![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 24 to 48 of 48. Go back in thread:
Posted by fallsfall on March 27, 2005, at 10:04:21
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 27, 2005, at 3:01:01
Yes. I understand. I understand the impatience. I understand wanting to defend your therapist while at the same time you are angry at what he is doing (or not doing). I understand the divide (for me, it really did get lots better - the fee/insurance issue helped us get closer).
Do bring it up when you are ready. Don't feel like it is a taboo subject.
Sounds like a rough time with your aunt. And you need to be support for your mother and cousin. I hope you have some IRL support yourself - but remember that we will be here to support you, too. Let us know what you need.
(((AllDone)))
Posted by gardenergirl on March 27, 2005, at 10:16:18
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 27, 2005, at 3:01:01
Oh sweetie,
We're here for you. And of course you would feel conflicted about this. I bet you want to feel good about him, but the insurance thing is tricky.And I'm so sorry about your aunt. How awful. I'm glad you are there for your cousin, but do also take care of yourself. Let me know if you need any late night IM's, okay? I'll let you know if I can sleep in the next day or at least nap. No worries there.
We're here for you. You can share this with us.
(((((Laurie))))
gg
Posted by shrinking violet on March 27, 2005, at 11:34:05
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :( » All Done, posted by gardenergirl on March 27, 2005, at 10:16:18
Posted by Dinah on March 27, 2005, at 13:38:30
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 27, 2005, at 3:01:01
I'm so sorry about your family. The situation itself and the feelings it's reawakening in you about your father. My thoughts are with you and yours.
There's no need to defend your therapist to me. I think his response, while justifiably annoying, is not at all unexpected for a therapist. They aren't generally business whizzes or they'd have gone to business school. And we like them that way. He's just trying to feel his way along a new territory for him.
Money is always a tricky subject in therapy. :(
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 0:05:04
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :( » All Done, posted by fallsfall on March 27, 2005, at 10:04:21
> Yes. I understand. I understand the impatience. I understand wanting to defend your therapist while at the same time you are angry at what he is doing (or not doing). I understand the divide (for me, it really did get lots better - the fee/insurance issue helped us get closer).
Thanks, falls. It really helps me to hear that things got better for you and your T and that it even helped you get closer. I just feel so out there on my own right now and it's kind of lonely :(.
> Do bring it up when you are ready. Don't feel like it is a taboo subject.
I will. We even talked about it yesterday. Just not much I think, in part, because he hadn't talked to them, yet. I'll bug him next week if he doesn't bring it up. I don't think it would be a very wise idea to have a white elephant in the room with us. It's kinda small in there ;).
> Sounds like a rough time with your aunt. And you need to be support for your mother and cousin. I hope you have some IRL support yourself - but remember that we will be here to support you, too. Let us know what you need.
>
> (((AllDone)))A lot of my IRL support comes from my husband. He knows about my aunt, of course, but he has a hard time understanding some of the therapy stuff. (Especially when I don't tell him about all of it. Sigh.) So, it's nice to know I have you guys, too.
Thank you so much, falls.
Laurie
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 0:11:20
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :( » All Done, posted by gardenergirl on March 27, 2005, at 10:16:18
> Oh sweetie,
> We're here for you. And of course you would feel conflicted about this. I bet you want to feel good about him, but the insurance thing is tricky.I do want to feel good about him. He said he thinks this is a new "phase" of my therapy (I think he used the word phase.) Maybe less idealization of him or something. At kind of the same time, he was talking about the beginning, middle, and end of therapy. I guess my head is just assuming a new "phase" means I'm closer to the end. I don't like thinking about that :(.
> And I'm so sorry about your aunt. How awful. I'm glad you are there for your cousin, but do also take care of yourself. Let me know if you need any late night IM's, okay? I'll let you know if I can sleep in the next day or at least nap. No worries there.
>
> We're here for you. You can share this with us.
>
> (((((Laurie))))
>
> ggThanks, gg. I feel like I have a lot of stuff I want to talk about, I just don't know how to get it out in an organized manner. So, if we do IM, consider yourself warned - much rambling will ensue ;).
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 0:13:01
In reply to {{{{{{{{{{{{All Done}}}}}}}}}}}} (nm), posted by shrinking violet on March 27, 2005, at 11:34:05
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 0:23:40
In reply to ((((All Done)))), posted by Dinah on March 27, 2005, at 13:38:30
> I'm so sorry about your family. The situation itself and the feelings it's reawakening in you about your father. My thoughts are with you and yours.
Thanks, Dinah.
> There's no need to defend your therapist to me. I think his response, while justifiably annoying, is not at all unexpected for a therapist. They aren't generally business whizzes or they'd have gone to business school. And we like them that way. He's just trying to feel his way along a new territory for him.
