Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 918799

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Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath

Posted by number42 on September 28, 2009, at 14:30:25

In reply to wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by Sunbath on September 28, 2009, at 9:12:17

> sorry, I know this question has been asked numerous times, but I just cannot remember any straight answer.
> Will this pass (if when) or persist?I mean this tiredness that starts a few hours after taking parnate.
> Anyone also remembers being slightly nauseous on parnate at the beginning (probably it's not the parnate but I dunno)?
>
> Thanks!

i wish i could be more encouraging, but for me it was very energizing after about 10 days. Then it quit working after about 2.5 mos. But, everyone's different...hang in there.

#42

 

fatique number42

Posted by Sunbath on September 29, 2009, at 1:54:00

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by number42 on September 28, 2009, at 14:30:25

Hi #42, thanks for answering!
I also notice an activating effect, especially in the morning after waking. This is pleasant so far.

But after 2-3 hours the daytime sleepiness begins, which is sad :(

Did you also experience this in the first days?
I'd really like to know if this is going to subside as my brain adjusts to it.

 

Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath

Posted by Girlnterrupted78 on September 29, 2009, at 13:43:54

In reply to wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by Sunbath on September 28, 2009, at 9:12:17

In my experience, the exhaustion did actually subside. I remember the first weeks I was exhausted pretty much all the time, but now I only start to feel that exhaustion at about 11pm, and I'm ok during the day.

Of course, this is only one person's experience, so I cannot assure anything, but that's how it worked for me.

In fact, now it's kind of the opposite. I have severe insomnia (I've had it for 10 years, so it's not because of Parnate) but the difference is that before Parnate, I'd just crash every evening and sleep an insane amount of hours until I woke up feeling sick of sleeping.

On Parnate, even if I don't sleep at all at night, I don't need to sleep during the day. I just keep going about my day, and although I do feel that sleepy feeling throughout the day, I have this strong drive to just keep going. I guess that must be Parnate, cause it never happened before.

I wish you luck. Parnate has been working wonderful for me so far, and I'm very happy with it. I hope it works for you as well.

 

Re: wow am I tired... Girlnterrupted78

Posted by Sunbath on September 30, 2009, at 10:00:16

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by Girlnterrupted78 on September 29, 2009, at 13:43:54

Thank you very very much GirInterrupted!
I already feared it could be some bad reaction meaning I'd have to stop it..
Now this is encouraging..

so the sleepiness changed to energy/motivation? And you don't need provigil or anything to fight the fatigue?

Did you find the exhaustion to be dose dependent?
Or could you then -once the sleepiness wore off- increase the dose without being deadly tired again the next following weeks?
I ask because I don't know whether I should stick with only 10mg for awhile and wait it out, or if I should increase the dose further (maybe a higher dose would be more activating?)..
If this strange fatigue would reappear after each dose increase, it would take ages to reach a therapeutic level I guess..

Your insomnia problem sounds horrible! What do you take at night to help you sleep?

Thanks and good luck to you too it's soo great that Parnate is helping you!!!

 

Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath

Posted by delna on October 1, 2009, at 10:44:51

In reply to wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by Sunbath on September 28, 2009, at 9:12:17

Do let me know how it goes.
Started parnate last night at 10mg and JUST managed to wake up (9pm )
Good luck
hope the sleepiness goes...
D

 

Re: wow am I tired... delna

Posted by Sunbath on October 1, 2009, at 11:05:03

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by delna on October 1, 2009, at 10:44:51

Hi,

thanks! You say you started it at night? Did you sleep well?
Are you tired during the day?
I met with my pdoc today and she suggested trying taking it at night if it was making me that tired..
I will try that out the next days..

Good luck to you too and please also keep me updated :)

 

Re: wow am I tired...

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 1, 2009, at 14:29:30

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... delna, posted by Sunbath on October 1, 2009, at 11:05:03

Hi Sunbath and Delna:

I took 40mg Parnate at 5:pm last night and another 30mg Parnate plus 25mg Nortriptyline at 9:30pm and I slept like a baby! Didn't wake up. Slept until 9am which is longer than I like, but felt good! Amazing.
I still have to take provigil as well, but altogether it is working great! I'm feeling really good!!
I'm still going to ask my pdoc if I can take it all at night.

