Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 1108690

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Re: Nardil to Marplan undopaminergic

Posted by Jadde on February 28, 2020, at 18:18:46

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by undopaminergic on February 28, 2020, at 3:00:41

> >
> > Funny thing happened when I dcd Nardil, I had a day or two of euphoria. Strange drugs.
> >
>
> What is "dcd"?

Sorry, discontinued.

>
> > Thanks for the advice, may we both have a successful journey with Marplan!
> >
>
> Good luck to both of you, I wish I could join in, but they don't have Marplan (or other classic MAOIs) here.


Sorry to hear that. I became psychotic on Parnate, and prior to that it wasnt as effective as Nardil (for me not even close). So whatever similarities their are with Nardil and Marplan I have hopes that Marplan will also work for me.

> -undopaminergic
>

Jade

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by Jadde on February 28, 2020, at 18:22:36

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by undopaminergic on February 28, 2020, at 3:06:00

> > Obv it's best to be safe but if you find yourself having to do less than 14days you'll be ok. At least in my opinion.
> >
>
> I agree. There is no obvious reason why there should be a problem. Both have the same effect, mainly. Nardil has a GABAergic metabolite, but that would seem, if anything, to make it safer.
>
> -undopaminergic

Im on the fence. Picking up Marplan tomorrow so I will decide soon. Thank you for your advice,

Jade


 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by Jadde on February 29, 2020, at 7:35:38

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by Jadde on February 28, 2020, at 18:22:36

https://ww2.health.wa.gov.au/~/media/Files/Corporate/general%20documents/WATAG/WAPDC/Antidepressant-switching-strategies-March-2013.pdf

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by Jadde on February 29, 2020, at 7:36:58

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by Jadde on February 29, 2020, at 7:35:38

https://gpnotebook.com/simplepage.cfm?ID=x20190918181526587321&linkID=80188&cook=yes

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by Lamdage22 on February 29, 2020, at 10:30:39

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by Jadde on February 29, 2020, at 7:36:58

It's not just meds that can help. Just keep that in mind in case it doesn't work out.

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan Lamdage22

Posted by Jadde on February 29, 2020, at 13:37:33

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by Lamdage22 on February 29, 2020, at 10:30:39

> It's not just meds that can help. Just keep that in mind in case it doesn't work out.

I will. I know there are many ways I could improve my mental health that dont involve meds. However, when you find a med that brings you out of deep despair (Nardil) its hard to remember that some things are under your control. For example, I know that exercise, proper diet, and therapy all have their place. For me, those things alone do not treat my depression in a way that a good med does.

Jade

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by Lamdage22 on February 29, 2020, at 23:14:11

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan undopaminergic, posted by Jadde on February 28, 2020, at 18:18:46

Well, I improved as much or more from regular blueberries as I did with Venlafaxine or Trazodone. To be fair, I'm on a low dose of both. I don't like the sexual side effects of Venlafaxine and I don't like the evil metabolite of Trazodone. My feeling is that higher dosages wouldn't even be more effective. The blueberries don't have any side effects. But yeah, I wish I had a full response to an Antidepressant, too. But I have given up on that for now. Too many trials. Too many disappointments and nasty side effects. And not much left to try anyway.

My best bet for the remaining 50% of depression and anxiety right now is therapy. I think I can't drug away the issues that my upbringing has caused. The dentist had to give me a pep talk because no one else does. These things are so important. I hope to find a good therapist. I am scheduled for Thursday. Sounded nice on the telephone.

Good luck to you. MAOI turned me into a maniac. I have gotten rid of a lot of friends that way. But when I felt good on MAOI, it was awesome. So I get it. I just don't like to see when people think their life is over when they don't respond to meds.

 

Re: Question

Posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 10:46:53

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by Lamdage22 on February 29, 2020, at 23:14:11

If I were to quickly cross taper Nardil to Marplan, will I still experience all the withdrawals coming off of Nardil? Or will the Marplan, being an MAOI, cancel those out?

My thinking is that if Im gonna go thru the w/ds either way, I may as well do the slow taper off Nardil then start Marplan a couple of weeks later. If Marplan will cancel those out the fast cross taper makes more sense.

Picking up Marplan today.

