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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 34. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by lostforwards on March 21, 2006, at 14:27:52
Does anybody know if it's possible to build a ray gun that can damage tissue without leaving burns or few marks on the skin? Such that the person who's targetted doesn't feel anything or very little.
Just curious.
Posted by deirdrehbrt on March 21, 2006, at 15:34:35
In reply to ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by lostforwards on March 21, 2006, at 14:27:52
By definition, the tissue damage from an energy weapon is a burn. I'll assume though, that you mean external burns.
Microwaves can damage tissue. They can do so on a small or moderate scale without initial noticeable pain or external damage. I know of one person who was a crew chief in the Air Force who was wearing a metal belt-buckle around an active tracking radar and was rendered sterile. I have also heard stories of people being injured quite severely around other radar systems without pain being involved. One was standing on the feed horn of an air traffic control radar. He felt no pain, but the damage was enough to require amputation of his foot. I can't vouch for the levels of pain involved.
Microwaves can, and do cause serious injury. By their nature, they can be directed. They cause internal injury. They do so by exciting water molecules inside tissue, and thus heat the tissue causing damage.
Directed sound doesn't cause nearly as much tissue damage, but can cause nausea, confusion, anger, etc. The military worked with sound as a means to cause confusion and to incapacitate enemies and intruders.Lasers can be used to blind; either temporarily or permanently. They are an effective anti-personnel weapon.
CO2 lasers have been tested that were able to destroy missiles and aircraft at distances measured in miles. I saw a film of one such demonstration back in 1980. I'm certain that technology has advanced.
Anyway, it's possible for directed energy weapons to cause damage not immediately noticed. These weapons aren't really common. You're more likely to be injured by a microwave with leaky seals than an actual weapon.
--Dee
Posted by special_k on March 21, 2006, at 17:03:49
In reply to ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by lostforwards on March 21, 2006, at 14:27:52
most things are possible...
i'll admit this sounds highly improbable...
you have been worried about this for a while, eh?
Posted by sleepygirl on March 21, 2006, at 17:22:07
In reply to ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by lostforwards on March 21, 2006, at 14:27:52
I don't think so, but are you worried about this happening?
Posted by Phillipa on March 21, 2006, at 19:26:30
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » lostforwards, posted by sleepygirl on March 21, 2006, at 17:22:07
Lostforwards, I'll protect you. Fondly, Phillipa
Posted by rjlockhart on March 21, 2006, at 22:35:32
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by Phillipa on March 21, 2006, at 19:26:30
THat was really quite i post i sat there and read it like an article ROFL. That was very intresting, you have some knowlage. You have have caught my attention
THis subject caught my attention, i didnt see anyhting and then "ray guns"
Phillipa do you think any of this can help with your condition?
Posted by deirdrehbrt on March 21, 2006, at 23:28:13
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energ -- deirdrehbrt, posted by rjlockhart on March 21, 2006, at 22:35:32
Having said what I said, these aren't the sort of things used on the public at large. Johnny Q Public doesn't have anything to worry about.
Realistically, I'm certainly not interesting enough for the government to take notice of me, unless it's tax time.
If anyone wanted to prove that they were or weren't being exposed to microwave energy, you can get EM radiation detectors through various vendors.
Honestly though, people are much more likely to find sources of EM radiation around their typical environments, from cell phones, leaky microwave ovens (which can penetrate the body over 1"), computer monitors, TV screens, high tension power lines, and more.
I honestly don't think that anybody reading this board has ever been subjected to a directed energy weapon. Had they, they would be likely quite sick, and a doctor would have noticed some sort of tissue damage.
IRL, one company producing some of these weapons is Ionatron. http://www.ionatron.com/ Theirs are a class of weapon called LIPC, where an electric voltage is carried on the plasma created by a laser beam. They are designed though, at a minimum, to temporarily disable an individual. Were someone hit by such a weapon, the result would likely not be ambiguous.
Anyway, again, I don't think that anyone here is likely to be the target of these weapons. Unless you're trying to break into a high-security government facility, or a nuclear plant, or something similar, there would be no reason.
