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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 32. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
Hi there, has anyone made a complete career change in midlife? I'm 39 and contemplating a change from software engineer into ... something. I'm mainly looking at stuff I could transition into by getting a new master's degree.
Ideas so far include therapist (that 10 years as a patient has to help), librarian (sounds perfect expect for low pay), or physician assistant (pays well but looks tough to get into the schools).
In current job I'm burnt out on overwork, and my hands are injured from too much keyboard work.
Comments anyone?
And BTW, there's all kinds of good info on the U.S. Beaureau of Labor Statistics website. Warms my heart to see my tax dollars doing something useful.
Posted by Ginjoint on January 22, 2003, at 7:50:20
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
Hi Tabitha...
First, I am really glad to see you back. I missed your intelligence and wit. :) Thanks for returning.
I haven't done a career change, so I have little advice to offer you, but I wanted to say that I think it's really cool that you're willing to do this. Making major changes takes cajones. (I'm 36 and would LOVE to become a certified nurse midwife -- but this means nursing school, which I don't have the confidence for.) :(
From what I've read (I'm job searching so I read a lot about this crap), more and more, employers appreciate - and HIRE - those who make career switches that involve more schooling, especially mid-career. Obviously, this usually points to someone who really wants to do the job at hand, someone who's particularly motivated and dedicated. Best a' luck in whatever you choose!
Ginjoint
Posted by ROO on January 22, 2003, at 8:47:58
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
Which ones appeal to you most? Without thinking
about pay or money at all (or reality) at all...what
are some of your biggest fantasy jobs?
Posted by Eddie Sylvano on January 22, 2003, at 8:54:09
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
> Hi there, has anyone made a complete career change in midlife? I'm 39 and contemplating a change from software engineer into ... something. I'm mainly looking at stuff I could transition into by getting a new master's degree.
-----------------I'm relatively close to that. At 30, after programming computers for 8 years, I'm quitting work to go back to school in the fall. I never really wanted to be a programmer to beign with, but it was my most useful skill 8 years ago, and now I'm regretting it a bit. More to the point, I don't think I really knew what I wanted to be doing back then, whereas now I'm more focused. It was also very clarifying to get out from under my depression long enough to realize that I might actually live beyond 35. It also feels like the first time since high school that that my mind is clear enough to handle the rigors of school.
I think it'll be exciting to be working toward something I enjoy, regardless of the abject poverty it'll cause me (or student loans. ugh.).
Posted by Dinah on January 22, 2003, at 9:03:21
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by ROO on January 22, 2003, at 8:47:58
I think it sounds great, Tabitha. And I think you have the resources to do it. Why don't you ask some people who are actually working in the field to tell you about it. Sure, everyone will probably gripe, but you could find something out by the type of gripes. :)
Does your therapist enjoy her work? Mine says it's a rough way to make a living, although he enjoys the actual work. (Yes, I too thought of it.) I think librarian sounds utterly wonderful. And I knew a college librarian who loved her work. And with your excellent mind, I know you'd do anything medical well.
The best way I found to assess how much I'd like a job isn't an easy way. I worked as a vet assistant for less than a week, and changed my college major from pre-vet. And I volunteered at a classroom, and discovered that my dream of making a difference as a teacher would be short-circuited by my easy over-stimulation.
Of course, I did the same thing for my current job and enjoyed it enormously. Hidden pitfalls.
I think it's great that you're taking steps to solve your problem. I know how easy it is to just get trapped.
Posted by Dinah on January 22, 2003, at 9:10:35
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change » Tabitha, posted by Eddie Sylvano on January 22, 2003, at 8:54:09
And really glad to hear you're feeling better.
Posted by mikhail99 on January 22, 2003, at 10:18:51
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
> Hi there, has anyone made a complete career change in midlife? I'm 39 and contemplating a change from software engineer into ... something. I'm mainly looking at stuff I could transition into by getting a new master's degree.
>
> Ideas so far include therapist (that 10 years as a patient has to help), librarian (sounds perfect expect for low pay), or physician assistant (pays well but looks tough to get into the schools).
>
> In current job I'm burnt out on overwork, and my hands are injured from too much keyboard work.
>
> Comments anyone?
>
> And BTW, there's all kinds of good info on the U.S. Beaureau of Labor Statistics website. Warms my heart to see my tax dollars doing something useful.Hi Tabitha,
Your email almost could have been written by me. I'm 39 and wanting to change careers too. I have seriously considered nursing school but don't have the confidence to apply. My reasons for wanting a change are a bit different. I work for a satellite tv provider as a "media librarian" which is ok work but not very fulfilling. I make pretty good money but the job has gotten very boring as of late, the industry is changing and my company is in limbo. (Sorry, I'm going on and on...)