Thanks, Jade

 

Re: Question

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 2, 2020, at 11:03:44

In reply to Re: Question, posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 10:46:53

I felt more anxious after an abrupt switch from Nardil to Parnate, not more depressed, however.

 

Re: Question

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 2, 2020, at 11:06:36

In reply to Re: Question, posted by Lamdage22 on March 2, 2020, at 11:03:44

Which makes sense as Nardil is a GABA-T inhibitor and i believe Parnate has a stimulating metabolite?

 

Re: Question

Posted by undopaminergic on March 2, 2020, at 13:00:08

In reply to Re: Question, posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 10:46:53

> If I were to quickly cross taper Nardil to Marplan, will I still experience all the withdrawals coming off of Nardil? Or will the Marplan, being an MAOI, cancel those out?
>

Cross-titration will keep the MAO inhibition in effect; as the MAOI effects from phenelzine (Nardil) diminish, the MAOI effects from isocarboxazid (Marplan) will increase, keeping up the effect, and so, there will be no withdrawal with respect to MAO inhibition.

However, Nardil has a GABAergic metabolite that Marplan lacks, and you may experience some withrawal from that as you phase out Nardil. If you go slow, you should be all right.

-undopaminergic

 

Re: Question

Posted by PeterMartin on March 2, 2020, at 13:59:10

In reply to Re: Question, posted by undopaminergic on March 2, 2020, at 13:00:08

I just did this switch (Nardil-->Marplan w/o a washout) in January and did once a couple years ago.

I actually felt pretty good for the first 2 weeks or so after switching. I don't remember having any w/d the last time around but I did have some issues this time. Really the big problem I had was restless leg (zaps). I can't be 100% sure that they came about due to stopping Nardil and not some other reason but there ws a period of 10 days or so I had terrible sleep. It would make sense that the decrease in Gaba could have caused me to have that issue.

The great news is I'm doing fantastic the past week or so. It's very much like the first time I too Maprlan where I just feel like "my best self". I'm on point/positive and my brain backs up that feeling (vs. trying to undercut/doubt everything).

I hope you dont' experience much w/d and get to a good place w/ Marplan. It seems to be a med that works really well for the people who it does work for......sounds odd but......it's definitely the best medicine I've found for me to this point (1999 to 2020).

I should note my other meds though:

Marplan 40mg (since Jan 9)
Desipramine 25mg (Only 8days so far)
Lamictal 200mg (Unichem verified batch)
Metformin 1500 (Mylan IR verified batch)
Seroquel ~25mg (for sleep)

I have been drinking crystal light the past few weeks also which has aspartame (breaks down to phenylalanine). I do think that may help a touch as well and I know there's a lot of "bad news" research about Aspartame. At some point I'll go back to water only but I'm not looking to tinker w/ too much while I'm doing really well for the first time in a months.

Good luck!!

 

Re: Question Lamdage22

Posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 14:50:12

In reply to Re: Question, posted by Lamdage22 on March 2, 2020, at 11:03:44

> I felt more anxious after an abrupt switch from Nardil to Parnate, not more depressed, however.

What was abrupt in terms of time? One day Nardil, the next Parnate?

 

Re: Question undopaminergic

Posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 14:57:20

In reply to Re: Question, posted by undopaminergic on March 2, 2020, at 13:00:08


>
> However, Nardil has a GABAergic metabolite that Marplan lacks, and you may experience some withrawal from that as you phase out Nardil. If you go slow, you should be all right.
>
> -undopaminergic
>

The GABA that Marplan lacks is making me nervous. Im wondering if the amount of GABA in Nardil was one of its big benefits. I did not find Nardil to be a relaxing med. I liked the energy it gave me. Cognitively Im crap right now, making this decision even more difficult. Ugh

 

Re: Question PeterMartin

Posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 15:07:16

In reply to Re: Question, posted by PeterMartin on March 2, 2020, at 13:59:10

> I just did this switch (Nardil-->Marplan w/o a washout) in January and did once a couple years ago.

So one day Nardil, the next Marplan? My doc has me on this schedule (havent started yet):

4/0
3/1
2/2
1/3
And then 3 Marplan daily for a couple of weeks, till I see him again.
Too fast?

