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Lou's reply to Sigismund- Lake of Fire-1b Lou Pilder

Posted by Lou Pilder on December 16, 2007, at 12:16:38

In reply to Lou's reply to Sigismund- Lake of Fire-1a Sigismund, posted by Lou Pilder on December 11, 2007, at 10:26:22

> > >Since he was speaking to Jews at that time, the symbol of {baptism with fire} was likely something that Jews could understand. As a Jew, I understnd what is meant and how it relates to {The Lake of Fire}
> >
> > Lou, what do you understand 'baptism with fire' to refer to?
>
> Sigismund,
> You wrote,[...Lou,what do you understand 'baptism with fire' to refer to?...]
> The phrase was spoken to Jews so it could mean that those Jews could have an understanding of what that means.
> Let us look at some verses in the scriptures used by the Jews of that time that it was innitialy said to them.
>
> In Jeremiah 23 (29),
> Is not my word like a fire?
>
> In Lamentations 1 (13)
> From above, He has sent fire into my bones
>
> In Malachi 3 (2)
> But who can undure the day of His comming? And who can stand when He appears?
> For He is like a refiner's fire
>
> In Ezekial 38 (19)
> For in...My fire of My wrath I have spoken
>
> In Zephaniah 3 (8)
> All the earth shall be destroyed with the fire of my zeal
>
> Here we have fire depicted in a spiritual sense. In a baptism of fire, if the baptism was literal fire, would not anyone baptzed with a literal fire burn?
> Now God's fire is written as a {refiner's} fire, and does not a refiner's fire purify? And if God has sent fire into someone's bones, could that not be a spirtiual fire? If that fire was literal, the person that wrote about that happening to them could be dead, could they not?
> In that it is written that His word is like a fire, a person reading His word , or hearing His word, if it spiritual like a refiner's fire, could not that person be purified?
> More about the baptism of fire and The Lake of Fire...
> Lou

Sigismund,
You asked about baptism with fire. The Lake of Fire is either a symbol or a literal fire (or both or niether) used by John, a Jew in his writing the book known as the book of Revelation. Being a Jew, I think that John was writing what Jews could understand in the symbols that he used. As a Jew, I can understand the symbols used from my perspective as a Jew.
Let us look at the book called Exodus in the 25th chapter starting at verse 16. This book attributed to Moses describes God as we read;
[...Now the glory of the Lord rested on Mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it six days. And on the seventh day He called to Moses out of the midst of the cloud. {The sight of the glory of the Lord was like >a consuming fire<} on the top of the mountain in the eyes of the children of Israel...]. Later in an epistle to the Hebrews, in Chapter 12 verse 29 it reads;
[..For our God is a consuming fire...].
The writer of Revelaion goes on to write in chapter 20 verse 14,[...Then death and Hades were cast into the Lake of Fire.{This is the second death}...].
But in chapter 2 verse 11 the writer , John, a Jew, writes;
[...He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death...]. Does this mean that all experiamce the Lake of Fire but some may not be hurt by it? Could a Jew understand this?
Let us look at the book called Isaiah in the 43erd chapter starting in verse 1,
[...Fear not, for I have redeemed you;..when you pass through the waters, I will be with you;..When you walk throgh the fire you shall not be burned nor shall the flame scorch you.
more...
Lou
>
>
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poster:Lou Pilder thread:798827
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faith/20070227/msgs/801124.html