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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by iforgotmypassword on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
does anyone know what is the specific neurological cause of apathy, amotivation (and/or possibly cognitive defecits) stemming from long-term (or even short-term) marijuana use?
i worry that my use in my teens did a lot of damage, as pot tended to effect in me in absolute off the wall bizarre ways compared to everyone else who would just get calm and mellow. every time i think about it i wonder if the initial ultra inspiring and creative-feeling effects, overstimulation/paranoia, and terrible comedowns burnt out my ability to ever be truly inspired, motivated or sensible again in my life.
Posted by SLS on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to neurological effects of long term marijuana use, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 2, 2005, at 14:49:48
> does anyone know what is the specific neurological cause of apathy, amotivation (and/or possibly cognitive defecits) stemming from long-term (or even short-term) marijuana use?
>
> i worry that my use in my teens did a lot of damage, as pot tended to effect in me in absolute off the wall bizarre ways compared to everyone else who would just get calm and mellow. every time i think about it i wonder if the initial ultra inspiring and creative-feeling effects, overstimulation/paranoia, and terrible comedowns burnt out my ability to ever be truly inspired, motivated or sensible again in my life.
How do you currently measure your performance in these areas? How do you know you have suffered any kind of deterioration?How old are you?
- Scott
Posted by med_empowered on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana use » iforgotmypassword, posted by SLS on October 2, 2005, at 15:33:40
I wouldn't worry about it. One study I read found that the whole "amotivational syndrome" they attributed to pot way back when wasn't really due to pot per se--if you notice, a lot of the "amotivational syndrome" symptoms overlap with depression; it seems that those with depression and bipolar disorder are more likely to smoke pot, and smoke it heavily, than other people, so what people were observing was more or less mood disorder pot effects. Pot doesn't cause brain damage and it doesn't seem to be carcinogenic, either...if you're having any sort of cognitive impairment or emotional ill-effects, odds are they'll wear off in about 4 weeks. Personally, I've seen many a stoner dry out and come out with sprakling intellects after about 4 weeks of abstinence or very, very reduced use...I seriously doubt you're going to suffer any long-term problems. Good luck!
Posted by blueberry on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to neurological effects of long term marijuana use, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 2, 2005, at 14:49:48
I often wonder the same thing from previous years of chronic usage. But honestly, I don't think it did any damage from the pot, but maybe from holding it in and starving the brain for oxygen could have killed off some brain cells. But why that would only affect mood and nothing else kind of dampens that theory.
I think chronic use of pot is maybe a good indicator that there is a dopamine deficient brain chemistry. The dopamine release from smoking pot fixes it, temporarily. Or possibly a GABA deficient chemistry. And then when we are treated with serotonin meds, we wonder why we don't get better. I think it's a dopamine thing. Just my own theories though.
Posted by iforgotmypassword on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana use » iforgotmypassword, posted by SLS on October 2, 2005, at 15:33:40
> > does anyone know what is the specific neurological cause of apathy, amotivation (and/or possibly cognitive defecits) stemming from long-term (or even short-term) marijuana use?
> >
> > i worry that my use in my teens did a lot of damage, as pot tended to effect in me in absolute off the wall bizarre ways compared to everyone else who would just get calm and mellow. every time i think about it i wonder if the initial ultra inspiring and creative-feeling effects, overstimulation/paranoia, and terrible comedowns burnt out my ability to ever be truly inspired, motivated or sensible again in my life.
>
>
> How do you currently measure your performance in these areas? How do you know you have suffered any kind of deterioration?
>
> How old are you?
>
>
> - Scott
>i'm 21. i don't know whether to attribute the effects to the pot or not... but when i started the effects were so wonderful inspirationally. now i truly don't see any colour to the world. i was taking it as a means to self-medicate. but the positive effects started to die with age. i would just be a babbling, clumsy, falling down, carried away idiot, not really enjoying anything, but for some reason seeming like it. i don't know why it took so long to stop.
the thing that was really noticable was the year i started smoking pot heavily, i failed practically all of my classes, and it only got worse... i was bad to begin with but now i struggle to do anything. i'm incompetent no matter what i try to do. anything external, requiring concetration in the world, my brain just falls apart, i don't even see the world anymore. just simple a few simple concepts that for some strange reason manage to keep my pellet-sized mind entertained.
Posted by SLS on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 2, 2005, at 17:50:11
Hi.
There is some indication that long-term use of marijuana can have negative effects on memory. What you are talking about is a more global loss of interest, motivation, cognitive slowing, and anhedonia. These things seem to me to be better attributed to a mood disorder. That you sense that you were self-medicating indicates that there was something you were medicating yourself for. You might have been suffering from a mild depression in your teens that has since grown in severity.
Marijuana did not treat me well when I was in my teens. It was anxiogenic rather than anxiolytic. Perhaps this type of reaction to marijuana is a reflection of the presence of a mood disorder. I don't know.
If you haven't already done so, perhaps it would be in your best interests to abstain from using marijuana, at least temporarily. It couldn't hurt. You will then be able to better evaluate your baseline mental health.
I think it is depression that is the cause of those things you are presently experiencing and are concerned with.
- Scott
----------------------------------------------------
> i'm 21. i don't know whether to attribute the effects to the pot or not... but when i started the effects were so wonderful inspirationally. now i truly don't see any colour to the world. i was taking it as a means to self-medicate. but the positive effects started to die with age. i would just be a babbling, clumsy, falling down, carried away idiot, not really enjoying anything, but for some reason seeming like it. i don't know why it took so long to stop.