Anyway, I'm stuck between making sure I make the amount of money I make now, finding the confidence to change and wondering just what in the hell I'm supposed to do with my life. (I think some people would call this a mid-life crisis.)
Maybe we can bounce ideas off one another since we're in a similar boat? Hang in there and don't give up on this dream, I think you can get there.
Take care,
Mik
Posted by jay on January 22, 2003, at 10:57:14
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
I will say if you go for therapist...go for an MSW. It is the only truly 'recognized' credential in this field. Most of therapist jobs require an MSW. Anything else, like an MA in 'Counselling' rarely cuts it. The programs are tough, and tough to get into, but your experience, as you say, may help. It's a very rewarding career, and regardless of misconceptions, the money is great.
Let me know if you are interested,
Jay
Posted by Greg on January 22, 2003, at 13:33:55
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
Hi Tabby,
At age 37 I put myself thru college and got my degree in Computer-Aided Design Drafting, specializing in both Architectural and Mechanical design. Before that I had spent my whole working career as a long haul truck driver... If an ornery ol' ass like me can do it, it should be a breeze for you. It was hard, a lot of intense studying, and I had to work full-time while I went to school. There never seemed to be enough hours in the day. But I wanted more out of life, I wanted to spend more time with my family, and I knew there was something creative inside me screaming to get out, so I went for it. Although the job market is really brutal right now, and I've been working as a contractor for over a year, I do believe it's going to get better. And I will always believe that my decision to re-educate myself was one of the smartest choices I ever made.
One little piece of advice if I may be so bold? If you go back to school, learn to do something that you truly love. Money does not buy you happiness. If you happen to make a lot of cash in your new career, that's cool too :)
I hope you're well.
Greg
Posted by Mr Beev on January 22, 2003, at 14:39:10
In reply to Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 22, 2003, at 4:01:52
I have made such a change. I, too, was a computer programmer; I, too, returned to university at midlife. My new "career", if one may call it that, is philosophy.
Why philosophy? I hear that's, uh, where the big money is... I have been at it for over ten years, and have no regrets whatsoever.
Naturally, my income is a minute fraction of what it was; however, one need not topple over at a diminuition in one's standard of living. A trip to, say, Calcutta helps to remind us in the West of just how fortunate we are in our living standards, among other things.
The key to my success, insofar as one could call it that, is as simple as it is peculiarly difficult, or so it seemed to me, and may summarized as (1) reduction: substantially shrink expenditures; (2) discipline: make the decision, stick to it; (3) continuity: keep in touch with prior profession as something to fall back upon.
Recommended reading by Juliet Schor:
"The Overworked American"
"The Overspent American"Best regards,
Mr Beev
Posted by Mashogr8 on January 22, 2003, at 15:40:42
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by Mr Beev on January 22, 2003, at 14:39:10
All my life I wanted to be a physician. As a woman (going to college in the midsixties), my parents encouraged me to look into nursing, but I wanted to get a BS in nursing. I got into nay three year nursing program I applied to but I was urged to matriculate in English rather than be admitted to the Nursing Program at the university. Shot down big time and not confident enough to rise above adversity I accepted the decision not to pursue a nursing degree. Why I would go off and be a social work major. But then the head of the department spoke with a really thick German accent and I couldn't understand him or any of his lectures. End of my career in social work. A fellow student told me of her work area speech/language pathology. there you are independent, diagnose language, articulation difficulties, make a difference in peiople's lives. So that's where I headed but the field required a Master's degree. If I were going to get a Master's why not just go on and get an MD. But my Mom reminded me why would you take a spot in med school when you plan to have a family. You would be depriving a man of an opportunity to earn a good living, to support HIS family and his wife. Why look at how unruly the "Soandso"kids are --that's 'cause their Mom is too busy with HER patients to take proper care of HER kids. That was the worst advice my mom ever offered and unfortunately it was the one advice I followed even though I thought it was plain stupid. I believed that I didn't have what it would take to become a doctor. I know today that I should not have given up that dream. If it was not to be, I would fail and I could go back to speech pathology. Almost forthy years later, I still wish I had had the fortitude to buck my mom and apply to med school, get through it, owe a fortune and maybe be satisfied that I had followed my dream.
