Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 871750

Shown: posts 1 to 25 of 31. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

How to decrease NE ?

Posted by mav27 on January 1, 2009, at 1:51:03

What drugs are available that will is some way cause decreased levels of noradrenaline or block ne receptors ect? Has to be readily available stuff... ie not some research only drug ect.

So from what i've been researching the 2 possibilities i've come up with are lithium ? And possibly clonadine which being an alpha2 agonist should decrease release of NE?

how about 5ht2c receptor agonists? any available in australia ?

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by SLS on January 1, 2009, at 6:41:46

In reply to How to decrease NE ?, posted by mav27 on January 1, 2009, at 1:51:03

> What drugs are available that will is some way cause decreased levels of noradrenaline or block ne receptors ect? Has to be readily available stuff... ie not some research only drug ect.


What are your reasons for wanting to do this?

Is there any medical literature about this?


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by linkadge on January 1, 2009, at 9:23:28

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 1, 2009, at 6:41:46

Vitamin C and Magnesium

Linkadge

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? linkadge

Posted by Phillipa on January 1, 2009, at 12:33:38

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by linkadge on January 1, 2009, at 9:23:28

I take 2000mg Vita C with rose hips and Magnesium citrate 500mg a day. Am I hurting my neurotransmitters? I seriously don't know as I'm sure you already know that. Phillipa

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 2, 2009, at 5:06:57

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 1, 2009, at 6:41:46

> > What drugs are available that will is some way cause decreased levels of noradrenaline or block ne receptors ect? Has to be readily available stuff... ie not some research only drug ect.
>
>
> What are your reasons for wanting to do this?
>
> Is there any medical literature about this?
>
>
> - Scott

Everything just seems to work wierdly in my body so i'd be interested in seeing what happens by decreasing NE. I have absolutely no drive, energy ect.. the thing is drugs that effect NE make it work... they zap more energy from me are are like sleeping pills as well as causing sexual dysfunction badly.. reboxetine being the worst of the lot. Lately we have found that sodium valproate has given me more drive to get out and do things and alprazolam seems to be as well. I'm kind of wondering if too much activity of something is actually draining my brain so to speak.. i know it sounds wierd and probably of no medical basis but i've had no luck yet with any ssri, tca, maoi ect available in australia.

Also any drug i take that increases NE in any way causes my blood pressure to drop.. which i think is the opposite to what is meant to happen.. had them amused when i was last in hospital though. I'm currently on prozac and it's making me worse and my blood pressure just happens to be dropping on it.. i saw from previous posts here that it increases NE and DA by 5ht2c antagosinm.

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27

Posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 6:43:40

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by mav27 on January 2, 2009, at 5:06:57

> > > What drugs are available that will is some way cause decreased levels of noradrenaline or block ne receptors ect? Has to be readily available stuff... ie not some research only drug ect.
> >
> >
> > What are your reasons for wanting to do this?
> >
> > Is there any medical literature about this?
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> Everything just seems to work wierdly in my body so i'd be interested in seeing what happens by decreasing NE. I have absolutely no drive, energy ect.. the thing is drugs that effect NE make it work... they zap more energy from me are are like sleeping pills as well as causing sexual dysfunction badly.. reboxetine being the worst of the lot. Lately we have found that sodium valproate has given me more drive to get out and do things and alprazolam seems to be as well. I'm kind of wondering if too much activity of something is actually draining my brain so to speak.. i know it sounds wierd and probably of no medical basis but i've had no luck yet with any ssri, tca, maoi ect available in australia.
>
> Also any drug i take that increases NE in any way causes my blood pressure to drop.. which i think is the opposite to what is meant to happen.. had them amused when i was last in hospital though. I'm currently on prozac and it's making me worse and my blood pressure just happens to be dropping on it.. i saw from previous posts here that it increases NE and DA by 5ht2c antagosinm.

Interesting. Does Remeron make you feel worse, too?


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 7:05:13

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 6:43:40

I forgot to mention that clonidine seems to be specific for certain areas of the brain. It binds to a subtype of NE-alpha that is expressed in the vasomotor center in the brainstem. This is how the drug works to reduce sympathetic tone and thus reduce blood pressure and heart rate peripherally. I don't know anything more about clonidine to know if it would be ideal for accomplishing your goal. My guess is that it wouldn't.