>
> Money is always a tricky subject in therapy. :(Justifiably annoying - I like that :). Somehow, it feels better to me to be annoyed than angry. (I think I tend to use the terms interchangeably, though.)
And what do you mean he's not a business whiz? I like to believe he knows everything about everything (um, just like I thought my dad did). Maybe that's why I'm so darn disappointed :(.
Posted by Dinah on March 28, 2005, at 0:28:29
In reply to Re: ((((All Done)))) » Dinah, posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 0:23:40
Ok, clearly he's not perfect. Otherwise he would have showed his various and sundry failings very early in therapy. Perhaps my therapist could give a course in *that*. :)
"How to Ensure You Are Not Idealized (or Making Errors a Therapeutic Opportunity)"
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 1:02:01
In reply to lol » All Done, posted by Dinah on March 28, 2005, at 0:28:29
(((Dinah's T)))
;)
Posted by mair on March 28, 2005, at 5:07:16
In reply to Re: too funny, Dinah :), posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 1:02:01
I know I'm jumping in late here, and I haven't read all of the posts on this thread, but I dealt with exactly the same issue with my T after i first started seeing her. She was a provider for my insurance company although she worked in a different state from the one I lived in so she had to submit claims to her state and they then passed them along to my state. The allowed amount she was permitted under her contract was less than a T would have been allowed in my state. She submitted the claims and generally didn't bill me until after she got paid, but she'd bill me for the full difference between what she got from the insurer, and her normal hourly rate. More than that, the insurer in her state was so awful about processing claims that it took months for her to get reimbursed, and I started paying her on a monthly basis what she thought I would owe. She only had a couple of patients with my company and I think she maybe thought she could bill me differently since I lived in a different state.
I figured out that what she was doing was wrong but I hadn't been seeing her that long. I have a real aversion to dealing with money matters and in particular money disputes and I really didn't want to say anything to her. I found out that it just bothered me too much, however, - not so much the money as the fact that she was just not correct in the way she was billing me. I pretty much thought that raising it with her would fracture the relationship we were just starting to build and that I'd end up losing her, but I couldn't let it go.
After I raised it, I realized that she was amazingly naive and uninformed about the way these things were supposed to work and that her billing practices were a little sloppy. She certainly wasn't gypping me deliberately. I also discovered that she was really upset to discover that she had been doing things wrong, but also that she'd be getting paid so little if she could only bill me my copay. We worked out a compromise where we split the difference. I know I was still paying more that I was supposed to, but it wasn't that much different and could certainly live with it. And I was so grateful that she handled it in a way that made me feel ok for bringing it up.
Ultimately she dropped my insurer which meant I started having to submit my own claims. That hasn't been too bad because my state's allowed amount was higher than her's anyway.
What I learned was 1) you have to bring this stuff up if it bothers you; 2) the T should be able to deal with it in a constructive way; and 3) you can't assume that the T understands his or her provider contract, or for that matter, has a clue how the financial world really operates.
Mair
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 17:12:41
In reply to my experience » All Done, posted by mair on March 28, 2005, at 5:07:16
Thanks for sharing your experience, Mair. It's really too bad that this is such a common issue. I feel like there should be some sort of training seminar for the T's before they sign their contracts with the insurance companies.
I wish my T had expressed a little more concern that perhaps he was, in fact, doing something incorrectly. Instead, I felt sort of like he wasn't even going to accept any part of that theory and it kind of reminded me of my mom and the stuff that really irritates me about her.
Anyway, I agree, it was important for you to bring it up since it bothered you. Good job and I'm glad things worked out in the end. It gives me hope ;).
Thanks and take care.
Laurie
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 17:21:22
In reply to Re: I'm a bit of a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 27, 2005, at 3:01:01
Thanks everyone for your thoughts and well wishes. Unfortunately, my aunt passed away this morning. It's really triggering a lot of my feelings about my dad's death and I'm feeling a little twisted up inside right now. And for some reason, I feel myself getting more and more upset with my T over this stuff. It all feels so intertwined and I can't make heads or tails of it at the moment.
Sigh. Keep your fingers crossed that my T will be able to help make sense of all this with me.
:(
Posted by fallsfall on March 28, 2005, at 17:39:07
In reply to Re: I'm a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 17:21:22
(((Alldone)))
My condolences on your loss.
This issue with your therapist can wait a little bit. You need to give your attention to your mother and cousin, and yourself. Can you try to put this money issue on the shelf for a little bit?
Posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 19:11:05
In reply to Re: I'm a mess :( » All Done, posted by fallsfall on March 28, 2005, at 17:39:07
Thanks, falls.