--Dee
Posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 7:43:25
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by deirdrehbrt on March 21, 2006, at 15:34:35
> By definition, the tissue damage from an energy weapon is a burn. I'll assume though, that you mean external burns.
> Microwaves can damage tissue. They can do so on a small or moderate scale without initial noticeable pain or external damage. I know of one person who was a crew chief in the Air Force who was wearing a metal belt-buckle around an active tracking radar and was rendered sterile. I have also heard stories of people being injured quite severely around other radar systems without pain being involved. One was standing on the feed horn of an air traffic control radar. He felt no pain, but the damage was enough to require amputation of his foot. I can't vouch for the levels of pain involved.
> Microwaves can, and do cause serious injury. By their nature, they can be directed. They cause internal injury. They do so by exciting water molecules inside tissue, and thus heat the tissue causing damage.
>
>
> Directed sound doesn't cause nearly as much tissue damage, but can cause nausea, confusion, anger, etc. The military worked with sound as a means to cause confusion and to incapacitate enemies and intruders.
>
> Lasers can be used to blind; either temporarily or permanently. They are an effective anti-personnel weapon.
>
> CO2 lasers have been tested that were able to destroy missiles and aircraft at distances measured in miles. I saw a film of one such demonstration back in 1980. I'm certain that technology has advanced.
>
> Anyway, it's possible for directed energy weapons to cause damage not immediately noticed. These weapons aren't really common. You're more likely to be injured by a microwave with leaky seals than an actual weapon.
>
> --DeeWow. Thanks for your input. I was attacked by somebody with a directed energy weapon. I was hoping that it wouldn't be possible. He targetted my brain. At least that was his claim. Shortly after being hit I had these blank states and perceptual distortions. There were no burns on my skin. However there was some pigmentation changes on my forehead.
I know it sounds hard for most people to believe. I'm not schizophrenic. Someone really did come after me.
Wouldn't the temperature of the tissue have to reach a certain point for damage to be done? When I was hit I didn't really feel anything. Just a slight tingly feeling at the back of my head.
Posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 7:44:48
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by special_k on March 21, 2006, at 17:03:49
Someone harassed me for about a year and claimed he could fry my brains. I've been concerned ever since.
Posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 7:45:39
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by Phillipa on March 21, 2006, at 19:26:30
> Lostforwards, I'll protect you. Fondly, Phillipa
thank you Phillipa
Posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 7:46:16
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » lostforwards, posted by sleepygirl on March 21, 2006, at 17:22:07
> I don't think so, but are you worried about this happening?
It's happened
Posted by caraher on March 22, 2006, at 9:29:01
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » deirdrehbrt, posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 7:43:25
> Wow. Thanks for your input. I was attacked by somebody with a directed energy weapon. I was hoping that it wouldn't be possible. He targetted my brain. At least that was his claim. Shortly after being hit I had these blank states and perceptual distortions. There were no burns on my skin. However there was some pigmentation changes on my forehead.
Could you describe the circumstances? Such as when you became aware of this tingling you associate with being hit, the exact claims of your assailant, whether you saw this weapon? What is the timeline of the threats, the attack, and this other person's telling you about what was targeted?
Posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 9:48:47
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by caraher on March 22, 2006, at 9:29:01
First some background:
"Sharp and Grove (note 2) found that appropriate modulation of microwave energy can result in "wireless" and "receiverless" communication of SPEECH"
http://www.raven1.net/ewmcmscr11.htm
http://www.raven1.net/v2succes.htmUsing voice to skull he told me he would fry my brains. I'm not sure how long after he said that that he shot me.
I became aware of the feeling immediately after he hit me. I didn't see the weapon. He shot me through the wall or the window. I think I've seen his van though.
Posted by notfred on March 22, 2006, at 17:09:04
In reply to ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by lostforwards on March 21, 2006, at 14:27:52
To me this sounds like a delusion. Have you told your doc about this consern ?
nf
Posted by special_k on March 22, 2006, at 17:44:42
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » special_k, posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 7:44:48
> Someone harassed me for about a year and claimed he could fry my brains. I've been concerned ever since.
:-(
That must have been pretty freaky
:-(But...