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 7:43:45

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 7:05:13

> I forgot to mention that clonidine seems to be specific for certain areas of the brain. It binds to a subtype of NE-alpha that is expressed in the vasomotor center in the brainstem. This is how the drug works to reduce sympathetic tone and thus reduce blood pressure and heart rate peripherally. I don't know anything more about clonidine to know if it would be ideal for accomplishing your goal. My guess is that it wouldn't.

-----------------------------------------------

I did a little snooping.

I may have guessed wrong. Some very recent work demonstrates that the NE-alpha2A receptor subtype (clonidine being an agonist of), in addition to congregating in the brain stem to reduce blood pressure, seems to actually enhance cognitive performance in Rhesus monkeys. This increase in performance was reversed by known NE-alpha2A receptor antagonists. Both the A and C subtypes are now known to be additionally localized in the prefrontal cortex, with the A subtype the more prevalent. I bet this is relevant to the ability of clonidine to improve ADD/ADHD.

Guanfacine is a selective agonist of the 2A/D receptors. You might want to look into it.


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27

Posted by bleauberry on January 2, 2009, at 16:57:50

In reply to How to decrease NE ?, posted by mav27 on January 1, 2009, at 1:51:03

Hey, I think you've done an awesome job monitoring your reactions to various drugs. I believe there are clues in how we respond to things, and you seem to be putting some clues together into some sort of picture. It makes sense to me. That being said, biochemistry is way way way more complicated than we know. What we talk about here is just the tip of the iceberg compared to all the stuff that is really going on that we don't know about.

Link has good ideas. High dose VitC and magnesium will calm NE way down. That's why I can't take them. I am the opposite of you. My brain likes NE. VitC and Mag make me feel so much worse.

I used to have a terrible time with this racing anxiety/paranoia/scaredness thing when I woke up every morning. I didn't go to bed that way. My doc did a test and showed my cortisol, related to NE, was sky high off the charts when I woke up. I found that VitC before bed almost completely killed that waking friekiness stuff.

As far as drugs, I don't know. You can block the effects of NE in selected areas, depending on the med, but I don't know about reducing it. All amino acids compete for entry into the brain. You could possibly take tryptophan supplements to change the ratio of what gets in the brain, squashing out some of the phenylalanine and tyrosine which eventually make NE. Along the same lines, since you respond to GABA-ish things, you could try supplements of GABA, glycine, taurine, magnesium, l-theanine, niacinimide. They all work in the same arena as benzos by calming down and balancing excitatory things such as NE.

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 19:15:17

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by bleauberry on January 2, 2009, at 16:57:50

> High dose VitC and magnesium will calm NE way down.

Any idea on how vitamin-C works to calm NE down?

Magnesium ion works by blocking the N-type calcium channels at NE nerve terminals and thus inhibits NE release. Would there be a therapeutic effect to treat depression if there were NOT a Mg deficiency? Would megadose treatment with Mg produce a long-term therapeutic effect or is it acute only, with feedback loops producing a loss of effect? I haven't been around anyone who has actually tried megadose Mg2+ treatments for MDD or BD, so I can't attest to its effectiveness.

Calcium is my nemesis. I become significantly more depressed after a single megadose. Calcium and magnesium are in some ways at opposite ends of the same pole. I found magnesium to be somewhat calming after the first few doses, but basically inert thereafter.

Lithium is a calming agent of NE neurons when used chronically. Interestingly, it produces elevations in the level of circulating Mg2+ ion. Mg2+ is essential to "calm down" glutamatergic NMDA receptors. It also helps to "turn off" NE release. Chronic use of lithium downregulates NE-alpha1/2 and NE-beta1/2 receptors. These represent long-term changes.

Using megadoses of magnesium and vitamin-C would seem innocuous in the absence of a calcium channel blocker. I guess bowel tolerance will tell you when you are taking too much of either Mg or Vitamin-C.


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 19:41:22

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 19:15:17

> Using megadoses of magnesium and vitamin-C would seem innocuous in the absence of a calcium channel blocker.

Sorry. I need to retract this statement. The case I was thinking of was an intentional overdose of diltiazem, potassium, and magnesium.

Large doses of magnesium are sometimes used to treat TCA overdose.