It's not specifically the money issue that's bothering me. Otherwise, I would just table it until things settle down for my family. It's an overall sense (based only in part on the money thing) that I'm losing my connection with him. Logically, I know I'm not, but logic doesn't seem to be winning out.
I don't know that I'm making any sense. I'm not even sure what I'm feeling. Just an overwhelming sadness for lots of reasons that are getting all mixed up right now.
Posted by TofuEmmy on March 28, 2005, at 19:13:18
In reply to Re: I'm a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 17:21:22
So sad about the death of your aunt. And I totally understand how new losses kick up those other griefs. It's a bit like stirring up something we thought had settled a bit.
Yes, I hope your T helps you process all this. It will take some time to sink in tho pookie. Hang on, we're here for you.
Loving hugs, emmie
Posted by gardenergirl on March 28, 2005, at 19:18:40
In reply to Re: I'm a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 17:21:22
Oh dear,
What a trigger. I'm so sorry for your loss, especially at a time when you are feeling a bit diconnected with your T. I'm thinking of you. I hope that your T is able to jump in and help you feel connected again while giving you support through all this.Thinking of you,
gg
Posted by Dinah on March 28, 2005, at 19:26:45
In reply to Re: I'm a mess :(, posted by All Done on March 28, 2005, at 17:21:22
I too felt disconnected from my therapist when I had recently experienced loss. In fact, I'm not sure I've recovered the attachment.
Although it feels bad, and not at all helpful, somewhere inside us there must be some alarm going off telling us to pull back and protect ourselves.
My therapist says to just hang on and it will come back.
Posted by All Done on March 29, 2005, at 0:57:49
In reply to ((((((((((AllDone)))))))), posted by gardenergirl on March 28, 2005, at 19:18:40
The two of you make me feel so cared for and you're both so kind. I truly appreciate all of your support and I love when you make me laugh, too ;).
Thanks for being there for me.
[[[[[(((emmy)))and(((gg)))]]]]]
Your grateful pal,
LaurieP.S. Does it make me a geek that I think that hug kinda looks like a math equation?
Posted by All Done on March 29, 2005, at 1:00:07
In reply to I'm so sorry., posted by Dinah on March 28, 2005, at 19:26:45
Thank you, Dinah.
It's interesting (for lack of a better word) to me that it seems like when I need my T the most is when I pull away. Maybe frustrating is a better word?
For both of our sakes, I hope your T is right.
Take care,
Laurie
Posted by Daisym on March 29, 2005, at 10:10:35
In reply to Re: I'm so sorry. » Dinah, posted by All Done on March 29, 2005, at 1:00:07
****It's interesting (for lack of a better word) to me that it seems like when I need my T the most is when I pull away. Maybe frustrating is a better word?
I think it is a learn response to crisis. We pull in to protect ourselves. And typically, begin taking care of everything and everyone else.
I'm sorry about your Aunt. This is the holy season and God often calls folks home. I hope you can find some small comfort in that. My prayers are with you.
Posted by All Done on March 29, 2005, at 17:15:57
In reply to Re: I'm so sorry. » All Done, posted by Daisym on March 29, 2005, at 10:10:35
> I think it is a learn response to crisis. We pull in to protect ourselves. And typically, begin taking care of everything and everyone else.
I know you're right, but I expend so much energy worrying and taking care of everyone else that it gets very tiring and physically and emotionally draining. I know you understand that. Maybe we can pick a time (for even just a half hour) when we both do something for ourselves (other than therapy) and we'll compare notes afterwards.
> I'm sorry about your Aunt. This is the holy season and God often calls folks home. I hope you can find some small comfort in that. My prayers are with you.
Thank you, Daisy. I do find comfort in that and the fact that she is at peace after a very long, hard life.My prayers are with you, too, Daisy.
Take care,
Laurie
Posted by TofuEmmy on March 29, 2005, at 18:18:26
In reply to Re: emmy and gg, posted by All Done on March 29, 2005, at 0:57:49
No, sweetie, that doesn't make you a geek. The fact that you were a cheerleader for the mathletes makes you a geek. :-)
Kisses, emmy
Posted by gardenergirl on March 29, 2005, at 21:08:52
In reply to Re: emmy and gg, posted by TofuEmmy on March 29, 2005, at 18:18:26
Hey, even mathletes need support! And our kind and caring lala was there for them.
gg
Posted by All Done on March 30, 2005, at 16:50:52
In reply to Re: emmy and gg » TofuEmmy, posted by gardenergirl on March 29, 2005, at 21:08:52
Well, I guess it's time to fess up. I was only cheering for the mathletes because they were my teammates. :-P
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Psychology | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.