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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Andy123 on July 7, 2001, at 10:32:10
I'm feeling pretty normal lately; I'd like to start a thread about how people who are in fair remission from mental illness feel they got there.
I read this book several years ago called "The Wisdom of the Ego." It did have some psycho-jargon in it, but the take home message is that people deploy defenses with various degrees of efficacy. The author stipulated that there are two mature defenses: 1. altruism 2. humor. Another idea I wanted to post to this board (and was reminded by the thread about movies:) a psychiatrist that I went to when i was an adolescent told me that he thought that visual media were reponsible for a lot of psychopathology. He was kind of an "out there" type of psychiatrist, but I think he was right. I stopped going to movies and curbed TV watching over the last several years and i think it helps. So there are my 2 cents. Please contribute to this thread :)
Posted by Glenn Fagelson on July 8, 2001, at 0:29:13
In reply to The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by Andy123 on July 7, 2001, at 10:32:10
> I'm feeling pretty normal lately; I'd like to start a thread about how people who are in fair remission from mental illness feel they got there.
> I read this book several years ago called "The Wisdom of the Ego." It did have some psycho-jargon in it, but the take home message is that people deploy defenses with various degrees of efficacy. The author stipulated that there are two mature defenses: 1. altruism 2. humor. Another idea I wanted to post to this board (and was reminded by the thread about movies:) a psychiatrist that I went to when i was an adolescent told me that he thought that visual media were reponsible for a lot of psychopathology. He was kind of an "out there" type of psychiatrist, but I think he was right. I stopped going to movies and curbed TV watching over the last several years and i think it helps. So there are my 2 cents. Please contribute to this thread :)Dear Andy,
Yes, humor and altruism can be very powerful
weapons against depression, at least I have found
that to be the case; however, both take energy
which is often in short supply when one is
clinically depressed.About movies and TV, I agree; I no longer
watch the news on TV and I have seen my anxiety
levels plummet as a result. I am also very
careful as to what kinds of movies I will watch.Glenn
Posted by Marie1 on July 8, 2001, at 8:51:03
In reply to The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by Andy123 on July 7, 2001, at 10:32:10
My shrink recommended my reading "The Wisdom of the Ego" but I never tried it because I thought it would be too over my head. (Sometimes I think my shrink thinks I'm a lot smarter than I really am). So did you like it? How much psychology is requisite to understanding it?
Marie
> I'm feeling pretty normal lately; I'd like to start a thread about how people who are in fair remission from mental illness feel they got there.
> I read this book several years ago called "The Wisdom of the Ego." It did have some psycho-jargon in it, but the take home message is that people deploy defenses with various degrees of efficacy. The author stipulated that there are two mature defenses: 1. altruism 2. humor. Another idea I wanted to post to this board (and was reminded by the thread about movies:) a psychiatrist that I went to when i was an adolescent told me that he thought that visual media were reponsible for a lot of psychopathology. He was kind of an "out there" type of psychiatrist, but I think he was right. I stopped going to movies and curbed TV watching over the last several years and i think it helps. So there are my 2 cents. Please contribute to this thread :)
Posted by Andy123 on July 9, 2001, at 0:56:18
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology » Andy123, posted by Marie1 on July 8, 2001, at 8:51:03
> My shrink recommended my reading "The Wisdom of the Ego" but I never tried it because I thought it would be too over my head. (Sometimes I think my shrink thinks I'm a lot smarter than I really am). So did you like it? How much psychology is requisite to understanding it?
>
> MarieMarie,
The book is very long on narration, possibly because its a narrative :) Anyhow, he uses the life stories of some famous folks to demonstrate how their egos employed defenses against insults. Then he talks about whether or not its possible to purposefully plan ego defenses.
Very early on in the book, he rates the relative maturity of the ego defense mechanisms that he considers fundamental.
It seems like there is quite a bit of material to cover without much reward. Maybe you'll get more out of the book than I did (I got a fancy smartypantz book to go on my shelf!)