>
> the thing that was really noticable was the year i started smoking pot heavily, i failed practically all of my classes, and it only got worse... i was bad to begin with but now i struggle to do anything. i'm incompetent no matter what i try to do. anything external, requiring concetration in the world, my brain just falls apart, i don't even see the world anymore. just simple a few simple concepts that for some strange reason manage to keep my pellet-sized mind entertained.
Posted by Phillipa on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » iforgotmypassword, posted by SLS on October 2, 2005, at 18:33:06
I only tried it a few times but I self medicated with alchohol for many years. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by iforgotmypassword on October 5, 2005, at 13:50:36
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » iforgotmypassword, posted by SLS on October 2, 2005, at 18:33:06
my inpatient doctor doesn't agree. he says that i have personality disorder and mentioned nothing else. he didn't specify which one, but he did say cluster B.
ugh. i really don't want to know where my life is headed.
Posted by SLS on October 5, 2005, at 13:52:00
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » SLS, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 3, 2005, at 2:58:57
> my inpatient doctor doesn't agree. he says that i have personality disorder and mentioned nothing else. he didn't specify which one, but he did say cluster B.
I defer to the professional community for your care. Axis II diagnoses are very complicated and not easily interpreted by laymen. However, I would encourage you to get a second opinion on your diagnosis and treatment, even if only to be more confident that you are being treated properly.
> ugh. i really don't want to know where my life is headed.Nor do I. Well, then again, I sort of do. I know in which direction I am not headed. I am headed away from mental illness and towards mental health. Be positive and constructive. The healthier you become, the more you will see yourself building a life in a direction that you choose and that you are happy with.
You might have some obstacles yet to overcome in seeking the right treatment and working through that treatment, but don't stop now. Try to be proactive and assertive with the professionals. This can be very difficult and anxiety-provoking, but you need to take care of you, not the egos of those who are treating you.
All easier said than done...
- Scott
Posted by Phillipa on October 5, 2005, at 13:52:01
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » iforgotmypassword, posted by SLS on October 3, 2005, at 9:00:50
Scott, how true. But after a while the doctors disagree on meds and leave you so confused. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by tizza on October 6, 2005, at 22:44:44
In reply to neurological effects of long term marijuana use, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 2, 2005, at 14:49:48
I am absolutly positive, without a shadow of a doubt that marijuana has caused more damage to my brain than any other drug on this earth and I think alcohol has come a very close second. Not a bad effort for so called soft drug catagory.
Posted by Phil on October 7, 2005, at 16:31:44
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana use, posted by tizza on October 6, 2005, at 22:44:44
I am absolutly positive, without a shadow of a doubt that marijuana has caused more damage to my brain than any other drug on this earth..
___________
What drugs have you done? What kind of 'brain damage?'
Just curious.
Posted by tizza on October 12, 2005, at 18:17:03
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » tizza, posted by Phil on October 7, 2005, at 16:31:44
severe long and short term memory. I have tried other drugs such as speed, ecstascy, coke but only in moderation and a long time after the marijuana abuse/damage
Posted by tizza on October 13, 2005, at 18:27:04
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » Phil, posted by tizza on October 12, 2005, at 18:17:03
hey phil, why did you just repost my message, did you have anything else to comment on, regards Paul
Posted by Phil on October 14, 2005, at 19:14:47
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » tizza, posted by tizza on October 13, 2005, at 18:27:04
No more comments, Paul. I was just concerned about what kind of problems you had experienced from using pot. I'm sorry to hear you have had a tough go of it.
I do hope things get better for you.Phil
Posted by tizza on October 15, 2005, at 22:36:46
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » tizza, posted by Phil on October 14, 2005, at 19:14:47
well that was years ago, so you have to live with the choices you make in life, either good or bad
Posted by mitchshrader on October 24, 2005, at 7:44:36
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us » Phil, posted by tizza on October 15, 2005, at 22:36:46
heavy to moderate pot smoker 3 decades, then quit. 2 weeks grumpy, irritable.. 4? weeks more gradually becoming residue free.. (i figure it had soaked into my bones by that time, took a while).. noticed better memory, for phone numbers etc.. BUT.. more sensitive (aware) of depression. not depressed per se. just that there was a wider emotional spectrum and part of that was depression.. (some days sucked).. HOWEVER.. by the 3rd week clean (so to speak) I was dreaming vivid colorful dreams again.. and much less irritable. In my situation, 3 years abstaining wasn't difficult. Nor was beginning to use it again. I'd suggest if you've had trouble with it take a serious break, and as possible, Get In Shape. Swimming is recommended, as is bicycle riding.. i'd not suggest running.. (unless you are quite healthy and not overweight) ..
as well as take moderate vitamins and perhaps a mineral supplement. Micronutrients are often low and this can seem like illness without having a particular single symptom. just 'blah'..I hope you feel better soon, and try to improve your general health as seems best to you.
Posted by spierson1253 on November 2, 2005, at 11:08:40
In reply to Re: neurological effects of long term marijuana us, posted by iforgotmypassword on October 2, 2005, at 17:50:11
I had the same problem. Turns out on top of being bi-polar and OCD, I also have Adult Attention Deficit Disorder. Pot helped focus, but whatever my emotional/mental state, I now can't quite function without the pot to smooth the rough edges. And it led to my firing last week (drug test).
This is the end of the thread.
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