> I actually felt pretty good for the first 2 weeks or so after switching. I don't remember having any w/d the last time around but I did have some issues this time. Really the big problem I had was restless leg (zaps). I can't be 100% sure that they came about due to stopping Nardil and not some other reason but there ws a period of 10 days or so I had terrible sleep. It would make sense that the decrease in Gaba could have caused me to have that issue.
>
> The great news is I'm doing fantastic the past week or so. It's very much like the first time I too Maprlan where I just feel like "my best self". I'm on point/positive and my brain backs up that feeling (vs. trying to undercut/doubt everything).
>

Hey thats awesome!

> I hope you dont' experience much w/d and get to a good place w/ Marplan. It seems to be a med that works really well for the people who it does work for......sounds odd but......it's definitely the best medicine I've found for me to this point (1999 to 2020).
>
> I should note my other meds though:
>
> Marplan 40mg (since Jan 9)
> Desipramine 25mg (Only 8days so far)
> Lamictal 200mg (Unichem verified batch)
> Metformin 1500 (Mylan IR verified batch)
> Seroquel ~25mg (for sleep)

Do any of these meds replace GABA?

>
> I have been drinking crystal light the past few weeks also which has aspartame (breaks down to phenylalanine). I do think that may help a touch as well and I know there's a lot of "bad news" research about Aspartame. At some point I'll go back to water only but I'm not looking to tinker w/ too much while I'm doing really well for the first time in a months.
>
This is funny, I too drink several glasses of Crystal Light each day.

> Good luck!!

Thanks!

Jade

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan Jadde

Posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:42:37

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan SLS, posted by Jadde on February 27, 2020, at 7:26:55

Hi.

Sorry I haven't been around for a few days.

I started taking Marplan yesterday after a 10-day washout from Effexor.

I had a similar reaction to the discontinuation of Nardil in 1990. I ended up being hospitalized for psychotic mania.


- Scott

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan PeterMartin

Posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:46:42

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by PeterMartin on February 27, 2020, at 21:00:44

Hi.

I'm glad that you are feeling better. It gives me hope. How long have you been taking 40 mg/day for? Is your doctor willing to go up to 60 mg/day?

I began taking Marplan yesterday with a 10mg dose late in the day. Today I'll take 20 mg. How quickly did you increase the dosage?


- Scott

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by Stargazer2 on March 3, 2020, at 9:51:09

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan Jadde, posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:42:37

Scott,
Good luck with Marplan. I am hoping you get a good response with it. It will be on my list to try if necessary. I think I told you it was the first AD that made a difference in my life. I hope it can do this for you.
SG2

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan undopaminergic

Posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:52:10

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by undopaminergic on February 28, 2020, at 3:00:41

> Good luck to both of you, I wish I could join in, but they don't have Marplan (or other classic MAOIs) here.

That totally sucks! I'm sorry to hear that. Where do you live? Is there any way you can import medication? I imported clomipramine (Anafranil) from Canada in the 1980s before it was approved in the U.S. In 2000, I imported reboxetine from Britain. My doctor simply wrote a prescription which I sent to the British pharmacy.

Best wishes.


- Scott

 

Re: Question

Posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 10:00:43

In reply to Re: Question, posted by PeterMartin on March 2, 2020, at 13:59:10

> Good luck!!

Good luck!!

:-)


- Scott

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 10:04:05

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan, posted by Stargazer2 on March 3, 2020, at 9:51:09

Hi.

> Good luck with Marplan. I am hoping you get a good response with it. It will be on my list to try if necessary. I think I told you it was the first AD that made a difference in my life. I hope it can do this for you.

Thanks.

I started taking Marplan yesterday. I am encouraged by what people have said here.

Are you taking Trintellix?

Best wishes...


- Scott

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan SLS

Posted by undopaminergic on March 3, 2020, at 11:57:32

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan undopaminergic, posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:52:10

> > Good luck to both of you, I wish I could join in, but they don't have Marplan (or other classic MAOIs) here.
>
> That totally sucks! I'm sorry to hear that. Where do you live?

North Europe.

