Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 1113893

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Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 8, 2021, at 6:38:08

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2021, at 5:30:18

Yeah, but what if we germans turn the other cheek to our government? We will still have to do social distancing in 5 years.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2021, at 7:18:38

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on March 8, 2021, at 6:38:08

> Yeah, but what if we germans turn the other cheek to our government? We will still have to do social distancing in 5 years.
>

I didn't understand that.

-undopaminergic

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 8, 2021, at 12:10:57

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by undopaminergic on March 8, 2021, at 7:18:38

The corona management is very poor in Germany. First, no masks, then no vaccinations and now no quick tests. The government is failing all the time.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis...

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 2:45:39

In reply to I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by jay2112 on February 26, 2021, at 0:31:43

Ok, suicidal crisis. I would strongly recommend Lithium as a supplement!!! There is no harm in trying. At least not with a low dose. Even if you are not at risk of doing it, these thoughts really hurt!

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis...

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 2:47:27

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis..., posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 2:45:39

I would try for a week or two. For me the effect was quicker, but you never know

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis... Lamdage22

Posted by jay2112 on March 11, 2021, at 4:51:25

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis..., posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 2:45:39

> Ok, suicidal crisis. I would strongly recommend Lithium as a supplement!!! There is no harm in trying. At least not with a low dose. Even if you are not at risk of doing it, these thoughts really hurt!

I tried all doses of lithium, on it's own..etc...and it is hit and miss...one day works...next week blah. And, it KILLS my stomach!! I end up vomiting blood, almost EVERYTIME I take it..with/without food, with gravol/drammamine, ginger...nothing stops it!!

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis...

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 7:07:02

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis... Lamdage22, posted by jay2112 on March 11, 2021, at 4:51:25

Oh... so you didnt feel less suicidal? Nothing works for everybody unfortunately. It is a tough feeling, but hang in there. I got over it for the most part. What other avenues are you working on?

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis...

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 7:10:50

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis..., posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 7:07:02

How is your nutrition? Sun exposure? Sometimes when nothing works the culprit is a lack (or less often an excess) of nutrients. Even with a normal diet.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis...

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 12, 2021, at 2:13:34

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis..., posted by Lamdage22 on March 11, 2021, at 7:10:50

You can't fix a lack of certain nutrients with meds. Not long term. And it is more prevalent than most people think, especially if you are not healthy. Clearly, depression usually leads to an unhealthy lifestyle, which worsens the problem even more.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea jay2112

Posted by SLS on April 6, 2021, at 16:53:57

In reply to I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by jay2112 on February 26, 2021, at 0:31:43

> Warning...SI
>
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> Hi folks...I lost my little dog a week or so ago. I had told myself, once he goes, I am going too. I had enough of this life.. :( I have been coping bad...taking handfulls of Tylenol 3's, and handfulls of Lytica (mood stabalizer....feels good in high doses. O just want to kill the pain...too much damn life and death!!! Bit, I am going to the rehab clinic and going on Suboxone. Then I am going to get a kitten....then maybe a part-time jib. These are the bare threads I am hanging onto. I am 51...it's harder as you get o;der. Am I on the right track? Onr day at a time, and baby-steps? I lost a girlfriend, child, best friend (suicide) and then my parents 7 years ago.
>
> Jay (deeply, deeply, sad....)

First of all, you should look at what you have already experienced. If you have ever been in this suicidal state before, then you know, one way or another, the worst of it will pass. Hopefully, you won't feel yourself being drawn towards suicide anymore. It will pass, I guarantee it. You might still feel crappy, but for now, crappy is better than feeling that suicide is inevitable. It's not. Try to keep your anxiety level as low as possible. Maybe you can figure out what thoughts are best to avoid or not take seriously. Avoid anxiety and thoughts that overwhelm you. Do things that either distract you from your negative thoughts or that genuinely put a smile on your face.

Easier said than done! I've done it, though.

Zyprexa, in my silly opinion, can be used as an emergency anti-suicide drug, but use it as a very temporary treatment strategy.


- Scott

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 22, 2021, at 10:02:21

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea jay2112, posted by SLS on April 6, 2021, at 16:53:57

That sounds much more positive now. Glad you are better, SLS! I agree with you, it does pass.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 23, 2021, at 2:46:57

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea jay2112, posted by SLS on April 6, 2021, at 16:53:57

Not sure, avoiding bad thoughts can make them haunt you subconsciously. Of course you mustn't dwell on them, but yeah, there are different strategies. Psychologists argue about them. There is no one size fits all. I would find somebody to talk about those thoughts, if you can.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea Lamdage22

Posted by SLS on April 28, 2021, at 12:59:59

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 23, 2021, at 2:46:57

> Not sure, avoiding bad thoughts can make them haunt you subconsciously. Of course you mustn't dwell on them, but yeah, there are different strategies. Psychologists argue about them. There is no one size fits all. I would find somebody to talk about those thoughts, if you can.


