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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
This is a long update on the ongoing saga of my therapy...
Most of you know that I haven't really clicked with my pdoc. And since I've been seriously depressed the past month or so, my therapist has been increasingly concerned that I'm on the wrong medications. I did go back and see Ms. pdoc and she added in zanax for anxiety. Yes, well...a week ago Friday I went so far south that I left a good-bye message of sorts for my therapist and had every intention of following through. A number of things got in the way, including him getting the message much sooner than I anticipated, but once the panic was over and safety re-established, we walked back through the triggers to try and figure out how I ended up where I did. It was only the second time I'd taken the zanax so it became our prime suspect.Fast forward to this week. My therapist did what he almost never does and got pushy. He set up things with a new pdoc, and even talk to him first before I went. (He had my permission of course.) I met the new guy yesterday and he is very nice and pretty creative. I'd done some research (thanks Racer) and he agreed that a change was necessary. He also said "no more zanax" just because I seem to react badly to anti-anxiety meds by themselves. Near as we can figure out, I need to be anxious about suicide so as not to go there. Makes sense in a really weird way. What I liked best about the new pdoc was that he took a whole hour with me, even though he had most of my history from my therapist and he made it a point to say he doesn't work with people unless he is doing therapy for them or works closely with their therapist. But he also said he doesn't interfere with the therapy, except to cover if the therapist needs to be gone or something. He talked a lot about being a team, how to reach him for both regular and emergency things and what his philosophy about feelings were. Not medications...feelings. (Yes, he is a trauma specialist.) He didn't ask invasive questions about the abuse, just the extent of the flashbacks, etc. He understood about being in parts and pieces and even asked me how old I felt during our session. (Yes, I totally lied. I don't know him well enough to admit feeling 7!) What really surprised me was when he asked: "how worried do I need to be about you?" OK, I just met this guy, why on earth would he care about me? He knows I have a good therapist, etc. I was just so impressed that he was asserting himself as "MY doctor" after only an hour. I'm supposed to call him next week and go back in a month. And he was calling my therapist to keep him in the loop too. I'm starting to think I might like this guy.
Today I went and met with my priest, again at my therapist's urging. Church has always been the place I found peace but lately it is such an emotional experience for me. I end up in tears so I've been avoiding it. And I don't talk to God much. We talk about this in therapy on and off -- my therapist thinks this is a really important part of who I am and an important source of strength. He uses it against me sometimes, "suicide is a sin" -- I always respond, "you are Jewish, you don't believe that!" His response is: "but you do..." (Yes, I've said it is unfair and he always says everything is fair when it comes to keeping you alive. *sigh*) It was hard for me to say to Father Steve, "I think God has deserted me." His answer was, "He hasn't. But you have every right to be mad at him. So I think you should get mad -- really mad --- and tell him when you talk to him. Don't hide behind structured prayers, go ahead and yell at God." I was totally in shock. This is NOT what I expected him to say. He also talked about therapy and was very pleased that I was going "a lot" and he was thrilled that a psychologist would send me to talk to him. He said, "you've got a good one." :) The other thing that surprised me was that Father Steve told me I need more fun things in my life, I need to sleep more (he suggested medications) and it would be OK to take a break from Church for awhile if I needed to. He said just remember that God won't really ever leave you. I cried and cried. He wants me to come back and see him in a couple of weeks to check in.
I had therapy this afternoon and we talked about the new team members. I admitted to being scared that pushing me to these new people meant he was pushing me away. He was really quiet and then he said, "I needed more links in the chain of the life line I keep throwing you. But I'm still the one at the end with my hands out." It made me cry but I'm so glad! And when I worried about pulling him under with me, he said, "think of me as a beach ball. Impossible to keep under. We just need to get the safety ring around you."
So, I guess I'm "bad enough" to need a team now. But it feels OK, like they are all working together. My therapist also reminded me that I've always found Babble to be a source of support too, so not to isolate from you guys either. It is true -- I just hope this wasn't too long of a post to come back with.
