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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 13:51:09
I'm trying to figure out if the weight gain I
am experiencing is from Lithium.Is this a very common side effect of lithium?
Posted by Squiggles on November 26, 2002, at 16:19:39
In reply to lithium weight gain, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 13:51:09
Hi JohnX2,
How long have you been taking lithium?Squiggles
Posted by JonW on November 26, 2002, at 16:34:59
In reply to lithium weight gain, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 13:51:09
>
> I'm trying to figure out if the weight gain I
> am experiencing is from Lithium.
>
> Is this a very common side effect of lithium?Some one I know is on a complex "cocktail" and ballooned up once lithium was added. I understand weight gain to be a fairly common side-effect. Lithium can cause hypo-thyroidism which can be associated with weight gain. As a layperson, I wonder if Synthroid would be helpful? Who knows, the cause of the weight gain probably isn't from hypo-thyroidism, but the effect on thyroid function sure can't help matters. Just some thoughts...
Jon
Posted by Squiggles on November 26, 2002, at 16:43:24
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain, posted by JonW on November 26, 2002, at 16:34:59
Lithium definitely causes hypothyroidism,
though only in about 10% of all taking it
and mostly in women. Infact, lithium is
used for hyperthyroidism.I think that part of the weight gain may
be the hypothyroidism. I know that i started
gaining a lot more weight when my dr. lowered
my Synthroid level. I am hypothyroidic yet
still take Synthroid to counteract the lithium
effect. My thyroid is functioning at 15%.I know that many clinicians and doctors swear
that hypothyroidism does not cause weight gain,
but that has not been my experience.Whether lithium causes weight gain *indirectly*
in this way or not, i am not sure. There is
the water gain to consider as well.However, you need not balloon if you watch your
food intake and check your thyroid level with
your doctor.Squiggles
Posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:52:28
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JohnX2, posted by Squiggles on November 26, 2002, at 16:19:39
> Hi JohnX2,
> How long have you been taking lithium?
>
> SquigglesLithium for 6 months. Started Serzone a bit sooner.
Posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:55:45
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain, posted by JonW on November 26, 2002, at 16:34:59
> >
> > I'm trying to figure out if the weight gain I
> > am experiencing is from Lithium.
> >
> > Is this a very common side effect of lithium?
>
> Some one I know is on a complex "cocktail" and ballooned up once lithium was added. I understand weight gain to be a fairly common side-effect. Lithium can cause hypo-thyroidism which can be associated with weight gain. As a layperson, I wonder if Synthroid would be helpful? Who knows, the cause of the weight gain probably isn't from hypo-thyroidism, but the effect on thyroid function sure can't help matters. Just some thoughts...
>
> JonI don't even think the lithium does squat for me. It doesn't do jack for manic symptoms (it never got to a high blood level) and I don't think it helps depression. Maybe it has some neuroprotective effects. I seem to be on it for the sake of being on it. I can't sort out if the
weight gain is the Lithium or Serzone.Thanks
Posted by Squiggles on November 26, 2002, at 17:01:50
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » Squiggles, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:52:28
Lithium is not the only drug that will
make you gain weight in 6 months - many
ADs do that - for a number of reasons;
psychologically (and i think at 6 months
it is psychological and not a thyroid
problem -- btw almost all ADs have an
effect on the thyroid - lowering it);
the main reason i think is the relaxation
that you get from a previous depressed and/or
anxious state; that increases your appetite.I think it would take more than 6 months
to blame it on the thyroid for lithium;Squiggles
Posted by Ritch on November 26, 2002, at 20:52:47
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JonW, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:55:45
> > >
> > > I'm trying to figure out if the weight gain I
> > > am experiencing is from Lithium.
> > >
> > > Is this a very common side effect of lithium?
> >
> > Some one I know is on a complex "cocktail" and ballooned up once lithium was added. I understand weight gain to be a fairly common side-effect. Lithium can cause hypo-thyroidism which can be associated with weight gain. As a layperson, I wonder if Synthroid would be helpful? Who knows, the cause of the weight gain probably isn't from hypo-thyroidism, but the effect on thyroid function sure can't help matters. Just some thoughts...
> >
> > Jon
>
> I don't even think the lithium does squat for me. It doesn't do jack for manic symptoms (it never got to a high blood level) and I don't think it helps depression. Maybe it has some neuroprotective effects. I seem to be on it for the sake of being on it. I can't sort out if the
> weight gain is the Lithium or Serzone.
>
> Thanks
>
>
Hi John, my theory on the weight gain issue with mood stabilizers is.. if you quickly feel a "water-retention, edema-like thing" situation with either Lithium or Depakote, then it is definitely the med that is the *cause*. If the weight gain happens much later while being on it, I suspect that it has to do with reduced hyperkinetic calorie-burning activiites such as incessant pacing and fidgeting. Maybe it is time for some thyroid blood levels and maybe some T3/T4 augmentation?
Posted by comftnumb on November 26, 2002, at 21:54:38
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JonW, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:55:45
Maybe you should try a different mood stabilizer, say Depakote or Topamax? Don't do Neurontin. It doesn't do jack for manic symptoms.
