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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by kerria on August 17, 2005, at 10:19:59
go to heaven?
Are there verses in the Bible?
i know about Judas- he didn't, i don't think- but not because of what he did but because he wasn't a believer.
In the Old Testament Saul did. David said later that he did.There are family members that i believe were Christians that made this choice.
thank you so much,
kerria
Posted by spriggy on August 17, 2005, at 12:59:26
In reply to Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by kerria on August 17, 2005, at 10:19:59
This is my personal opinion about that...
Yes, suicide is wrong but given the state of mind of the person who is committing the act, I can't imagine God would not be gracious.
My grandmother was a wonderful Christian woman- loved God and the bible more than just about any other person I have known. She suffered with severe bipolar. Lithium typically treated it and kept her balanced but occasionally it would cause a problem with her kidney's and they would have to remove her off of it.
About 10 years ago, they had to take her off of her lithium, within about a week she had hit rock bottom. She prayed so hard for God to help her through it, quoted scripture, etc.. but continued to decline.
She took her own life.
There is ABSOLUTELY NO doubt in my mind that she is in heaven.She was mentally and physically sick, she was exhausted from a life long battle with this disease, and she felt like a burden to her family.
I know I'll see her again one day.. Whole, well, and healed.
Posted by spriggy on August 17, 2005, at 13:02:18
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by spriggy on August 17, 2005, at 12:59:26
Another thought...
If a Christian were to slip up one night, drink too much alcohol, get in a car wreck that caused their life to be taken- very few people would sit around debating if that CHristian were in heaven.
According to the Bible, once you have accepted Christ as your Savior and acknowledged your sinfulness, you have been saved.
I think God has more grace than we could ever even fathom.
Posted by kerria on August 17, 2005, at 20:09:13
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by spriggy on August 17, 2005, at 12:59:26
That's so beautiful, Spriggy, about your Grandmother. It's sad and so hard how difficult life is for us sometimes but God doesn't leave us then.
(((((((((Squiggy))))))))))
it's so hard having someone you love so much leave this way but you at least have witness from God that she is completely whole and perfectly well and healed.Love,
kerria
Posted by kerria on August 17, 2005, at 20:11:56
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by spriggy on August 17, 2005, at 13:02:18
Yes, i think He has Grace more than we could think also. Thank you, Squiggy.
take care,
kerria
Posted by rayww on August 18, 2005, at 1:29:18
In reply to Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by kerria on August 17, 2005, at 10:19:59
Yes. I believe they can eventually go to heaven.
Mormons believe God has said, "this is my work and my glory, to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man". God has stated on several occasions that He is capable of doing his own work. His work is the work of salvation, and He is capable of seeing to it that we all make it. He gives us each our portion of life, some have it harder than others, but we each have it hard. Without God's Grace not one of us could possibly succeed. If we could just look to him and hang onto life we could make it through the rough spots. He is capable of getting us through. Our life is His problem.
We come to earth in agency, free to choose good over evil for a purpose. There must be opposition to all things. Even in the garden there was an opposition, presented to Adam and Eve by Satan, and if they hadn't chosen the oposing path, none of us would have been born. The fall was essential to have the need for the atonement. It set the plan into motion, and we are still in it with God.
God has a plan for us, and likes to choose when our life begins and ends. That's why he places sexual sin right up there next to murder in seriousness, and why suicide is considered murder by God. Suicide is difficult to define. Is the careless action of one any less suicide than the deliberate? And, what about prolonging life beyond one's natural time? Only God can be the judge. God is perfect, and so is his justice and mercy. He can bring you to peace on the matter if you seek him in prayer.
My opinion is that all people who die, whether they were good or bad, meet God on their first stop, (go home to that God who gave them life) and then they are sorted, the righteous go to a place of rest, and the wicked to another place to await the resurrection and final judgement. Choices can still be made, and must be made, but will be more difficult there than they would be here.
I don't want to say anything that might encourage another person to comit suicide, yet at the same time keep a balance for loved ones of those who have already. People need to realize that life doesn't end with suicide, you go on, and the first thought after would be one of deep regret I am sure.
God has promised that he won't let our life go unnoticed, that with every problem, will be an escape, that we may be able to bear it. We need to hang onto life, it is our greatest gift. Adam fell that man might be, and man is that he might have joy.
Posted by Declan on August 18, 2005, at 2:56:37
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide - » kerria, posted by rayww on August 18, 2005, at 1:29:18
When Maxim Gorki attempted suicide he was brought before the ecclesiastical court of the Orhodox Church and excommunicated. Oddly recently (to me), around 1900.
Declan
Posted by rayww on August 18, 2005, at 11:00:52
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by Declan on August 18, 2005, at 2:56:37
A lot has happened since 1900 Declan. Light and truth is literally flooding the earth. Religion might be in chaos, many doctrines have been challenged, and beliefs changed. etc. Those who honestly seek truth are finding it. Oppression is being oppressed. Reality is flourishing because of the Internet, and people can find out what they want to right here. Choose wisely my friend. Don't get snagged by the dogma from the past or false tradition. There are many false educational ideas floating around with the true. Learn to sort. Pray. Walk with God.
Posted by Declan on August 18, 2005, at 15:49:23
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide - » Declan, posted by rayww on August 18, 2005, at 11:00:52
Light and truth is flooding the earth?
I'm afraid I see it very differently.
Declan
Posted by rayww on August 18, 2005, at 21:50:46
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by Declan on August 18, 2005, at 15:49:23
Depends on where you're looking I suppose, and environment, where you live, etc. I see incredibly strong youth, fit for our day. I see opportunities that we have never known before. Sure, the glass is half empty, but which half is going to win in the long run? God is in the half empty glass, and he will keep filling it if you allow him. The heavens are not sealed shut. He can and will do it - - with our help - - in my opinion.
Posted by Dominique on August 27, 2005, at 0:24:59
In reply to Re: Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by spriggy on August 17, 2005, at 12:59:26
I have to agree w/ spriggy.
I believe that a person who knows their maker to thier fullest, yet is so down mentally/physically and takes their own life; as according to my religion instructor in school, at the point of someone taking their own life, that person is deemed mentally ill, thus is taken in by thier maker and forgiven for their sins...
Smiles
Posted by 4wd on October 20, 2005, at 21:11:54
In reply to Do you believe Christians that die from suicide -, posted by kerria on August 17, 2005, at 10:19:59
> go to heaven?
> Are there verses in the Bible?
> i know about Judas- he didn't, i don't think- but not because of what he did but because he wasn't a believer.
> In the Old Testament Saul did. David said later that he did.
>
> There are family members that i believe were Christians that made this choice.
>
> thank you so much,
> kerria
Kerria,I talked with my minister about this a few months ago. I absolutely trust this man, the spirit of God just shines from him.
I asked him if he believed suicides went to hell. He said, no not necessarily. Of course I guess it depends on the state of mind of the person at the time. But he said that he would certainly never judge someone himself or consign them to hell for having to escape intolerable pain.
That gave me great comfort.
Marsha
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