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by yxibow on January 3, 2009, at 1:36:12

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 19:41:22

> > Using megadoses of magnesium and vitamin-C would seem innocuous in the absence of a calcium channel blocker.
>
> Sorry. I need to retract this statement. The case I was thinking of was an intentional overdose of diltiazem, potassium, and magnesium.
>
> Large doses of magnesium are sometimes used to treat TCA overdose.


Curious -- wont go further down that road other than to say that -some- TCAs can be in that only regard as bad as barbiturates.

As for how I mitigate the "unclean drug" wired/pulse action of NE in Anafranil, its usually propranolol.

Peace and happiness, its 2009!

-- Jay

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 3, 2009, at 2:41:31

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 7:43:45

> > I forgot to mention that clonidine seems to be specific for certain areas of the brain. It binds to a subtype of NE-alpha that is expressed in the vasomotor center in the brainstem. This is how the drug works to reduce sympathetic tone and thus reduce blood pressure and heart rate peripherally. I don't know anything more about clonidine to know if it would be ideal for accomplishing your goal. My guess is that it wouldn't.
>
> -----------------------------------------------
>
> I did a little snooping.
>
> I may have guessed wrong. Some very recent work demonstrates that the NE-alpha2A receptor subtype (clonidine being an agonist of), in addition to congregating in the brain stem to reduce blood pressure, seems to actually enhance cognitive performance in Rhesus monkeys. This increase in performance was reversed by known NE-alpha2A receptor antagonists. Both the A and C subtypes are now known to be additionally localized in the prefrontal cortex, with the A subtype the more prevalent. I bet this is relevant to the ability of clonidine to improve ADD/ADHD.
>
> Guanfacine is a selective agonist of the 2A/D receptors. You might want to look into it.
>
>
> - Scott
>

Awesome... do you have a link to a study online or something with that info ? Something i can show my pdoc.
I just checked Guanfacine but it isn't available here.
cheers

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27

Posted by SLS on January 3, 2009, at 5:19:48

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by mav27 on January 3, 2009, at 2:41:31

Hi.

I'm having a tough time locating the literature that would be sufficient to show your doctor.

I'll keep looking.

Was ADD or ADHD ever suspected with you?

Do you suffer from fear, anxiety, or panic attacks?

Keep in mind that clonidine is well known to be depressogenic. However, there may be things about your individual biology that produce paradoxical reactions to NE alpha2 drugs. Guanfacine is less depressogenic and less sedating than clonidine. Both drugs are now used to treat ADD and ADHD. They serve to "calm down" NE activity in the prefrontal cortex (PFC).


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 3, 2009, at 8:02:03

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by SLS on January 3, 2009, at 5:19:48

> Hi.
>
> I'm having a tough time locating the literature that would be sufficient to show your doctor.
>
> I'll keep looking.
>
> Was ADD or ADHD ever suspected with you?
>
> Do you suffer from fear, anxiety, or panic attacks?
>
> Keep in mind that clonidine is well known to be depressogenic. However, there may be things about your individual biology that produce paradoxical reactions to NE alpha2 drugs. Guanfacine is less depressogenic and less sedating than clonidine. Both drugs are now used to treat ADD and ADHD. They serve to "calm down" NE activity in the prefrontal cortex (PFC).
>
>
> - Scott

I suspect i have some form of Adult ADHD... and if i was a child in this day and age i would bet my life i would be diagnosed with it... the signs of it being there when i was a kid are clear and even readsing old school reports you could see it... thing is back in my day no one knew what adhd was... and it doesn't help with australia being 10years behind the US when it comes to psychiatry.

I believe i still have it in some form.... but any attempt ive made for drugs to treat it i just havnt had luck getting my hands on... anything even remotly related to stimulants are the most restricted drug and they don't recognise adult ADHD here as existing.

Heres a recent newspaper article about it
http://www.thedaily.com.au/blogs/is-it-just-me/2007/sep/07/adults-adhd/

A lot of it sounds like me and i was that hyper kid that couldnt concentrate in class and always in trouble bcause i couldnt focus or be still for 1 second.... the only difference is they have spent the last 10 years trying to settle me with things like anti-psychotics but nothing has worked. (im 28 now)

Around the age of 16 the depression set in and at 20 was diagnosed with anxiety and social phobia.
Another of those wierd things i guess... on one hand saying i crave attention... on the other hand being afraid of it because i suffer anxiety attacks being around people and of being judged.

