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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
Nada, zip, nothing.
I didn't feel anything, not even generalized anxiety. We could try again, I suppose, but I'm not sure it's worth the time or money.
Has anyone had EMDR do absolutely nothing on the first session and then have it work later?
Posted by gardenergirl on January 26, 2004, at 21:43:59
In reply to EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
Sorry it wasn't helpful. I don't know much about the experience, just the approach as it was (very basically) taught in school. My own thoughts, however, are to give things a chance to work. Perhaps the T can answer your question about what you should be experiencing during the session.
But at least it wasn't horrible????
:)
gg
Posted by DaisyM on January 26, 2004, at 22:25:24
In reply to EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
I'm sorry it was great. I haven't used it, just read about it. Sometimes I wish I could shut down the pain...
I agree with maybe give it more time. At least one more session might do it.
hang in there.
Posted by Speaker on January 26, 2004, at 22:52:01
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me » Dinah, posted by DaisyM on January 26, 2004, at 22:25:24
Dinah,
I think it takes a few times to get relaxed enough with the process to let it work...at least it did for me. I thought it was such a stupid thing to do that I couldn't let it work for me the first few times. My T also did a lot of explaining to me the first few times. He even would stop and restart at times. I hope you will give it a few more times as it covers a lot more ground in such a short amount of time in comparision to conventional therapy. Keep taking care of you!!!
Posted by jane d on January 26, 2004, at 23:10:23
In reply to EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
I don't know Dinah. I can't think of anything else offhand that costs that much money that we would be willing to keep going back for even when it showed no results. The lottery maybe? Racetrack? Psych meds? On the other hand there are always a few winners in all of these things - if only to keep the rest of us coming back - so maybe you will be one of them. Can you tell that I'm feeling cynical tonight?
I'm sorry it didn't do more for you and also that you now have to make the difficult decision about when enough is enough. Despite my cynicism I really don't know the answer to that one. Do you have any "gut feelings" one way or the other? Do you still have a good feeling about this person?
I know you are aware of the argument that it isn't the EMDR technique at all that is effective but just plain old therapy. Is it possible that you didn't get any effect from this because you already have what you need in the way of therapy from someone else?
Jane
Posted by Medusa on January 27, 2004, at 2:50:34
In reply to EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
I'm not sure what the connection is, but one systems-approach therapy institute supports Francine Shapiro.
www.mri.org
Dinah, if you want rapid results, I can't say enough about a family systems approach. It's no fun, and certainly not a replacement for talk therapy if you like what talk therapy gives you, but it's made big changes for me very quickly.
If you're willing to try something different, and you want the fast change, this could be worth trying.
If you want empathetic listeners, this approach would probably feel pretty harsh to you. It does to me, but "nice" therapists didn't help me figure out how to relieve my pain, and I'm in enough that I'm willing to feel worse for a little while. I presume that every institute differs, maybe there are "nice" systems therapists - but you know what I think about therapists' motivations, 'niceness' included. Anyway, I don't think that mine would help me with anxiety attacks. (Which are much worse currently.) They'd probably see this as indications that the subject I'm on is really "dangerous" territory for me, and that I'm working on the right area. I presume that the panic etc will subside once I've resolved the guts of this issue.
In the meantime, it's h@ll. I feel terrible, I look worse. And yeah, I'm recommending it, if you're desperate enough to try therapy that gets to the roots with a big knife.
And no, it doesn't have to be in an observed setting, although I'm convinced that the therapist's work is a lot more focused when s/he knows s/he's under scrutiny.
I can look up institutes in your area, if you're comfortable e-mailing me what geographical area you're in. Or I can suggest books, but frankly, what I read in books terrifies me so much, I don't think I'd keep up the work if I didn't have deadlines and homework (and the bill hanging over my head, that I want to keep to a minimum).
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:00:28
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Speaker on January 26, 2004, at 22:52:01
I thought I recalled that EMDR was supposed to work right away, if it's going to work at all. Shapiro or someone said that. I'll have to do some more research. But honestly, I'm cash strapped as well as time strapped right now. And I didn't feel a single thing, not even anxiety about the process. Maybe a mild interest, no more.
It could be that I'm just very well defended, but I'm not sure I want to cut down sessions with my regular therapist so I can afford the EMDR during the many sessions it might take to cut through the defenses.
I suppose I should add that my EMDR therapist was not really familiar with using the process to reconnect dissociated feelings. She is more familiar with using it to desensitize painful memories.
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:05:34
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me » Dinah, posted by jane d on January 26, 2004, at 23:10:23
> I know you are aware of the argument that it isn't the EMDR technique at all that is effective but just plain old therapy.
I'm not altogether sure my therapist believes in the eye movement techniques either. She stopped them for a while during the process to try an auditory approach. The trouble is that I thought the auditory approach involved alternating sounds in the left and right ear? She played the tape on a regular tape player that was stationed in the room. I'm not sure how it could have differentiated ears... She also stopped the entire thing for a while to do that EFT process, which also didn't do anything for me.
She did give me a bit of insight (which I already knew but had never put into words), but that was before the EMDR started and came from her experience as a fellow former catholic schoolgirl.
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:06:18
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:05:34
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:11:16
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me » Dinah, posted by Medusa on January 27, 2004, at 2:50:34
I've pretty well researched all the therapists and forms of therapy in our area, and I don't believe there *is* a family systems institutes in my area. Which doesn't surprise me a bit. I can't find a DBT group either. Or anyone who knows what a SCID-D is, never mind how to give it.