Hi, Lambage22.

I have been away because I am feeling better. I'll come on the board soon and catch up.

I am most impressed with your thinking and writing. Do you feel that you are progressing as a human being? It seems that way to me.


- Scott

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 28, 2021, at 21:38:24

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea Lamdage22, posted by SLS on April 28, 2021, at 12:59:59

Hey Scott,

that is awesome. You sounded so hopeless not that long ago. Yeah I guess you could say that I am making progress. Thanks. What really helps is having a psychologist with whom I can about what truly occupies my mind. I found I can't do that with CBT Therapists. They always changed the subject. Not sure if it is safe to say that all CBT Therapists here are that way.

And if I want to improve something biologically, I am looking almost exclusively at alternative treatments. I haven't changed meds since 2016. And made the most progress ever in those 5 years. In 2016 Trazodone was added, but it pooped out partially. Think I started supplementing in 2018. Found out I had deficiencies.

Everyones way to better health is different. What do you think made you better now?

> Hi, Lambage22.
>
> I have been away because I am feeling better. I'll come on the board soon and catch up.
>
> I am most impressed with your thinking and writing. Do you feel that you are progressing as a human being? It seems that way to me.
>
>
> - Scott
>
>
>
>

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 28, 2021, at 21:49:28

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 28, 2021, at 21:38:24

"Nothing will ever make me better" is almost certainly an illusion.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by undopaminergic on April 29, 2021, at 0:15:23

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 28, 2021, at 21:38:24

> What really helps is having a psychologist with whom I can about what truly occupies my mind. I found I can't do that with CBT Therapists. They always changed the subject. Not sure if it is safe to say that all CBT Therapists here are that way.
>

So, what kind of therapy are you getting now instead of CBT?

-undopaminergic

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 29, 2021, at 1:40:45

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by undopaminergic on April 29, 2021, at 0:15:23

Analytic therapy. It is not to say we never talk about behavior though. It is just not focused on that as much as CBT would be. There is a couch to lie on, but I don't use it :)

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by undopaminergic on April 29, 2021, at 10:52:10

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 29, 2021, at 1:40:45

> Analytic therapy. It is not to say we never talk about behavior though. It is just not focused on that as much as CBT would be. There is a couch to lie on, but I don't use it :)
>

I'm of an analytic orientation myself, but have been experimenting with behavioral approaches recently. In my opinion, it is really just a way of getting to the psyche indirectly through analysing and shaping behaviour. I guess the main advantage is that it can be much easier than finding an effective direct psychodynamic approach. I recently discovered that it does not have to be aversive at all; indeed, using purely positive reinforcement (immediate reward of desired behaviours) can be more effective!

For more information, I recommend the book "Don't Shoot the Dog!" by Karen Pryor.

I tried using nicotine spray as the reinforcer, but I've moved mostly to xylitol tablets, as it is easier to time the delivery of the reward accurately (this is *key*!), and also nicotine is overkill; there are reasons to use the smallest reward you can "get away" with.

Rewarding myself in connection (best simultaneously) with desired behaviours, I've been able to "train" myself to get out of bed more. I'm now trying to tackle the apathy, by reinforcing desired (non-apathetic) thought patterns and emotions.

-undopaminergic

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 29, 2021, at 10:58:15

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by undopaminergic on April 29, 2021, at 10:52:10

Right, in analytic therapy you'd have to come up with stuff like that yourself. You can talk about it with your therapist, but he won't say "do this, do that". It relies on your own wisdom and he/she seeks to nurture it through conversation without telling you what to do and how to think.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on April 30, 2021, at 4:13:21

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 29, 2021, at 10:58:15

I am confident that most people here can come up with that stuff themselves. And I don't think that most analytical therapists would say "Hey, but that is CBT, I won't do it with you". They know a thing or two about CBT as well.

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by undopaminergic on April 30, 2021, at 6:57:29

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 30, 2021, at 4:13:21

> I am confident that most people here can come up with that stuff themselves.

I'm afraid not... it took me all these years, until recently. That is even though I had met CBT-ish therapists. One of them told me about positive thinking, and that has helped me, but one of them also wanted me to do things that I couldn't due to apathy.

> And I don't think that most analytical therapists would say "Hey, but that is CBT, I won't do it with you". They know a thing or two about CBT as well.
>

Right.

-undopaminergic

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by undopaminergic on April 30, 2021, at 7:00:23

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by undopaminergic on April 30, 2021, at 6:57:29

I was at first inspired by the "conditioned place preference" I had read about in neuroscience articles. For those who aren't familiar with that term, animals, including rodents, learn to prefer a particular place where they had previously received rewarding drugs, such as cocaine.