Hugs to all!
Daisy
Posted by zenhussy on October 27, 2005, at 19:12:27
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
>>So, I guess I'm "bad enough" to need a team now.
Hush! Not bad enough......smart enough sweetie. Smart enough to realize you need a multi-professional approach.
Sounds healthy and promising for your future.
What a great T to help line up the new p-doc. You'll be able to trust these new team members in time. They sound very gentle in their approach to you which can be so helpful with csa/trauma healing work.
__zh
Posted by antigua on October 27, 2005, at 19:37:25
In reply to Re: New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger » daisym, posted by zenhussy on October 27, 2005, at 19:12:27
Sounds like your own "dream team." You are very lucky to find people who care so much.
antigua
Posted by zenhussy on October 27, 2005, at 19:41:56
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
Daisy,
Think of the people you care for and respect on this board. How many of them are being seen by more than "the usual"...meaning a T and p-doc? Quite a few. How many didn't approach their healing this way until well into their forties or fifties? Again quite a few. Do you think less of anyone for needing more people on their team in order to heal? Strongly doubt it. Allow yourself the same compassion you would extend to others so instantly....eventually you'll see yourself as so deserving of this team approach to healing. You ARE worth the time, efforts and energies of these people because you deserve to heal.
Nothing wrong with having more help available to learn to use as additional healing resources. Lots of practice helps make reaching out easier eventually. Having a team helps create space in which to practice. Life IS the dress rehearsal ;) so practice and learn and keep healing.
Relieved you're still here and proud you've remained on your healing path through all these rough times.
__zh
Posted by Shortelise on October 27, 2005, at 20:35:58
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
Daisy, thanks for writing. It's good to "see" you.
ShortE
Posted by Tamar on October 27, 2005, at 20:38:40
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
Your p-doc sounds great. And I really, *really* like Father Steve on the basis of what you said. He sounds extremely sensible. I think it's so important to have a good priest when things are hard... it's good to find someone who understands the complexities of faith and suffering. I'm also glad your therapist reassured you.
(((((Daisy)))))
Tamar
Posted by Annierose on October 27, 2005, at 20:54:53
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
I like your team! And again, your T amazes me, knowing that he needed you to have more links in the chain. The new p-doc sounds incredible. I hope he helps you find the right medication or combination. The fact that he does therapy speaks volumes. And I like your priest too. I'm glad your T persuaded you to have a chat with him.
You sound like you are on more solid footing ... does it feel that way yet?
You deserve happiness. Thank you for letting us know how things are going. I feel bad that you had such a horrible weekend. Thank goodness your T called you back ASAP.
Posted by daisym on October 28, 2005, at 0:04:04
In reply to Re: New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by antigua on October 27, 2005, at 19:37:25
I wish I could trust their caring and honor it by feeling better and not giving them reasons to worry. I'm working on it though.
Posted by daisym on October 28, 2005, at 0:16:58
In reply to Re: p.s. to above ^^^ » daisym, posted by zenhussy on October 27, 2005, at 19:41:56
Think of the people you care for and respect on this board. How many of them are being seen by more than "the usual"...meaning a T and p-doc? Quite a few. How many didn't approach their healing this way until well into their forties or fifties? Again quite a few. Do you think less of anyone for needing more people on their team in order to heal? Strongly doubt it.
***Of course I don't think less of them. I guess I just have unrealistic expectations of what I *should* do for myself. I feel like I'm being so much trouble for everyone. It is an old feeling.Allow yourself the same compassion you would extend to others so instantly....eventually you'll see yourself as so deserving of this team approach to healing. You ARE worth the time, efforts and energies of these people because you deserve to heal.
***How do you make yourself believe this? It is such a core thing...if my mom didn't think I was worth saving, why should anyone else??Nothing wrong with having more help available to learn to use as additional healing resources. Lots of practice helps make reaching out easier eventually. Having a team helps create space in which to practice. Life IS the dress rehearsal ;) so practice and learn and keep healing.