I kind of feel like there is some wierd link 1ith one being the key.. like a triangle with 3 points... on the points being ADD, depression, and social phobia. One of those points is the key to breaking the triangle but we can't figure it out... and the only one we havn't... and can't work on well is ADD.

There is 1 thing i know though... i've been on all the AD's in aus without luck.... the one thing that does temprerily fix my depression though is attention... it gets worse and worse and then i sms everyone on the phone that im going to kill myself.. post it on facebook, myspace ect... the more attention i get the better i feel and i live to suffer another day.

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by SLS on January 3, 2009, at 8:24:03

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by mav27 on January 3, 2009, at 8:02:03

I think the bottom line is that you might be right about your need to reduce the activity of NE pathways that use NE alpha2A receptors as a negative feedback loop. That you experience social phobia helps to bolster your theory. NE alpha2A receptors are concentrated in the amygdala, the major fear center in the brain. Taken together, the ADHD thing and the social phobia thing would merit an investigation into using clonidine, or, preferably, guanfacine.

Some people experience a "paradoxical" anxiolytic effect from D-amphetamine (Dexedrine). It might be interesting for you to give it a try. Perhaps now would be a good time for you to take a psychometric exam to look for ADD / ADHD. If the exam shows positive for attention deficit disorder, you might have an easy time getting a doctor prescribe amphetamine. I wouldn't recommend methylphenidate (Ritalin) as a first choice of stimulant. I think it would have a greater potential to produce anxiety.


- Scott


> > Hi.
> >
> > I'm having a tough time locating the literature that would be sufficient to show your doctor.
> >
> > I'll keep looking.
> >
> > Was ADD or ADHD ever suspected with you?
> >
> > Do you suffer from fear, anxiety, or panic attacks?
> >
> > Keep in mind that clonidine is well known to be depressogenic. However, there may be things about your individual biology that produce paradoxical reactions to NE alpha2 drugs. Guanfacine is less depressogenic and less sedating than clonidine. Both drugs are now used to treat ADD and ADHD. They serve to "calm down" NE activity in the prefrontal cortex (PFC).
> >
> >
> > - Scott
>
> I suspect i have some form of Adult ADHD... and if i was a child in this day and age i would bet my life i would be diagnosed with it... the signs of it being there when i was a kid are clear and even readsing old school reports you could see it... thing is back in my day no one knew what adhd was... and it doesn't help with australia being 10years behind the US when it comes to psychiatry.
>
> I believe i still have it in some form.... but any attempt ive made for drugs to treat it i just havnt had luck getting my hands on... anything even remotly related to stimulants are the most restricted drug and they don't recognise adult ADHD here as existing.
>
> Heres a recent newspaper article about it
> http://www.thedaily.com.au/blogs/is-it-just-me/2007/sep/07/adults-adhd/
>
> A lot of it sounds like me and i was that hyper kid that couldnt concentrate in class and always in trouble bcause i couldnt focus or be still for 1 second.... the only difference is they have spent the last 10 years trying to settle me with things like anti-psychotics but nothing has worked. (im 28 now)
>
> Around the age of 16 the depression set in and at 20 was diagnosed with anxiety and social phobia.
> Another of those wierd things i guess... on one hand saying i crave attention... on the other hand being afraid of it because i suffer anxiety attacks being around people and of being judged.
>
> I kind of feel like there is some wierd link 1ith one being the key.. like a triangle with 3 points... on the points being ADD, depression, and social phobia. One of those points is the key to breaking the triangle but we can't figure it out... and the only one we havn't... and can't work on well is ADD.
>
> There is 1 thing i know though... i've been on all the AD's in aus without luck.... the one thing that does temprerily fix my depression though is attention... it gets worse and worse and then i sms everyone on the phone that im going to kill myself.. post it on facebook, myspace ect... the more attention i get the better i feel and i live to suffer another day.

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by linkadge on January 3, 2009, at 9:16:30

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 2, 2009, at 19:15:17

Its not necessarily about using megadoses of vitamin C / magnesium. Vitamin C directly antagonizes the release of cortisol which is a stress hormone which tends to lead to higher adrenaline output.

