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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 16:11:15
Since there is no dedicated OCD board, or for that matter, depression or PTSD boards - all possible contributors to hoarding - I post this here. As an Adult Protective Services worker I run across hoarding periodically at work. Some of you may find this support website interesting:
http://www.childrenofhoarders.com/bindex.php
Posted by Dinah on April 9, 2007, at 17:45:16
In reply to Hoarding, posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 16:11:15
Boy, can I relate. I took pictures once for my therapist of my mother's house. There are some rooms (most rooms) that you can't even walk in. At all. Even if you hop.
Now that Katrina flooded her house, it's even more urgent, because if she doesn't clear the clutter enough to reach the walls to gut the house by the end of the month, her church won't be able to help her rebuild. Not even mentioning the mold, etc.
It's unbelievable. She's having my uncle box up paperback books that were under flood water because she can't throw them away until she writes down the title. She's having him box up twenty year old mail order catalogs.
And there's nothing at all I can do. I even did try to turn her in several times (including when the social worker came to the house for my dad), and the local government won't do anything.
It's hard for me to think of it as a disorder, and maybe especially hard to think of it as OCD, since I associate that with a whole different set of symptoms (contradictory symptoms at that).
Posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 18:54:03
In reply to Re: Hoarding » Toph, posted by Dinah on April 9, 2007, at 17:45:16
Hi Dinah,
I'm no expert but for some the compulsion and the anxiety that is elicited when one attempts to remove what we consider worthless trash is probably where the OCD connection comes from. But I have seen other clients who if you go to the bottom of each pile you find things that date with uncanny proximity to the date their child or spouse died. This strikes me as depression or PTSD. Regardless, in our unit we beg off these cases. Too many of us have spent about a thousand precious dollars of our emergency funds to do a clean up only to get a referral a year later where the stuff is up to the ceiling again. The distorted view of appropriate or worthiness of possessions is reminiscent of the intense distortion an anorexic has for her perceived obesity. My only advice Dinah is I'd be careful as a child to be the change agent here. Losing your mom is not worth a tidy house (unless of course there is threat of disease, fire, complete isolation, etc).
I miss Babble. I'm almost caught up at work. I'm hoping there in no connection.
Toph
Posted by sunnydays on April 9, 2007, at 20:17:39
In reply to Hoarding, posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 16:11:15
Very interesting. I debate whether my dad hoards or not. I think he does, it's just my mom every once in a while forces him to throw stuff out, so it doesn't get unbearable. But before we undertook a multi-state move, we had a basement full to the ceiling with only three little tiny paths through it. And he got SO upset when we tried to throw out the old technical magazines from the 70s that had to have been sooo out of date because he might need them someday and we were trying to get rid of all his stuff and ruin his life. And yet I still debate...
sunnydays
Posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 22:25:42
In reply to Re: Hoarding, posted by sunnydays on April 9, 2007, at 20:17:39
I had a case sunny where this one old guy had his entire basement was filled with refrigerators he'd bring home when people would toss them. Not sure if he was actually a hoarder, though some that I've seen only hoard in specific areas of the house. He was really paranoid and when I asked him why he collected fr*gs in his basement (hard to distinguish a compulsive collector from a hoarder), he told me, "because that's the best place to keep people from stealing them." Made sense to me.
Geez, is fr!g a dirty word somewhere?
Posted by 10derHeart on April 10, 2007, at 11:47:50
In reply to Re: Hoarding, posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 22:25:42
Who knew...but apparently, M-W says 'yes':
fr*g
Main Entry: fr*g
Pronunciation: 'fr*g
Function: intransitive verb
Inflected Form(s): fr*gged; fr*g·gingEtymology: Middle English fr*ggen to wriggle
often vulgar : COPULATE -- sometimes used in the present participle as a meaningless intensive
---------------------------------------------People do substitute that a lot for the "actual" F-word, but I thought it was sorta a made-up thing .....learn somethin' new every day :-)
And.....why does that last part - [sometimes used in the present participle as a meaningless intensive] - sound far more suggestive and potentially vulgar to me, than the word itself? Lol...
And..... my advice is - keep your 'g's' nice and soft, as in "gyrate" or "gymnastics," and you'll be okay....fr*g is another version of fridge...but, when prounounced with a hard 'g' - then the trouble starts.... ;-)
--- Excessive commentary by 10derHeart, 'specially for you, Toph ---
Posted by philyra on April 10, 2007, at 14:27:23
In reply to Re: Hoarding, posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 22:25:42
one of my parents is a hoarder. my sibling and i still have a lot of shame around it. i find it really hard to talk about and it makes me incredibly sad, knowing it will never get better and someday i'll have to clean out that house.
i think i also have some hoarding instincts. it can be difficult for me to get rid of things. i always do eventually - i have a pretty clear space - but i put it off and i worry that i might change my mind and need something someday. when i'm really stressed out i notice that i put off taking out the garbage and feel almost emotionally attached to it. at the same time clutter terrifies me and i get very triggered if i'm in someone's home and it has a lot of clutter. i can't stand it.
thanks for posting that group. i think i'm going to join.
take care,
philyra
Posted by scratchpad on April 10, 2007, at 16:22:39
In reply to Hoarding, posted by Toph on April 9, 2007, at 16:11:15
Toph!! My Toph!! A visit from the prince of the midwest!!
Is there a reverse infliction? Because my mum threw out all the stuff from my childhood. Homemade xmas greetings, report cards, handkerchiefs... all discovered after the fact by us kids. She didn't want extraneous "stuff" in her life. Didn't want to think about and have rememberances of her life with our dad. It felt like a lifetime discarded to us all.
Meanwhile, I'm collecting memorabilia of the 1967 World's Fair (Expo '67) in Montreal. Probably buying up the stuff that our mum tossed out.
It goes around and around.
So lovely to see your name here, though!!
Scratchpad
who used to be ClearSkies, and before that PartlyCloudy, etc.
Posted by Toph on April 11, 2007, at 10:56:50
In reply to Re: Hoarding » Toph, posted by 10derHeart on April 10, 2007, at 11:47:50
Of course fr*g is spelled fridge, 10. I can't spell but I sure can wriggle. : )
Posted by Toph on April 11, 2007, at 11:47:26
In reply to Re: Hoarding, posted by philyra on April 10, 2007, at 14:27:23
I've noticed that hoarding is tough on kids who avoid having anyone come over fearing the brutal judgements of their peers. You seem to have a lot of insight into the tendencies you see in yourself. It sounds like you manage these anxieties well, philyra.
Posted by Toph on April 11, 2007, at 12:00:05
In reply to Re: Hoarding » Toph, posted by scratchpad on April 10, 2007, at 16:22:39
I think you know already how I feel, but I don't mind telling you again, you are one beautiful person pc (OK, so I've been a little manicky lately, but I mean it nonetheless). There is a name for your mom's affliction, I think they call it child abuse. The irony is that she probably threw away some memories that you had positively associated with her. Anyway, I don't think all collectors are hoarders, at least the Beanie Babyers are hoping so.
This is the end of the thread.
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