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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by DayByDay on October 7, 2003, at 7:55:44
Im brought up as a Catholic and when I was younger
a lot of my obsessions and compulsion was of the religios kind. Now I don´t have religous OCD-symptoms any more or very, very, little.
I don´t regret my religious upbringing but I feel that without it I would have been better of and still ended up the about same kind of beliver that I am now, (I have friend that wasn´t brought up that way and still have similar belief-systems to mine) There were a lot of positive sides with
the church stuff and everything but the problem I got from it was worse. Then again if it wouldn´t been religion my OCD-mind would have found something else to worry about. Finally OCD people without any religious or superstitious beliefs at all can have religious or magical obsession an compulsions. So I don´t know but if I would choose
to live my life again I think I would remove the religios upbringing- if I couldn´t remove the OCD
ofcourse - (then again maybe what is is meant to be even if if I don´t like some/much (depends on my mood) of it.)
Has anyone had similar experieces or just have a comment on stuff like this???
Posted by Tovah on October 7, 2003, at 11:45:07
In reply to RELIGION OCD - What do you think...., posted by DayByDay on October 7, 2003, at 7:55:44
I was brought up in a home that was not very religious (church on Easter and Christmas) and yet I developed religious OCD in college. I always attributed it to the need that I had for religious instuction that hadn't been met. Your story shows me that this probably isn't the case.
If you do a Google search on "Scrupulocity" (that is what religious OCD is called) you will find information on Scrupulous Anonymous. Most of these individuals were brought up Catholic and I'm not sure why that is...I doubt a particular religion is more likely to become scrupulous.
An interesting aside...many belive that Martin Luther had religious OCD which is why he sought to make changes (especially in the faith/works issue). Imagine, the impetus for our entire Western society due to a psycholigcal illness! ;)
Posted by rayww on October 10, 2003, at 10:17:18
In reply to Interesting..., posted by Tovah on October 7, 2003, at 11:45:07
After the death of the apostles many Christian churches sprung up, all hoping and claiming a portion of that orriginal authority. These are wonderful religions, and they have blessed the earth. Good people become better when they adhere to their religion. Perhaps the OCD comes during the futile search, when no matter where you go you just can't find what you are looking for. Something inside keeps driving you to whatever it is, but you can't find it. Each will satisfy for a time, but it wears out fast, so you try another. Then you decide it isn't worth it, so abandon religion all together. It's not supposed to be that way.
Posted by Tovah on October 11, 2003, at 17:47:47
In reply to Re: Interesting..., posted by rayww on October 10, 2003, at 10:17:18
..in my current religion my search has stopped. I HAVE found what I was looking for. I have found my permanent church home, and I am very comfortable with it.
The OCD manifested itself in a different way...don't want to go into details, but in MY case anyway (not speaking for others with Scrupuocity), it was different from what you described.
Posted by rayww on October 11, 2003, at 23:44:26
In reply to I'm lucky, in that..., posted by Tovah on October 11, 2003, at 17:47:47
It's wonderful you were able to find a perfect match. You must have been led there for a reason. Does your family support you?
Posted by Tovah on October 12, 2003, at 13:57:35
In reply to Re: I'm lucky, in that... » Tovah, posted by rayww on October 11, 2003, at 23:44:26
...neither one will likely ever become Orthodox. Both believe in God but for different reaasons (cognitive disability in the case of my father, and a spiritually abusive upbringing in the case of my mom) neither feel comfortable with organized religion. However my dad is happy if I'm happy and my mom donates money and labor to the church (painting, advertising and such). I've come far enough in my faith to believe that our judgement depends on what is in our hearts rather than if we simply recite an eight-word Christian shahada anyway.
Posted by rayww on October 13, 2003, at 0:17:34
In reply to They are happy that I'm happy...., posted by Tovah on October 12, 2003, at 13:57:35
Posted by Tovah on October 13, 2003, at 12:32:28
In reply to what is spiritual abuse? (nm) » Tovah, posted by rayww on October 13, 2003, at 0:17:34
...or being exposed to toxic or dysfunctional religion
Posted by Tovah on October 13, 2003, at 13:31:08
In reply to RELIGION OCD - What do you think...., posted by DayByDay on October 7, 2003, at 7:55:44
(((BTW, "Scrupulocity" is another name for reigious OCD)))
"Scrupulocity is a disorder that not only makes a person doubt and live their life filled with anxiety, it is not only a disorder that is manifested by "a thousand frightening fantasies," but it is also a disorder that orients a person towards the exception, the single possiblility that in this one single instance, it "might not be true." Scrupulous people often believe that others are enjoying the abundance of God's grace and blessing, and might even go so far as to recognize God's action at work in their friends and neighbors, but they have a difficult time seeing the same power of God working in their own life. Scrupulous people see themselves as the exception, somehow deprived of what others seem to be so freely given...Acknolwedge the fear and the anxiety but also take the risk to believe that you are not the exception, that you are in fact capable of being loved, and that there is no need to be perfect."