I sometimes think part of my depression is rooted in the fact that I don't or didn't have control of my destiny. about fifteen years ago, a pdoc suggested that I reconsider that desire and try to get into Med school or at least a PA school. Too depressed to believe I could accomplish that I said "no, it's too late." five years ago I find out that we reach an apex in the learning experience in our forties. I probably could have done it. At least I could have been a PA (I'm my own worst enemy, PAs answer to MDs and I wanted to be the boss). Bottom line, I'm still in my original field which I definitely like and I'm good at it but whenever I get overburdened by paperwork and whining teachers or even do wn on myself, I always wonder what life might be like if I just had the courage......
Bottom line, be what you think you want to be. You really can try something new without the world coming to an end. Do it now as you enter into a renewed "Brain charge". Take advantage of your age and wisdom as well as what you know about your illness. Don't take the easy way out and listen to the words of depression telling you you can't.
Go for it.
MA
Posted by ShelliR on January 22, 2003, at 19:11:22
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by ROO on January 22, 2003, at 8:47:58
I'm with Roo. You already have one very successful career finanancially, so this time pick a real fantasy.
I changed careers early thirties. From computer programer (and before that social science researcher) to portrait photographer. In working for myself, though, I forgot to worry about retirement money; stuff like that. Bad mistake which will probably work out because of inheritance some day if the stock market doesn't completely die. But bad idea, anyway.
Go for it. You mentioned a book before which spurred me on (it's only too late.........)
Shelli
Posted by noa on January 22, 2003, at 19:28:09
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change » Tabitha, posted by mikhail99 on January 22, 2003, at 10:18:51
I saw on the news that because of the nurse shortage, there are now programs to speed up the retraining process for people who want to become nurses but have a degree in something else.
Posted by ShelliR on January 22, 2003, at 21:22:59
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by noa on January 22, 2003, at 19:28:09
That's probably because so many smart nurses are becoming nurse practitioners, unwilling to settle for low wages and bad working conditions of nurses with no degree or just a BS. Many of the nurse practitioners go into private practice with doctors; also hospitals are hiring them for emergency rooms so they can hire less MDs.
Posted by Eddie Sylvano on January 23, 2003, at 10:20:47
In reply to Re: Good to see you » Eddie Sylvano, posted by Dinah on January 22, 2003, at 9:10:35
> And really glad to hear you're feeling better.
Thanks! :)
Posted by lostsailor on January 23, 2003, at 19:16:15
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change » noa, posted by ShelliR on January 22, 2003, at 21:22:59
Hi.
Too bad for your post. Both as a past mental health worker and now consumer, I turned to library school for a change. I am taking a break for better breakdown, but getting you MLS will open many doors both in the context of the 'traditional librarion" stereotype to the world of on line seach specialization. The roots and theory are noble and the advent of the net etc make the jobs options endless.
Also look into special librarys like in hospitals, pop magazines, law firms the gamut.
An msw or som counseling degree leads to more time "in the chair"> IMHO, proceed with great care.
(ps) See http://www.ala.org
Posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 1:56:30
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change--tabitha and mls/msw, posted by lostsailor on January 23, 2003, at 19:16:15
Thanks for so many interesting and thought-provoking responses. About the options I listed, I thought therapist because I really believe it helps people, and the process fascinates me. But it requires 2 years school, plus 2 years internship (minimum wage) to get licensed, which is kind of a long haul. I'm not sure the actual practice of it would suit my personality. I'm probably too introverted to have to interact with people all day long. I can't figure out the income statistics I saw either. If they bill 60-120 per hour, then how do the median salaries end up in the 30-40k range?
The physician assistant idea came up because health care seems like a secure profession, good income, your choice of location, consistent demand over economic boom and bust. But working in a medical facility probably doesn't fit my personality either. Too highly scheduled, too much face time with people. Plus I'm more interested in the mind and ideas than the body anyway. I wish I were more interested in it, instead of just thinking it's a "good" field. That sort of thinking is how I ended up in engineering.
Librarian or something related probably fits my interests best, since I love to read and research things. My programming talents might be of use there too. The salary expectation is frightening though. I don't have expensive tastes, but I want to always own a home, and I need retirement savings, and I'd just flip out if I had to use HMO type health care and couldn't afford to go around it. There also aren't any MLS programs at any schools in my town, so I'd have to relocate, or do distance learning. Part of the appeal of the career change is spending a couple years as a student again, getting that interaction with people. If any of the local universities had a program in it, I think I'd start right away. Looks like the good programs are in the Midwest or East. It would be hard to leave the west coast. It just seems wrong.
Posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 2:09:08
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change » Tabitha, posted by mikhail99 on January 22, 2003, at 10:18:51
Goodness, Mik, I'm not sure if you want a pep talk, but it wouldn't hurt to apply to nursing schools would it? Just to see what happens. Break it down into tiny steps, like looking up schools, getting the application, filling out one box of the form, etc. It seems like there's good demand for nurses now. (Of course if I could take my own advice about tiny steps I wouldn't be a year behind on certain paperwork right now.)
