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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Phil on July 6, 2001, at 6:55:40
VINCENT
Words/Music: Don Mclean
Starry, starry night.
Paint your palette blue and grey,
Look out on a summer's day,
With eyes that know the darkness in my soul.
Shadows on the hills,
Sketch the trees and the daffodils,
Catch the breeze and the winter chills,
In colors on the snowy linen land.
Now I understand what you tried to say to me,
How you suffered for your sanity,
How you tried to set them free.
They would not listen, they did not know how.
Perhaps they'll listen now.Starry, starry night.
Flaming flowers that brightly blaze,
Swirling clouds in violet haze,
Reflect in Vincent's eyes of China blue.
Colors changing hue, morning field of amber grain,
Weathered faces lined in pain,
Are soothed beneath the artist's loving hand.Now I understand what you tried to say to me,
How you suffered for your sanity,
How you tried to set them free.
They would not listen, they did not know how.
Perhaps they'll listen now.For they could not love you,
But still your love was true.
And when no hope was left in sight
On that starry, starry night,
You took your life, as lovers often do.
But I could have told you, Vincent,
This world was never meant for one
As beautiful as you.Starry, starry night.
Portraits hung in empty halls,
Frameless head on nameless walls,
With eyes that watch the world and can't forget.
Like the strangers that you've met,
The ragged men in the ragged clothes,
The silver thorn of bloody rose,
Lie crushed and broken on the virgin snow.Now I think I know what you tried to say to me,
How you suffered for your sanity,
How you tried to set them free.
They would not listen, they're not listening still.
Perhaps they never will.
Posted by dreamer on July 6, 2001, at 16:58:09
In reply to Vincent, posted by Phil on July 6, 2001, at 6:55:40
> VINCENT
A tragic life, mental illness a curse or a gift.
Hope Van Gogh is looking down thinking it was worth it.
Posted by Shar on July 7, 2001, at 20:29:50
In reply to Re: Vincent, posted by dreamer on July 6, 2001, at 16:58:09
> > VINCENT,,,
> A tragic life, mental illness a curse or a gift.
> Hope Van Gogh is looking down thinking it was worth it.
Posted by Willow on July 7, 2001, at 22:53:08
In reply to Vincent, posted by Phil on July 6, 2001, at 6:55:40
> Paint your palette blue and grey,
> Flaming flowers that brightly blaze,
> Swirling clouds in violet haze,
> Reflect in Vincent's eyes of China blue.
> Colors changing hue, morning field of amber grain,
> The silver thorn of bloody rose,
> Lie crushed and broken on the virgin snow.First, thanks for sharing it! I liked it.
Second, got me to wondering what everyone's favourite colour is? Mine being a mix of blue/grey. I wonder if there is any meaning to this, sortof like birth order?
Posted by susan C on July 9, 2001, at 17:27:28
In reply to Re: Vincent - Colour, posted by Willow on July 7, 2001, at 22:53:08
> Did you know his painting were all done during the times he was not sick? That he planned every stroke, every color?
I have a condition called keratonous(misshapened cornea) which, amoung other things, causes me to see halos around lights, especially at night. I have been wondering if Van Gogh had it too, because Starry Night, is how I see the night sky.
Thank you for your posts. I love the whole thing, all the colors.
> > Paint your palette blue and grey,
> > Flaming flowers that brightly blaze,
> > Swirling clouds in violet haze,
> > Reflect in Vincent's eyes of China blue.
> > Colors changing hue, morning field of amber grain,
> > The silver thorn of bloody rose,
> > Lie crushed and broken on the virgin snow.
>
> First, thanks for sharing it! I liked it.
>
> Second, got me to wondering what everyone's favourite colour is? Mine being a mix of blue/grey. I wonder if there is any meaning to this, sortof like birth order?
Posted by Racer on July 15, 2001, at 2:32:32
In reply to Re: Vincent - Colour, posted by susan C on July 9, 2001, at 17:27:28
It's funny, because this was an old forensic pathology query from way back. Digitalis poisoning is considered a more probable answer. Some even suggest that the images of foxgloves in some of his paintings are reflexions of this.
He was prescribed digitalis, but I forget what for.