And on another page:
"God receives us just as we are and accepts our prayers just as they are. In the same way that a small child cannot draw a bad picture, so a child of God cannot offer a bad prayer."
Posted by Dena on October 14, 2003, at 11:30:48
In reply to Re: Interesting..., posted by rayww on October 10, 2003, at 10:17:18
> After the death of the apostles many Christian churches sprung up, all hoping and claiming a portion of that orriginal authority. These are wonderful religions, and they have blessed the earth. Good people become better when they adhere to their religion. Perhaps the OCD comes during the futile search, when no matter where you go you just can't find what you are looking for. Something inside keeps driving you to whatever it is, but you can't find it. Each will satisfy for a time, but it wears out fast, so you try another. Then you decide it isn't worth it, so abandon religion all together. It's not supposed to be that way.
Dear Rayww -This is an interesting theory (about different Christian churches springing up after the Apostles died off, & thus the Church lost her authority). I understand that it's the teaching of the Mormon church, but it just doesn't hold up to historical facts.
Yes, heretical factions sprung up from the very beginning of Christianity, many of them claiming to be the "true Church". Heresies have arisen in every generation of Christianity, continuing to today. But the True Christian Church continued strong & has remained to this very day, faithful to the teachings of Jesus Christ Himself, regardless of any external opposition. The Christian Church has been sustained by Jesus Himself, not by humans, just as He promised He would do.
Perhaps an analagy would be helpful. Mormonism began in 1830, & almost right from the start, different "Mormon" churches sprang up, often contradicting the teachings of Joseph Smith & the Book of Mormon. Today there are many different churches under the "umbrella" of Mormonism (Most Mormons are not aware that there are nearly two hundred Mormon denominations with most of them claiming to be the "one and only true Church". In fact, the Mormon Church has schismatised more than orthodox Christianity in a comparable period of time (compare 200 LDS denominations in less than 200 years with 600+ Christian denominations in more than 2,000 years.)
Despite that, Mormons feel quite comfortable claiming that True Mormons have remained faithful to the teachings of Joseph Smith, despite the various factions which claim to have sole authority.
The Mormon teaching that Christianity stopped following the teachings of Jesus Christ in the second century is simply not true. It is revisionist history. There are true Christians all over the world, belonging to various denominations, but united in the truth as taught by Jesus Christ, despite the heretical groups claiming to be "the one true church". And despite the individuals who are Christian in name only.
Jesus promised to keep His Church, His Bride, safe from the fires of hell (& all of it's deceptions) forever... & Jesus keeps His promises.
The Christian Church has remained alive & well throughout the time since Jesus Christ established it. Nothing that any human or demon can say will change that fact.
Shalom, Dena
Posted by rayww on October 14, 2003, at 19:13:53
In reply to From this month's Scrupulous Anonymous newslette, posted by Tovah on October 13, 2003, at 13:31:08
>
> And on another page:
>
> "God receives us just as we are and accepts our prayers just as they are. In the same way that a small child cannot draw a bad picture, so a child of God cannot offer a bad prayer."
>This is so true.
Posted by rayww on October 14, 2003, at 19:43:11
In reply to Re: Interesting... » rayww, posted by Dena on October 14, 2003, at 11:30:48
> The Christian Church has remained alive & well throughout the time since Jesus Christ established it. Nothing that any human or demon can say will change that fact.
>
> Shalom, Dena
>
>As I said, the Christian churches have many wonderful people. They accomplish much good. They have been a blessing to the earth. They have preserved the word of God and writings of the prophets for over 6000 years. God has guided many people to the Christian churches. I'm sure he is in their midst as He hears and answers their prayers, just as he hears any sincere prayer from anyone else.
But no matter what the claim to authority, it stands to reason there can be only one faith, one authority for one baptism. It behooves every serious thinker to find out for themself.200 break away groups? I was aware of 115 but 200 seems a little high. How many break away groups are there in mainstream Christianity? I know you meant well. You are a good person, and I admire how you always stand up for your belief.
Stand for Jesus by standing for people, inasmuch as ye have done it unto the least of these, my brethren, ye have done it unto me. Golden rule, Peace Dena.
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 15, 2003, at 1:44:08
In reply to Re: Interesting... » rayww, posted by Dena on October 14, 2003, at 11:30:48
> the teaching of the Mormon church ... just doesn't hold up to historical facts.
Please respect the views of others, be sensitive to their feelings, and don't post anything that could lead them to feel their faith is being put down. The last time you were blocked, it was for 4 weeks, so this time, it's for 8.
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 15, 2003, at 1:45:11
In reply to Re: Interesting..., posted by rayww on October 14, 2003, at 19:43:11
> no matter what the claim to authority, it stands to reason there can be only one faith, one authority for one baptism.
Please respect the views of others, be sensitive to their feelings, and don't post anything that could lead them to feel their faith is being put down. The last time you were blocked, it was for 2 weeks, so this time, it's for 4.
Bob
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