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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by madwand on October 19, 2003, at 12:30:58
Hi MamaB,
I am making this a separately thread lest the "emotions" thread get overly tangled.
I am puzzled by something. You obviously believe that the person feeling an emotion is responsible for it (rather than the person who invited them to feel it) and as you can see from the emotions thread I agree with you. However, the whole thread started in admin because you objected to some people saying inappropriate things over on the med board and where that might lead people.
Doesn't the same standard apply? If those people are responsible for their emotions that arise as the result of other people's words or behavior, aren't they equally responsible for how they react to other communications from those people (questionable advice, boasting about drug use, etc.)?
In other words, why does personal responsibility stop with emotions?Michael
Posted by MamaB on October 19, 2003, at 14:08:28
In reply to MamaB --About personal responsibility, posted by madwand on October 19, 2003, at 12:30:58
No it does not. I am not sure why you are asking.
Posted by madwand on October 19, 2003, at 14:28:29
In reply to Re: MamaB --About personal responsibility, posted by MamaB on October 19, 2003, at 14:08:28
It sounds like my post may have come across as confrontational. That was not my intent. Let me rephrase it:
Why does personal responsibility apply in one case (others inviting you to feel something) but not in the other case (others inviting you to try something inappropriate, or to act on incorrect information).
In other words, we seem to be in agreement about the emotions issue, yet "the place I come from" which leads me to that agreement also leads me to disagree with your original concern.
So while perhaps we will not end up convincing each other, I am curious about the place *you* are coming from and how it leads to both of your positions. I have been trying to construct such a place in my mind, and am not succeeding.
Anyway, I hope your weekend is going well.Michael
Posted by zeugma on October 19, 2003, at 17:20:29
In reply to Re: MamaB --About personal responsibility » MamaB, posted by madwand on October 19, 2003, at 14:28:29
The real subject here IMO is not the nature of emotion, and whether control resides in the person who acts first or in the person who responds.
The real question seems to be about judgment. AS in having a good judgment (or faculty of judgment) versus having a poor one. If someone is 'bragging' about drug abuse, that is a judgment call. A fairly difficult one,perhaps. It's a lot more complex than simply 'being able to control your reaction' of anger or whatever. It's a process that demands a certain degree of introspection as well as insight into another person. It's a lot more subtle (and important) than just having a good 'theory of emotion,' and every person has to find out about this in their own way."...it appears that, though understanding is capable of being instructed, and of being equiped with rules, judgment is a peculiar talent which can be practised only, and cannot be taught. It is the specific quality of so-called mother-wit; and its lack no school can make good. For although an abundabce of rules borrowed from the insight of others may indeed be proffered to, and as it were grafted upon, a limited understanding, the power of rightly employing them must belong to the learner himself; and in the absence of such a natural gift no rule that may be prescribed to him for this purpose can ensure against misuse."- Immanuel Kant
I think that it's important not to try to pre-empt others' judgments by force because that does two things: 1) imposes possibly unsound judgments on others arbitrarily; and 2) robs people of their right to exercise their own capacities for judgment.
Posted by MamaB on October 19, 2003, at 17:35:37
In reply to judgment, not emotion, posted by zeugma on October 19, 2003, at 17:20:29
zegima and Michael,
I like the quote from Kant.
I am not sure just how to put this, but it is my belief that each individual is responsible for him/her self. While yes, life is one long learning experience and we take and hopefully from the wisdom, and experience of our fellowman and indeed (hopefully by our own trial and error); the bottom line falls to us.
I in no way believe in situational ethics. A moral code has been laid down for me and I try and follow it as best I can
More later myfamily is waiting for supper !!!!!
Posted by pixygoth on October 20, 2003, at 6:12:44
In reply to Re: judgment, not emotion, posted by MamaB on October 19, 2003, at 17:35:37
Following this stuff w/ interest -
MamaB, *who* laid down your moral code? Are you a Christian of some stripe? I'm very interested in the idea that it is in fact easier (and better) to be moral if you do *not* accept anyone else's definition of that, but instead think very hard indeed about it for yourself.
P.S. My therapist says that I *should* continue to abuse marajuana until I feel that I can cope without it. The terms "use" and "abuse" of drugs are essentially arbitrary - just a thought.S
Posted by MamaB on October 20, 2003, at 11:44:22
In reply to Re: judgment, not emotion » MamaB, posted by pixygoth on October 20, 2003, at 6:12:44
> Following this stuff w/ interest -
> MamaB, *who* laid down your moral code? Are you a Christian of some stripe? I'm very interested in the idea that it is in fact easier (and better) to be moral if you do *not* accept anyone else's definition of that, but instead think very hard indeed about it for yourself.
> P.S. My therapist says that I *should* continue to abuse marajuana until I feel that I can cope without it. The terms "use" and "abuse" of drugs are essentially arbitrary - just a thought.
>
> SUse and abuse are NOT arbitrary to a reliable therapist and in some cases, the law.
Yes, I am a Christian. I am also 62 years old and have not been a Christian all of that time -- I had to learn the hard way that God did mean they were The TEN COMMANDMENTS, and not the "ten suggestions". They pretty well sum up my moral code, though there's a LOT more, especially in the second part of the Book!
(We will probably get redirected to "Faith", so if you want to continue this why don't you just post to me over there?)
This is the end of the thread.
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