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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 11:21:17
Hi All,
Wondering what people had to say about the topic of curiousity--not transference--about your therapist.
I've made a ton of headway in therapy over the past four years and beginning next year we will discuss new goals or termination. No pressure but clearly I'm coming to an end in terms of what I originally came in for. Great stuff for the most part.
The thing that still bugs me though is that I almost feel like I've got a mystery to solve about my therapist. Like I feel like I need to "find out" what her deal is.
One thing that I think plagues me is this: I was referred to this therapist by a friend who told me that she was roomate's with my therapist a long time back. She said she was gay for a long time and then ended up marrying a guy.
Over the past years my path has taken me in a similar direction. It came from left field--I was gay, was with a woman and then fell head over heels with a guy. It's genuine--I do not feel I was pushed into this at all.
But I don't know. Maybe part of me wants to know if I'll know what happens to me if I know what happened to her?
She and I have talked about the similarities and how I feel about them.
But I don't want to leave therapy curious. I want to leave therapy DONE.
Any advise? Is this just a "thing" I need to process with her?
Thanks!
Rigby
Posted by LadyBug on December 14, 2005, at 13:25:29
In reply to Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy, posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 11:21:17
I've talked about ending my therapy at times with my therapist. She's always told me this; "When we're done telling each other everything there is to tell, we'll be through with therapy." Pretty broad statement, I know. But when everI think about leaving, I think about this statement and I know I'm not done talking with her about the things I struggle with. And I've been seeing her for almost 9 years!! She's told me some people need therapy in order to function in their life. I believe I need her to function the way I want too. I love having her in my mind.....
She said, "when we're done, you'll just know it!" And somehow I believe her.
I know whenever I start to think about termination it clouds up our work together, it's too painful for me to think about. Then she say's I'm not ready for that step.Sorry to write a novel here, I'm sure that wasn't what you were after....
Good luck~
LadyBug
Posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 16:34:25
In reply to Re: Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy » Rigby, posted by LadyBug on December 14, 2005, at 13:25:29
Hey Lady Bug,
Thanks for your response. This was helpful.
I'd heard similar things--that when you're done you know it--you just know it in your gut. And there's just not much to say anymore.
I guess at times I'm beginning to feel like that--just hints of it.
But there's still this gnawing part of me that feels that my curiosity is a sign of something still not "done."
Hmmm...
> I've talked about ending my therapy at times with my therapist. She's always told me this; "When we're done telling each other everything there is to tell, we'll be through with therapy." Pretty broad statement, I know. But when everI think about leaving, I think about this statement and I know I'm not done talking with her about the things I struggle with. And I've been seeing her for almost 9 years!! She's told me some people need therapy in order to function in their life. I believe I need her to function the way I want too. I love having her in my mind.....
> She said, "when we're done, you'll just know it!" And somehow I believe her.
> I know whenever I start to think about termination it clouds up our work together, it's too painful for me to think about. Then she say's I'm not ready for that step.
>
> Sorry to write a novel here, I'm sure that wasn't what you were after....
> Good luck~
> LadyBug
Posted by Tamar on December 14, 2005, at 16:56:16
In reply to Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy, posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 11:21:17
Hi Rigby,
> Wondering what people had to say about the topic of curiousity--not transference--about your therapist.
Hmmm… I see why you’re making that distinction, although I suspect some therapists might argue that curiosity is part of the transference. Perhaps the reason why we want to know things about them is something to do with how we’re processing old feelings…
> I've made a ton of headway in therapy over the past four years and beginning next year we will discuss new goals or termination. No pressure but clearly I'm coming to an end in terms of what I originally came in for. Great stuff for the most part.
That sounds like an interesting place to be! Good for you!
> The thing that still bugs me though is that I almost feel like I've got a mystery to solve about my therapist. Like I feel like I need to "find out" what her deal is.
>
> One thing that I think plagues me is this: I was referred to this therapist by a friend who told me that she was roomate's with my therapist a long time back. She said she was gay for a long time and then ended up marrying a guy.
>
> Over the past years my path has taken me in a similar direction. It came from left field--I was gay, was with a woman and then fell head over heels with a guy. It's genuine--I do not feel I was pushed into this at all.
>
> But I don't know. Maybe part of me wants to know if I'll know what happens to me if I know what happened to her?I wonder if I’ve understood you correctly. Are you curious about how it came to be that she seemed to switch from gay to straight? And you’re curious if it’s the same kind of thing that happened to you?
> She and I have talked about the similarities and how I feel about them.
>
> But I don't want to leave therapy curious. I want to leave therapy DONE.
>
> Any advise? Is this just a "thing" I need to process with her?It does sound as if you need to process it with her. I don’t know if I’ve understood you correctly…
Are you struggling to understand your own sexuality? Sexuality can be pretty mysterious. Or do you sometimes wonder what kinds of feelings could have arisen between you and your therapist if you’d both remained gay?