It it my understandings that these two nutrients are lost during stress. As a result, the stressed brain is less capable of dealing with stressors and hence gets stuck in a vicious loop.

If I take magnesium chronically, it makes me depressed. However, if I take lower doses before, or during stresful events, I find myself having a faster rebound.

Linkadge

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 3, 2009, at 9:23:51

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ?, posted by SLS on January 3, 2009, at 8:24:03

All i've been able to find out so far is for an adult to be prescribed dexedrine you need consent from 5 senior pdocs.. which would mean a stay in hospital i would think... which i would rather kill myself than experiance ever again.
People here say parnate is stimulating.... yet it puts me right out to sleep.

I will gather info and se what i get from my pdoc about dexedrine... but bottom line is i think the chances are close to zero.
I just looked at strattera but its too expensive for me.... what else can you think of for adhd ? Amisulpride low dose was great but only lasted about a month and stopped working.


> Some people experience a "paradoxical" anxiolytic effect from D-amphetamine (Dexedrine). It might be interesting for you to give it a try. Perhaps now would be a good time for you to take a psychometric exam to look for ADD / ADHD. If the exam shows positive for attention deficit disorder, you might have an easy time getting a doctor prescribe amphetamine. I wouldn't recommend methylphenidate (Ritalin) as a first choice of stimulant. I think it would have a greater potential to produce anxiety.
>
>
> - Scott
>
>
>
>
> > > Hi.
> > >
> > > I'm having a tough time locating the literature that would be sufficient to show your doctor.
> > >
> > > I'll keep looking.
> > >
> > > Was ADD or ADHD ever suspected with you?
> > >
> > > Do you suffer from fear, anxiety, or panic attacks?
> > >
> > > Keep in mind that clonidine is well known to be depressogenic. However, there may be things about your individual biology that produce paradoxical reactions to NE alpha2 drugs. Guanfacine is less depressogenic and less sedating than clonidine. Both drugs are now used to treat ADD and ADHD. They serve to "calm down" NE activity in the prefrontal cortex (PFC).
> > >
> > >
> > > - Scott
> >
> > I suspect i have some form of Adult ADHD... and if i was a child in this day and age i would bet my life i would be diagnosed with it... the signs of it being there when i was a kid are clear and even readsing old school reports you could see it... thing is back in my day no one knew what adhd was... and it doesn't help with australia being 10years behind the US when it comes to psychiatry.
> >
> > I believe i still have it in some form.... but any attempt ive made for drugs to treat it i just havnt had luck getting my hands on... anything even remotly related to stimulants are the most restricted drug and they don't recognise adult ADHD here as existing.
> >
> > Heres a recent newspaper article about it
> > http://www.thedaily.com.au/blogs/is-it-just-me/2007/sep/07/adults-adhd/
> >
> > A lot of it sounds like me and i was that hyper kid that couldnt concentrate in class and always in trouble bcause i couldnt focus or be still for 1 second.... the only difference is they have spent the last 10 years trying to settle me with things like anti-psychotics but nothing has worked. (im 28 now)
> >
> > Around the age of 16 the depression set in and at 20 was diagnosed with anxiety and social phobia.
> > Another of those wierd things i guess... on one hand saying i crave attention... on the other hand being afraid of it because i suffer anxiety attacks being around people and of being judged.
> >
> > I kind of feel like there is some wierd link 1ith one being the key.. like a triangle with 3 points... on the points being ADD, depression, and social phobia. One of those points is the key to breaking the triangle but we can't figure it out... and the only one we havn't... and can't work on well is ADD.
> >
> > There is 1 thing i know though... i've been on all the AD's in aus without luck.... the one thing that does temprerily fix my depression though is attention... it gets worse and worse and then i sms everyone on the phone that im going to kill myself.. post it on facebook, myspace ect... the more attention i get the better i feel and i live to suffer another day.
>
>

 

cortisol question

Posted by elanor roosevelt on January 3, 2009, at 22:30:37

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by bleauberry on January 2, 2009, at 16:57:50

how does the level of cortisol effect the morning

if it is lower you are less afraid of getting out of bed?

how much vitamin C and in what form?

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27

Posted by SLS on January 4, 2009, at 20:42:37

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by mav27 on January 3, 2009, at 9:23:51

I know you said that you have tried a great many antidepressants. Did you try desipramine? If so, at what dosage? How did you react to it?