Delna, I was so tired the first month or so, all day long, that it was misery. But well worth it now.

Good luck to you both!!!

Gayle

 

Re: wow am I tired... ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by Sunbath on October 1, 2009, at 15:16:53

In reply to Re: wow am I tired..., posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 1, 2009, at 14:29:30

Glad to have you back doing so fine Gayle!!
And thanks very much for the info!
I'll try the same tomorrow.

When you said you were tired the whole first month.. was this despite taking the Provigil?Or did you start the Provigil later? Was the tiredness dose dependent (did it return when you increased the dose after this first month) or not?


Sorry to pester you so much with questions, but I'm sooo curious :)

Thanks and good luck!!

 

Re: wow am I tired... ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 1, 2009, at 22:22:51

In reply to Re: wow am I tired..., posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 1, 2009, at 14:29:30

Hi Sunbath:

I got off to a rocky start with Parnate because of my fear of insomnia on Parnate. What a joke that turned out to be for me!!
My pdoc had me start a TCA when I was coming off my other meds and doing the washout. I suggested amytriptyline because I wanted to sleep well. Amytript. always gives me a fabulous sleep that I can count on. Parnate made me sleepy from the get-go. But I was so jacked up with other stuff going on during the day, always including terrible fatigue, it was hard for me to sort it out. Scott suggested early on that I trade amytrip. for nortript. at night, but I was afraid of not sleeping, so I dragged my heels for a long long time.....so exhausted....Finally I got off amytrip. onto nortript. and it was immediately "the bomb" I felt so good! And the nortrip. has mostly been a fine sleep aid at night. (I wonder if it still will be if I take 70mg Parnate at night. We'll see.)

But still some residual fatigue . So my pdoc added Provigil and that seems to have done the trick. I didn't take the full amount of Provigil until recently because of the cost. But I'm on the whole 200mg now and feeling good.

I still have ups and downs with the Parnate, but mostly feel good and "gooder"........Certainly better than I have felt on any other meds for the last 15 years. I do feel, occasionally, that those other meds are still washing out of my system, bringing feelings up with them, which is probably a good thing.

Fatigue has always been a major piece of my depression and the hardest thing to treat. So it was probably predictable that Parnate would give me fatigue. I think it's very common. I do think it gets better with time, as does Parnate generally. My pdoc had me promise to take it for at least 6 months and now I know why. It gets better and better. I'm very glad, for myself, that I didn't give up on it. When I was younger I probably would have, and then ended up back to it at some point.
Oh, and no sex problems or weight gain...that's a plus!

I hope all this info helps!!!

If you have any more specific questions let me know.

Best,

Gayle

 

Re: wow am I tired... ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by Phillipa on October 2, 2009, at 14:12:17

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... ColoradoSnowflake, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 1, 2009, at 22:22:51

Gayle still doing well on the parnate? Phillipa

 

Re: wow am I tired... ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by Sunbath on October 3, 2009, at 2:40:50

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... ColoradoSnowflake, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 1, 2009, at 22:22:51

Thank you Parnate-Queen :)

Amazing that it still continues to improve for you.
Did you try taking the whole dose at night yet? I tried 10mg in the morning and 10mg 2hours before going to sleep 2 days before and I slept very poorly :( Maybe this was coincidence though as that night was unexpectedly warm and I woke up sweating all the time. I will try it again today!
The acute effects Parnate is giving me are really strange and paradoxical. It kinda dampens my thinking wich is pleasant and unpleasant the same time :) I'm much less ruminating over stupid things and I feel really calm. When this is over, about 8hours later I feel motivated and clear headed. Also when I wake up in the morning I feel I'm quite activated and even agitated. The energy I get is really much appreciated! Why are those effects so different? Can't imagine the noradrenaline releasing effect of acute Parnate is causing this strange calmness and tiredness?
Do you notice something similar? 2 very distinct effects?

Have a nice weekend!!