***I'm trying. Really trying. I tell myself that at least this should help calm my fears of overwhelming my therapist. And maybe hearing the same thing from several people will help it sink in. (Maybe?)Relieved you're still here and proud you've remained on your healing path through all these rough times
***Thanks. I scared myself this time because I truly didn't care anymore. I can't say I'm all the way back, I'm shocked at attractive it sounds to just give up and go to sleep forever. I wish the path would wind downhill for awhile. I'm really tired of the constant climb.I've missed you around here. Thanks for popping in and helping me.
Posted by daisym on October 28, 2005, at 0:18:11
In reply to Re: New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger » daisym, posted by Shortelise on October 27, 2005, at 20:35:58
Thanks for reading that long diatribe! I know you've been struggling as well. I hope things are getting better and your stress goes down soon.
Posted by daisym on October 28, 2005, at 0:27:06
In reply to Re: New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger » daisym, posted by Tamar on October 27, 2005, at 20:38:40
It felt strange to talk about therapy with my priest even though it wasn't strange to talk about my faith with my therapist. But I think in order to heal, I'm going to have to ask some of those little kid questions that never have been answered, like was it a sin for me not to confess what was happening? Was God mad at my dad? Is he going to hell?
My therapist thought Father Steve was pretty good too. In fact he said that maybe we need to spend more time in therapy talking about how I could find joy in my life. Mostly I think he liked that fact that someone else told me it would be OK to get angry.
I'm just glad he isn't sick of me and looking to unload me. I wish I didn't still get so scared about this, but things have been so hard lately. I wouldn't blame him for bailing. :(
Thanks for the hug.
Posted by daisym on October 28, 2005, at 0:59:27
In reply to Re: New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger » daisym, posted by Annierose on October 27, 2005, at 20:54:53
I like your team! And again, your T amazes me, knowing that he needed you to have more links in the chain.
***Reminds me one more time how lucky I am to have an experienced person who doesn't seem to get threatened easily. He is pretty confident in his approach, which helps. I guess since he does long term stuff a lot, he is knows how much support it can take to get through all of this stuff.The new p-doc sounds incredible. I hope he helps you find the right medication or combination. The fact that he does therapy speaks volumes.
***I hope so too because SOMETHING has to give soon. I'm really hoping first impression works out to be true in this case. I worried a little when he talked about doing therapy but clearly he understands who is in charge of that part. He asked me if I'd call him if I was in trouble and I said no, but I'd call my therapist. His comment was "you obviously trust him. That is a huge compliment to him." Besides, I know my therapist told him not to mess with me around session frequency.And I like your priest too. I'm glad your T persuaded you to have a chat with him.
***I like him too. He baptized all my kids and he is a warm compassionate man. He said that too often priests are overlooked as supports these days -- too much bad press he guessed. You should have seen me blush when he asked if my "marital relations" were suffering due to my depression! It wasn't an inappropriate question in the context of what we were talking about but still...You sound like you are on more solid footing ... does it feel that way yet?
***Not yet. The new pdoc and I talked about the scale of suicidal feelings. The concern is that I sit mostly in the middle but can drop clear down in an afternoon. I do know more about the triggers but it is the impulse control that is seriously impaired. I'm still on daily check ins with my therapist and I had to do some real pleading not to end up in the hospital last week. In retrospect, I probably belonged there. I think I'm scary right now. My husband agrees.
You deserve happiness. Thank you for letting us know how things are going. I feel bad that you had such a horrible weekend. Thank goodness your T called you back ASAP.
***Actually, at first he couldn't find me. He left messages for me in several different places. I scared him a lot. But I didn't really realize how final the message I'd left him sounded. I guess I was asking for help without really asking for it. But the panic in his voice shook me up enough that I did respond to him. It was pretty awful. I don't know about deserving happiness. Right now I'll settle for no more catastrophes.