I have this idea that you might profit from combining desipramine with clonidine. I haven't looked into it yet, and I don't know if there are any contraindications against using these drugs in combination. The only thing I can think of is orthostatic hypotension. My guess is that this might mitigate somewhat over time.


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 4, 2009, at 23:14:17

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by SLS on January 4, 2009, at 20:42:37

I did look into desiprimine once but unfortunatly it turns out not to be available here in Australia :(

I actually thought imipramine was working ok but the doc wasn't happy with it giving m a 120bpm heart rate plus i had NE induced sexual dysfunction... for me NE SD is different from seratonin induced dysfunction in that things work but it feels like someone has stuck a skewer through my prostate at -that- time.

> I know you said that you have tried a great many antidepressants. Did you try desipramine? If so, at what dosage? How did you react to it?
>
> I have this idea that you might profit from combining desipramine with clonidine. I haven't looked into it yet, and I don't know if there are any contraindications against using these drugs in combination. The only thing I can think of is orthostatic hypotension. My guess is that this might mitigate somewhat over time.
>
>
> - Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 4, 2009, at 23:26:48

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by SLS on January 4, 2009, at 20:42:37

Cn't remember if i metioned it before or not but nortriptyline increased my anxiety and made me 'short tempered' as did bupropion. Both also decreased blood pressure.

> I know you said that you have tried a great many antidepressants. Did you try desipramine? If so, at what dosage? How did you react to it?
>
> I have this idea that you might profit from combining desipramine with clonidine. I haven't looked into it yet, and I don't know if there are any contraindications against using these drugs in combination. The only thing I can think of is orthostatic hypotension. My guess is that this might mitigate somewhat over time.
>
>
> - Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27

Posted by SLS on January 5, 2009, at 6:41:53

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by mav27 on January 4, 2009, at 23:14:17

> I did look into desiprimine once but unfortunatly it turns out not to be available here in Australia :(
>
> I actually thought imipramine was working ok but the doc wasn't happy with it giving m a 120bpm heart rate

That is the nature of the beast. Elevated HR is an almost guaranteed side effect. If your doctor has a problem with it while you take the only drug that works for you, I would search for a new doctor or suggest to this one that he add the beta-blocker, propranolol. An added benefit to this drug is that it "calms down" NE throughout the brain as well as peripherally. There is some recent investigation into the use of propranolol in ADD. It is also used to help reduce explosive behavior.

Imipramine is the parent drug of desipramine. 20-30 years ago, it was used to treat adult ADD. It was effective enough to warrant its continued use. Desipramine is chosen more frequently now because of its reduced antcholinergic side effects. Desipramine is sort of a poor man's Straterra. It works, but has been largely forgotten about.

> plus i had NE induced sexual dysfunction... for me NE SD is different from seratonin induced dysfunction in that things work but it feels like someone has stuck a skewer through my prostate at -that- time.

I am familiar with this side effect. You are right about orgasm being driven by NE pathways. However, it might be the anticholinergic properties of imipramine that acts synergistically to produce this side effect. It tends to go away with time.

How long were you on imipramine for? This drug is also used sometimes to treat agoraphobia.


- Scott

 

Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS

Posted by mav27 on January 5, 2009, at 10:35:29

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? mav27, posted by SLS on January 5, 2009, at 6:41:53

Umm was on it for a few months i think, hard to remember back that far. My doc worried about the heart rate because i already have heart problems which run throughout the family as well on my dad's side so he's very reluctant have me on anything that can damage it more.

However looking back it may have actually been mostly anxiety driven increased HR and BP when i went because since then i have gotten my own BP machine and it reads lower at home than when i go to the doc... and that inludes me taking my puse rate by measuring the pulse on my wrist ect..

The thing i do remember about imipramine though is it gave me the zombie like state i get from ssri's.. in terms of my brain just having a bit of lag to it (which was really the only side effect i cared about)

 

Re: How to decrease NE ?

Posted by SLS on January 5, 2009, at 13:21:20

In reply to Re: How to decrease NE ? SLS, posted by mav27 on January 5, 2009, at 10:35:29

That brain "lag" might have been due to the strong anticholinergic properties of imipramine. A few people complain of being "dumb" or "stupid" when taking imipramine. Desipramine has a much reduced liability in this regard.


- Scott


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