 

Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath

Posted by delna on October 3, 2009, at 3:47:27

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... delna, posted by Sunbath on October 1, 2009, at 11:05:03

> Hi,
>
> thanks! You say you started it at night? Did you sleep well?
> Are you tired during the day?
> I met with my pdoc today and she suggested trying taking it at night if it was making me that tired..
> I will try that out the next days..
>
> Good luck to you too and please also keep me updated :)
>

Hi
Hope you are feeling better.
No I am not sleeping well at all. I take Klonopin 2mg anyway to sleep but my sleep has been disturbed and restless.
The daytime sedation is ridiculous and today I have taken 200mg Provigil (having woken up at 1pm.
The doctor says it will get better and perhaps so at a higher dose like 30mg.
I'm giving it a fair shot because I have limited choices.
Keep me posted
TC
D

 

being 'out of it' Sunbath

Posted by Sunbath on October 3, 2009, at 3:49:32

In reply to MAOI Diet, posted by Sunbath on September 28, 2009, at 5:43:50

The effect I get for some hours from parnate after each dose has changed a bit. Now I don't exactly feel tired anymore, but still a bit "foggy", although this "brain fog" doesn't feel the same and maybe isn't as sever as the brain fog caused by other meds. It's characterized by difficulty concentrating, bad attentiveness and feeling introverted.

Is this a normal side effect from Parnate which does fade over time?I'm a bit worried..
University already started and it's really troublesome staying focused and behaving normally. For example people sitting besides myself are sometimes making jokes and I don't even notice it or don't get it.


Thanks very much for some info from you parnate veterans, sorry for so much questions!

 

Re: wow am I tired... delna

Posted by Sunbath on October 3, 2009, at 4:01:50

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath, posted by delna on October 3, 2009, at 3:47:27

Hi Delna,

sorry to hear about your insomnia :(
So you sleep till 1pm?Is this because you wake so often?
What about a sedating serotonin antagonist that could help you sleep?Maybe this would work better than a benzo as ColoradoSnowflake with Nortriptyline and me taking Trazodone aren't experiencing any insomnia? Did you or your doc think of something like that?Also did you start right away with taking parnate at night?Maybe it would be better for you to take it in the morning as recommended "officially"?I still don't know whether I can take it at night or not.. the first night trying that wasn't good at all..
I'd be very interested which side effect your doctor suggested might get better with higher dosages: The daytime sedation or the insomnia (sorry didn't get it :) )?

Thanks very much! Good luck to you, I really hope your insomnia will get better and please keep me updated too :)

 

Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath

Posted by delna on October 3, 2009, at 4:24:01

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... delna, posted by Sunbath on October 3, 2009, at 4:01:50

> Hi Delna,
>
> sorry to hear about your insomnia :(
> So you sleep till 1pm?Is this because you wake so often?
> What about a sedating serotonin antagonist that could help you sleep?Maybe this would work better than a benzo as ColoradoSnowflake with Nortriptyline and me taking Trazodone aren't experiencing any insomnia? Did you or your doc think of something like that?Also did you start right away with taking parnate at night?Maybe it would be better for you to take it in the morning as recommended "officially"?I still don't know whether I can take it at night or not.. the first night trying that wasn't good at all..
> I'd be very interested which side effect your doctor suggested might get better with higher dosages: The daytime sedation or the insomnia (sorry didn't get it :) )?
>
> Thanks very much! Good luck to you, I really hope your insomnia will get better and please keep me updated too :)

Hi
He thinks the tiredness will get better because it will start becoming activating. Not sure if I believe him though.

PS:
I think my sleep is just screwed up at the moment because of this drug- I don't think I need any sedatives to sleep. Plus when you sleep all day, sleeping at night is not so easy however much you are sedated.

Let me know your status. This seems like a hard drug to take.
TC
D

 

Re: being 'out of it' Sunbath

Posted by delna on October 3, 2009, at 10:05:10

In reply to being 'out of it' Sunbath, posted by Sunbath on October 3, 2009, at 3:49:32

> The effect I get for some hours from parnate after each dose has changed a bit. Now I don't exactly feel tired anymore, but still a bit "foggy", although this "brain fog" doesn't feel the same and maybe isn't as sever as the brain fog caused by other meds. It's characterized by difficulty concentrating, bad attentiveness and feeling introverted.
>
> Is this a normal side effect from Parnate which does fade over time?I'm a bit worried..
> University already started and it's really troublesome staying focused and behaving normally. For example people sitting besides myself are sometimes making jokes and I don't even notice it or don't get it.
>
>
> Thanks very much for some info from you parnate veterans, sorry for so much questions!