I live in a psychiatric backwater. :(
Besides, I'm never ever ever ever ever ever ever going to go through that interview again. I'm just not strong enough. I'll be wrapped around my therapist's legs clinging for dear life till he dies or retires or moves. It's him or nothing for me from here on out.
It does sound interesting though. I admire your guts in being able to tolerate the distress.
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:15:38
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me » Dinah, posted by jane d on January 26, 2004, at 23:10:23
That because I'm really not feeling well right now, I might not be really motivated to dip deep into the well of past pains.
Every morning since last Friday, I've been waking up with the most disturbing images and barely dragging myself through the day without ending up sitting on the floor laughing hysterically or crying hysterically or worse. Maybe this just isn't a good time to try anything new. My therapist yesterday was pointing out that I really didn't want to end up in the hospital did I, and for the first time, I wasn't so sure...
Posted by gardenergirl on January 27, 2004, at 8:32:11
In reply to Re: It does occur to me though, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:15:38
Posted by DaisyM on January 27, 2004, at 10:33:38
In reply to Re: It does occur to me though, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:15:38
So a lecture from me about getting extra help when you need it seems laughable but here goes:
You cancelled your appointment on Friday -- then proceeded to go downhill. Hmmm...I think you need to listen to your Therapist because you DON'T want to end up in the hospital. You son and your puppies and your husband and I need you.
Take it slow. Ask yourself why it is so important to do something "different" right now? Especially if it is destabalizing?
Here is the question I always see you ask everyone else: have you had a check up recently? Especially since you have to watch your sugars.
There is a ton of research on Diabetes and depression and how they effect each other. Please pay attention to this. Just a little bit of exercise can make a HUGE difference. Just a little bit of stress can make a HUGE difference. I would equate the new therapy with more than a little bit of stress.
One thing I learned with my son is that when he doesn't pay attention to staying hydrated, he feels worse, even if his sugars are in a decent range. Drink lots of water and decaff tea. Walk back and forth in your house 10 times today. (See drinking water makes you get up and go potty so you are exercising more!)
Really, please pay attention to all of this. You can't seperate physical care from mental care. They are linked so tightly.
Hope you feel better soon.
Posted by judy1 on January 27, 2004, at 11:34:12
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:00:28
> I suppose I should add that my EMDR therapist was not really familiar with using the process to reconnect dissociated feelings. She is more familiar with using it to desensitize painful memories.My son's EMDR therapy was successful after a few sessions, but it was geared towards specific 'painful memories' rather than dissociative memories. I'm not familiar with the success of EMDR with dissociative memories, don't they have to be 'remembered' i.e. in the correct part of the brain to be treated?
take care, judy
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 12:31:40
In reply to Re: It does occur to me though » Dinah, posted by DaisyM on January 27, 2004, at 10:33:38
Thanks Daisy, and you're right. My therapist did his usual magic yesterday and the obsessive thoughts were less intense this morning, and largely gone as the day went on. I guess an hour of my bludgeoning ahead with my irrational logic and his patient countering of it with more rational thoughts lessened the hold of the obsessive thoughts.
Stress is way up at work, and at home to some extent. And Friday morning my innocent looking macaroni and cheese interacted very badly with my glucophage, so I was sick as a dog. All that probably had an effect on the downturn. But I have an appointment with my internist tomorrow, and I think my sugars are ok. And I walked up five flights and down eight flights of steps today (thank you vomit phobia - someone on the elevator didn't look well). I was amazingly un-winded for someone who doesn't exercise. :)
I just need a few good days where I accomplish more at work than I get loaded with. Because the thoughts were definitely about escaping from what seems like an impossible situation.
And I'm trying to take care of myself. That's the main reason I want to drop the EMDR for now. Since it didn't do anything, and since I can only afford two hours of therapy a week (and that only barely) I think I'd rather have the second session with my own therapist.
Posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 12:33:08
In reply to Re: EMDR didn't do a thing for me » Dinah, posted by judy1 on January 27, 2004, at 11:34:12
I'm attempting to do a bit more research on it before I cancel Monday's appointment. Some of what she was saying yesterday made me wonder how much confidence *she* had in the process working for me.
Posted by fallsfall on January 27, 2004, at 13:54:38
In reply to Re: It does occur to me though, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:15:38
My therapist yesterday was pointing out that I really didn't want to end up in the hospital did I, and for the first time, I wasn't so sure...
I agree with Daisy. Please take this as a caution sign and be careful.
(((((Dinah)))))
Posted by Speaker on January 27, 2004, at 16:22:43
In reply to EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
Dinah,
I don't know if I would continue to invest with a therapist that wasn't that confident they could help me! The T I went to was very confident that if I would allow him the chance to work with me I would see results...and I did! I had a very good relationship with him before the EMDR and I think that made a difference. I agree with the others though that the first thing is just take care of you and if you feel it adds to much stress then stop. I agree that the two hrs. with someone you know helps you is better that adding stress. Take care!
Posted by antigua on January 28, 2004, at 0:40:51
In reply to EMDR didn't do a thing for me, posted by Dinah on January 26, 2004, at 20:14:37
Dinah, did your EMDR therapist tell you why she thought it didn't work?
antigua
Posted by Medusa on January 28, 2004, at 4:49:23
In reply to Re: It does occur to me though, posted by Dinah on January 27, 2004, at 8:15:38
> That because I'm really not feeling well right now, I might not be really motivated to dip deep into the well of past pains.
>(((((((((Dinah))))))))))
I haven't read the rest of this thread, so I might be missing key information, but if I don't post now I won't find this post of yours again ...
Is there any chance that your current pain is +connected+ to your past pain, that the current stuff is so much worse +because of+ your courage to approach the original pain?
This is the end of the thread.
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