Posted by susan C on July 9, 2001, at 20:11:47
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology » Marie1, posted by Andy123 on July 9, 2001, at 0:56:18
Another book to go on the shelf: 'The Media is the Message' Marshal McClun (sp) about the process of TV cathod ray tube and how the picture is created. What you see on this screen is just dots starting at the upper left and going line by line down the screen and it is your brain putting it together. Unlike a movie, which is 'moving pictures' shot by shot of photographs. TV can be VERY appealing to the brain, no matter what the content is...you notice people staring blankly at a TV? Be sure your monitor's 'refresh rate' is set as high as it can go. Otherwise, it blinks and can be very disturbing.
I too have to be careful about controling my media intake. I have found I can't watch anything within the hour or so before I go to bed. I get too agitated. I find it confusing that I can't watch real life murder stories, but one of the clues that I am getting depressed is I go to the library and check out stacks of detective novels.??? I am currently devoring Nero Wolfe.
Posted by mila on July 10, 2001, at 22:01:04
In reply to The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by Andy123 on July 7, 2001, at 10:32:10
Hi Andy,
thank you for starting an interesting thread.
i am in full remission now myself, emotionally I am OK, but I still have to deal with the consequences of my depression and anxiety disorder, and with the damage caused to me by the ADs.
I put my full effort into exercising my memory (paxil destroyed both my LTM and proactive memory, a horror story), because poor recall makes me feel unsure of myself, and a bit 'crazy'. I do not like the feeling. Now my memory is actually better than it was before the treatment.
I also actively pursue meeting new people. Depression made me very lonely. I constantly remind myself to smile to people and to say something nice even to the strangers. Feeling that I belong to my city, to my neighbourhood and to my class, etc. makes me very happy, and reinforces the recovery.
Finally, I remind myself from time to time to experience anger when under stress. Not irritation, which is more a sign of a depression, but some sort of an angry rebellion. It somehow makes me feel strong and powerful, and I go through the trials of life more successfully, laughing at the ways I used to be scared of challenges before.
This is how I keep myself at the level of 'minimal pathology' as you say. I got into remission by swallowing pills for 7 months and having CBT for 15 weeks. Prior to that I suffered from two bad anxiety disorders for 25 years and a double depression for 10.
mila
Posted by Andy123 on July 14, 2001, at 7:50:10
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by mila on July 10, 2001, at 22:01:04
> I also actively pursue meeting new people. Depression made me very lonely. I constantly remind myself to smile to people and to say something nice even to the strangers. Feeling that I belong to my city, to my neighbourhood and to my class, etc. makes me very happy, and reinforces the recovery.
I totally agree with this. Unfortunately alot of Americans live in cities that don't involve people in the community very well (read: suburban spraw sucks.)
> Finally, I remind myself from time to time to experience anger when under stress. Not irritation, which is more a sign of a depression, but some sort of an angry rebellion. It somehow makes me feel strong and powerful, and I go through the trials of life more successfully, laughing at the ways I used to be scared of challenges before.That reminds me of another book called "Psychosynthesis." Its about changing your personality on purpose, and has a good chapter on using anger in contructive ways.
I looked back at "The Wisdom of the Ego" and realized that I had forgotten most of what it said. There are actually five ego defenses listed as "mature." They are: 1. altruism 2. humor 3. sublimation 4. suppression 5. anticipation. Really there is alot of instructive advice on using the defense mechanisms to improve one's outlook and personality. It is somewhat time consuming to try to apply these ideas, though. :)
Posted by Lorraine on July 15, 2001, at 12:27:15
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by Andy123 on July 14, 2001, at 7:50:10
This seems like the place to post this issue. I have been enjoying the exchange on this thread. I apologize if anyone has read this excerpt from the regular psycho-babble thread. I just thought that this might be a better forum for the discussion.
I have not been able to work because I am not stabilized and cannot from day-to-day know where my mood will land. I am beginning to come to the realization that I have some "acceptance" work to do in terms of my condition and I need to figure out how to make a life where I am right now. This always putting life on hold until I figure out my meds doesn't work for me--it's been too long and my focus becomes myopic. I'm longing for the sense of community that one finds at the workplace--but now perhaps charity oriented, maybe even dealing with depression or mental illness--kind of a need to see and help people who are in worse condition than me. Unfortunately, I don't even know how to approach finding this type of volunteer work or getting involved with this type of community so the idea just hangs in midair.