Posted by allisonross on October 28, 2005, at 8:25:09
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
> Hi, Daisy, sweetie: I am new here, so don't know your story.
This is a long update on the ongoing saga of my therapy...
> Most of you know that I haven't really clicked with my pdoc.Why is that?
And since I've been seriously depressed the past month or so, my therapist has been increasingly concerned that I'm on the wrong medications. I did go back and see Ms. pdoc and she added in zanax for anxiety. Yes, well...a week ago Friday I went so far south that I left a good-bye message of sorts for my therapist and had every intention of following through. A number of things got in the way, including him getting the message much sooner than I anticipated, but once the panic was over and safety re-established, we walked back through the triggers to try and figure out how I ended up where I did. It was only the second time I'd taken the zanax so it became our prime suspect.
>
> Fast forward to this week. My therapist did what he almost never does and got pushy. He set up things with a new pdoc, and even talk to him first before I went. (He had my permission of course.)This sounds good.
I met the new guy yesterday and he is very nice and pretty creative. I'd done some research (thanks Racer) and he agreed that a change was necessary. He also said "no more zanax" just because I seem to react badly to anti-anxiety meds by themselves. Near as we can figure out, I need to be anxious about suicide so as not to go there. Makes sense in a really weird way. What I liked best about the new pdoc was that he took a whole hour with me, even though he had most of my history from my therapist and he made it a point to say he doesn't work with people unless he is doing therapy for them or works closely with their therapist. But he also said he doesn't interfere with the therapy, except to cover if the therapist needs to be gone or something. He talked a lot about being a team, how to reach him for both regular and emergency things and what his philosophy about feelings were. Not medications...feelings.
This is good; medications only mask our feelings. Unless we can know and "own" our feelings, we cannot heal.
(Yes, he is a trauma specialist.) He didn't ask invasive questions about the abuse, just the extent of the flashbacks, etc. He understood about being in parts and pieces and even asked me how old I felt during our session. (Yes, I totally lied. I don't know him well enough to admit feeling 7!)
Hmm (please know I am NOT criticizing you; that was what you were comfortable with---we all lie, LOL, but it is important to be authentic. It is okay (and necessary to feel all of our feelings and honor ourselves by doing that)
What really surprised me was when he asked: "how worried do I need to be about you?"
Wonderful questiion.
OK, I just met this guy, why on earth would he care about me?
Because that is who he is and what he does.
He knows I have a good therapist, etc. I was just so impressed that he was asserting himself as "MY doctor" after only an hour. I'm supposed to call him next week and go back in a month. And he was calling my therapist to keep him in the loop too. I'm starting to think I might like this guy.
I like him already. He sounds authentic--there are too few authentic people.
>
> Today I went and met with my priest, again at my therapist's urging. Church has always been the place I found peace but lately it is such an emotional experience for me.i know all about that (but for different reasons)
I end up in tears so I've been avoiding it.
Tears are precious and important. It is important to feel our feelings and let them out. If we do not, they will eat us up inside and destroy us.
And I don't talk to God much. We talk about this in therapy on and off -- my therapist thinks this is a really important part of who I am and an important source of strength. He uses it against me sometimes,
Uses it AGAINST you?
"suicide is a sin" --
I always respond, "you are Jewish, you don't believe that!" His response is: "but you do..." (Yes, I've said it is unfair and he always says everything is fair when it comes to keeping you alive. *sigh*)
That is true!
It was hard for me to say to Father Steve, "I think God has deserted me." His answer was, "He hasn't. But you have every right to be mad at him. So I think you should get mad -- really mad --- and tell him when you talk to him. Don't hide behind structured prayers, go ahead and yell at God." I was totally in shock. This is NOT what I expected him to say.
Sounds like he is (one of my favorite words): Authentic! Being real---that's what it is all about.
He also talked about therapy and was very pleased that I was going "a lot" and he was thrilled that a psychologist would send me to talk to him. He said, "you've got a good one." :) The other thing that surprised me was that Father Steve told me I need more fun things in my life,
Do what makes you feel good. Have fun.