She might ask you what sort of answer you’re expecting. Are you expecting her to say she just happened to fall in love with a man? Or that she was always a little bit interested in men but usually preferred women until she met her current partner? Or that her interest in men increased gradually over a number of years until she met one she fell in love with?
I suspect there isn’t a definitive answer. As far as I can tell, people’s sexuality isn’t fixed; it changes over time. One of my close friends has always been a lesbian. A couple of years ago she happened to mention that she’d never kissed a man. My husband said he’d kiss her, she dared him to, and they kissed. Recently she’s been talking about a new interest in men. I’d like to think it’s because of my husband’s incredible kissing technique, but I suspect it’s more likely that she’s been gradually becoming more aware of the delights of the male form. I’m expecting her to find a man fairly soon (probably not my husband…).
I dunno. I have plenty of trouble trying to understand my own relationship; I can never figure out how other people’s relationships work!
Sorry, I think I’m just rambling now. Anyway… I think if you want to hear her story, you should ask her. I don’t know if she’ll tell you. But even if she doesn’t, I think you’ll find out something about yourself in the process.
Tamar
Posted by Dinah on December 14, 2005, at 17:13:17
In reply to Re: Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy » LadyBug, posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 16:34:25
Is it therapeutic curiousity or personal curiosity? I'm sort of careful not to step into my therapist's life unless he brings something up. And even then I'm scrupulously noncommittal in my response. But then, I'm that way with just about anyone (IRL anyway).
If you have the sort of therapist who wouldn't mind it, I can see where you might bring up what you had been told and the things it caused you to wonder. She may or may not answer about her own life. But she might be more willing to talk about the feelings you have about it. I suspect that's what mine would do.
Ending therapy... What a difficult subject! Do you feel like you've accomplished what you set out to accomplish?
Posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 20:15:21
In reply to Re: Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy » Rigby, posted by Tamar on December 14, 2005, at 16:56:16
Hi Tamar,
Thanks for your response. You bring up some really good questions. Really good. It made me think that there might be some unfinished transference business mixed in.
> Hmmm… I see why you’re making that distinction, although I suspect some therapists might argue that curiosity is part of the transference. Perhaps the reason why we want to know things about them is something to do with how we’re processing old feelings…I am curious about her story for some reason. But I really don't understand what it's about. I don't know exactly what I'm after but the feeling there is one of being not done with something around her.
> I wonder if I’ve understood you correctly. Are you curious about how it came to be that she seemed to switch from gay to straight? And you’re curious if it’s the same kind of thing that happened to you?I don't feel at odds with my sexuality or struggling. Maybe I wonder where the gay part of her sexuality went. It certainly seemed turned on at times with me. And I know that while I'm now in love with a guy I'm still the same person and probably still quite capable of having feelings for women too.
> Are you struggling to understand your own sexuality? Sexuality can be pretty mysterious. Or do you sometimes wonder what kinds of feelings could have arisen between you and your therapist if you’d both remained gay?I know that she won't answer *anything.* She's got super strict boundaries with me. Here's the strange thing: I want to know but when I imagine her talking about it I nearly cringe. Last week all she mentioned about herself was something about trouble sleeping when she's out of town in a hotel room and that made me cringe.
> She might ask you what sort of answer you’re expecting. Are you expecting her to say she just happened to fall in love with a man? Or that sheYeah, that's for sure.
> I suspect there isn’t a definitive answer. As far as I can tell, people’s sexuality isn’t fixed; it changes over time. One of my close friends has always been a lesbian. A couple of years ago she happened to mention that she’dWow--*you're* generous! And super secure. Very cool that you could do that.
>never kissed a man. My husband said he’d kiss her, she dared him to, and they kissed. Recently she’s been talking about a new interest in men. I’d like to think it’s because of my husband’s incredible kissing technique, but I suspect it’s more likely that she’s been gradually becoming more aware of the delights of the male form. I’m expecting her to find a man fairly soon (probably not my husband…).Thanks, Tamar--really provocative post--appreciate it.
Rigby
Posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 20:23:35
In reply to Re: Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy » Rigby, posted by Dinah on December 14, 2005, at 17:13:17
Hi Dinah,
I guess it's therapeutic--I think. I'm not exactly sure what the difference would be?
> Is it therapeutic curiousity or personal curiosity? I'm sort of careful not to step into my therapist's life unless he brings something up. And even then I'm scrupulously noncommittal in my response. But then, I'm that way with just about anyone (IRL anyway).I have asked her, said I feel alone--like there's not many on this journey--coming out of the closet in reverse and would she just freaking throw me a bone and she said she didn't want her experience to color mine. My experience was mine. I guess because her boundaries sucked in the beginning she's super closed now. When I said something about her being so rule based she said she wasn't. I asked her to talk about a rule she wasn't following and she thought for a moment and said that she spends a lot of time thinking about me (I assumed she meant my "case" as that's how it sounded.)