Sunbath,
I woke up at 1 today and took 2 provigils and I am really stimulated
(normally I take 4 Provigils + 2 Wellbutrins and am still like a dead duck)
This is a really sudden and strange thing since as you know I have been complaining about sedation. Lets hope this is not temporary.
I know you are meant to take it in the day but last time I tried Parnate I took it in the day and after 4-5 doses quit because i couldn't take the afternoon fatigue.
Why not try taking it at night- especially since it is not yet having a stimulating effect on you. I can imagine trying to be at college in a zombie state. Maybe take Provigil early in the morning (are you on that at all??)
I'll keep u updated. What dose are you up to so far?
Keep me updated
Love
D

 

Really inconsistent

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 13:03:36

In reply to Re: being 'out of it' Sunbath, posted by delna on October 3, 2009, at 10:05:10

Sunbath and Delna:

The big reason I didn't post for awhile was because I couldn't figure out how I felt. I knew I was feeling better and better overall, but specifically, even now, I don't have a clue! My friends ask me how I feel and I can't explain it. and it changes all the time.
I think Parnate IS a hard drug to take because of that....you have to have a lot of patience to ride it out.

I asked my pdoc if I could take it all at night and he said to start dividing it between dinner and bedtime. Last night I went out to dinner with old friends, forgot about the Parnate, got home at 11:30pm and didn't know what to do. I took 40mg. plus the nortriptyline immediately, waited until 1:30 and took 30mg Parnate. I was kind of scared. I went right to sleep, up once at 3 or 4am (my usual), bathroom break, went right back to sleep until 10:am. Feel really rested. Wow.

I checked my BP and it was OK, a little high. But after I took the second dose I did notice my arms itched terribly! Like a big allergic reaction. (liver?) It was gone this morning.

I took 100mg of Provigil and felt positively ready to face the day! I'll take another 100mg at noon.

Sunbath, the Provigil is very important to my feeling sharp. I would REALLY want it if I were in school!!!! Is there any way you could get it or something else stimulating? like Girl takes Adderall, someone else takes d-amphetamine? Maybe enough Parnate will do it for you. My pdoc said I could keep increasing my Parnate up to 80mg day without even checking with him. I am at 70mg/day which feels right. And I think in another month or two I will lower it to 60mg. It seems like it is doing a whole big bunch of long over-due "housekeeping" in my brain and that is what makes it so inconsistent.

I felt pretty terrible on it for a long time. I fell asleep like a narcoleptic! sitting up talking to someone, at the wheel of the car (eek), I just could not stay awake. And I was foggy, also. I had low low BP, I itched all over, my face, hands and feet were puffed up. It wasn't fun.

I can't believe how much better I feel all the time now. I'm older than you guys and I think it's taking my body longer to get rid of the old and build up the new. Sunbath, I wish you had another month at least until school started. Those feelings you describe I had also, they are gone. I'm much more up and outgoing and cheerful and funny and clear. I don't worry all the time. My old friends last night were amazed at how much I was like my "old self". My sleep seems to be of better and better quality as I go along, also. But then I'm in my 6th month of taking it. I wouldn't be surprised if you need a lot more Parnate! Maybe that would make up for not having a stimulant to add.

It is surprising to be dealing with such fatigue when I thought I would be super-stimulated. Maybe that will come later and I wont need the Provigil.

I know it will work for you guys!! and it's worth it!!

Good luck!

Gayle

 

Re: Really inconsistent ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by SLS on October 3, 2009, at 13:59:59

In reply to Really inconsistent, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 13:03:36

How much nortriptyline are you taking?


- Scott

 

Re: Really inconsistent

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 16:30:35

In reply to Re: Really inconsistent ColoradoSnowflake, posted by SLS on October 3, 2009, at 13:59:59

> How much nortriptyline are you taking?
>
>
> - Scott

Still only 25mg.....because I'm still afraid it will make me tired. Why?

