > Can I add Havarti to the list? I recently had to put it out of sight when I had guests here. I would have loved to have been able to have some...
> > >
> > > gg
> >
> > This website says you could have had some....
> >
> > http://devweb3.vip.ohio-state.edu/Materials/PDFDocs/nut-diet/nut-other/low-tyr.pdf
> >
> > Lar
> >
> That website is wrong, wrong, wrong. I don't know whether it's wrong about Havarti, but it's wrong about yogurt, sour cream, and processed American cheese. All of those are okay to eat. I eat yogurt and American cheese regularly.I think the problem we're seeing here isn't one of foods themselves. We want to be able to form hard and fast rules to guide food selection. Unfortunately, Mother Nature does things differently.
Various microbes that can infect food will transform certain amino acids, among other molecules. Tyramine is an amino acid byproduct. Those transformations will often produce intensely flavoured foods. When the infecting microbe is well-chosen, the resultant food will be highly sought after. Consider the difference between authentic Parmesan and the grey sodden smelly mass that forms on too long refrigerated cottage cheese. Which one is the appetizing one? But Parmesan takes much longer to produce, because the microbes tranforming it are rather slow workers. Really, Parmesan is a fluke of nature. Cheesemakers in Parma got lucky that the local microbes imparted a special je ne sais quoi to their cheese while in storage. If it had spoiled instead, those cheesemakers would have become carpenters or something else. Ya know?
In reading the literature that I have been able to access, I see that food products that we call by a particular name (e.g. mozzarella cheese, or tofu) may have substantially different chemical characteristics. Tofu that has aged as little as nine days may have huge tyramine content, whereas fresh tofu would likely have none. It all depends on those little microbe fellas, which are in the air, on surfaces, on our skin, in our breath.....just waiting to land on moist nutritious surfaces.....food. Even the same company's mozzarella might vary over time, let alone vary when compared to the stuff made across town.
I think that a dangerous attitude may develop if one presumes that e.g. "American cheese" is ALWAYS safe. Your next slice may have been colonized by tyramine-producing critters. One reference described "air-dried sausage" as having extreme tyramine content. Well, pepperoni is supposed to be an air-dried sausage, as is salami, summer sausage, and so on. That doesn't mean that modern food production techniques will prevent tyramine formation, but based on the recent analyses, it looks like that particular character is largely blocked. What happens if you get a couple pieces of real pepperoni on a pizza, and it happens to also have some mozzarella which was grated on a less than perfectly clean grater, and held for a couple of days before use?
Anybody using Nardil or Parnate or any other drug associated with tyramine restriction should become fully aware of the symptoms of hypertensive crisis, and should carry medication to forestall the most serious effects of hypertensive crisis while seeking emergency care.
Relying solely on the selection of food types is foolhardy. One paper I read mentioned that certain soy sauces are very high in tyramine. I know for a fact that soy sauce is added to restaurant foods, particularly sauces, without that fact being disclosed. All it takes is a few miligrams of tyramine. Eating something once without adverse effects is not a guarantee that eating it again will lead to the same result.
So, caution is always warranted. Recognizing where the risks are most likely to be found is only part of the puzzle. Being prepared for the surprises is the other part.
Individual differences in tyramine sensitivity are also confusing the risk assessment. I know a guy on Parnate who eats old cheddar. He gets a buzz, but he likes that buzz. The same behaviour would kill someone else, though. What works for you applies only to you.
Lar
poster:Larry Hoover
thread:394544
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20040921/msgs/395210.html