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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by tabitha on July 27, 2002, at 22:48:47
(this is a cross-board post replying to
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/2000/20020724/msgs/542.html )Thanks for that link, Phil. I liked what he said. Did you read his book? When it came out, I expected to feel really validated by it, but it kind of alienated me. What he described as his depression is not what I feel. Maybe he's more vegetative, and I'm a little more agitated, I don't know, or maybe I've never been as low as he describes.
Anyway, here's my favorite piece of that interview...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
What advice would you give to the family member or friend or mate of someone suffering from depression?Depression is a disease of loneliness, and the best thing you can do is to mitigate the isolation of a depressed person. No matter how withdrawn that person is, it is helpful to him to have constant concrete manifestations of support around him. It is important to remember that the depressive's belief in the intractability of his condition is one of the symptoms of the illness. Keep reminding the person who suffers that the situation is temporary, that things will change, and that the voices he hears within himself are the voices of depression and not the voice of reason. Encourage your depressed friend to seek the professional help he may need -- to find medications if appropriate (and they usually are) and to find some form of talking therapy to enable the emergence from despondency. Give encouragement. Don't, however, keep telling the person to cheer up, or remind the person in great detail of how wonderful his life is. Don't be patronizing. Accept that the statements being made by the depressive, no matter how distorted they may seem, are his truth. Have some respect for the reach of the illness.
Posted by Phil on July 27, 2002, at 23:04:59
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon » Phil, posted by tabitha on July 27, 2002, at 22:48:47
Yes, I read the book and think it's pretty close to perfect. The guy is such a good writer.
I couldn't relate to some of his experiences with his depression but we all act out differently.
BTW, his father is Chairman of Forest Labs who bring us Celexa. You probably saw that in the book.
Posted by tabitha on July 27, 2002, at 23:37:52
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by Phil on July 27, 2002, at 23:04:59
No, I didn't know about the Celexa tie-in. Hmm. Maybe they didn't publicize that too much, for fear people would accuse him of being a pawn of the pharmaceutical industry.
I think my disappointment was that I wanted it to be the book that would explain everything I could ever want anyone to know about MY depression, so I could hand them the book, and they'd be educated just like that. That wasn't quite the book.
Posted by Lini on July 28, 2002, at 17:55:44
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by tabitha on July 27, 2002, at 23:37:52
>I think my disappointment was that I wanted it >to be the book that would explain everything I >could ever want anyone to know about MY >depression, so I could hand them the book, and >they'd be educated just like that. That wasn't >quite the book.
For me, it was that book . . . though I probably haven't handed it to the right people . . .What stories/books have you read that better approximate your particular depression?
-L
Posted by tabitha on July 28, 2002, at 18:22:31
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by Lini on July 28, 2002, at 17:55:44
>
> For me, it was that book . . . though I probably haven't handed it to the right people . . .
>
> What stories/books have you read that better approximate your particular depression?The only first-person ones I've read are that one and Prozac Nation, and the Kay Jameison ones on bipolar. None of them quite matched. I liked his book a lot, I just didn't relate to the accounts of being bed-bound for days on end and afraid to take a shower. At my depths I'm more likely to be up and about, appearing fairly normal, but consumed with dread and terror and anxiety internally. Sort of a walking dead feeling. Some people will notice that my face has no life in it, but some won't notice anything at all.
Posted by Phil on July 28, 2002, at 19:28:34
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by tabitha on July 28, 2002, at 18:22:31
William Styron's Darkness Visable, unlike his other books, is very short. It's a great book to give to friends who 'don't get it'.
It's well worth the short time it takes to read.
I think you could relate to Undercurrents: A Life Beneath the Surface. Her depression is more similar to most and she manages a good sense of humor. Kay Redfield Jamison was either her counselor or confidant, don't remember.
This woman was a clinical psychologist and while asking a patient a list of questions to determine the level of depression, noticed she herself had more 'wrong' answers.