People do say the darndest things... Just 'cause he said he would do it... Doesn't mean he CAN do it... And even if he CAN do it (which I think is fairly improbable) I think it is even more improbable that he WOULD do it.
((((lfw))))
Posted by deirdrehbrt on March 22, 2006, at 19:42:56
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » caraher, posted by lostforwards on March 22, 2006, at 9:48:47
Lostforwards,
I know that you believe strongly in some of this technology. Some of what you believe though, may not be entirely accurate. For example, the voice-to-skull technology which you reference, and the documents you point to have some errors.\
Most important of these is the concept that it is impossible to shield oneself from such attacks. As this sort of attack is possible to be accomplished via modified Amateur Radio equipment operating in the 450MHz or 1.2 GHz bands, it is quite easy to shield oneself from these frequencies. Any proper RF shield will work. A microwave oven works directly opposite this technique, shielding the outside from the RF field within.
If an article is in error on such simple facts, it would not be unwise to question other assumptions posed.
Lastly, Amateur equipment, if used would likely be noticed, especially by other amateurs, or hams as they are called. Many amateurs engage in a sport called fox-hunting. In this sport, a transmitter is hidden, and the contest is to find said transmitter in the shortest amount of time. If someone were operating a sort of rogue transmitter on amateur bands, it would likely be heard, and when heard, located and reported to the FCC.
Also, if such equipment is being used, it would be noticed on an instrument called a field-strength meter. This instrument reports the density of RF fields in a given area. If you are seriously concerned about such a problem, an instrument such as this could confirm or disprove your suspicions.
If you're wondering if I really know what I'm talking about, my last job was as an engineer, and I also held an Amateur Radio General Class license. (I may renew it this year, but I'm not currently licensed. It expired last August, and I have a year to renew it.)
Honestly, I really don't believe you have a great deal to be worried about. If you want to prove it though, that's one technique.
Blessings,
--Dee.
Posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 8:46:56
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by special_k on March 22, 2006, at 17:44:42
> > Someone harassed me for about a year and claimed he could fry my brains. I've been concerned ever since.
>
> :-(
> That must have been pretty freaky
> :-(
>
> But...
>
> People do say the darndest things... JustThat's what I'm hoping for. That he was just saying it to scare me.
'cause he said he would do it... Doesn't mean he CAN do it... And even if he CAN do it (which I think is fairly improbable) I think it is even more improbable that he WOULD do it.
>
> ((((lfw))))
>
>Thanks
Posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 8:47:53
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by notfred on March 22, 2006, at 17:09:04
> To me this sounds like a delusion. Have you told your doc about this consern ?
>
> nfYeah, I've talked to my doc and I'm on medication. Though it hasn't made any difference
Posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 9:20:25
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » lostforwards, posted by deirdrehbrt on March 22, 2006, at 19:42:56
> Lostforwards,
> I know that you believe strongly in some of this technology. Some of what you believe though, may not be entirely accurate. For example, the voice-to-skull technology which you reference, and the documents you point to have some errors.\
> Most important of these is the concept that it is impossible to shield oneself from such attacks. As this sort of attack is possible to be accomplished via modified Amateur Radio equipment operating in the 450MHz or 1.2 GHz bands, it is quite easy to shield oneself from these frequencies. Any proper RF shield will work. A microwave oven works directly opposite this technique, shielding the outside from the RF field within.
> If an article is in error on such simple facts, it would not be unwise to question other assumptions posed.
> Lastly, Amateur equipment, if used would likely be noticed, especially by other amateurs, or hams as they are called. Many amateurs engage in a sport called fox-hunting. In this sport, a transmitter is hidden, and the contest is to find said transmitter in the shortest amount of time. If someone were operating a sort of rogue transmitter on amateur bands, it would likely be heard, and when heard, located and reported to the FCC.
> Also, if such equipment is being used, it would be noticed on an instrument called a field-strength meter. This instrument reports the density of RF fields in a given area. If you are seriously concerned about such a problem, an instrument such as this could confirm or disprove your suspicions.