And then there's the other question: do we really care what caused him to see the world as he did? Isn't it enough that he left us his amazing vision?
(I'm old enough now to grieve for his pain, and wish that he had had enough wellness to paint more. No romanticism in dying young, or in suicide. If only...)
Posted by Willow on July 15, 2001, at 10:23:53
In reply to Re: Vincent - Not Keratonus, posted by Racer on July 15, 2001, at 2:32:32
Are these your words:
>
> (I'm old enough now to grieve for his pain, and wish that he had had enough wellness to paint more. No romanticism in dying young, or in suicide. If only...)They would make a great campaign for our youth. I believe these are words that they could understand. Perhaps with a piece of the art on a billboard too. What do you guys think?
Weeping Willow
Posted by Mitchell on July 15, 2001, at 16:40:36
In reply to Racer ...great quote, posted by Willow on July 15, 2001, at 10:23:53
> >I have a condition called keratonous …I have been wondering if Van Gogh had it too, (susanC)
I can't diagnose Van Gogh's conditions, but perceptual anomalies have been identified as the basis for many mood disorders. Not all depression or ADHD is a result of any one perceptual condition, but many individuals whose perceptions are unique as a result of physical arrangement develop mood disorders as a product of their isolation. Some see (hear, taste, smell, feel or understand) the world differently and are ostracized for their differences.
Confusing the message with the static, critics often claim a person is communicating a fundamentally flawed concept because the concept is related in a confused or confounding manner. Many times, people would rather accept an authoritative presentation of a fallacious concept than a distorted presentation of a fundamental truth. Unfortunately, the mood disorders that result when a unique person is ostracized can be more deep-seated and often remain, maybe partially controlled by some treatment, long after the perceptual anomaly has been resolved by often simple procedures such as a corrective lens or cognitive realignment.
A gift or a curse? Some would speculate as to when long-passed artists (or living members of their community) were sick and when they were well. We celebrate their contribution, but sometimes attempt to surgically separate the underlying perceptual insight we appreciate from the pathological social and personal conditions that develop as a result of the difference. Some would appeal to a judge, pleading for an involuntary commitment and forced treatment. Others appeal to friends to orchestrate an intervention. Yet others might appeal directly to the affected individual, attempting to convince them of their inappropriate and ostensibly treatable difference. But when affected individuals contribute to our community, offering fresh perspectives, we hoist them on a pedestal. We hang on our walls the paintings of those whose perception is ordered differently than the norm, while asking the artist to return to their artists' quarter or their gilded mansion so as to not violate our sense of normality.
I wonder if we truly grieve for their pain. Or do we, intoxicated with the longing and desire of a romantic culture, grieve for ourselves that we cannot at once have the same expanded cerebral capacity for hearing and touch as a blind person while still enjoying pleasure of 20/20 vision.
Though my life has gone on decades longer than I hoped or planned, some communities deeply appreciate my creative contributions. I carefully quarantine my inner self so that those who enjoy the banquets I serve will not injure me when they become frustrated over the source of the insights I serve. Full access to my soul is reserved for the few who will not attempt to rearrange me to suit their romantic notions.
Posted by susan C on July 15, 2001, at 19:25:06
In reply to They did not listen, they did not know how, posted by Mitchell on July 15, 2001, at 16:40:36
Thank you. I am having a hard time mentally focusing right now (up up up), so it took me a few times to read what you wrote. I tke it now with appreciating and put it with my things to read again. Thank you. (A side note and up date to what I said, I was able to talk with my eye dr and he said the effect I have is probably not kc, but the extreme astigmatism in one eye.)
> > >I have a condition called keratonous …I have been wondering if Van Gogh had it too, (susanC)
>
> I can't diagnose Van Gogh's conditions, but perceptual anomalies have been identified as the basis for many mood disorders. Not all depression or ADHD is a result of any one perceptual condition, but many individuals whose perceptions are unique as a result of physical arrangement develop mood disorders as a product of their isolation. Some see (hear, taste, smell, feel or understand) the world differently and are ostracized for their differences.