The thing that scares me is the programs that want recommendation letters. I'm afraid of asking anyone to do that for me. Many of them want 3! Three letters!
Posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 2:16:38
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change » Tabitha, posted by jay on January 22, 2003, at 10:57:14
Hi Jay, tell me more! Maybe U.S. is a little different than Canada. You can get licensed as an MFT with several different MA and MS degrees, plus 3000 hours internship. I was most attracted to MS or MA in Clinical Psychology, just because I don't have much interest in social welfare programs which I thought would be emphasized more in MSW. I'm most interested in doing therapy.
I saw on the US labor statistics site, median salary for MFT is 30-40k. Seemed low to me based on billing rates, even with sliding scale factored in.
Posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 2:25:19
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by Mr Beev on January 22, 2003, at 14:39:10
Thanks Mr Beev. Hmm, how does one make even a modest living in philosophy? Do you teach? Don't answer if you're trying to protect privacy.
I'll check out those books. I used to read "Your Money Or Your Life" and dream of escape from the work world altogether. Their whole scheme was to stick it out at the high-paying job as long as you could stand, while investing in fixed-income bonds. When your investment income met your reduced expenses, boom, you're free! Of course that was when the interest rate on such bonds was 8%.
Posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 2:42:23
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by Mashogr8 on January 22, 2003, at 15:40:42
You know what, Mash, speech/language pathologist and audiologist are predicted as fastest growing careers in the U.S. over 2000-2010 time frame.
(I was confused about whether you're still in English or you did go into speech/language so excuse me if this post doesn't make sense)
I also have regret about not choosing medical school after high school. My parents were blue collar and I didn't think they would support a decision to go into a profession that required more than 4 years college. Little did I know, what's 11 years of training compared to the years you'll spend working? Not much. I wish I'd gone for it. (Though the appeal was more the income, prestige, and intellectual challenge of it rather than any real desire to practice medicine.) I was looking up info about medical school too, and I don't even have the undergraduate coursework required. I read that schools in the UK typically limit admissions to those under age 30, and it hit me, the US probably does something similar. It might truly be too late for that one.
I did have a friend who started training in Chinese medicine and acupuncture at age 50. In my state, acupunturists can get licensed to be primary care doctors! She's probably done by now. Before that, she was a part-time piano teacher eking out a living.
Posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 2:56:28
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change--tabitha and mls/msw, posted by lostsailor on January 23, 2003, at 19:16:15
Thanks, Sailor. I saw the ALA site already from BecomeALibrarian.com (just love that URL name).
Tell me more, are you in library school now? Did working in the mental health field make you, er, more crazy?
Posted by noa on January 24, 2003, at 5:34:06
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change--tabitha and mls/msw, posted by lostsailor on January 23, 2003, at 19:16:15
I think library science is quite different from social work or nursing in that you would use more skills in organizing data, and using computers, whereas in nursing and especially social work, you would use a lot more of your "self" (although they also require organization and information management, just not as much).
Posted by noa on January 24, 2003, at 5:37:17
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change, posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 1:56:30
Tab, what about moving into a different area of computers, like content writing or web design? These would both involve research.
As to the salary vs. the billing rates discrepancy you noticed, I think the billing rates are for private practice therapists, while the salary quotes are probably for people working in agencies, clinics, hospitals, etc.
Posted by lostsailor on January 24, 2003, at 10:00:29
In reply to Re: Midlife Career Change--tabitha and mls/msw » lostsailor, posted by Tabitha on January 24, 2003, at 2:56:28
Tab,
I don’t know really, but it did not help. I loved and always desired to "make a difference" and thought being a social worker would be the best choice. But to really become skilled there are many "undesirable ' jobs that you will prob. take. Child welfare or any family violence related one takes a toll.
Instead of a haven if you are still experiencing symptoms. The profession is cutthroat.
Not knowing Calis. rules on billing, the NY ones would you have obtain you Masters in Social work--not just counseling, (2 years) with a busy unpaid internship. Billings ins comps is only allowed after achieving an "R number" (for registered) This will take, on average about five years after completing your MSW.
On the MLS... there are many options after grad. I think I will be the longest student in my departs. history eventually. On In NY alone there is one at SUNY Buffalo (mine), SUNY Albany, SUNY Stony Brooke- I think and one at Syracuse University. I think there is at least one other, too.
Good Luck,~Tony
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