> If you have the sort of therapist who wouldn't mind it, I can see where you might bring up what you had been told and the things it caused you to wonder. She may or may not answer about her own life. But she might be more willing to talk about the feelings you have about it. I suspect that's what mine would do.I set out to accomplish two things: 1. To no longer feel waves of wanting to kill myself and 2. To be in an intimate relationship--one that combines love and sex. I'm there and it's been a long, four year road. The question is, do I have more goals in therapy--or more goals that I would want to pursue with *this* therapist.
> Ending therapy... What a difficult subject! Do you feel like you've accomplished what you set out to accomplish?Thanks so much for your thoughtful post--really appreciate it.
Rigby
Posted by Tamar on December 15, 2005, at 3:19:19
In reply to Re: Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy » Tamar, posted by Rigby on December 14, 2005, at 20:15:21
Hi Rigby,
> I am curious about her story for some reason. But I really don't understand what it's about. I don't know exactly what I'm after but the feeling there is one of being not done with something around her.
Well, I guess there’s still some work to be done…
> I don't feel at odds with my sexuality or struggling. Maybe I wonder where the gay part of her sexuality went. It certainly seemed turned on at times with me. And I know that while I'm now in love with a guy I'm still the same person and probably still quite capable of having feelings for women too.
Yeah. I had a long relationship with a woman before I met my husband and although I’ve been married for close to ten years I still have feelings for women occasionally. I don’t know how to label myself (I think the term bisexual doesn’t really fit me), but I definitely notice women sometimes. I tend to find it goes in phases.
> I know that she won't answer *anything.* She's got super strict boundaries with me. Here's the strange thing: I want to know but when I imagine her talking about it I nearly cringe. Last week all she mentioned about herself was something about trouble sleeping when she's out of town in a hotel room and that made me cringe.
Ah. So it’ll be hard to address it if it makes you cringe. Sometimes people don’t like knowing personal things about their therapists. But I can really understand wanting to know. I suppose you must wonder how her experience is similar to yours, and how it’s different.
> Wow--*you're* generous! And super secure. Very cool that you could do that.
Well, I was standing right there. If they’d been kissing in secret I might have had something to worry about! But yeah, I’m pretty secure about my husband. I know that he’ll always come home to me, so if he occasionally kisses someone else it doesn’t really bother me, as long as it’s casual. If he fell in love with someone else, that would be another matter!
It’s very true that coming out in reverse is somewhat unusual and there aren’t many people to share experiences with. Is it something you’ve talked about much with your partner? Is he at all anxious that you might ‘revert’ one day?
Tamar
Posted by Rigby on December 15, 2005, at 14:09:40
In reply to Re: Curiosity About Therapist/Ending Therapy » Rigby, posted by Tamar on December 15, 2005, at 3:19:19
Hi Tamar,
I'm with you on this--don't really think the bi label works for me either. Not sure why it doesn't but I just don't feel comfortable "wearing" it.
> Yeah. I had a long relationship with a woman before I met my husband and although I’ve been married for close to ten years I still have feelings for women occasionally. I don’t know how to label myself (I think the term bisexual doesn’t really fit me), but I definitely notice women sometimes. I tend to find it goes in phases.Yeah, I do wanna know. And darn it I don't too!!! ACK! I'm gonna have to get a tad bit clearer before my appointment tonight--I'd really like to try and take a stab at this topic with her.
> Ah. So it’ll be hard to address it if it makes you cringe. Sometimes people don’t like knowing personal things about their therapists. But I can really understand wanting to know. I suppose you must wonder how her experience is similar to yours, and how it’s different.How long have you guys been married? I think I'd clock my boyfriend if he kissed another woman. I never ever thought: 1. I'd have a BOYfriend and 2. that I'd feel so possessive but hey, life's funny that way!
> Well, I was standing right there. If they’d been kissing in secret I might have had something to worry about! But yeah, I’m pretty secure about my husband. I know that he’ll always come home to me, so if he occasionally kisses someone else it doesn’t really bother me, as long as it’s casual. If he fell in love with someone else, that would be another matter!I've definitely talked with my boyfriend about this process. He's not anxious about me reverting because there's so much love between us. When I tell him how much I love him he says he knows--not in a stuck-up way but in a way that says he really understands me.
> It’s very true that coming out in reverse is somewhat unusual and there aren’t many people to share experiences with. Is it something you’ve talked about much with your partner? Is he at all anxious that you might ‘revert’ one day?
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