> Is there any way you can import medication? I imported clomipramine (Anafranil) from Canada in the 1980s before it was approved in the U.S. In 2000, I imported reboxetine from Britain. My doctor simply wrote a prescription which I sent to the British pharmacy.
>

Not at this time... I'm hospitalised, and I don't think my doctor would go along with it. Moreover, I'm currently trying to give trimipramine (Surmontil) an adequate evaluation. It seems to be working a bit -- I'm so positive, even while (occasionally) fantasising about death.

It is actually possible to get special permission, from the medicines regulatory authority, to prescribe unapproved drugs. The challenge is to get a doctor to do that.

> Best wishes.

Thanks.

-undopaminergic

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan SLS

Posted by Jadde on March 3, 2020, at 13:48:36

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan Jadde, posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:42:37

> Hi.
>
> Sorry I haven't been around for a few days.
>
> I started taking Marplan yesterday after a 10-day washout from Effexor.
>
> I had a similar reaction to the discontinuation of Nardil in 1990. I ended up being hospitalized for psychotic mania.
>
>
> - Scott

Hey, sorry to hear that. Must have been frightening :(

Im down to the nitty gritty. Ive taken 3 Nardil today, I have Marplan in my possession. My choices (as I see them):

A. Do the cross taper my doc prescribed 3/1, 2/2, 1/3 then continue with 3 tabs Marplan for 2 weeks till I see him again. So 3 day crossover. Yikes

B. Continue to taper off Nardil for 3-4 weeks, wait 14 days, then start Marplan.

My brain is not working at full capacity. Not gonna lie, Im scared.

Plan A is so tempting right now, but my reactions to meds are so inconsistent that caution seems the way to go. Of course, Im wondering if Marplan will be more effective if Im quick about doing the crossover. Ugh.

 

Re: Nardil to Marplan

Posted by PeterMartin on March 3, 2020, at 17:23:34

In reply to Re: Nardil to Marplan PeterMartin, posted by SLS on March 3, 2020, at 9:46:42

> Hi.
>
> I'm glad that you are feeling better. It gives me hope. How long have you been taking 40 mg/day for? Is your doctor willing to go up to 60 mg/day?

I've been taking 40 since the 17th of Jan, so a little over six weeks. I saw my doctor just before it really started kicking in. I was on Ritalin (60mg which is high IMHO) and I started wanting off of that and it definitely confounded my perception of how Maplan was working. I think the fact that I took myself off rather than getting a refill is a good sign. Marplan tends to make me better at not caving to addictive chemicals. I quit smoking on it and also alcohol when I started in 2010. That's just a bunch.

Anyway when I saw my doc I was going through w/d from the ritain. It was the Monday after quitting taking my last pill the Friday prior. I was zonked and down - no energy as expected. He suggested we go to 60 on Marplan but at the moment my insurance isn't covering any of it. They will once I hit my deductible but since it's so expensive I asked if we could just add 25mg of Desipramine. The day after (I don't think it was the deal / more time and getting over the Ritalin w/d) I started to feel much better. I've been very focused on computer work that I've usually enjoy but have put off for a long time. Very driven at the moment which is what I was hoping for....

My bp was also low around the time (110/70) I wanted off of Ritalin so that's an indication to me that Marplan was definitely doing it's thing. My bp today is 97/70 - a good sign when on an MAOi.

So I'd say w/in 4 or 5 weeks it was starting to work. It's soooo much cleaner to me than Nardil. I don't have specific side effects that I attribute to it. Don't even have anorgasmia at the moment but that may be because I was beyond that point on Nardil before.

> I began taking Marplan yesterday with a 10mg dose late in the day. Today I'll take 20 mg. How quickly did you increase the dosage?
>

I honestly think you should go up to 40 w/in 3 days and then roll w it. I think I stopped Nardil then did Marplan 20 for the first day and then 40 the day after. No side effects that I can attribute to it.....

I really hope it works for you. I think I have some depersonalization issues that it helps a lot w also. Im full of self doubt even when I know I'm right....and somehow w Marplan I'm much more on point.

Sorry if this is rambling I'm typing on my phone and don't have time to proofread.

 

Re: Question

Posted by Lamdage22 on March 3, 2020, at 20:16:52

In reply to Re: Question Lamdage22, posted by Jadde on March 2, 2020, at 14:50:12

I think it was like that. But please don't base your decision solely on this, because I am not entirely sure.

> What was abrupt in terms of time? One day Nardil, the next Parnate?
>


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