I need to sleep more (he suggested medications) and it would be OK to take a break from Church for awhile if I needed to. He said just remember that God won't really ever leave you.
He won't...we may leave him for awhile, but he is always at our heart's door, waiting for that invitation.
I cried and cried.
Good. Crying is good and necessary to healing.
He wants me to come back and see him in a couple of weeks to check in.
>
> I had therapy this afternoon and we talked about the new team members. I admitted to being scared that pushing me to these new people meant he was pushing me away. He was really quiet and then he said, "I needed more links in the chain of the life line I keep throwing you. But I'm still the one at the end with my hands out." It made me cry but I'm so glad! And when I worried about pulling him under with me, he said, "think of me as a beach ball. Impossible to keep under. We just need to get the safety ring around you."
>
> So, I guess I'm "bad enough" to need a team now. But it feels OK, like they are all working together. My therapist also reminded me that I've always found Babble to be a source of support too, so not to isolate from you guys either. It is true -- I just hope this wasn't too long of a post to come back with.Not at all. It was good to get to know you in a small sense. May I suggest my website that may help you heal? www.churchabusepoetrytherapy.com......(faith-based poems) of anguish, healing, hope and comfort came pouring from my wounded soul, because my church voted me out of a 31-year church membership, because I got a divorce after 31 years of abuse...long story, but the site has been a phenomenon. Perhaps it will help you.
I'd like to know if it does, that is, if you choose to go into it. My love and hugs, and bless you, sweetie (wacalice@aol.com)
> Hugs to all!
> Daisy
Posted by Dinah on October 28, 2005, at 8:45:54
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
Daisy, it sounds like you are developing an excellent support system. That's such a wonderful thing to have, no wonder how terrific your therapist is.
I like your priest. :)
Posted by caraher on October 28, 2005, at 10:48:00
In reply to New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger, posted by daisym on October 27, 2005, at 19:04:24
>It was hard for me to say to Father Steve, "I think God has deserted me." His answer was, "He hasn't. But you have every right to be mad at him. So I think you should get mad -- really mad --- and tell him when you talk to him. Don't hide behind structured prayers, go ahead and yell at God." I was totally in shock. This is NOT what I expected him to say.
If Jesus himself said on the cross, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?" I think God understands when we lesser mortals despair and questions him.
It also sounds like Father Steve wants you to do what you say you haven't been doing - talking to God. *Really* talking.
>The other thing that surprised me was that Father Steve told me ... it would be OK to take a break from Church for awhile if I needed to. He said just remember that God won't really ever leave you.
In a similar vein, in the Bible Jesus is quoted as saying, "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath." If attending church is not a restoring experience for you I'm sure God won't miss your body in the building.
It's great that you're getting so much good support!
Posted by Tamar on October 28, 2005, at 11:43:06
In reply to Re: New Members of my Mental Health Team/trigger » Tamar, posted by daisym on October 28, 2005, at 0:27:06
> It felt strange to talk about therapy with my priest even though it wasn't strange to talk about my faith with my therapist. But I think in order to heal, I'm going to have to ask some of those little kid questions that never have been answered, like was it a sin for me not to confess what was happening? Was God mad at my dad? Is he going to hell?
These are really important questions. And from what you say, Father Steve will be able to help you find answers.
> My therapist thought Father Steve was pretty good too. In fact he said that maybe we need to spend more time in therapy talking about how I could find joy in my life. Mostly I think he liked that fact that someone else told me it would be OK to get angry.
Yes, I think people need to be able to express anger to God. I think God can take it. I sometimes think expressing the anger is necessary for reconciliation.
> I'm just glad he isn't sick of me and looking to unload me. I wish I didn't still get so scared about this, but things have been so hard lately. I wouldn't blame him for bailing. :(
I think it’s great that there are more people to support you. And although they can help with different things, I think it’s good to be able to talk about faith with your therapist and about therapy with your priest.
This is the end of the thread.
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