Posted by JonW on November 26, 2002, at 23:00:22
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JonW, posted by JohnX2 on November 26, 2002, at 16:55:45
> I don't even think the lithium does squat for me. It doesn't do jack for manic symptoms (it never got to a high blood level) and I don't think it helps depression. Maybe it has some neuroprotective effects. I seem to be on it for the sake of being on it. I can't sort out if the
> weight gain is the Lithium or Serzone.John,
I looked up Lithium on RxList.com and "excessive weight gain" is one of the possible side-effects. I also looked up Serzone, and the incidence of weight gain is less than or equal to placebo. All things being equal, I would put my money on Lithium as the culprit. Are you taking any other meds that could be causing you to gain weight? You eluded to possibly dropping the Lithium, and maybe that would be best... but make sure you do it with your pdoc and go slowly. The pdocs I've been to all agree that with bipolar disorder, or any severe mental illness for that matter, it's best to first get the patient well and then start taking things away. However, increased side-effects without effect certainly doesn't help someone deal with a severe depression. Do anti-depressants work for you? Would you say that you deteriorate when they are pulled away? I'm sure I don't have to tell you how frustrating the relationship between bipolar disorder and ADs has become... If you benefit from ADs, I hope you can find a way to tolerate them and possibly something more potent than Serzone. Have you ever been on Synthroid? Pushing someone with bipolar disorder into hypo-thyroidism can enable them to tolerate ADs. The dangers of hypo-thyroidism are far less than the dangers of untreated bipolar disorder.
Jon
Posted by Squiggles on November 27, 2002, at 6:26:35
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JohnX2, posted by JonW on November 26, 2002, at 23:00:22
I get the impression from this post that
lithium may not be the number one choice
for bipolar, possibly for the weight gain
in the case.Jon sounds like he knows a lot more than
i do about relative merits of these drugs;
i wonder if you could elucidate on any
articles or studies that compare long-term
treatment of lithium versus the alternatives.Thanks
Squiggles
Posted by JonW on November 27, 2002, at 19:35:42
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JonW, posted by Squiggles on November 27, 2002, at 6:26:35
> I get the impression from this post that
> lithium may not be the number one choice
> for bipolar, possibly for the weight gain
> in the case.
>
> Jon sounds like he knows a lot more than
> i do about relative merits of these drugs;
> i wonder if you could elucidate on any
> articles or studies that compare long-term
> treatment of lithium versus the alternatives.
>
> Thanks
>
> SquigglesI appreciate the assumption, but unfortunately I don't have the specific information you're asking for. I do know that in general Lithium is thought to be better for bipolar I, and anti-convulsants and atypical anti-psychotics are thought to be better for rapid cycling and bipolar II. You might want to try searching PubMed to see if you can uncover any abstracts that talk about long-term outcome.
Jon
Posted by Squiggles on November 27, 2002, at 20:03:23
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » Squiggles, posted by JonW on November 27, 2002, at 19:35:42
Thanks Jon,
Yup, those are pretty "scientific" reports;
Unfortunately, i was diagnosed bipolar so
long ago, that the distinction between I and
II did not exist - showing my age, LOL!
Well, i did get roller coaster rides between
depression and elation at incredibly fast
intervals -- say 10 seconds -- but that was
at the critical point before i crashed into
the pits of hell. Does that sound like
BP I or II?Squiggles
Posted by JonW on November 27, 2002, at 21:42:42
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » JonW, posted by Squiggles on November 27, 2002, at 20:03:23
> Thanks Jon,
>
> Yup, those are pretty "scientific" reports;
> Unfortunately, i was diagnosed bipolar so
> long ago, that the distinction between I and
> II did not exist - showing my age, LOL!
> Well, i did get roller coaster rides between
> depression and elation at incredibly fast
> intervals -- say 10 seconds -- but that was
> at the critical point before i crashed into
> the pits of hell. Does that sound like
> BP I or II?
>
> SquigglesWhat you describe sounds more like bipolar II than I to me, but I never heard of anyone cycling so rapidly. This is obviously a very controversial topic, but if you don't clearly fit into the bipolar spectrum, you should consider that your "cycling" could be the result of the reactive mood associated with atypical depression. If you were diagnosed so long ago it would seem that you would've had to show clear signs of bipolar disorder, though... Do you have manic or hypo-manic episodes?
Jon
Posted by Squiggles on November 27, 2002, at 22:44:20
In reply to Re: lithium weight gain » Squiggles, posted by JonW on November 27, 2002, at 21:42:42
With the lithium, i feel no pain; though
i really must monitor the dose esp. after
so many yrs. There is a constant nagging
doubt in my mind about my dx - was it Valium
withdrawal - it's too late now; they did
put me on imipramine a couple of yrs before
for depression but it made me horribly ill.As i said, the lithium stabilized me like
a miracle within a week, after the very
bad depression and agitatation anxiety
(sleepless and without eating for a week,
and regression of ego - every heard of that?)Anyway, i am forever greatful to my drs.
including Dr. Hughes who saved my life.Squiggles
This is the end of the thread.
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