>
> Confusing the message with the static, critics often claim a person is communicating a fundamentally flawed concept because the concept is related in a confused or confounding manner. Many times, people would rather accept an authoritative presentation of a fallacious concept than a distorted presentation of a fundamental truth. Unfortunately, the mood disorders that result when a unique person is ostracized can be more deep-seated and often remain, maybe partially controlled by some treatment, long after the perceptual anomaly has been resolved by often simple procedures such as a corrective lens or cognitive realignment.
>
> A gift or a curse? Some would speculate as to when long-passed artists (or living members of their community) were sick and when they were well. We celebrate their contribution, but sometimes attempt to surgically separate the underlying perceptual insight we appreciate from the pathological social and personal conditions that develop as a result of the difference. Some would appeal to a judge, pleading for an involuntary commitment and forced treatment. Others appeal to friends to orchestrate an intervention. Yet others might appeal directly to the affected individual, attempting to convince them of their inappropriate and ostensibly treatable difference. But when affected individuals contribute to our community, offering fresh perspectives, we hoist them on a pedestal. We hang on our walls the paintings of those whose perception is ordered differently than the norm, while asking the artist to return to their artists' quarter or their gilded mansion so as to not violate our sense of normality.
>
> I wonder if we truly grieve for their pain. Or do we, intoxicated with the longing and desire of a romantic culture, grieve for ourselves that we cannot at once have the same expanded cerebral capacity for hearing and touch as a blind person while still enjoying pleasure of 20/20 vision.
>
> Though my life has gone on decades longer than I hoped or planned, some communities deeply appreciate my creative contributions. I carefully quarantine my inner self so that those who enjoy the banquets I serve will not injure me when they become frustrated over the source of the insights I serve. Full access to my soul is reserved for the few who will not attempt to rearrange me to suit their romantic notions.
>
> http://www.vangoghgallery.com/index.html
Posted by Phil on July 15, 2001, at 20:09:05
In reply to They did not listen, they did not know how, posted by Mitchell on July 15, 2001, at 16:40:36
> > >I have a condition called keratonous …I have been wondering if Van Gogh had it too, (susanC)
>
> I can't diagnose Van Gogh's conditions, but perceptual anomalies have been identified as the basis for many mood disorders. Not all depression or ADHD is a result of any one perceptual condition, but many individuals whose perceptions are unique as a result of physical arrangement develop mood disorders as a product of their isolation. Some see (hear, taste, smell, feel or understand) the world differently and are ostracized for their differences.
>
> Confusing the message with the static, critics often claim a person is communicating a fundamentally flawed concept because the concept is related in a confused or confounding manner. Many times, people would rather accept an authoritative presentation of a fallacious concept than a distorted presentation of a fundamental truth. Unfortunately, the mood disorders that result when a unique person is ostracized can be more deep-seated and often remain, maybe partially controlled by some treatment, long after the perceptual anomaly has been resolved by often simple procedures such as a corrective lens or cognitive realignment.
>
> A gift or a curse? Some would speculate as to when long-passed artists (or living members of their community) were sick and when they were well. We celebrate their contribution, but sometimes attempt to surgically separate the underlying perceptual insight we appreciate from the pathological social and personal conditions that develop as a result of the difference. Some would appeal to a judge, pleading for an involuntary commitment and forced treatment. Others appeal to friends to orchestrate an intervention. Yet others might appeal directly to the affected individual, attempting to convince them of their inappropriate and ostensibly treatable difference. But when affected individuals contribute to our community, offering fresh perspectives, we hoist them on a pedestal. We hang on our walls the paintings of those whose perception is ordered differently than the norm, while asking the artist to return to their artists' quarter or their gilded mansion so as to not violate our sense of normality.
>
> I wonder if we truly grieve for their pain. Or do we, intoxicated with the longing and desire of a romantic culture, grieve for ourselves that we cannot at once have the same expanded cerebral capacity for hearing and touch as a blind person while still enjoying pleasure of 20/20 vision.
>
> Though my life has gone on decades longer than I hoped or planned, some communities deeply appreciate my creative contributions. I carefully quarantine my inner self so that those who enjoy the banquets I serve will not injure me when they become frustrated over the source of the insights I serve. Full access to my soul is reserved for the few who will not attempt to rearrange me to suit their romantic notions.
>
> http://www.vangoghgallery.com/index.html
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