Posted by mattdds on April 18, 2003, at 15:31:03
In reply to To Mattdds, posted by glenn on April 17, 2003, at 16:46:40
Glenn,
For me it is the same way. Feelings *seem* to come first, preceeding my *awareness* of what I am thinking. It takes a while to learn to get that awareness. The interaction between cognitions and emotions is definitely not a one way street. Feelings can sometimes preceed the *awareness* of cognitions, especially after depression has become chronic. Then depressive feelings can certainly come spontaneously. Have you ever been doing something, and realize you are well along a train of thought that you didn't even realize you were on? Most of the time, we aren't even aware of what we are thinking. And one should not conclude that since feelings seem to come first, that therefore cognitive therapy will not work for them. I don't think people are wired as differently as you might think. One of the core aspects of depression is that we believe we are somehow defective (e.g., my brain works SO much differently than "normal" people). Don't fall for that trap, as it serves you no advantage to believe that.
Take me for example. I used to never know what I was depressed / anxious / worried / panicky about. There were never any major problems that I would get worried about. Just a sort of nebulous cloud of worry.
So, again, it is not only:
Cognition ------> emotion
But much more like:Cognition <-----> emotion
It works both ways; it's a reciprocating relationship. CBT makes the big deal about the cognitions because we can to some degree control that variable. We can influence our beliefs and thoughts throught conscious effort, but we cannot directly change our feelings, or none of us would be sick. That is the whole point!
Did you do the exercises in CBT? Or did you just show up to the therapy sessions? There have been good studies done that show that mood improvement is directly correlated with the amount of homework done in CBT(causally related, as in it was shown that homework was *causing* the improvement, not just an association between the two).
In CBT, you describe the event that is upsetting you, when it happened, who you were with, etc. Describe the emotions that you were having. This applies even to you when you said that the only thing upsetting you was your mood! So use your *MOOD* as the upsetting event. So, a brief example:
Upsetting event: my mood is low, I feel depressed for no apparent reason.
Emotions: depression (90%)
Automatic Thoughts:
1. I will never get better
2. This CBT will never work on my, I'm different
3. I am biologically programmed to be depressed
4. There is nothing I can do to make myself feel better.
5. I have always felt depressed, I never feel right.Do you see how these thoughts could perpetuate the cycle, or become self-fulfilling prophecies? So sometimes your automatic thoughts that need to be straightened out are *concerning* your mood! Does that make sense? I had the same stumbling block as you, but realized I could apply this method to any upsetting experience in life, including apparently random mood dips.
I reached a point where I carried distorted beliefs about depression and anxiety, e.g.:
1. I will not be able to finish dental school because I am depressed
2. I will probably commit suicide
3. My wife is going to leave me (because I'm depressed)
4. I will never be able to work (again, because of the depression)These were just a few of the core beliefs that I had to work on.
In short, cognitions about moods themselves can feed the cycle of depression.
Does any of this make sense?
Thanks,
Matt
poster:mattdds
thread:220143
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030417/msgs/220421.html