Posted by mila on July 15, 2001, at 17:21:00
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by Lorraine on July 15, 2001, at 12:27:15
Hi Lorraine
I am doing some volunteering work in the hospital for chronically ill people. Being with people there really puts things into perspective for me. Many of the residents cannot even speak or swallow, but are in the most cheerful disposition all the time. Others are really angry and depressed because they have to live there. Generally, I love it. Working there is a great inspiration for me, it also scares me a bit, to tell you the truth, because it forces me to live my own life very honestly, and I am more used to hiding behind excuses.
Actually, several students from my class were able to find volunteer work only in the psychiatric departments of the hospitals, so your desire to volunteer in such settings might be easier to fulfill than you think.
mila.
Posted by AMenz on July 15, 2001, at 19:09:02
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology, posted by Lorraine on July 15, 2001, at 12:27:15
> This seems like the place to post this issue. I have been enjoying the exchange on this thread. I apologize if anyone has read this excerpt from the regular psycho-babble thread. I just thought that this might be a better forum for the discussion.
>
> I have not been able to work because I am not stabilized and cannot from day-to-day know where my mood will land. I am beginning to come to the realization that I have some "acceptance" work to do in terms of my condition and I need to figure out how to make a life where I am right now. This always putting life on hold until I figure out my meds doesn't work for me--it's been too long and my focus becomes myopic.This is terribly wise. It's the point I've come to recently. Thanks.
Posted by susan C on July 15, 2001, at 19:32:39
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology Lorraine, posted by AMenz on July 15, 2001, at 19:09:02
> > This seems like the place to post this issue. I have been enjoying the exchange on this thread. I apologize if anyone has read this excerpt from the regular psycho-babble thread. I just thought that this might be a better forum for the discussion.
> >
> > I have not been able to work because I am not stabilized and cannot from day-to-day know where my mood will land. I am beginning to come to the realization that I have some "acceptance" work to do in terms of my condition and I need to figure out how to make a life where I am right now. This always putting life on hold until I figure out my meds doesn't work for me--it's been too long and my focus becomes myopic.
>
> This is terribly wise. It's the point I've come to recently. Thanks.I think you are peeking in my windows and listen in on my brain...:o)the saying 'take one day at a time' is literally what I do, but it seems like it has been so long. I have been thinking maybe about the humane society and taking dogs for walks, it might be comforting and it wouldn't be with judgemental people. i think I could show up or not and I might be able to walk there....
Posted by Lorraine on July 16, 2001, at 10:35:46
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology Lorraine, posted by mila on July 15, 2001, at 17:21:00
> Hi Lorraine
>
> I am doing some volunteering work in the hospital for chronically ill people. Being with people there really puts things into perspective for me. Many of the residents cannot even speak or swallow, but are in the most cheerful disposition all the time. Others are really angry and depressed because they have to live there. Generally, I love it. Working there is a great inspiration for me, it also scares me a bit, to tell you the truth, because it forces me to live my own life very honestly, and I am more used to hiding behind excuses.
>
> Actually, several students from my class were able to find volunteer work only in the psychiatric departments of the hospitals, so your desire to volunteer in such settings might be easier to fulfill than you think.
>
> mila.Mila: Thank-you for your response. This is helpful. I am going to find out if there is a mental health hospital near me (of course there is--it Los Angeles).
Posted by Lorraine on July 16, 2001, at 10:37:23
In reply to Re: The Path to Minimal Pathology Lorraine, posted by susan C on July 15, 2001, at 19:32:39
> > >I have been thinking maybe about the humane society and taking dogs for walks, it might be comforting and it wouldn't be with judgemental people. i think I could show up or not and I might be able to walk there....
Or you might feel "obligated" to do it even when you feel bad and it might lift your mood or at least make you feel "worthwhile".
This is the end of the thread.
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