> If you're wondering if I really know what I'm talking about, my last job was as an engineer, and I also held an Amateur Radio General Class license. (I may renew it this year, but I'm not currently licensed. It expired last August, and I have a year to renew it.)
> Honestly, I really don't believe you have a great deal to be worried about. If you want to prove it though, that's one technique.
> Blessings,
> --Dee.
Dee,While I don't dboubt the exitance of psychotronics ( technology that can influence the nervous system and the brain from a distance ) or directed energy weapons ( microwave ovens with the door ripped off ), I must admit that some of the information on that page may be fraudulant. However, voice to skull technology really does exist.
I never liked raven1.net much because some of the claims on that site are a little hard to swallow. The most blatant example is that the maintainer believes that there exists technology that than move objects at a distance. I find that a little hard to believe. However, I can sort of stretch my imagination and rationalize it as a possibility
lostforwards
Posted by special_k on March 23, 2006, at 13:05:14
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » notfred, posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 8:47:53
> > To me this sounds like a delusion. Have you told your doc about this consern ?
er yeah. i'll admit that that was what i was thinking too...
> Yeah, I've talked to my doc and I'm on medication. Though it hasn't made any difference
okay. have you told your doc that? sometimes... different meds are suited to different people etc...
might be time for a change?
Posted by Phillipa on March 23, 2006, at 13:46:56
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » lostforwards, posted by special_k on March 23, 2006, at 13:05:14
Lostforwards you know I care and love you as a fellow babbler so here's what I'd do. Call you doctor tell him what you're thinking about the energy attacking you and then let him decide if you need a med change. Special K is right different meds at different time for different people. Pleasa? I really do hate to see you feeling this way. Love Phillipa you do know I care.
Posted by deirdrehbrt on March 23, 2006, at 14:09:06
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » deirdrehbrt, posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 9:20:25
Hi there.
First, I hope that you can recognize that I do have some background in understanding some of the subjects you're talking about. If so, I would like to discuss the "voice-to-skull" experience you've been talking about.
From the web site you pointed me to, and the way you've discussed it, it involves using a radio (microwave or other) signal to excite nerves from a distance, and creating the sound within a person's head.
Is this really possible? It is possible to excite nerves using transcranial magnetic techniques, but what about microwaves from a distance? The brain works on electrochemical reactions, with signals travelling down axons. If we wanted to make someone hear something, we would have to target very specific neruons dedicated to hearing. From a distance, we would need a beam extremely tightly focussed, and we would need to aim it at a particular part of the brain. If we had any spillover, we would be targeting different parts of the brain and cause disturbances ranging from involuntary muscle movement, visual disturbances, possible stopping of the heart or respiration, etc. Basically, you can't hit one part of the brain and expect not to affect other parts.
Let's look at this technology in another way. If it existed, if it were possible to create the experience of sound from a distance, it would also be possible to do so from close-by. Were this able to be done, it would obviate the use of implants to restore hearing in the deaf. One cold wear a pair of glasses, or a hat containing a low power transmitter that directly stimulated the proper nerves. Unfortunately for the deaf, that just doesn't yet exist.Like others said, I would really consult your doctor if you're experiencing what's called "voice-to-skull". Working as an engineer, and having lots of experience with radio and microwave, I really don't see how such a thing is possible, let alone practical. Certainly, directed energy weapons exist, but something that can transmit sound directly to the brain, to me, doesn't sound feasible.
Good luck,
--Dee
Posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 16:34:19
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by Phillipa on March 23, 2006, at 13:46:56
I'm seeing my doctor soon
Posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 16:36:49
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.., posted by deirdrehbrt on March 23, 2006, at 14:09:06
Perhaps you're right. However my experience tell me otherwise and we do live in the 21st century. If it's not voice to skull then it's something else. My exeprience was too coherent to be the product of mental illness. At least that's how it seems.
Posted by Phillipa on March 23, 2006, at 18:56:56
In reply to Re: ray guns, directed energy weapons.. » deirdrehbrt, posted by lostforwards on March 23, 2006, at 16:36:49
If I could put my arms around you now I would and give you a big hug. Right now you need one. And do you live alone or with someone else? Love Phillipa
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