Posted by Lini on July 28, 2002, at 20:31:15
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by tabitha on July 28, 2002, at 18:22:31
While I was never afraid of the shower, I definitely was afraid of the phone. And, though I couldn't lay in bed for days, Jack Daniels and I could watch TV endlessly. I would sometimes race home from work just to sit down on my couch until it was morning.
I do know what you mean though, about "appearing" fairly normal. I think my co-workers would be shocked to find out that the days I called in sick I was actually drinking and watching CNN or in the hospital. My friends only know that things have gone down hill because I stop answering the phone. I don't think I could ever rely on people to the extent that Andrew Solomon did, not because supportive people aren't around, but because I just couldn't be that vulnerable in front of anyone.
Posted by Phil on July 28, 2002, at 20:46:46
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by Lini on July 28, 2002, at 20:31:15
I can relate to that. When things get hard for me, I feel I need to deal with it. Not burden anyone else.
I'm a little better at answering the phone but well known for not answering it. If they leave a message, I might return their call. My phone doesn't ring much; I don't want it to.
Posted by tabitha on July 28, 2002, at 21:23:55
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon » tabitha, posted by Phil on July 28, 2002, at 19:28:34
Posted by Gabbi on July 28, 2002, at 21:26:09
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon, posted by Lini on July 28, 2002, at 20:31:15
I almost cried with relief reading "Noonday Demon". My first episode with Depression/Anxiety 10 years ago resulted in my being frightened of the bathtub and the phone.
To see similar experiences written in his book was almost unbelievable. In retrospect though my fears weren't really as tangible as all that.
I think they were rooted in the fact that for the first time ever, I felt so sick with dread and hopelessness THAT the things that could at one time draw me out of what I'd thought of as being depressed (phoning a friend, taking a hot bath) no longer could could comfort me. In a convoluted way I became frightened by them.I feel so fortunate, that My Dad heard about the book on C.B.C. and read it of his own volition or he never would have considered it "valid".
If I'd asked him to read it, he wouldn't have bothered. I mean I could be lying with a knife in back, and he'd say "oh you've just been reading too many of those crime novels again"As it is his actions towards me have changed in every way. The rest of my family though, is still alienated by my "weakness", and refusal to 'grow up.
I feel bad that it didn't do the same for you Tabitha, really, I don't know what would have happened to me without it.
My Dad is my only support (who I see)and that is soley because he read "Noonday Demon" after he'd kicked me out for my "laziness" in March. He reads all books recommended on C.B.C. so the fact that it was about depression wasn't signifcant to him.
The book has been the only significant comfort and help to me that isn't a medication. And I've as most of has read endlessly on the subject.Darkness Visible I would definately recommend. not that Phil needs me to approve) It is short, "reader friendly" and interesting, while being as descriptive as I think is possible about the illness to people who haven't suffered it.
It's the kind of book you can leave lying around and someone might actually read it.
Its been years since I read it, but I think It also mentions the author Albert Camus thoughts that depression and suicide were weaknesses, a cop out, until he himself succumbed to depression. That might register with some "chin up" types.
I don't know about everyone but It seems the only people I know who will read a book about depression that I actually suggest, are the ones who are already open minded enough to be of some support even if they don't exactly "get it"I don't usually gush but I want to kiss Andrew Solomons feet in gratitude.
Gabbi Gabbi
Posted by jane d on July 28, 2002, at 22:27:09
In reply to Thanks for the book tips (nm) » Phil, posted by tabitha on July 28, 2002, at 21:23:55
You might try Undercurrents by Martha Manning or The Beast by Tracy Thompson. I liked the first one a lot and couldn't relate to the second at all but they both describe a different kind of experience from Solomon's.
Jane
Posted by jane d on July 28, 2002, at 22:32:21
In reply to Re: Good interview with a great writer, Andrew Solomon » tabitha, posted by Phil on July 28, 2002, at 19:28:34
Posted by Phil on July 29, 2002, at 7:11:58
In reply to Sorry - forgot you had mentioned Manning already (nm) » Phil, posted by jane d on July 28, 2002, at 22:32:21
I think I heard that she has relapsed and had ECT again. Not that unusual. Hope she's okay.
This is the end of the thread.
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