Posted by rod on August 30, 2003, at 20:57:20
In reply to ROD, temp. lobe, SSRIs worse, anticonvulsants, posted by McPac on August 29, 2003, at 21:06:44
Hi McPac,
> "He is saying, that people with temporal lobe hypo/hyper perfusion, often get significantly worse on serotonergic drugs like the SSRIs. (I do)"
>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Rod. Rod, when you say that the SSRI's make you worse---worse in what way?At the beginning, they make depression worse, much worse. They cause something like an artificial drug inuced depression and also makes me suicidal (I am and never was suicidal without drugs)
They increase anxiety, nervousness, cause insomnia, weight loss, hair loss, ejaculation delay (60min and sometimes impossible), agitation, irritability and bann my emotions. Its like they induce something comparable to the negative symptoms of schizophrenia. (ssri apathy etc...). They just disable me. It might sound strange, but they do a mood-lift on the long term. But it seems they activate exclusively the "mood center" of my brain, while they make the rest worse. Sounds a bit strange, but thats the way I experience it.
> The ssri's (although they work well for me as far as mood-lift, anti-ocd...they have the TERRIBLE effect of causing VERY much anger/agitation/irritability in me......I have little (no) doubt that I have temporal lobe problems which are the reason for this. In Dr. Amen's book (which I read before and was just flipping through today), I could not find what meds he uses to 'counter' that effect, though I'm fairly certain he uses the anti-convulsants (like Depakote, Tegretol) or a mood stabilizer (like lithium) in many cases. (What's ironic about my seeing your post just now is that earlier today I was talking to someone at Dr. Amen's clinic for a while on the phone). The lady I spoke with said that they (Dr. Amen) are the ONLY ones doing the SPECT testing for psychiatric purposes (that seemed odd to me...why couldn't other dr's do it too I thought?). Obviously you are seeing a dr who is having your tests done and evaluating your results....you're not doing that in conjunction w/ Dr. Amen are you?
No, I live in europe. Its not a routine test for psychiatric purposes, where I am. I am just treatment resistant depressed and also fulfill many other diagnostic criteria for other conditions. I also have a high score in a subsyndromal epilepsy evaluation etc. Hypoperfusion is one cause of epileptic discarges (especially temporal lobe). I talked to him about all this, and he agreed to make a Spect, to exclude temporal hypoperfusion as *the* root of all evil. He is not evaluating my results. The results doesnt mention anything about psychiatric conditions (conclusions). It just describes my perfusion situation of my brain in the different regions. My doctor knows too little about underlying neurological diseases, so he is sending me to a neurologist, to find out, why there is significant hypoperfusion. If the whole left part of my brain does not get enough blood, I guess there is a medical problem, rather than a psychological.
>She definitely made it sound like only they could properly evaluate the SPECT results for psychiatric problems.I guess thats right. Dr. Amen just has a huge collection of spect pictures, and is able to compare the patterns, in my opinion. My doctor does not use Spect images as a diagnostic tool, to differentiate between different psychiatric conditions. There is also a letter from the doctor included, who did the medical evaluation (just about perfusion). I dont know this doctor and its unimportant. They do this for stroke patients, vascular dementia... Thats their job. just about perfusion, listing brain regions etc.
>Also, regarding this, "There are 2 case reports with this "subtype". They were helped with Lamictal and Tegretol. huh? Wasnt he talking about the GABAergic drugs like gabapentin or divalproate. Tegretol works a little on GABA, but Lamictal does quite nothing on GABA." Did you ever figure this out?As far as I remember there is a study at pubmed, saying lamictal actually is reducing gabaergic neurotransmission.
>What strikes me is that I tried Lamictal---it made me TERRIBLY angry! Again, no doubt, because of the temporal lobe problem. So I too, like you, am wondering about Lamictal in that scenario.
Yes, thats true. I am actually taking Lamictal and was taking it while I did the Spect. So I guess it does not correct such a condition very well, at least for me. Or even created ? But I dont think so...
But in general, Lamictal is working not bad for me. Still far away from remission, but a bit better.>I'd LOVE to get and get this SPECT testing done---if you know of various locations where this is offered, or how I can find SPECT centers to have this done, please let me know. I know Doc Amen can't be the ONLY doc around capable of interpreting the results for psych patients...despite what his co-worker said.
> Were you pleased with your doc's findings and evaluation? Have the results helped you? THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>I somehow feel mental relief, because I gained much info and hope to be on the road to remission. If I look at the symptoms about brain damage of specific regions and their psychological and neurological symptoms, i just can smile.. I have ALL symptoms of left (left temporal lobe, left frontal lobe, left parietel, left occiptal etc.) brain dysfunction. Things like "pseudo depression", impairment of calculating (its qiute easy to betray me. I often cant calculate how much money i get back from the cashier in a shop), attention abnoramlities , problems distincting left from right (I sometimes have this, especially east and west), difficulty with writing (I have a very vary bad handwriting) and so on...
The "skills" of the right parts are quite good (word recall (ok, not in english I guess ;-), musical memory, ...)
I did not mention most of these symptoms to my doc before. But now, that I have my results, I'm quite happy, because I fit every symptom of left side dysfunction (with varying severity of course), and not right side. I finally fit something very well...>"because I get my results of a HMPAO-Spect (brain perfusion)"
>>>>>>> Rod, is this the exact same type of SPECT test that Dr. Amen would perform...or is this a different version? Thanks!
I dont know. There are two different types (I guess there are just 2 different "tracer" substances). I was once reading, he also used this (HMPAO) in some of his studies. Or at least mentioned the substance in the abstract of the study. I think his web pages tells more about this.
good luck, in whatever you do
Roland
poster:rod
thread:255193
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030828/msgs/255779.html