-undopaminergic

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea Lamdage22

Posted by SLS on April 30, 2021, at 16:45:22

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on April 28, 2021, at 21:38:24

> Hey Scott,
>
> that is awesome. You sounded so hopeless not that long ago. Yeah I guess you could say that I am making progress. Thanks. What really helps is having a psychologist with whom I can about what truly occupies my mind. I found I can't do that with CBT Therapists. They always changed the subject. Not sure if it is safe to say that all CBT Therapists here are that way.
>
> And if I want to improve something biologically, I am looking almost exclusively at alternative treatments. I haven't changed meds since 2016. And made the most progress ever in those 5 years. In 2016 Trazodone was added, but it pooped out partially. Think I started supplementing in 2018. Found out I had deficiencies.
>
> Everyones way to better health is different. What do you think made you better now?

I decided to add Nardil 90 mg/day. I almost went back to Parnate, which is of only limited benefit.

So, this is what I am taking right now:

Nardil 90 mg/day
nortriptyline 100 mg/day
Lamictal 300 mg/day
lithium 300 mg/day

I need someone to slap me upside the head. I had reached 90 mg/day, and stayed there for 2 months. I had a bumpy ride, but the net trajectory was upward. Then I had smart/dumb idea. If 90 mg/day gave me a bumpy ride, maybe I should take more. So, I raised the dosage to 105 mg/day. I received an immediate robust improvement. It took less that 3 hours to respond to the dosage increase. After a few days, I began to feel crappy, so I raised the dosage again. I played with the Nardil dosage up and down for 3 months. I didn't think that there was a dosage window for Nardil. I never saw it in the literature, and no doctor ever mentioned such a dosage-response curve. In other words, 75 mg/day was too little and 105 mg/day was too much to maintain a persistent improvement. I am still experiencing mood shifts every few days, but they they are less frequent and less severe. My doctor said it might take a year from beginning Nardil for me to come close to remission. I wasted three of those months.

Be careful with Nardil. For me, it cannot be used with the notion that you can take as much as you can tolerate the side effects. My intuitive guess is that the brain needs to do some of the work. Otherwise, the signal-to-noise ratio might decrease, and the response lost. Who knows?

Treatment response:

The best way I can describe my experience is to use The Wizard of Oz as a metaphor. Of course, the movie starts out in black-and-white. Everything is a drab and dirty gray. The farm is depressing. Ominous clouds fill the sky and a tornado drops down to the ground in the distance. Without warning, the house is hit by the tornado and is carried upwards into the sky. When the house finally lands abruptly, Dorothy grabs her dog, Toto, and heads for the black-and-white front door. When she opens it, the world explodes in Technicolor.

That's the way it has always been with me, especially when I would respond to a tricyclic for three consecutive days two weeks after starting to take it. That was my pattern early in my treatment history.

>
> > Hi, Lambage22.
> >
> > I have been away because I am feeling better. I'll come on the board soon and catch up.
> >
> > I am most impressed with your thinking and writing. Do you feel that you are progressing as a human being? It seems that way to me.
> >
> >
> > - Scott
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on May 1, 2021, at 1:03:52

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea Lamdage22, posted by SLS on April 30, 2021, at 16:45:22

You can probably get some more mileage out of Nutrients if you don't improve enough with Meds. Im not sure if this is the exact book that I have since I have a German one, but thee guys are pretty good. Certainly, if you use substances that the body has known from day 1, you won't fall into as deep of a hole if it is not the right substance for you. You will feel well again after 1 day, two days tops. Are you on any supplements?

https://www.amazon.com/-/de/dp/B011DCAV3O/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?__mk_de_DE=M&dchild=1&keywords=burgerstein+schurgast+zimmermann&qid=1619848720&sr=8-1-fkmr0

 

Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea

Posted by Lamdage22 on May 1, 2021, at 1:05:53

In reply to Re: I am going through a suicidal crisis....help, plea, posted by Lamdage22 on May 1, 2021, at 1:03:52

It is the english version. It is quite comprehensive. Take a free peek if you like.

> You can probably get some more mileage out of Nutrients if you don't improve enough with Meds. Im not sure if this is the exact book that I have since I have a German one, but thee guys are pretty good. Certainly, if you use substances that the body has known from day 1, you won't fall into as deep of a hole if it is not the right substance for you. You will feel well again after 1 day, two days tops. Are you on any supplements?
>
> https://www.amazon.com/-/de/dp/B011DCAV3O/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1?__mk_de_DE=M&dchild=1&keywords=burgerstein+schurgast+zimmermann&qid=1619848720&sr=8-1-fkmr0


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