Gayle

 

Re: Really inconsistent ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by SLS on October 3, 2009, at 16:55:32

In reply to Re: Really inconsistent, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 16:30:35

> > How much nortriptyline are you taking?
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> Still only 25mg.....because I'm still afraid it will make me tired. Why?


I don't think you are taking enough nortriptyline. You would probably do better at 75mg.

What would lead you to believe that it would make you tired? My guess is that, at worst, you would feel a little more tired for a few days after a dosage increase. I don't think the presence of Parnate changes the dosage/response to the nortriptyine. Perhaps you can go to 50mg first and then get a blood level. You have too much at stake to remain inadequately treated by a subtherapeutic dose of nortriptyline.


- Scott

 

Re: Really inconsistent

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 17:29:20

In reply to Re: Really inconsistent ColoradoSnowflake, posted by SLS on October 3, 2009, at 16:55:32

> > > How much nortriptyline are you taking?
> > >
> > >
> > > - Scott
> >
> > Still only 25mg.....because I'm still afraid it will make me tired. Why?
>
>
> I don't think you are taking enough nortriptyline. You would probably do better at 75mg.
>
> What would lead you to believe that it would make you tired? My guess is that, at worst, you would feel a little more tired for a few days after a dosage increase. I don't think the presence of Parnate changes the dosage/response to the nortriptyine. Perhaps you can go to 50mg first and then get a blood level. You have too much at stake to remain inadequately treated by a subtherapeutic dose of nortriptyline.
>
>
> - Scott


I upped the Nortrip. to 50mg, a month or so ago and it made me tired, but I didn't have much Provigil then. I'll try it again now. Should I take the additional 25mg at night with the other 25mg Nortrip? That appeals to me because of it helping me sleep. But if some other time has a better chance of improvement I'll do that. And I'll give it five or more days this time. But I have to say, I'm feeling pretty darn good right now!

So what time of day/night do you think?

Thanks again, Scott, for you continued help!!

Gayle

 

Re: Really inconsistent ColoradoSnowflake

Posted by SLS on October 3, 2009, at 17:59:41

In reply to Re: Really inconsistent, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 17:29:20

Hi Gayle.

You can take all of your nortriptyline at night.

I'm crossing my fingers for you.


- Scott

 

Adding Nortriptyline SLS

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 19:18:32

In reply to Re: Really inconsistent ColoradoSnowflake, posted by SLS on October 3, 2009, at 17:59:41


Scott:

I'll start 50mg tonight!

and let you know.

Thanks!!,

Gayle

 

Re: Adding Nortriptyline SLS

Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 6, 2009, at 13:27:58

In reply to Adding Nortriptyline SLS, posted by ColoradoSnowflake on October 3, 2009, at 19:18:32

Scott

I can't take it anymore! Adding that 25 mg put me out of the zone. I had headaches every night..not in the neck but on the top of my head and forehead. They wouldn't go away with any NSAIDs I have. My mouth got so dry my esophagus was sticking to itself. I took by blood pressure quite a few times. It's funny, my BP wasn"t high, but my pulse was 100 and over which did concern me.
If I were to try it again it would have to be at a tiny amount.
I am disappointed.
Thanks for the good suggestions and help!!
Gayle

 

Re: wow am I tired... Sunbath

Posted by FredPotter on October 6, 2009, at 15:47:46

In reply to Re: wow am I tired... delna, posted by Sunbath on October 1, 2009, at 11:05:03

Because taking Parnate in the morning made me sleepy I too thought I'd take at night instead. True to the general cussedness of Nature in general it gave me total insomnia until it was time to go to work, when I fell fast asleep.

There are plenty of references to Parnate increasing serum levels of melatonin, so that would explain the daytime sleepiness. I'm now trying to eat breakfast gazing towards, not at, the sunrise, if there is one, to ram home to my crazy brain that it's time to wake up.

The night effect is weird. Perhaps Parnate acts like an on/off toggle for a signal from the pineal gland. Has anyone any ideas on this, or on melatonin antagonists? De-acetylation would produce serotonin but would this be safe as regards serotonin toxicity?
Fred


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